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Celebrity Big Brother 2007

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penitentvandal

12:17 / 18.01.07

The Perfune Shop are withdrawing Jade's perfume while she is in the house. I suspect that will not be for too long.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:34 / 18.01.07

Hey Stoat, I have to disagree with the statement you made on DSBB, pardon for dragging your words here but it's only fair I do right?

No probs, Jonlee. To be honest, if I've taken the time to say something on DS I usually regret not having posted it here instead, just cos the discussion's better here and I don't want to waste all my good lines.

I'll give you an answer when I've got time... right now I think Weevil's pretty much said what I meant.

ONLY NICE THINGS

12:42 / 18.01.07

According to Popbitch, Jade Goody has the same management as Davina, Dermot, Ruussell and Chantelle. How cosy.

Smoothly

12:45 / 18.01.07

Andy Duncan's approach seems to be to ask the perpetrators whether they think they are being racist, and then taking their word for it. Interesting.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:48 / 18.01.07

Anyone hear Luke Johnson on the Today programme this morning?

Every question was met with "we have issued a statement. If you read the statement it'll answer your question".

In a stroke of genius, they finished the interview with "thank you, Luke Johnson. The only person in Britain not to have an opinion of Celebrity Big Brother".

Smoothly

12:50 / 18.01.07

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:56 / 18.01.07

Can you say cop-out?

Or would "blatantly unethical plug for phone vote" be more appropriate, d'you think?

penitentvandal

13:13 / 18.01.07

According to Popbitch, Jade Goody has the same management as Davina, Dermot, Ruussell and Chantelle. How cosy.

Well, that would explain all Russell's 'let's not meet intolerance with intolerance' bollocks, and his insistence to his audience that Jade is 'a lovely person, really.'

Because, despite his kinky jeans and 'rebellious' haircut, at the end of the day he's still just a company man.

Hey, Russell. I got an idea for you. You're always going on about ballbags: why don't you actually grow a set and tell your management to go fuck themselves?

penitentvandal

13:19 / 18.01.07

And re. Andy Duncan, I don't know what's worse: that he issued that utterly mendacious statement (as one of the reporters asked: 'let the public decide? Aren't 27,000 complaints enough?'), or that he made the statement in that horrible shirt.

It was like something you'd wear while changing the oil in your car. Man can't be bothered to even wear a decent dress shirt when he meets the public. Prunt.

Spaniel

13:45 / 18.01.07

27,000 complaints are a shit load more than ofcom normally require

Spaniel

13:49 / 18.01.07

(Okay, okay complaints aren't simply judged on volume, but stil...)

Evil Scientist

13:55 / 18.01.07

Hmm. Andy Duncan is also claiming that they’ve asked Shilpa and that she is unequivocal that the bullying is not racially motivated. It sounds like there are going to be some interesting developments in tonight’s show.

I'm wondering exactly how they asked Shilpa that. Did they do it in a face-to-face and, more importantly, private interview. Or was it done in the "persona" of Big Brother? Shilpa might well say that she didn't think it was racist if she was given the impression it was just going to be broadcast as part of the program (rather than them actually informing her what's going on).

Just because she's an actress it doesn't mean she'll be any more comfortable discussing something like that if she thinks it's just for the watching masses rather than as part of a possible criminal prosecution.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

13:57 / 18.01.07

Incidentally, watching the repeats, it's fairly fucking obvious that Shilpa told pretty much everyone she was flushing the food down the toilet. Nobody told her not to.

Smoothly

13:59 / 18.01.07

I assume they asked her in the diary room, much as the approached Danielle and (it seems) Jade.
Yes, I wonder how the question will be worded and exactly how unequivocal Shilpa is, given what she's already said to Jermaine and Cleo.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

14:02 / 18.01.07

Also remember Shilpa's not looking for a fight. She doesn't enjoy the arguing in the same way as Team Jade do. In her situation I'd probably wuss out and say "no, it's fine" as well. Then cry a bit.

Alex's Grandma

14:15 / 18.01.07

Just because she's an actress it doesn't mean she'll be any more comfortable discussing something like that if she thinks it's just for the watching masses rather than as part of a possible criminal prosecution.

Well a criminal prosecution would mean she'd have to come to Blighty for the trial, I suppose, which is something I can't imagine she's all that keen to do at the moment. It's difficult to say how much she's thought about it (though last night's comment about British society being 'scary' would tend to suggest she's considered it a bit,) but she may well be under the impression that Jade and the gang are simply expressing the views of significant proportion of the GBP. I mean I wouldn't want to hurry back, personally.

Jade and Danielle might be prosecuted, under the Public Order Act 1986 or the Prevention of Harrassment Act 1997, as I understand it. It's possible that the leadership of Channel 4 might be had up for the same reasons. It sounds to me as if Shilpa has been browbeaten into disclaiming her earlier statement that she felt herself to be the victim of racially-motivated harrassment, because Hertfordshire police would be obligated to investigate and possibly to press charges if there was an incident in which the victim and many witnesses perceived racist intent in the persecution.

Smoothly

14:50 / 18.01.07

They've just showed her Diary Room conversation, and she does sound unequivocal. But out of superhuman magnanimity, I'm sure.

