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Lost (US thread)

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23:41 / 24.11.05

OMFG, I so enjoyed that episode. In fact, I'm gonna own up, I'm loving Lost loads.

Right then, that's the last time I get involved in such a completely polarised debate. It made me miss what I like the most about this kind of show: the speculation.

For the record, and at risk of sounding totally up myself, I thought AL was a cop after the first Tailender episode. I didn't focus on the notion, however, because, as a response to the Barbedebate, I got caught up in thinking that her demeanour must have been a response to her situation, despite the fact that in the back on my mind there was a voice telling me that she was displaying perfectly understandable responses to an awful situation. Now, whilst I still think her behaviour would have been understandable IRL, I should have realised that Lost, in common with most drama, has its own set of rules: plane crashes, etc don't matter, what matters (in Lost) is your past, and your past will be expanded upon, and will descrive further action.

Also, did anyone else think that Eko and Locke would be the first to meet and bond? In shows like Lost, that like to set up a faith vs science divide, I think it's pretty obvious where the alliances will spring into life.

My latest prediction? Despite appearances, at the end of the day there's going to be romance between AL and Sayid. Why do I think this? Because Lost thrives on conventional modes of dramatic tension and these guys are about as far apart as you can get at the moment.

Just my two pennorth, but this show is getting funner and funner.

23:43 / 24.11.05

And, Keith, sorry, man. It's me that wasn't reading posts properly. The whole AL copthing should have been directed at Alex Thoth.

23:46 / 24.11.05

Because Lost thrives on conventional modes of dramatic tension and these guys are about as far apart as you can get at the moment

In addition to this, Lost is a very much a heteronormative environment, and in heteronormative drama men and women who are hugely at odds with each other usually end up together.

00:18 / 25.11.05

I can, and should, expand on my last post but I'm bit tired right now.

02:00 / 25.11.05

these guys are about as far apart as you can get at the moment

Not really. There was that line when he refuses to kill her where he says something like "what's the use if we are both dead already" or summink like that. AL and Sayid are only really different by the (in)convenient matter of Shannon's death.

Liked lots about this. Rose and Bernard. Sun and Jin. Jack, Kate and Sawyer in steamy three-way feverfest. I think it had the biggest season one community vibe about it of any episode since the season began.

Ana-Lucia just needs a hug.
Anyone think she'll overcome her negative press among the Lostaways by foiling an Aaron-snatching plot? She's put the others-hatred and the baby-love high up on her CV.

06:46 / 25.11.05

I think the moment where Locke and Eko meet in the hatch was hilarious.

But the true character moment, the reason that I love Sayid so much, is that, tied up and beaten, the first thing he says when he sees Michael is, "Where's Walt." That was just great, and in many ways encapsulated the character for me.

09:29 / 25.11.05

Not really. There was that line when he refuses to kill her where he says something like "what's the use if we are both dead already" or summink like that. AL and Sayid are only really different by the (in)convenient matter of Shannon's death.

True, and if there's to be any romance there needs to some strong common ground (Kate and Sawyer, anyone?), but there has to be something powerful that keeps them apart - like one of them being responsible for the death of the other's beau. Helps to create drama, like.

Of course, the thing that could scupper my theory is the possible AL and Jack romance that seems to be lurking in the background - especially now that it looks like a Kate and Sawyer romantic entanglement is right around the corner. I'll be interested to see how their (AL and Jack's) relationship develops next episode.

For the record, if any romance between AL and Sayid does materialise, I don't expect it be for quite a while.

12:48 / 25.11.05

I don't really see Sayid and Ana-Lucia becoming an item. I think with them it's more like the Angel and Faith relationship: "I see my bad past reflected in your present and I want to help you through it."

I suspect Kate will spurn Jack for Sawyer, sending Jack into the arms of Ana-Lucia.

