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"Heroes" Series 1 (US and Torrents edition)

 
  

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Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
20:09 / 08.11.06
No more oafish then your average misdirecting comic book cover. That is pretty much how I watch the show, if I woulf accept something that happens in a comic book then I must accept it on Heroes.

Also on the comic front, I love how the subtitles when Hiro and Ando talk are next to their heads like speech bubbles.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:36 / 08.11.06
Niki kills reactor guy in New York

That's what happened in the backstory to Kingdom Come ~ Superman killed... who was it, some kind of Nuclear Man? Not the Atom, obviously. Causing armageddon, anyway.

Given that this show does draw quite consciously on comic book tropes, your suggestion doesn't seem that unlikely.
 
 
Spaniel
21:08 / 08.11.06
Elijah, I'm not sure you understand me. For a start comics and films are different mediums and as such I have different expectations of them. I'm used to ignoring misleading comic covers (which, by the by, aren't part of the narrative proper), I'm not, however, used to ignoring telly dialogue, in that it serves a terribly important role in how we understand the narrative at hand.

Put it like this: he has splodey radioactive powers, he might become a human bomb, wait a minute, he's telling us he might become a human bomb. DO YOU SEE!?1?!

Irritating however you look at it.

I did, as a matter of fact, like this week's show.
 
 
Spaniel
21:10 / 08.11.06
Actually I'm not sure it draws quite as directly on comic tropes as you would imagine. Apparently Kring - the executive producer and by far the most powerful creative force behind the show - can't read comics.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
06:50 / 09.11.06
I think Tim Sale writes for it though.
 
 
Jack Fear
09:52 / 09.11.06
As does Jeph Loeb.
 
 
Spaniel
11:50 / 09.11.06
So I'll be shutting the face.
 
 
Jack Fear
17:16 / 09.11.06
Well, no, actually—because you're on to something; but maybe not the way you think.

There's a pretty extensive and spoiler-laden article in the US magazine ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY about the show; it makes the point that one of the jobs of the comics-industry vets on the writing staff is to keep Kring from veering into comics cliché. Remember, the guy is a comics n00b, so he doesn't know what's cliché and what isn't. There was one exchange that went something like this (paraphrasing, from memory):

KRING: ...and maybe there's this guy with, like, magnetic powers, and he's, like, picking up cars and throwing them across the street and stuff, and...

LOEB: Dude. That's Magneto.

KRING: Oh. Um. Never mind.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
17:21 / 09.11.06
SIMPSONS DID IT!

That is pretty funny though, especially since they let Kitty and (maybe after last episode) Forge slide by without a problem.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
17:55 / 09.11.06
Sorry, what am I talking about. Tim Sale does the in-show paintings. Jeph Loeb writes for it.
 
 
grant
15:11 / 10.11.06
By the way, the spoiler-laden wikipedia episode summaries (including some not-yet aired) indicate that Nathan really couldn't get the painting. I'm not sure why I (and others) assumed that he could but wasn't letting on -- according to the wikipedia folks, though, he was telling the truth to his brother.
 
 
buttergun
16:12 / 10.11.06
That's strange, because the dialog from the phone conversation implied that he did. He said something along the lines of, "My brother would appreciate it," and then thanked Linderman. But I guess it makes sense. If Linderman is involved in all these situations, he wouldn't so easily give up the painting anyway.

Speaking of Nathan, I really don't fall in line with the speculation that he will go bad or evil or whatever. There's just too much dramatic material there for a good old-fashioned redemption storyline. The crippled wife -- handicapped by Nathan himself -- the shady past, the dealings with criminals, etc. It only makes good dramatic sense that Nathan will be redeemed in some magnificent way in the final eps of this (or a future) season.
 
 
BrianFitzgerald
19:44 / 10.11.06
My biggest disappointment with this week's episode was that Texas Tina didn't get killed by Jessica. The actress who plays Tina is just so bad that it's distracting.
 
 
FreakWolf
15:00 / 14.11.06
This weeks episode was great and I can't wait till next week. ALL HELL BREAKS LOOSE!
 
 
buttergun
20:41 / 14.11.06
I also thought it was a great episode. I'd say Heroes is better than, say, Lost has been in years. Since Arrested Development is gone and 24's 6th season hasn't begun yet, I'd say it's the best show currently on television.

And yes, next week's episode does look very good. Lots of promising clips in that preview, chief among them a shot of Alter-Ego Mom carrying what looked like a big shotgun.

