BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Marvel's 'Civil War'.

 
  

Page: 1 ... 45678(9)1011121314... 21

 
 
Professor Silly
18:32 / 05.06.06
...I mean, what are JJJ's choices, really?

If he continues his stance of attacking Spider-Man's credibility, then he is attacking a de facto government employee; in so doing he would have to question the whole registration act, which would require him to (in essence) condone the very masked actions he's argued against all these years. Such a course would likely seem very transparent to the public at large as petty and hypocritical. I would think the more strategic route for the paper would be to embrace Spider-Man's unmasking and be pro-registration, but can Jameson put his feelings of failure (at never unmasking Spider-Man himself, even though the answer was right under his nose the entire time) aside and do what's best for his paper? Jameson has never seemed very rational, so I have no idea.

And then there's the other heroes' reactions to consider: will they look up to Peter for being a good example, for putting his private life aside and risking all for a principal, or will they view him as an opportunistic sell-out? We'll probably see a combination of the two from the various factions throughout the war. I imagine Captain America will have respect for Peter's decision, even if he's willing to beat the snot out of him when push comes to shove. The mutants out there will probably view him as a pretty-boy sell-out, especially those mutants that don't "fit in" physically. So the question in my mind is this: will Peter's unmasking inspire any others to follow his example?
 
 
Jack Denfeld
18:57 / 05.06.06
Put me in the Spidey will unmask but end up on Cap's side anyways camp.
 
 
Spaniel
18:58 / 05.06.06
Yeah, after rereading I'm aware that both May and MJ are singing from the unmasking hymn sheet. Anyway, the specifics aside - and I think Jonah's reaction is another potential problem for the Parkers - I'll be very surprised if the events of CW, and principally the unmasking (or not), don't eventually lead to the breakdown of the Parkers' marriage. My main reasons for thinking this are twofold. Firstly Quesada is going on about this stuff right now, and secondly, right now happens to coincide with what is bound to be an exceptionally turbulant time for Peter and MJ, and, you know, divorces and turbulant times tend to go hand in hand.
Whether the break-up happens during the events of CW or in the crossover's wake is only the question, as far as I'm concerned.
 
 
Spaniel
19:06 / 05.06.06
Put me in the Spidey will unmask but end up on Cap's side anyways camp.

Whatever happens Spidey is gonna wobble. He's the master of angst, he *has* to wobble.
 
 
Professor Silly
19:46 / 08.06.06
Civil War: Front Line answered some of our most recent questions regarding J. Jonah Jameson (he's pro-registration--no surprise there)...but not the most crucial one, which is "how does he react if/when Spider-Man reveals his secret identity?" Otherwise it focused on Iron Man and Spider-Man (and touched upon the power of a superhero to turn an otherwise professional journlist into a spandex-groupie...tee hee hee AND I QUOTE: "Spider-Man showed you his what?!?")

Another part focused on Speedball and all the trouble he's in now (they're gonna make him a scapegoat of sorts). The drawing of the explosion from Speedball's perspective really moved me (no pun intended).

It also had a beautiful short (four pages or so) referencing the internment of Japanese-Americans during WWII drawn by (I'd assume) a Japanese artist.
 
 
rabideyemovement
23:58 / 08.06.06
Frontline convinced me that Spidey is definietly going to unmask. I'll try and withold my astonishment and ire and just prepare myself for what had better be some original plotlines.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:36 / 14.06.06
Aw man, Yahoo News just spoiled me on Civil War #2. That kinda sucks. Stay away from CNN and Yahoo News today, dear readers, if you don't want to get spoiled!
 
 
matthew.
21:10 / 14.06.06
Don't even hover over the link if you don't want spoilers.


Major spoilers coming from... New York Post?
 
 
FinderWolf
01:30 / 15.06.06
oh boy.



oh boy.





SPOOOOOIII

IIIILLLL

ERS.


>>>>



seriously.

So, not a hoax, not a dream, not an imaginary story.