But that said, I still find the potential romances on this show extremely hard to guess. For most of season one, I was expecting the Michael-Sun-Jin triangle, which never quite materialized. And then just when I thought they'd forgotten about that, who's the first person Michael sees when gets back to the castaway camp: Sun. (And there are no coincidences on this show, only contrivances.)

13:18 / 25.11.05

who's the first person Michael sees when gets back to the castaway camp: Sun.

I thought that too, but it's possible that it's simple drama maths. Sun and Jin have to get held off until the end of the episode. Sawyer's incapacitated. Micheal's the only one able to deliver the news. And it has to happen because Sun needs some screentime to set up the fact that Jin is coming back to her.

I think the S/M/J triangle was primarly to set up an antagonistic relationship between Jin and Micheal that could be resolved over building the raft. That way, Jin's struggle to become part of the group has a personal arc that reflects his more general social one.

the first thing he says when he sees Michael is, "Where's Walt."

But does anybody think it was a bit odd that he didn't say something along the lines of... "What are you talking about? Right before you turned the corner, he was standing there, dripping wet and talking backwards! And now these people who killed my girlfriend and tied me up are holding you at gunpoint?! OMG! WTF!", etc. etc.?

20:31 / 25.11.05

ok after having avoided this thread until I saw eps 7 and 8 its kind of funny to see how these epiodes shine a light on AL's character.
Don't get me wrong. I hated the bitch the first time she started beating up the raftaways (love the terms you folks have been coming up with) plus I never really bought her character in Resident Evil and so had issues with the actress before she came on board. 7 & 8 managed to soo thoroughly throw these assumptions that I must presume that the producers intended this.
I think the entire tailaways episode, including the drumbeat accompanied "skipping" of scenes we've already seen was one of the strongets episodes of lost to date and really explained how AL got the way she was.
She was normal in those first few days and partnered with how fucked up she was as a cop I've been convinced the girl can act ( and as I said I never really liked the actress)
I have been converted hallelujah!!
Still the lag between episodes is beggining to grate for those of us in the great republic of downloadia.
I was actually disappointed when we got back to watching Kate and Jack playing golf!
Fuck that !
Plus I agree with someones post earlier that Locke and Eko's introduction was the funniest thing on the show EVAR

.."hello" ..."hello"

by the way anyone else checked http://bigspaceship1.com/ lately?

Its now a picture of a load of syringes that link to a bay name definition for kathros and thr title of the page is a load of morse code that translates as :
three little children lay in in the bed two were sick and the other most dead sent for the doctor the doctor said feed those children on short ninbrea (d)

I presume this has something to do with the tailaways kids?

08:40 / 26.11.05

Grids, I think that the kind of relationship you describe for AL and Sayid is more than possible, and I too was predicting a Sun/Jin/Michael love triangle, and whilst I appreciate what Melrudeen has to say on the subject, I'm still not sure it's impossible. Every other first meeting in that show seemed to resonate - Locke & Eko, Sayid & AL, Jack & AL - I'm not sure that Michael and Sun was any different, especially given their past. Also, Sun and Jin are alright now, they're back together. They're nearing the end of their romantic arc, and when you reach the end of your romantic arc, well, the drama has to come from somewhere...

08:59 / 26.11.05

Just to take up Mes point more directly, I know what you're saying but I think you're missing a key point about screenwriting: make every scene work as hard as it can - get as much as possible from every scene. Sure, Sun and Mike's meeting could be simply functional, information is passed from a to b, storytelling, but I think it's pretty unlikely. As far as I'm concerned, at the very least we're being told their relationship is significant (whether it leads to romance or not is another question).

19:59 / 26.11.05

OH, crap -

http://www.buzzscope.com/news.php?id=2636

23:31 / 26.11.05

If that's a spoiler you can "oh, crap" away, but I ain't going to read it.

23:36 / 26.11.05

Oh Crap = Jeff Loeb joins the writing team on Lost.
Not sure why that's an "Oh Crap" but there are no spoilers on that link that I could see.

