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Doctor Who: Season 2 UK

 
  

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ONLY NICE THINGS
14:18 / 09.07.06
Yes, but I quite liked that - that when they came up against the Daleks, they were pretty comprehensively pwn3d - in fact, I don't think the Cybermen recorded a single Dalek kill, did they?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
14:20 / 09.07.06
That's what happens when yo redesign a classic enemy so that it no longer has one distinct, obscure weakness, I guess. The gold thing was always daft and never made a huge amount of sense, but it at least made them more of a threat when they showed up. The benefit of getting shot of it in New Who, I suppose, is that it was one of the few things that eventually put some distance between the Daleks and the new Cybermen - that, and the Cybermen do have a different motivation, now that I think about it some more. Oh, and they're willing to form alliances when they need.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
15:00 / 09.07.06
I know I sound like a broken record but... what a waste of an opportunity.

The good:

Daleks were very exotic and strange beside the Cybermen (who mainly marched in line a lot).

The Genesis Ark was very interesting and while I secretly hoped it contained the Master or Eccleston to rescue the show from Tennant... the reveal of it being an infinite prison was quite good.

The Tyler Family storyline finally comes to a close and the seemingly meaningless inclusion of the parallel reality is justified here with the alt Pete Tyler arriving to reunite his family.

Mickey Smith rocked (as usual) as an action hero.

The Daleks flying over London was an impressive visual and I really can feel that RTD is giving the new generation of Who fans moments that they can look back on with joy and excitement... still not a patch on Dalek Invasion of Earth but never mind.

The explanation of Dalek from last season and the fact that Daleks can absorb 'time energy' was... a bit hamfisted and embarassing that it waited over a year to be said but clever.

The bad...

Rose Rose Rose... I was done with her five minutes into the story. She then cried her way through the remainder of the episode and kept insisting on staying with the Doctor who strangely seemed ready to see her go. Her crying fits were so annoying and drawn out and no one seemed to really empathize with her until the very end. In any case she's gone. While I enjoyed her in the first year where she had a purpose she's been nothing but a jovial 'I wuv you Doctah' recording on repeat this year (except for a couple of brief shining moments such as Idiot's Lantern). I'm beyond caring whether it's Piper's acting or the character, I'm just glad that's over with.

Missed opportunities abound as we see so many explosions and toy soldier-ish battles that Doctor Who has been without for years yet... the story is vacant. If only the story were as impressive as the effects and monsters we'd be in business. As it is, the story is superficial and boring.

The ending was drawn out, self-serving (seeing the Tyler family drive to Norway? Throwing in yet ANOTHER reference to Bad Wolf? Yet another 'I wuv you' and the Doctor gets cut off right before he can reciprocate? What is this, Moonlighting?) and ultimately killed by a bad joke with Catherine Tate.

Last year the romance angle on the Doctor and Rose worked because Eccleston and Piper had chemistry. This year there is so little chemistry between the principals that the Doctor could care less if Rose is having a baby or it's her mum.

All in all the finale was a lot of gloss and not much substance. I think that there was a definite push away from the darker stories and the 9th Doctor's somewhat downtrodden behavior for the upbeat all action unbeatable Doctor #10... and I can understand that. In many ways it's a reference to the 17th season where Tom Baker was sending up his performance and greeted every villain with a smile and a jelly baby.

But even on his best days, Tennant is mo Tom Baker... nor is he a patch on Eccleston.

I can only hope next year is an improvent because there are so many involved who want this show to work, including the fans.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
15:08 / 09.07.06
Most of the fans seem to think this episode worked more or less fine, don't they?
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
15:32 / 09.07.06
There is quite a lot of fan support here, yes.

But elsewhere online (as there always is), there is an opinion to the contrary.

I'm not out to change anyone's opinion, just offering another point of view.
 
 
Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!
15:35 / 09.07.06
Yes but... oh, nevermind.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
15:44 / 09.07.06
I thought it was fantastic myself. Loved every minute of it. Loved the whole season.
 
 
Triplets
15:47 / 09.07.06
Triplets: Well, the Doctor Who finale was on last night at 7 - dunno why I missed it, I was in - but it's repeated tonight at 7 on BBC3.

Dad: How long's it on for?

Triplets: An hour. Okay, 45 minutes. If that's too much Doctor Who for you.

Dad: It is, actually! The World Cup Final's on tonight.

Triplets: Hang on. Is the World Cup on BBC1?

Dad: Yeah.

Triplets: Someone's watching it in the kitchen then!

*Point for Team Whoooeeeooo
 
 
Alex's Grandma
16:38 / 09.07.06
It would have been better if they'd cast Macgowan though, GL
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
16:43 / 09.07.06
It could only have been worse if they'd announced that the Doctor's new companion was Jimmy Carr. Then there would have been hurtage.
 