ONLY NICE THINGS

14:54 / 18.01.07

Right - so they didn't actually stop the show and send somebody into the house to talk to the competitors, as with sloshedgate? So, the housemates were aware that they were being filmed and that what they did and said might affect how the public thought of them? Yeesh.

nighthawk

14:55 / 18.01.07

But to what extent do people think their behaviour is motivated by racism, or that Shilpa might see it as such? I can't remember her exact words last night, but I got the impression that though she was aware that her racial and cultural background was shaping Jade etc.'s hostility, she didn't necessarily feel it was motivating it? Perhaps that a real hair-splitting distinction, but I can see how Shilpa might respond negatively when asked 'do you feel the treatment you have received is racially-motivated', while still being aware that race and racist assumptions (very basic and ignorant ones, as Ganesh said up-thread) are structuring the dynamic of her relationship with other housemates. Does that make sense?

Smoothly

15:03 / 18.01.07

Indeed. I think she only meant that they weren't racist in the strong sense. But yes, she wasn't asked in confidence, and of course she hasn't seen and heard anything that's been said behind her back.

As it stands though, it looks like this is going to keep the police at bay, for the moment at least.

nighthawk

15:10 / 18.01.07

Do posters think that the police ought to intervene?

Whisky Priestess

15:15 / 18.01.07

Not sure, depends on how heavy-handed they're likely to be. Would this situation be treated as some variant of a "domestic", do you think?

nighthawk

15:25 / 18.01.07

Also, did people here have similar reactions to Shamil's treatment in BB? I mean suggesting that Channel 4 should have directly intervened, suggesting criminal proceedings might be appropriate, etc.? I remember that getting pretty awful (locking Shamil in the garden, stealing his clothes, etc.), and the guy was fairly unstable and isolated in the house. Obviously 'race' was not an issue there, and he certainly exacerbated the situation himself. But I'm just trying to work out what it is people think Jade, Danielle and Jo are guilty of individually and collectively, and how it ought to have been dealt with in the context of the show. If their behaviour isn't racially-motivated - and I'm not sure either way - does the fact that race is still involved make this more than a case of bullying? Such that someone could seriously bring up prosecution I mean? And why?

Harrison Ford, in a battle suit, wheels for feet, knives and guns

15:27 / 18.01.07

I'd really like to see the police get invloved, at least express publicly that they're monitoring the situation in case legal action needs to be taken.

I wonder who, if anybody will sponsor CBB now that CPW have pulled funding? Maybe the BNP?

nighthawk

15:28 / 18.01.07

Sorry, I meant Shahbaz, not Shamil.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

15:40 / 18.01.07

Remember in law there's also "racially aggravated", not just "racially motivated".

Triplets

15:40 / 18.01.07

at least express publicly that they're monitoring the situation in case legal action needs to be taken.

And that was the day... Ganesh... joined the MET.

ONLY NICE THINGS

15:44 / 18.01.07

Well, the Mcpherson report identifies the point at which racial aggravation has to be considered to be the point at which the victim or another identifies a racial element to the crime. In this case, suggestions that she should go back where she comes from, mimicking of her accent, accusations that she wants to be white... yeah, I'd say that was sufficiently bad that there is no public interest argument for seeing it. At which point, if the network refuses to cut it, which since the network is also the producer seems unlikely, it's possible the police should be involved, yes.

nighthawk

15:44 / 18.01.07

Yes, good point Stoatie. The following might suggest that label is appropriate, but only if a crime has been committed:

A crime will count as "racially aggravated" if it can be shown that it was motivated either wholly or partly by racism. A crime will also count as "racially aggravated" if it can be shown that – even though the motivation for the attack was not racist – racist hostility was demonstrated during the course of the offence or immediately before or after it.

nighthawk

15:48 / 18.01.07

I'd say that was sufficiently bad that there is no public interest argument for seeing it.

Hmm, I hadn't thought of that. But I'm not sure I precisely understand your point? Is it that C4 should have stepped in to prevent the bullying at the time, or just that they ought to have kept it off our screens? I mean, I can imagine various sections of the media jumping on the opportunity to suggest that there was no public interest argument for BB as a programme!

ONLY NICE THINGS

15:50 / 18.01.07

Precisely. Thus, Public Order 1986 and Prevention of Harrassment 1997. Obligingly, the potential perpetrators have agreed to stand in front of cameras to help the police determine whether there is a case for arrest.

This does mean that some poor bastard at the Hertfordhsire Ploddery is going to have to watch Celebrity Big Brother non-stop...

Harrison Ford, in a battle suit, wheels for feet, knives and guns

15:51 / 18.01.07

Both I reckon .

ONLY NICE THINGS

15:51 / 18.01.07

Is it that C4 should have stepped in to prevent the bullying at the time, or just that they ought to have kept it off our screens?

Well, isn't that largely academic? They are claiming that what is happening in the Big Brother house, and broadcasting it, is in the public interest. I do not believe that to be the case. Without that justification, watching the ongoing harrassment of an Indian woman by three white Englishwomen doesn't seem to be something there is a huge amount of profit in broadcasting.

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