07:38 / 27.11.05

I could think of a couple "oh crap" reasons for Jeph Loeb joining Lost. Most have to do with overbearing dual captions (in this case, voiceovers), and scenes lifted whole from Godfather (think Jack sitting there granting favors from the Hatch). I only watched about half of the first season of Smallville, but it's kryptonite affected freak of the week schtick was enough to turn me off of Superman for a lifetime.

09:49 / 27.11.05

I hope Loeb makes Lost more like Commando

17:20 / 27.11.05

Possible SPOILERS...

After peeking at the S2 trailer ages ago it appears we may well have Locke blitzing through the jungle tightly gripping a well oiled barrel.

End SPOILERS

P. Horus Rhacoid

00:01 / 28.11.05

I hope Loeb makes Lost more like Commando.

Maybe the scene Triplets references above will be preceded by Locke emerging dripping from the ocean in his underwear and indulging in a two-minute montage of armor-donning and gun-cocking.

Yotsuba & Benjamin!

12:11 / 28.11.05

As long as that barrel is one of the massive Used-By-Roadblock M60 Chain Guns (I only know the name because I've been using it in Perfect Dark Zero) I am GAME.

15:17 / 28.11.05

I think A-L is going to end up being Jack's girl. Re-watching Season 1 on DVD, I realized Sawyer and Kate are too perfect a match, and the producers must realize how fond their female fans are of Sawyer. I went to a few Lost forums, and that was the hottest debate -- comparing the tepid Jack-Kate romance with the hot Sawyer-Kate romance; something to me which is one of the less interesting details of the show. Having A-L hit on Jack in the season finale seems to me a foreshadowing of future involvement between the two. Especially when you factor in how the show's been hammering in alternate versions of the same archetype, ie Sawyer/Kate, Eko/Locke, and Jack/A-L -- with one serving as an effective leader, and the other serving as a leader who makes rash decisions that sometimes negatively affect her followers.

Locke and Eko meeting first was definitely more foreshadowing. Especially since Locke was working on a crossword puzzle in which the clue was "Enkidu's friend," Enkidu being from the ancient epic Gilgamesh. Enkidu was the friend of Gilgamesh, and the two were brothers-in-arms, fighting side by side. So -- is Eko Enkidu, the friend of Locke (aka Gilgamesh)?

Regardless, I do hope to see these two fighting side by side and wasting droves of those annoying Others.

15:23 / 28.11.05

And maybe that's why they've brought in Loeb, to pen a COMMANDO-style episode in which Locke and Eko don combat gear, paint their faces with blue camo, and mow down hundreds of Others. Loeb would just need to figure out some way to bring in Rae Dawn Chong and Alyssa Milano -- and of course the Freddie Mercury-looking guy who played Bennet, surely the greatest villain in B-movie history: "I don't need no gun, Matrix!!"

And speaking of which, what kind of human being would have 'Matrix' for a last name??

P. Horus Rhacoid

23:39 / 28.11.05

I think Lost could definitely benefit from a healthy dose of Commando-style one-liners- "Don't disturb my friend. He's dead tired." "Let off some steam, Bennett" etc.

00:21 / 29.11.05

"It's time for a Lockedown!"

Cl-TCHK!

As far as I'm concerned, at the very least we're being told their relationship is significant

Looking back, I think gridley and you are actually right on that one. I dunno if it's going to be a romantic thing or not but yeah, it probably means there's something going on there.

00:36 / 29.11.05

"It's time for a Lockedown!"

Cl-TCHK!

This made me laugh so hard! Hell, I'm still laughing!

08:59 / 29.11.05

Lol

12:18 / 29.11.05

Back on topic, I've been thinking a lot about the Others, and why they take people. Ana-Lucia was told that the Others only take 'good people', and that they had a list of people to take.