Peter Parker says to the world at a press conference that he is Spider-Man. JJJ is watching from his office on TV, of course.

Can they ever put this genie back in the bottle? I mean, of course they can, this is comics. This may lead to the dissolving of Peter and MJ's marriage, as Joe Q. has hinted, but then again, Joe Q. teased that Speedball would be dead in CW and he's very much alive. (the two characters are hardly analoguous in status of course)

I must confess, I didn't expect this and was genuinely floored when I read it. Feels kind of cool to see Marvel doing something this radical.
 
 
Slim
01:54 / 15.06.06
Joe Q. has mentioned that he doesn't like Spider-Man being married so I'd start the countdown to the end of Parker's relationship with MJ.
 
 
matthew.
02:01 / 15.06.06
Certainly radical enough to warrant attention from the New York Post, among other luminaries of the mainstream press. I admit, it's fairly cool.

I'm really interested in how this plays out between MJ and Peter.

I can already envision a graphic novel written by Peter David that shows only the disintegration of their marriage.
 
 
Spyder Todd 2008
03:13 / 15.06.06
I can already envision a graphic novel written by Peter David that shows only the disintegration of their marriage.

Well, it would be a far better read than a story about Osborn and Gwen making Goblin babies.

But I'm not bitter.
 
 
Professor Silly
04:15 / 15.06.06
At the very least he will now be able to patent and develop other uses for his synthetic webbing, potentially setting himself up financially for life.

I love that JJJ fainted/fell out of his chair at the news.
 
 
Jake, Colossus of Clout
04:40 / 15.06.06
Great. Let's dissolve one of the greatest relationships in comics history for the spectacle of it. We already have a single Spidey in the Ultimate version! I like the Spidey/Kitty Pryde storyline in that book, actually, but Peter and MJ have been married since 1988 or something! That has to be a comics record! I grew up with those two, being a little too young to see Gwen Stacy in new comics, and I just think it would be such a shame to break them up in a stupid "big event" comic.

Gah! I don't have a problem with Spidey unmasking. That's really cool and intriguing, and could lead to graet stories, but, really, fuck Quesada if this is some way to get Peter and MJ divorced.

I have some serious fanboy rage right now.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
12:41 / 15.06.06
I read the JMS/Quesada interview where they looked at the marriage as a major knee-capping for telling stories (which I think says moee about them as ppl than Spider-man comics, but never mind...) and that at the end of Civil wat Peter would be right back where Lee and Ditko started him... which is terribly strange to say as I'm sure he doesn't mean Peter will be going back to High School, living with his ailing Aunt and fighting the Sandman.

There are numerous tales to tell with a married Peter. The creators are just confused as to what to do for whatever reason.

It's a major problem only in that Peter Parker was supposed to be a hardluck case and now he's an Avenger with a hot model for a wife. Q and JMS are going to destroy all that (from the interview I read).

I just hope Peter gets smart again. He's been a major dufus the past few years and it doesn't fit his character.

You Essential Spidey readers out there know what I'm talking about. He should be a scientist by now surely! Making him a teacher was a great idea but got plagued by lost opportunities.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:19 / 15.06.06
Hmm...how can they 'return him to where he was during Lee/Ditko' if the whole world knows his ID?

Let's imagine possible ways they could 'erase' the world now knowing his ID:

1) Elaborate scheme to convince the public that "Peter Parker is Spider-Man" was a hoax
2) Scarlet Witch goes wonky again in a HoM-type way
3) Dr. Strange magically erases the world's memory of Peter being Spidey to help his friend, Strange experiences guilt and angst at messing with so many people's mind afterwards.
4) Peter fakes his own death and so when Spider-Man shows up, no one who knows who this 'new' Spidey is
5) Johnny Storm accidentally sets Ultimate Nullifier to 'make everyone forget a particular hero's secret ID'
6) Crisis in Infinite Marvel Universe has Korvac squishing multiple Marvel earths together and pressing huge red cosmic button marked "REBOOT UNIVERSE" as Uatu the Watcher looks on, taking notes for his autobiography
7) Seven men come forward all claiming to be Spider-Man in "Reign of the Spider-Men" and the public, having a fickle and short-term memory, is confused and soon forgets Peter is Spidey or assumes there must have been some mistake in Peter unmasking
8) The gov't has the entire public abducted by aliens, one by one, and each time the aliens give an anal probe, take DNA and erase the memory that Peter Parker is Spider-Man
9) Kraven the Hunter returns from the dead (again) and delcares to a bewildered public that the noble warrior he faced couldn't possibly be Peter Parker, out a feeling of obligation to Peter since Peter bested him in dramatic J.M.DeMatteis-written combat
10) Peter goes on the Today show and claims it was all just a stunt to get attention and he really is a janitor with no super-powers whatsoever, Matt Lauer laughs along and the public believes it

Any others?
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
13:53 / 15.06.06
I don't get why people are already jumping to The Divorce Card. MJ and May are in his corner. She could very well get chopped up and thrown into a refrigerator, but they won't be getting divorced any time soon.

BTW, I loved the opening of the book, the idea that Cap's going on a rampage of justice just say "Fuck You", and we don't see any of it.
 
 
FinderWolf
14:04 / 15.06.06
people are talking about the marriage maybe going bye-bye because Joe Q. has been talking about it SOOO much and hinting that developments on that front are on their way very soon. And this ID reveal seems like the beginning of a chain of events which may be related to the marriage thing happening.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
14:33 / 15.06.06
If Marvel, as opposed to Joe Q, does have problems with Peter/Mary Jane, it's their own damn fault. They could have instructed their writers back when Joe took over to soft-pedal and slowly 'forget' that MJ was a superstar actress/model, they could have made that one of the post-'House of M' reality changes. After all, Spidey goes out every night and leaves MJ alone while he fights crime. But who would have had the choice to retcon MJ from super-model to regular person? Who had final say over the already Overexposed Web-Slinger joining the Avengers? I think Joe is blaming a fictional character's marriage for his own problems of leadership.

So presumably Sue and Reed Richards will be splitting up as well, although quite who still reads that book any more is a mystery.

A good story is not made bad because Peter Parker is married. A bad story does not magically become good if he's divorced. He's no more magically everyman divorced than married. If Joe Q thinks stories with married Spidey suck then he should fire the writers.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
14:37 / 15.06.06
Oh, I know all about Joey Da Q's ranting, I just don't see this heading in that direction.
 
 
matthew.
14:42 / 15.06.06
A good story is not made bad because Peter Parker is married. A bad story does not magically become good if he's divorced.

It's not that making Parker divorced makes for better stories, but it makes for more interesting stories. Parker has been married since 1987. Since then, there has been 3 major Spider-titles and some others. Writers have not exhausted the marriage aspect of Spider-man, I admit that.

For me, the status quo has always been Parker=married. I never read the older issues until I was older. So this year, with the unmasking and a potential divorce is very interesting because it overturns the status quo at least for awhile. It gives the writers opportunities to write different stories than the ones they currently write. I think, therefore, that a divorced Parker means potentially more interesting stories because it's new.

Parker has never been divorced. Ergo, it's interesting.
 
 
Professor Silly
15:18 / 15.06.06
Anyone else notice Cable has joined Captain America's group?

I also enjoyed reactions to Peter's decision over in the Thunderbolts tie-in:

"He's MY age!"
"Looks like a SCIENCE DWEEB. Now I'm embarrassed he cleaned my clock."
"Out identities have pretty much been PUBLIC JOKES for years--but for Spider-Man to do this...".

I'm assuming that I'm the only one gullible enough to be picking up all the tie-ins (so sad)...so in the interest of keeping everyone informed I'll sum it up: Iron Man ask Zemo and the Thunderbolts to begin apprehending villians and to try and convince them to go legit and join Iron Man's army. Zemo has already been apprehending villians for three weeks and has other plans (including the use of dream control to brainwash them to his way of thinking).

