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Kay
Well then, will you please apologise for suggesting I didn't read all Flyboy's post (I had),
It's possible, then, that you missed the bit where he said:
This is, to use an accessible everyday idiom, bullshit.
This phrase to me suggests that he did not, in fact, concede that you were right after all, and indeed the rest of the paragraph that you quoted selectively further indicates that he understands your position to be rather different from what you are claiming here. As a general rule, a post which employs the word "bullshit" as descriptive of your arguments is not a complete or ringing endorsement.
As such, I put the most charitable possible spin on this (that you had been distracted, perhaps by a whistling kettle, and not read the enitre post) rather than, say, suggesting that you had decided selectively to quote the part which tallies with your latest rewriting of your position and then claim victory. I apologise for this, and if I return to spending any significant time posting to Barbelith I will do my best not to do it in future.
or for assuming that I wanted to prolong this pointless argument (I didn't, and don't, as I hope should be clear to all)?
I don't think I did. I assumed that you wanted to end it, and end it by getting the last word, and in that last word saying that you were right. I do not know why it is so important to you that you would selectively quote a post which clearly does not "concede your point", or that you would keep changing what you said rather than admit that you spoke unwisely in the first place, but I do know that it is bad for the level of discussion on Barbelith.
Incidentally:
The issue of whether there is a place for the description and/or glorification of violence in song is a wide one, and one which I'll happily talk to you and the board about, but it is secondary to the fact that the presence of description and glorification in rap sometimes leads to a negative perception of black artists, which is the triflingly simple thing I was trying to say.
Well, for starters, you actually started by talking about negative perceptions of black people, not black artists at all, since at that point black artists had not been mentioned, which you identified as the fault of other black people. At this point, nobody else had even mentioned hip-hop, I believe:
I suspect it won't make an awful lot of difference to public perceptions so long as the airwaves are brimful of upbeat, cheerful depictions of black Americans. Shooting each other and fucking their "ho"s, that is. Why bother letting other people charge you with violent misogyny when you can proclaim it for yourself? With friends like these...
If in fact you expressed yourself tragically badly there, and had hallucinated an entire discussion focussed entirely on black artists, for example, that you had eagerly but misguidedly contributed to, then it is a shame you chose to be quite so rude and dismissive when questioned, really. After your first rewriting of this, I asked:
But, Kay, what you actually _said_ was that it was pointless to worry about these little bits of colour prejudice thought up by Sony in the face of all the colour prejudice that was being facilitated by black people, by producing violently misogynistic music. Are you saying that this was absolutely not what you meant? If so, can you clarify what you meant by come on in the thread where you said that? Only, we come across this phrase quite often in these situations, and it seems to have a meaning akin to "I order you to assume that whatever I am saying is acceptable by dint of the fact that I am saying it".
This is just one of the many questions that have remained largely unanswered through the following five pages of blather.
As for the dangers of you starting a new thread on a rap musician - well, I personally would rather put my swingers through a mangle than try to talk to you about rap, especially after a five-page thread in which you managed, if I recall correctly, to mention a single actual hip-hop artist). However, I can't speak for the rest of Barbelith. A good start might be not to quote them selectively and then claim that they have admitted that you were right all along. That tends to hack people off. |
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