This raises an interetsing point (well, to me at least). Anybody else notice that every fucking character has mummy/daddy issues (with, perhaps the exceptions of Charlie and Hurley, but then Charlie was a smackhead and Hurley's mum didn't look too pleased with him whenever she was shown)? Every flashback seems to revolve around exposing the parent issues that each character has. Jack and dad, Sawyer and dad, Shannon and Boone with their messed up family tree, Sun's gangster dad, Jin's disowning of his father, even Kate had that scene where her mum was dying and terrified of her. So could the 'catch' be that t'others are only abducting good kids/parents, perhaps to make a uptopian society inside the island -- maybe the kids they take aren't old enough to have issues with their parents yet(bet I'm waaaaaay off there though). Might fit in with the Dharma corp too, maybe they're the ones building the utopia filled with perfect parents and children.

At first I though all of the inter-generational stuff was just American drama assuming every family is fucked up, but it's getting to the point now that has some kind of deep dark secret aboout their parents. AL's flashbacks last week were the icing on the cake for me. C'mon! It's got to be about this.

Hasn't it?

14:25 / 29.11.05

Interesting but on current evidence I can't say I agree with you. I just think the parent thing is the most efficient way to get most Americans to relate to the show and makes for easy drama.

P. Horus Rhacoid

16:24 / 29.11.05

I think that, more broadly than parent issues, family issues in general seem to be a theme- there are a whole lot of people on the island who've had bad relationships. The only apparently successful relationship we've seen is the marriage between whats-her-name and Bernard, and we know fuck-all about their history together, so I suspect this is a case of realizing how much each means to the other only after losing them. I'm not sure it's actually significant in the way you think, though- i agree it could very well just be the writers trying to create drama.

What I do find really interesting as well is the fact that any good people were on the plane at all, given all we've seen of the island and the castaways so far.

It also seems odd the Others didn't try to take Claire's baby. One would think a couple-week-old baby would be as unsullied as a pair of six-year-olds. I assume there's a reason why they've stayed away from the castaways though. Claire's kidnapping belies this, though.

08:45 / 30.11.05

We still have no idea what happened to claire while she was away - I wouldn't be too suprized if she somehow started exhibiting some kind of Hanso foundation inspired powers and successfully beat off the others...

19:22 / 30.11.05

This weekend, late one night, I saw a commercial for a dating service 800-number which I swore I spotted Evangeline Lilly in. I just did a Google search and it turns out I was right; it's her in a commercial for LiveLinks, most likely filmed before she got her role as Kate.

1-800-Call-Kate

19:30 / 30.11.05

Unless she was doing the phone service Locke was calling. Remember he called Kate "Helen" in episode 4?

Keith, like a scientist

12:29 / 01.12.05

Ok, so the Kate story was kind of out of nowhere and a bit pointless, and the extra footage was pretty lame. You could easily infer what that information that was cut out from what the existing footage was saying, but...

"Dad?" was well worth it. Think of the ramifications!

"Others" occupying another station? Back to the theory that the Others are original scientists?

13:16 / 01.12.05

I agree with you Keith.

I posted a link earlier in the thread where a guy speculations seemed too brilliant to be true about what's really going on in the series.

My post here is http://barbelith.com/topic/19064/from/442 is in case anyone who didnt read it would like to take a look at it now. It's all speculation but with this week's episode it rings hauntingly true. Those very well could be the answers.

Did anyone else see the allegory from Mister Eko coming? I liked how he looked after watching the tape. I also like how he was looking at Locke when he was rambling about fate. I think the missing pieces were too much of a Deus Ex Machina.

It can't be Walt's words on the monitor. The response seemed calculated. New episode isn't for another six weeks and has the coolest preview.

Keith, like a scientist

14:27 / 01.12.05

I didn't read that theory the first time you posted it, but reading through it now, it's pretty well thought out and seems to bear some weight given the evidence. I didn't really understand all the "collective consciousness" stuff, though. One detail seems to be off, though. The orbit is 100 minutes, not 108. Not sure if that means much.

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