(yes, that means I've been getting Fantasic Four too--I'm terribly ashamed at my lack of control)
 
 
Spyder Todd 2008
15:54 / 15.06.06
Parker has never been divorced. Ergo, it's interesting.

Maybe not divorced exactly, but close enough. Back in the late 90's/early 2000's during the whole "Mary Jane's dead!" "No she's not!" "Well we're still breaking up!" thing, MJ "died" in a plane crash leaving Peter single. Then, when she inevitably turned out not dead, she decided to stay separated from Peter. This stayed that way until *gasp* JMS under Joey Q's reign. So yeah. They had a (mostly) single Peter Parker. And they ended that themselves. They should quit bitching.
 
 
Slim
18:45 / 15.06.06
If writers are tired of the MJ-Peter relationship why don't they actually let it advance in some way? Make MJ more independent, give her a different career, give them children. After nearly 20 years any comic marriage is going to go stale if it's never allowed to progress in some fashion.
 
 
Spaniel
22:04 / 15.06.06
Oh, I know all about Joey Da Q's ranting, I just don't see this heading in that direction.

I'm pretty sure Q doesn't go on about this stuff for laughs.
Also, check out the cover to issue 5 and think about the implications.

I'm actually prepared to bet actual English pounds that CW leads to MJ and Peter splitting up.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
01:39 / 16.06.06
Regardless of the implications for the Marvel Universe post-'all this' though, it does seem like incredibly shoddily-written tat. If this was ever going to turn out all right (as looked possible after the Illuminati thing, but now seems unlikely,) it would have needed a writer who betrayed at least a working understanding of the characters involved (relationships going back twenty years, which hav survive numerous alien invasions, attempts at mind control etc, who hav defend teh Hulk, ie, who wouldn't, necessarily, turn on each other at the drop of a bad incident or two, so you'd have to explain their reasoning a little,) as opposed to the bad Mark Millar they've left in charge. As it is though, it reads like something a thirteen year old kid might have banged out on the back of a Cheerios packet after one too many ritalins, as a means of explaining to Marvel Comics that he was not very happy about school and so on (not on ritalin as a younger old woman, I remember thinking that a way of improving the Fantastic Four would be to kill at least two of them, and then watch the others suffer - the letters to Marvel were understandably not answered,) and while OK, Mark Millar hasn't been well lately, I'm still not sure why the board of directors is allowing him to make such a mess of a franchise that's otherwise been quite healthy, recently. It's going to take the Bullpen a couple of years to tidy this up, which would be fine, I suppose, but it's not even all that entertaining watching them get themselves into it.

*takes medication, calms down a bit*

And there probably will be a twist in the tale. Well there's going to have to be anyway, otherwise how is say Spiderman (whose adventures admittedly, I've always found a bit tiring,) going to go back to just fighting the Lizard or whoever, if in every single episode he has to deal with SHIELD? It's going to get terribly old, and very quickly. Boring enough to write this stuff, I'd imagine, with that much back story, but who in their right mind, as a thirteen year old kid, is going to want to read it?

Meanwhile, the grotesque gnome of Coatbridge, Scotland, pleasures himself quietly into his wad of filthy lucre ...

(MILLAR, in high-pitched, Jimmie Krankie squeal)

'Stan, Jack ... They may remember you fondly, but they'll never forget me!'

I suppose the last thing to ask, as a deadpool-type scenario, is which of the Young Avengers we feel is going to get ass-raped first?
 
 
Alex's Grandma
01:54 / 16.06.06
(I now gather off the interweb that a couple of the Young Avengers haven't been characterised as 100% red-blooded, practising Christians, so God help them really.)
 