 
■
17:07 / 09.07.06
...and back to broadband [hugs PC like a long-lost child].

I agree with most of Six's criticisms, but it was so damn fun that I really didn't care. Just think of the spectacle! I was watching with a non-Who-fan who was just gutted by the (in my opinion) overlong ending, and I think this is what the show is aiming for. We can't afford to be too precious about how well Who fares as SF when it's always been essentially a primer on SF tropes for the younger generation.

Speaking of which, I think it's easy to justify the existence of Torchwood in a parallel universe. All you have to do is say that it's one formed by one of a gajillion quantum decisions that could have been made, between Queen Vic founding the institute and Pete Tyler dying, being slightly different from those in the "real" world.

What I want to know is where all this leaves Torchwood as a series. I thought Ms Oberman was rather good, and I'm kind of disappointed she won't be in the hotseat.
 
 
Ganesh
17:20 / 09.07.06
(Warning: off-topic pedantry ahead.

Love and Monster's

Love and unnamed-something-belonging-to-someone-called-'Monster'? I'm used to seeing apostrophes misused where words end in vowels, but this appears to go a shade beyond that. Do you throw an apostrophe into all plurals (or plural's)?

Could we excise the apostrophe here? I don't love it; it's monstrous.)
 
 
Lama glama
17:37 / 09.07.06
(I've put it in for an edit. I usually notice when I bollocks up stuff like that, but this time it slipped under my punctuation-dar. While we're asking for edits, maybe Our Lady could remove or at least tag hir Dark Materials spoiler. I know we've had eight years to read it, but I didn't expect it to be spoiled so majorly in a Doctor Who thread. I know that the damage is done now, but maybe in the interest of not spoiling the book for other readers, such an edit could be made.)
 
 
Ganesh
17:40 / 09.07.06
(Cool. Thankyou. It's like windchill in my ear.)
 
 
Lama glama
17:41 / 09.07.06
(Gah. Putting the incorrect barbe-pronoun up for moderation.)

Happily, ratings for this episode were quite satisfactory. The episode's ratings reached 8.58 million in the last ten minutes, which are sure to increase as the overnights are often lower than the final figures.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
17:53 / 09.07.06
Gift horse. Mouth. *grump*
 
 
Spaniel
18:16 / 09.07.06
Agreed

I think it is a real shame that they did away with the gold thing. To my mind the best of Who has always had a kind of Lovecraftian feel: shambling monstrosities from outside space and time, ancient otherworldly threats, technology that looks a lot like magic, the irrational merging with the rational. Cybermen being vulnerable to gold was the sort of thing that a talented ideas man, like, say, Mr Groo Mornigan would have a field day with. It wouldn't look daft it would look frightening, and impenetrably strange and would in some poetic way be forced to make a degree of sense.

Anyway, thoughts on that subject aside, I liked the episode a lot but hope to God that the Daleks don't make an appearance next year. We've seen enough of them for the time being, I reckon. Time to give another baddie, or bunch of baddies, a go.

Oh, I liked Catherine Tate's cameo. Yar boo.
 
 
Billuccho!
21:10 / 09.07.06
Well, I liked it. The end destroyed me. So, yes, I am now, officially, hopelessly hooked on this show forever. This was a "Buffy s2/Becoming pt 2" moment for me.

Also, Tennant is, as far as I can tell, miles better than Tom Baker.
 
 
Evil Scientist
21:27 / 09.07.06
Cybermen being vulnerable to gold was the sort of thing that a talented ideas man, like, say, Mr Groo Mornigan would have a field day with. It wouldn't look daft it would look frightening, and impenetrably strange and would in some poetic way be forced to make a degree of sense.

Makes it way too easy to kill them though. An invasion of parallel earth Cybermen is much more scary when it takes a bazooka to kill just one of them. An actual gold weakness would have been a bit, well, crappy. Glint Morribund's JLA work featured a superhuman invasion of Earth where the common folk of the DC universe drove them off with fire. Which was all well and good but a gold-based version would have made the instantaneous victory of the Cybermen in Army of Ghosts a bit less effective, dramatically speaking.

I personnally liked the massive difference between Dalek and Cyberman technologies. I'd been hoping for one of the Order of Skaro to get zombie-mobbed by twenty Cybermen and cracked open by weight of numbers. But it still looked good. The Cybers aren't really much more advanced than the civilisation they've spawned from anyway, whilst the Daleks were hard enough to threaten the Time Lords.

Proper Daleks, absolutely refusing to ally with "inferior" organisms.

Is it me or does it feel like Daleks have always flown? They look so right sweeping in on their hapless targets in wave upon wave.

