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Celebrity Big Brother 2007

 
  

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Lurid Archive
16:44 / 21.01.07
Which, in a way, I can understand, since I don't think there's a single straightforward explanation of the strength of (national, global) response to Jade's actions on CBB.

Isn't part of the reason that Jade herself is easy to demonise? She is white trash and a fat slag. It is almost comforting to hate the bigotry of the stupid fuckpig, because there is so little about her with which to identify.

I continue to have mixed feelings about all this. On the one hand, I'm glad that Jade is having to pay for her racism. On the other hand, the condemnations leave me feeling uneasy and I do feel rather sorry for her and what she is probably going to have to go through.
 
 
Spaniel
17:08 / 21.01.07
...And that this is yet another example of teh racists being othered. That concerns me.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
17:10 / 21.01.07
See some of the comments in the link I just posted. Some people don't understand the difference between, well, justice and vengeance, or sympathy and apologism.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
17:10 / 21.01.07
This is already seeming weirdly out of perspective.

Whether or not Jade is genuinely sorry for her antics (and I'll admit to feeling some sympathy for her during her performance on 'Little Brother' just now, even in my cold, blackened, miserable excuse for a heart,) teh fact remains that she got herself into this situation all by herself, and that her management, lawyers, PR people and such will have her out of it, largely unscathed, in two shakes of a lamb's tail. Or failing that, a couple of months.

So shall we not feel too sorry for her, at the moment?
 
 
Spaniel
17:10 / 21.01.07
What did Andi do that rocked?

(I'm not watching)
 
 
Ganesh
17:14 / 21.01.07
Isn't part of the reason that Jade herself is easy to demonise? She is white trash and a fat slag. It is almost comforting to hate the bigotry of the stupid fuckpig, because there is so little about her with which to identify.

More significantly, I think, she was loud, overbearing and appeared to assume the role of ringleader (or at least the most up-front) of Shilpa's tormentors. More than anything else, I think it's the latter that makes her an easy receptacle for our quite genuine outrage. The others may have been equally or more racist (as Andi Peters pointed out, Danielle was probably worse than Jade in terms of traditional send 'em back BNP-style sentiment) but Jade's central, vocal role in the targetting of Shilpa meant she drew the majority of fire for the racist element.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
17:34 / 21.01.07
What did Andi do that rocked?

He exposed himself.
 
 
Spaniel
17:38 / 21.01.07
Is it big?
 
 
Whisky Priestess
17:46 / 21.01.07
It's as big as his beautiful heart.

No, seriously though, what he did was remind people that Jo and Danielle were equally culpable and that the story doesn't end with the media lynching of Jade.

He was just very sensible and level-headed about the whole thing and took it seriously without taking sides or going massively overboard on the Jade-hate. He came across as an intelligent and balanced person with views to match.

Shame Edd the Duck wasn't with him though.
 
 
Spaniel
17:49 / 21.01.07
Fits with other times I've heard his opinions, actually. He's always (well, post CBBC anyway) struck me as a smart, thoughtful bloke.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
17:53 / 21.01.07
His feelings about things are taller than a mountain, and wider than a sea.

It's hard to believe that he's the same man who apparently forced the puppet to go back to the dressing room with him, in the way that he allegedly did. While he was working at Childrens' BBC.
 
 
Ganesh
17:55 / 21.01.07
He's certainly known for having a lovely "hairy anus".
 
 
miss wonderstarr
18:12 / 21.01.07
Isn't part of the reason that Jade herself is easy to demonise? She is white trash and a fat slag. It is almost comforting to hate the bigotry of the stupid fuckpig, because there is so little about her with which to identify.

For the majority of Barbelith contributors and for many media commentators, perhaps. But if Jade didn't seem accessible, appealing and easy-to-identify-with for millions of other people, she wouldn't have successfully shifted magazines, exercise DVDs and perfume during her years of considerable fame and fortune.
 
 
Ganesh
18:13 / 21.01.07
True. She wouldn't have been nearly as inflyential.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
18:38 / 21.01.07
Dr G;

That link to (what I'm assuming are) images of Andi Peters' unshaved arse doesn't appear to be working.

Is that a good thing, or is it a bad thing? I don't know, any more.
 
 
penitentvandal
19:13 / 21.01.07
Whether or not Jade is genuinely sorry for her antics (and I'll admit to feeling some sympathy for her during her performance on 'Little Brother' just now, even in my cold, blackened, miserable excuse for a heart,) teh fact remains that she got herself into this situation all by herself, and that her management, lawyers, PR people and such will have her out of it, largely unscathed, in two shakes of a lamb's tail. Or failing that, a couple of months.

So shall we not feel too sorry for her, at the moment?


I concur.

If Jade feels bad at the moment, then good, she should. The question is, does she feel bad because she abused and upset another human being, or because her career looks like it's about to go down the toilet?
 
