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Burning down the Haus part 2 - Attack of the Clones

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11:28 / 13.07.06

Here we are in the Conversation then. w00t. That should perk up the debate.
Is the rationale that people will be less afraid to post here? Or just that the thread was too battered to stay in Policy? Or we prefer to lark about?

One last thing before the inevitable decline into one line puns, I think Miss Wonderstarr's point is good, if Haus wasn't here we'd have to invent him. Someone else would be getting the flak. OK let's splurge.

foolish fat finger

11:36 / 13.07.06

Last post- addendum/clarification…. “we came, we saw, we conked-out…”

I am not leaving barb, I am just stopping posting. It is an interesting place, and less time writing means more time for reading, which is cool. However, I am now going to cut-down the amount of time I spend online each day.
For me, this is a positive outcome to my part in the discussion.

I am a bit embarrassed about posting drunk last night. I sound like a humourless berk in that post and I totally earned the jibes about it (I particularly liked mathlete's ‘that’s it, I’m leaving’) perhaps I should have stormed out, but then, I live on the first floor and I don’t do stairs…

in my defence, I broke my rule #1 (no drunk posting) because I was carried along by the speed and energy of the discussion. Obviously, I usually consider things a lot more before I post.

Toksik, thanks for your apology. I think I kind of earned a bit of your ire with my “dumb drunk” post. However, you have earned a great deal of respect from me for your honesty.

Mathlete, I just wanted to second Olulabelle’s comment. I enjoy reading your posts, and would definitely find the barb less fun without you here.

Haus, I believe I was uncharitable in putting you on ‘ignore’ publicly. I think I needed to do it, just to find that out. I am no longer ignoring your posts.

I still feel I made some valid points in my posts in this thread… At this point, however, I am leaving the discussion.

But not the building…

Regrettable Juvenilia

11:38 / 13.07.06

Anyone who has said anything negative about Haus in the thread so far has been criticised by either him or his mates.

What do people think about this claim, then? Is it true, or would it be more accurate to replace "has been criticised" with "has had their arguments criticised or questioned or disputed" and "his mates" with "people who don't agree with the negative points put forward, who may or may not also be friends with Haus offline"?

11:42 / 13.07.06

I think perhaps it is sometimes an unfortunate thing for barbelith that some of the most vocal and fluent posters are also mates. This does not mean there is a big conspiracy, just that they live in the same place and have met each other.

Whisky Priestess

11:44 / 13.07.06

You're not implying that online friends don't count are you Fly?

(Please say they do ... for all of our sakes ...)

paranoidwriter waves hello

11:47 / 13.07.06

But he’s differentiating between people who’re trying to say something insightful and those who’re just trying to further their disputes or dislike of him.

A difficult task for anyone.

For the record, I REALLY was trying to help and not further an old dispute with my last post. However, I'll move for deletion if you all think it's unhelpful.

11:48 / 13.07.06

they live in the same place and have met each other.
...or that after a while you go to meets and make friend with other posters. I don't agree with Haus because he's a mate* but because he's right, and when he's not he gets picked up on it (like the Temple catflap for example).

* I think we've met three times and he hates me

11:53 / 13.07.06

Quick post as I have to run to work, but...

I certainly didn't like Haus for a while because of his suit's style: the arrogance, the snark, the snide, the everything.

But after a couple arguments via PM or on board, I've come to see that it's just him. That's Haus. There's different kinds of people in the world and not everybody can be super nice like alas. There are Haus-s and Flyboy-s out there.

What are you gonna do?

Now I like Haus when I'm not on the receiving end of his wrath. Then again, and I'm going to be honest, since I work two full-time jobs, I don't have time for arguments and therefore I avoid any thread of substance. So I don't get into fights.

I think people who tend to get into Haus-fights all the time have yet to understand that Haus isn't going to put on gentle gloves. Spare the rod and spoil the child.

Tryphena Absent

12:00 / 13.07.06

Well Fly, clearly people who have disagreed with Haus have been criticised by Haus or his "mates" (read there: people who agree with Haus about, let's hazard a guess, 67% of all issues discussed here) at some point or another... because they have disagreed with Haus and Chums and they don't agree. I think you see where I'm going with this. Not agreeing generally leads to some kind of criticism.

some people really do feel nervous about posting what they feel about people.