Hopefully they'll give them a rest for a season though. Cybermen too. Let's either have a brand new big bad for next year's finale or a different "Classic".
 
 
iamus
22:09 / 09.07.06
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iamus
22:09 / 09.07.06
...
 
 
iamus
22:10 / 09.07.06
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Mister Six, whom all the girls
23:40 / 09.07.06
Also, Tennant is, as far as I can tell, miles better than Tom Baker.

Bill R, you are one lucky guy.
 
 
Billuccho!
02:25 / 10.07.06
Bill R, you are one lucky guy.

Why? Did the hitmen fail?
 
 
iamus
02:59 / 10.07.06
See all you people that are picking holes in this, with your...

"I'm not too blah blah blah about the way the handled the blah blah blah. I think it would have been better if blah blah blah had blah blah blahed instead of blah blah blahing."

Gonnae stop? Unlock that beautiful Tardis called your heart and let it whisk you away on wonderful adventures. Don't worry about where you end up, just enjoy the ride as it happens, warts and all. The Doctor would want it that way. He shows you a better way of living your life.



Okay. So as is probably a little self-evident, I thought this was really rather good. At several points during, Squeee escaped from my mouth and I drummed my knees like a set of joy-bongos. It's easy to rip to shreds, but doing that tears all the fun into wee bits too, and that kind of defeats the whole point of Dr. Who, doesn't it?

Anyway.

The more I watch of this, the more impressed I get by it. It's a very odd show where structure is concerned, because it seems to be handled unlike any other program I can think of. For all the clunky, repeated name-dropping, and dodgy plot resolutions there is a lot of very complex and subtle character stuff going on, stretching behind it all on a very slow burn. So much so, that I think a lot of stuff only really begins to show itself when you start stitching both seasons together. I'm increasingly convinced that there's a long game (oooooo, see what I did there?) here. Time Lord stuff, Time War stuff...... It's all been coming since the start, it just needs time to ripen.

Over both seasons there are lines of dialogue here and there, behavioural tics and stuff, that all pile up on top of each other to build a bigger picture. Not so much like, say, Buffy, where Theme X is explicitly mirrored in Demon Y this week so that at the end we can have Revelation Z in order to start afresh again next season. Here we have new, unrelated situations coming out of left-field with every adventure, woven together by the threads of The Doctor and Rose with the Tardis as the needle.

At least for the most part. Obvious exceptions are the Big Thematic Numbers. Finales and setups and stuff.

That's not as clear as I'd like. No matter. I can clean up later. I'm not really sure where to begin. There's a whole muddle of brain-dump to be done here and no coherent order, so I apologise in advance........



Rose Rose Rose... I was done with her five minutes into the story. She then cried her way through the remainder of the episode and kept insisting on staying with the Doctor who strangely seemed ready to see her go

You're kind of doomed from the start then, because that's the payoff for everything this season's been building to thematically, and it's all solidly grounded.

There’s a reason The Doctor seems so nonchalant about the fact that he’s going to have to send her away.There’s a reason he doesn’t just fall to the ground in a heap when the void closes them off. There's a reason he stalls saying he loves her until he gets cut off.

Mortal/Time Lord. He may have tried to convince himself it was different with Rose after what she managed in Parting of the Ways, but he’s always known. One way or another it’s ending in a Madame du Pompadour. So like with all the stuff that really depresses him, the dark emotions that get in the way of his responsibilities, (his guilt over the fall of Arcadia, the inevitability of losing Rose) he sticks his fingers in his ears and goes la la la.

Except..... when it comes to sending Rose away he has no quips. He can’t dance around it and he certainly can’t deal with it so he has no option but to put it on ignore. There’s a billion Cybermen and a billion Daleks out there and a Doctor’s work is more important. His Hippocratic Oath to the universe pre-empts everything. That’s why he’s always going to be lonely.

You know that grin that Eccleston would flash about here and there? Full of manic energy but cracked around the edges? This regeneration is that to the power of Tennant. It's a lot more convincing (to himself and others) this time round, but we're shown here that it's not fool-proof.

Rose isn't daft either. She's known as well as he has. School Reunion, Girl in the Fireplace. She's just been hoping that the last-minute Tardis turnaround of Satan Pit can be the rule rather than the exception.



As for the Tardis.... This is something that I think is one of those behind-the-scenes slow-burners. Now stretched over both seasons, we're building up a view of the Doctor/Tardis relationship, and you know what? It’s one of the great buddy pairings of all time!

The Tardis isn’t just his Millennium Falcon, it’s also his Chewie. His constant companion that speaks in a language only he understands. It’s fiercely loyal to him above all others, but it takes those he lets into his life under its wing too. Impossible Planet and Satan Pit were the biggest episodes for Tardis relationship stuff this season, Parting of Ways was last season’s.

In IP, when The Doctor thinks he’s lost it to the pit, he has a conniption fit. He says quite plainly that “it’s all I have, literally the only thing” even when Rose is standing right next to him.