 
Whisky Priestess
20:49 / 21.01.07
I have to say that I did get the impression that she was genuinely upset, and that the reason was that she had finally realised just how awful she and the others had made Shilpa feel.

From what I know of bullies, they very often are aware of what they're doing, but not really fully aware of the extent to which their words and actions are hurting the victim; basically, the problem is a partial or total lack of empathy (something I think is also associated with psychopaths - Doctor G?)

This is not, of course, to excuse anything Jade, Danielle, Jo or any other bully does or says, but I think the reason I believed Jade's upset and tears on BBLB was what she said about how devastated she would feel if somebody had been acting like that towards her kids, and how Shilpa's parents must have felt watching their daughter cry night after night.

From what I know and have read of her, Jade adores her kids, as pretty much all mothers do, and I can quite see how (hypothetically) putting her children in Shilpa's place and some other screaming, abusive bully in her own would bring home to her the sheer hatefulness of her behaviour and the pain it caused.

Of course she knows she's in a world of shit, and that can't help, but I did and do believe that her appalled reaction is due to realising how horribly and disgracefully she's behaved, what a poor example she's set for her kids and how her behaviour could seriously negatively impact on her children's happiness - compared to which, I should imagine, getting her perfume back on the shelves is the least of her worries.
 
 
Peek
20:53 / 21.01.07
I'm not sure Jade does understand what she's done wrong. She knows what people think she's done wrong but I don't think she sees it herself. Hence all the "IF I've offended anyone.." stuff.

I think it's more like she was all warm and cosy thriving on the girly support feedback and the Usnessness, and suddenly got thrust out into the withering cold, exposed, as it were, on the mountainside. Now she's all blinky and bewildered, bereft of Beavis and Butthead and suddenly nobody sees the joke any more.

Doesn't make it right, mind. I'm all for shining a withering light on comfy Our Tribe unpleasantness, of whatever stripe.

I'm rather bewildered myself at the emergence of Cleo as apparent stand-in ringleader.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
21:03 / 21.01.07
I'm utterly horrified at Dark Cleo.

I was in love with her a week ago.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
21:16 / 21.01.07
Well, I'm not surprised.

I didn't want to say anything earlier, but anyone who still rates Kenny Everett as a comedian possibly does have all kinds of issues.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
06:56 / 22.01.07
Well, in the IoS yesterday we had Tim Lott saying that this entire furore was only because Jade Goody was working class, fuck off Tim!, and someone else saying that Shilpa didn't speak for British Indians like her (I'm not sure Shilpa was supposed to, not being a British Indian herself).

Today the Sun help with the rebuilding of Goodtopia with the Jade is suicidal over the pain and distress she caused although having to spend half a week talking again and again about your bad behaviour would probably be draining on most people. Supposedly C4 is in crisis as well, though tucked away is an admission from TV bosses that they put Shilpa in the house in the hopes of getting some sort of negative reaction from the British women. Lovely.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
08:29 / 22.01.07
Supposedly C4 is in crisis as well,

Maybe they should have a crossover where BBHouse-1 collides with BBHouse-4, then all the other Houses threaten to merge into one Nu-House with unpopular and outdated housemates wiped out of history.
 
 
Spaniel
10:14 / 22.01.07
According to my Mum the C4 building is on high security alert and everyone has been told not to speak to the press.

Whiskey, while I think Jade is probably unhappy for all sorts of reasons, your hypothesis chimes with stuff I've experienced as a parent. Ever since the Bosun entered our lives I've found myself increasingly disturbed by acts of cruelty directed towards other human beings, in that I keep imagining said acts happening to him, and that freaks me out big time. Christ, I almost turned off Longford rather than listen to what Hindley and Brady did.
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
11:02 / 22.01.07
It's fairly apparent to me (dunno about the rest of you) that while Jade may have been the bullying ringleader, she was probably the 'least bad' of all three of the witches when it came to the racism. Danielle had the traditional English racist's horrifying comments down, Jo was snide and crypto-racist in the way that around 40% of the people in my department at work have down pat, and Jade was the loud brassy one who couldn't keep her opinions or her mouth to herself. That Jade's being demonised so much is a little worrying... like someone said upthread, it's like we can point at her and say "look, 82% of the country voted her out, we must be doing ok as a nation! And she's a horrible pig-faced bully! We're not!"

For me, endemic casual bullying has always been part of the English national character. We're not a pleasant race, as a rule. We like slagging things off, dragging things down, deciding who is in need of a kicking and why, and rationalising whatever we do by virtue of the old stand-by, "they was asking for it." This person is smug or arrogant, that person is patronising or 'has a punchable face' (a lovely phrase used fairly often on this message board, actually meaning "I want to punch that person's face because I don't like it" but that transfers the blame for this to the face itself), etc. We like bitching about things, usually only when it's safe to do so (ie on the internet or behind someone's back, or when it's funny so that we can pretend that someone would laugh with us if they could hear what we were saying). Incidentally, I'm not using the first person plural to avoid sounding sanctimonious, I'm using it because I recognise that to a certain extent, sometimes quite a large extent, I myself do it too.