Well perhaps they should get someone to help them out with the neurosis that is clearly effecting their lives so negatively because this is a message board and people's judgement of you is inconsequential. If you are disabled by people's feelings in a space like this then it's not about Barbelith.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

12:01 / 13.07.06

I haven't read this thread but seven pages in four days!? For you Haus haters do you not think your kind of pandering to his ego here?

Regrettable Juvenilia

12:19 / 13.07.06

Anna - in part my point was whether in this thread at least, people themselves have been criticised, or just what they have been saying. There's a difference.

Can someone who isn't on foolish fat finger's ignore list ask him how he knew I was hectoring DM when he had me on ignore?

12:21 / 13.07.06

PW: I didn’t mean you, I thought your comments above were quite thoughtful

I should add to Nattyrajah. I’ve read a few of your posts and I thought they were thoughtful and articulate. I don’t think you’re in any danger of Bruno/Megatron style challenge or pissripping.

paranoidwriter waves hello

12:26 / 13.07.06

Thanks, illmatic. I know I come across as a cocky swine sometimes on Barbelith, but I was one of those people who were worried about posting in this thread. Very worried. I'd much rather meet Haus for a pint someday and have a friendly chat so he can see my eyes and better judge my intentions, and so I can do likewise with him. As Alex said earlier, I bet I'd like Haus a lot if I met him. Which is one of the reasons why this thread feels horrible right now.

12:32 / 13.07.06

What do people think about this claim, then? Is it true

Well not every person who's said something negative has been shouted down.

People have defended Haus, and the more vocal people doing it do seem to be those who've known him for a long time. The original question seemed to me to be using "Haus's friends" (to paraphrase) as another way of describing the mythical Barbelite, which is patently bollocks although I do know a poster who knows a poster who accidentally found zir way onto the Armoury forum.

There's not necessarily anything wrong with pro-Haus people getting involved though, whether they're his buddies or just don't have a problem with him. Otherwise it have just Haus on his own versus his detractors isn't it?

Weird how this thread seems to have gone a similar route to the original BDTH thread. Not identical, and this one seems a bit more involved in addressing people's concerns but still similar.

Anyhoo...

One thought that occurred to me last night was that this whole perception of Haus as something of a bully might come from his tendency not to back down once an argument has started. Being able to write long, well-thought out posts again and again can be quite an effective way of "winning" (for want of a better term).

That's not to say anyone else on here knows when to back down either, just that he may have a bit more "word-stamina" than some others.

I could be wrong about that though. The thought did occur to me after listening to something on the radio about how John Major managed to push through some important, British-friendly, EEC directive simply because pulling all-nighters was more common in British politics than on the continent.

Hmm. I just compared Haus to John Major didn't I?

(dives for cover)

Mister Six, whom all the girls

12:36 / 13.07.06

Weird how this thread seems to have gone a similar route to the original BDTH thread.

Could you expand on that?

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:39 / 13.07.06

I think the whole "diagreement"="gets wellied by Haus" thing is also a bit of a misrepresentation. Okay, I'm friends with him in real life, but I was on the board for a long time before I met him, and seem to remember disagreeing on many occasions (same goes for Flyboy), and never once felt I was being silenced, or was about to be banned, or any of that.

So if there's any truth to the stories, it's got to come down to something more than disagreement. Or at least I feel it does.

As Haus himself has acknowledged (by starting this thread) something may be going on. But if it's people being victimised merely for holding differing viewpoints, then I'm sorry, I'm just not seeing it.

miss wonderstarr

12:45 / 13.07.06

Can I ask again something I tried to suggest above: is anything going to change as a result of this thread? Was this thread supposed to lead to any kind of change? People obviously like posting on it and reading it to some extent, but it seems to be just a platform for some people to say what problems they have with Haus, and others (or the same people) to say what they admire about him, and for the audience to discuss each other's responses, while Haus sits on-stage (I think I'm heading for another analogy here) like Humpty (there you go), gently rocking and musing, and never cracking.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

12:47 / 13.07.06

Wonderstarr these threads have never made the slightest bit of differance before.

miss wonderstarr

12:55 / 13.07.06

OK thanks, I'll stop asking. The thread is still entertaining enough (for some reason) to keep me coming back.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:59 / 13.07.06

Well, they do provide a useful arena for people who wish to complain about Haus's perceived monstrous ego to keep massaging it...