 
Jack Denfeld
05:37 / 16.06.06
Civil War 2 thoughts and spoilers
Woohoo! The Cap and Falcon show, Viva La Resistance! Goddamn I love those characters. And Patriot is bomb proof now! And Nick Fury's around somewhere, the one guy who always stays good when SHIELD gets screwy. And Cable's on the team? Uhm....ok, sure why not?

Reed seems really happy about this plan 42 superjail or whatever, so I'm gonna assume it's not some deathcamp unless Reed just fell off his rocker. Tony shows a moment of doubt but probably thinks his way through it.

And on to Spider-Man. Did you see how proud Aunt May and MJ looked before his reveal? Here's the deal, Spidey thinks he's doing the right thing. His family thinks it's the right thing, his mentor father figure thinks it's the right thing, and Peter thinks he's doing all these people and his Uncle Ben proud. Jonah must be really pissed that Peter sold pictures of himself to the Bugel for years.

And here's the thing about Spidey as a comic character. I think over the years he's become like Superman, everyone loves the character and knows the basic premise, but no one really reads or cares about his books. And the character's still new enough in comics that they can still make a major change like an ID reveal.

My only problem with the book was that it read way too fast, and I kind of wish Frontline was just a more detailed series on the two opposing teams tactics and strategies and battles between each other.

Cap's resistance reads like really cool old GIJoe special missions comics.
 
 
rabideyemovement
14:21 / 16.06.06
Millar said that Cable isn't on the team. He just happened to be there at that time due to circumstances that will take place in the next ish of Cable/Deadpool...
I am very intrigued by the other people on Cap's team though... Cloak and Dagger! And the man I assume is the new Daredevil (certain friends are convinced that is Clint Barton in the DD getup).
I thought Spidey is supposed to be a genius. Unmasking himself is gonna prove to be the dumbest move he ever made.
 
 
FinderWolf
14:23 / 16.06.06
Millar from a recent Newsarama interview (this is the only thing in the interview of much substance and it's really only saying "more big things are coming," but I thought it was fun):

>> But anyone who thinks we've blown our wad with issue #2 is in for a pleasant surprise. I've pleaded with Marvel to keep details of this series secret because numbers are great anyway and I don't think we need to leak anything to inflate sales. The sales are there so I want to use that opportunity to surprise people and let them get find out about this story as they turn the pages. The original Crisis was like a 12 month epileptic fit to me because it was shock after shock and I had no idea what was coming next. I'd like to replicate that same experience for people here and it's funny because readers genuinely have no idea what's coming.
 
 
FinderWolf
14:35 / 16.06.06
There are potential spoilers as to the ID of the "new" Daredevil in another thread here...I've heard this guess before and it seems viable to me. Clint Barton is a new guess to my [virtual] ears, and actually a pretty good one. (I guess we have to factor in the guy looking sort of sarcastic/evil-lish flipping a coin in CW #1)
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:37 / 16.06.06
In that same Newsarama interview it is revealed that Tony Stark has a plan for something called 'The Initiative'.



Yeah!
 
 
FinderWolf
14:56 / 16.06.06
Ok, so CW has hinted at "the 42 Intiative" being a super-prison...I'm guessing it's going to be technology like the Joss Whedon-created Astonishing/X3 'cure for mutants' that de-powers heroes who don't comply with The Program.
 
 
Mr Tricks
16:13 / 16.06.06
SO, I'm wondering who the hell was the bald guy sitting at the "monitor" chatting with Daredevil.

would that be Deadpool?
 
 
Jack Denfeld
19:33 / 16.06.06
I'm kinda thinking Hawkeye too now. The coinflipping thing was kinda Bullseyeish, and Millar writes Ultimate Hawkeye like Bullseye, and Hawkeye always has Cap's back. But who knows.

I wondered about the guy talking to Daredevil too, at first I thought it was a horribly drawn Luke Cage, but I guess it might be Deadpool, that would make more sense.

And again, Millar loves giant superheroes.
 
  

Page: 1 ... 45678(9)1011121314... 21

 
  
Add Your Reply