Anyway, looks like Jade's 'asking for it' now.

Realistically what makes sense here is that there are appropriate and proportionate consequences, an equal and opposite reaction that goes as far as is practical towards balancing the scales. So the woman is likely to have lost a large proportion of the career that she's spent five years building up, and has very little in the way of fall back options. She's not profited out of the show (her CBB fee and the fee charged for the News Of The World interview have been donated to charity), and she's going to be working on damage limitation and re-evaluating if/how she's going to make a living now for a while to come. Considering what she's actually said and done while in the house, this seems sufficient. Effectively, she's had the self-employed celebrity-for-the-sake-of-it equivalent of losing her job over this, and potentially the career in which she worked. There's also bound to be a degree of fallout with the whole 'walking down the street getting abused' thing, (although I hear Tesco's online ordering service is pretty damn on the money these days). Shall we say she's had enough and move on?

I know people in my team at work who voted to evict Shilpa last Friday, by the way, and a lot more who didn't vote, despite the fact that they would ordinarily. They're convinced Jade wasn't being racist herself. They've made similar comments before themselves, and didn't mean it. There is a sense I'm getting today that a lot of people here didn't vote to evict Jade because to do so would be a little too much like voting to evict themselves... not sure what to make of that.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
11:21 / 22.01.07
Hellbunny this might be a stretch but let's stop and look at what you just wrote:

For me, endemic casual bullying has always been part of the English national character. We're not a pleasant race, as a rule. We like slagging things off, dragging things down, deciding who is in need of a kicking and why, and rationalising whatever we do by virtue of the old stand-by, "they was asking for it."

I suggest that you think about the racist attitude you just expressed towards the English, the fact that you linked it to people of a certain social make up with that little quote at the end and then consider whether you had the right to criticise people for making off the cuff violent statements when you slated an entire culture uneccessarily.
 
 
Smoothly
12:32 / 22.01.07
I dunno if anyone’s watching Shipwrecked on Channel 4, but one of the contestants says she hates black people and thinks we should bring back slavery. She’s educated and looks unremarkable. They had no apparent reservations about airing it on Sunday. I wonder how it will play.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:54 / 22.01.07
Hang on... wha?
 
 
Char Aina
12:57 / 22.01.07
double take...
am i missing a joke?

did someone actually say that, smoothly, or am i being slow today?
 
 
Char Aina
12:58 / 22.01.07
ah.
cross post.
what haus said.
 
 
ghadis
13:14 / 22.01.07
Didn't see Shipwrecked but i assume that she is the contestent who, according to the Guardian, 'spent 10 years in a public school acquiring some dodgy views' and who also 'hates fat and ugly people'. Could be interesting if it gains similer coverage as the BB story but i'm loathe to help raise C4s viewing figures and coffers anymore to be honest.
 
 
Spaniel
13:38 / 22.01.07
Isn't shipwrecked filmed months in advance? If that's the case I imagine the young woman in question is shitting it.
 
 
Char Aina
13:57 / 22.01.07
if so, surely they could have pulled that episode, no?
i mean, they'd have to want to, but it would seem sensible to pull the old 'technical difficulties' line, or something, wouldnt it?
i suppose they might have thought it would draw attention if they cancelled, but it seems like channel four are pretty fucked at the moment for sticking to their guns over the BB situation.

has it been talked about anywhere else that anyone has seen?
does racism on realitee-vee now deserve a thread?
 
 
Smoothly
13:58 / 22.01.07
Yes, sorry, no word of a lie. Her name is Lucy Buchanan, although her profile only makes mention of her hatred for fat people (reserving her thoughts on black and gay people for the island meet ‘n’ greet).

Unfortunately I can’t find any evidence on YouTube, Google Video or Vimeo, which is a bit of a surprise because she comes out with some choice gems. Just when you thought we could all agree on slavery...

But sorry, this is probably another thread (if I thought for a moment anyone but me was watching Shipwrecked, ffs).
 
 
Char Aina
14:00 / 22.01.07
is there any mitigation?
are some of her best friends slaves, perhaps?
 
 
Smoothly
14:09 / 22.01.07
There’s some stuff in Digital Spy, toksik, although it seems to have largely passed people by.
I’m not quite sure why exactly. Perhaps it’s because hardly anyone watches Shipwrecked, perhaps it’s because there is no expectation that she could possibly be a role model. Perhaps Channel 4 felt comfortable about airing it because she quickly has a Damascene conversion. I’m really not sure. It certainly struck me as odd at the time.
 
  

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