I mean, the guy puts a big "kick me" sign on his arse and people come from far and wide to point and say "look everyone! That's the guy who gets far too much attention".

It's all quite strange, really. Strange and beautiful.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

13:01 / 13.07.06

Haus is laughing at us all in a maniacal manner and masturbating onto his computer monitor.

13:07 / 13.07.06

If you are disabled by people's feelings in a space like this then it's not about Barbelith.

Isn't this the same argument usually used by those posters who make racist, homophobic or misogynistic statements? Mind you, I'm not equating anything Haus says with hate speech. I'm just suggesting that that particular defense is a bit flimsy.

13:10 / 13.07.06

Could you expand on that?

Sure thing Six. I flicked through it yesterday after it was mentioned on here, and just had another quick riffle through.

Aside from the rather obvious similarity that they're both started by the same fella with the intention of asking people to explain why he riles them up, there's a lot of posters with a general "He ticks me off, but generally because he's annoyingly good at arguing rather than him being a prick" theme.

There's less serious posts, the orginal seems a bit more frivilous but the general thrust of people's points are pretty much the same. For some reason I thought BDTH 1 was a Policy thread that got moved to Convo (as was the case with BDTH 2) but looking back I can't see a specific reference to that.

They both seem to round off like a Marvel comic book, with everything defaulting back to the status quo. Mind you that's a little presumptuous of me seeing as this one hasn't finished yet.

Have a look and see what you think.

BDTH 1

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

13:13 / 13.07.06

"Ah-ha-ha, Ah-ha-ha!" Whoosh! Splat!

miss wonderstarr

13:43 / 13.07.06

Interesting that the fictionsuit concept is used far more widely on that earlier thread than it is on the board these days, symptomatic perhaps of a ... paradigm... shift... something. People don't seem to talk so self-consciously about online personae, or virtual community dynamics, and certainly not about "cyberspace" *koff!* anymore. I suppose it's to do with the experience of interacting and presenting online becoming far more mundane and commonplace during the first years of the 21st century, and not seeming to require any gee-wizz we're all avatars in a consensual hallucination discourse.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

13:53 / 13.07.06

I don't like the first thread. I'm not in it.

13:57 / 13.07.06

Well, I *think* there were some differences in the way the board software handled user IDs then -- or at least, the days when you could change handles whenever you wanted without any trace of who you once were/what you had been called was still recent memory.

miss wonderstarr

14:00 / 13.07.06

Oh yes, good point grant. People were technically able to play around with different "suits" more (this was before my time but I have heard it said.) When you can only have one suit at a time, it's actually... it's actually your skin, rather than clothing.

paranoidwriter waves hello

14:07 / 13.07.06

Typing of which, mine seems to have flared up a bit of late. Who's got the cream?

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

14:09 / 13.07.06

PW if you hang around long enough in this thread you will become just another pixellated cum stained victim of Haus. Would that help?

paranoidwriter waves hello

14:12 / 13.07.06

Is that what Jane Fonda's using these days? Am I worth it?

*

14:14 / 13.07.06

I have both criticised Haus AND defended him in this thread. Is it because in the seeecret sub-universe of the barbe-Qs we had some spat and then made it up? Or is it because it's possible to hold some more nuanced position, such as that Haus has several blind spots which make him hard to deal with on the board at times but doesn't deserve the entirety of the criticism usually levelled against him? The world may never know. Mwahaha.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

14:16 / 13.07.06

PW, you're definitley worth it, besides judging by the size of this thread Haus is pretty indiscriminate.

If only he'd notice me. Sigh.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

14:19 / 13.07.06

Actually I'm not sure Haus would jizz on Jane Fonda. Perhaps back in the day when she was fighting the good fight.

14:27 / 13.07.06

Whoever drops a seven page thread from policy into convo, should not expect people to read every post (even before they start posting in said thread).

Sometimes I "feel", conversation is the dump for everything that´s not good enough anymore for wherever it came from.

I might read the first page or so, but most people who just now see this, probably won´t be able to catch up to the current debate.

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