He’s right. It’s the only thing that will always be there, because it’s the only thing that can. When it falls into the pit, only to be found again at just the right moment, it’s kind of missing the point to say it’s all very convenient, or to wonder how it managed to get down there. It’s there at just the right moment because it’s THE TARDIS! It’s got his back. Whenever the Doctor risks it all to do his thing, whenever he cuts the cord and commits to the fall, it’ll always be there to catch him. Because it loves him and it’ll never leave him.

It does the same thing in Parting. It opens up its most intimate self to Rose because of their deep, shared devotion to The Doctor. They both need to stand with him and do everything in their power to prevent him from coming to harm. Neither of them are going to roll over and die while he fights on alone.

The Tardis is a character like any other. It’s very quiet about it, (it literally IS the background) but it’s always observing, and just like the Doctor it has a very deep emotional life hiding inside.



Ech.... you know what? It's five in the morning, I think I should maybe come back to this later when I can write with something resembling structure. Maybe an essay of some sort might be in order.
 
 
iamus
03:12 / 10.07.06
Oh and the Catherine Tateification of the ending was pitch-perfect. A total smack across the side of the head that points to perfect Christmas fun. I'm holding back on critiquing her Doctor Who performance until she actually gives us one to go on.

I'd like to see her leave him in the dust. Development on all the "don't be such a smart-arse" stuff going on during this episode.
 
 
Sax
06:22 / 10.07.06
I blubbed.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
09:47 / 10.07.06
Did anyone else notice the Dalek who sqawked "EXECUTE TEMPORAL SHIFT" as he was getting sucked into the Void? Apparently it then vanished, so we've not seen the last of them... Which is great!

Favourite bit of Dalek/Cybermen bitching: when they're arguing about which one should identify themselves first, and one of the Daleks says the word "Dalek", leading a Cyberman to say "You have self-identified as Dalek!", like "Aha! Gotcha!"
 
 
Evil Scientist
10:12 / 10.07.06
Did anyone else notice the Dalek who sqawked "EXECUTE TEMPORAL SHIFT" as he was getting sucked into the Void? Apparently it then vanished, so we've not seen the last of them... Which is great!

Yeah, the Black Dalek was the one that time-jumped away.
 
 
The Strobe
10:50 / 10.07.06
Favourite bit of Dalek/Cybermen bitching: when they're arguing about which one should identify themselves first, and one of the Daleks says the word "Dalek", leading a Cyberman to say "You have self-identified as Dalek!", like "Aha! Gotcha!"

I loved this, mainly because I was convinced it's a reference here to Dad's Army:

"Don't tell him, Pike!"

etc.
 
 
adamswish
11:48 / 10.07.06
I loved the last episode. Went into it fully "knowing"* that Rose wasn't going to die then they threw me the second curveball when she headed towards the breach only to be saved by "Dad" (may of even cheered and whooped).

The first curveball was that I convinced myself that it was Davros inside the "Genisis Ark" but the eventual explanation fitted right in and just seemed so simple and right to me.

Other areas of love: Daleks and CYbermen arguing and the Daleks ultimately identifying themselves (head soundtack had a Simpson's "D'oh" right after the statement plus head also came up with a height gag when the black Dalek [didn't catch his name] started about what the only thing the cybermen are better then them at); Rose lording it up over the four Daleks about her knowledge about them and just what she did to the Emperor, and her great joy at their reaction to the news of the Doctor being there; the Doctor's reaction to the Bride; and of course the crying cyberman too.


*in my own head anyway
 
 
iamus
11:57 / 10.07.06
Ah... would anybody be interested in me starting a thread for general discussion on the series as a whole? A sort of overview thing, like the way Seven soldiers was handled in comics?

Was thinking it might be a bit of overkill, but there could be a call for it. Any takers?
 
 
Triplets
12:48 / 10.07.06
If it's anything like your Tardis post then yes. Yes indeed.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
14:25 / 10.07.06
Bit disappointed that no-one seems to have picked up on the fact that the Doctor was sending everyone to Hell, Billie was falling in, then Pete jumps in out of nowhere to catch her, how does he know what's happening in our universe? We saw no monitors in their world, just a wrecked Torchwood. I think Rose is in Hell. Her Hell is being with a boy she no longer loves, a mother she's outgrown and a man who looks like her father but who isn't. And the one man she loved she can't ever see again. Welcome to Hell Rose Tyler.
 
 
Eloi Tsabaoth
14:36 / 10.07.06
Thanks for that, Our Lady Of The Buzz-kill. It's obvious to anyone paying attention that when they raided Parallel Torchwood they found some kind of 'alien viewing sphere' that allowed them to see into the other dimension, which is how they knew to jump in commando style in their first appearance, and Pete just used that.
 
  

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