So what happened to Hiro? How far back do you think he went? I think it would be great if there was an entire episode which detailed nothing but Hiro's botched attempts at saving the girl, Charlie. Like a dark comedy in which, despite his best attempts, she kept dying. For example he'd go back a few days, she's hit by a truck. He goes back a few days before that, she's struck by lightning. At least I would think it's funny.

So why is Mind Reading Cop sticking with Shrill Wife? Sheesh. Even the FBI agent he works with is preferable (wasn't she the actress who played the Invisible Girl on that first season episode of Buffy?).

At first I thought Mohinder himself might have powers, due to his precognitive dreams, but it turns out that mysterious kid was behind them.

And we got our most recent glimpse of Syler at the diner. What does he do, request the spot with the least lighting?
 
 
gridley
17:46 / 15.11.06
Some very interesting news from Ask-Ausiello at TVGuide.com:

Fanboys, prepare to piddle yourself. Christopher Eccleston — the original Dr. Who from the current Sci Fi/BBC series — is joining the cast in January in a really super (tee-hee) role. Speaking of cool casting, wait until you see who's ******* ****'s ****. You're going to flip.
 
 
Tamayyurt
18:34 / 15.11.06
buttergun- I think it would be great if there was an entire episode which detailed nothing but Hiro's botched attempts at saving the girl, Charlie. Like a dark comedy in which, despite his best attempts, she kept dying. For example he'd go back a few days, she's hit by a truck. He goes back a few days before that, she's struck by lightning. At least I would think it's funny.

Isn't this the premise of that new Taye Digss show, which looks equally funny?

Next episode looks awesome!
 
 
buttergun
19:00 / 15.11.06
Alex, that's a good point. Now I'm really looking forward to Day Break tonight.
 
 
Spaniel
19:46 / 15.11.06
Chris Eccleston, eh? That's cool.

I'd say it's the best show currently on television.

That would be The Wire. I speak truth.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
20:28 / 15.11.06
*cough* both wrong *cough* battlestar galactica *cough*
 
 
Spaniel
21:25 / 15.11.06
I would be very disappointed with the world if I were wrong. I think it's kinda important that the Wire is so so so much better than just about anything else on telly in so many ways.
 
 
buttergun
12:47 / 16.11.06
I was thinking about the "save the cheerleader, save the world" tag. Also about the Syler/Linderman villains. Is it just speculation that they may be connected, or have we been given any proof? Because I'm thinking maybe Syler will be the season's first arc villain, with Linderman and the New York catastrophe being the second arc villain.

It was Future Hiro who said the "save the cheerleader/world" line. Which makes me think that he's aware that Claire will be central in averting a disaster in New York, which who knows, could lead to some world catastrophe. So if they save her now, ie stop Syler from getting her, then she will be alive to save the world in the second arc when the New York plot gets in. I don't know, I'm just guessing...because really I'm getting sick of hearing "save the cheerleader" whispered after each episode.
 
 
Olulabelle
22:17 / 18.11.06
I have no idea where to put this so I'm just going to ask it here because the geeks in you all will know the answer and it is a bit to do with heroes in that it is a question about Claire.

So, say you are indestructible like Claire and someone somehow temporarily disables you, for example like having something lodged in your head and being unable to repair youself until it is removed, and say someone buried you in that time. Then say the thing in your head rotted away and you woke up and fixed yourself but you had no food or water, would you eventually die, or does the being indestructible extend to not needing food or water to survive either?

I need to know folks. It's intriguing me.
 
 
Olulabelle
00:22 / 19.11.06
Oh and sorry to double post but I just saw this image of Sylar on another board:



Quite clearly not the black dude from the bar.
 
 
grant
01:37 / 19.11.06
Then say the thing in your head rotted away and you woke up and fixed yourself but you had no food or water, would you eventually die, or does the being indestructible extend to not needing food or water to survive either?

Dracula sez: You just get HONGRY.

I'm not sure if they've done this with Wolverine, but I think they have.

What did Claire's dad tell the painter again? About his daughter and something 14 years ago? I missed that...
 
 
miss wonderstarr
07:28 / 19.11.06
I don't know what happens to your body when you starve or thirst to death, but it must involve some kind of physical damage: your body drawing on its fat reserves until it depletes them, for instance. I don't think Clare's body could be damaged in that way. In that respect, it makes you wonder ~ could she lose weight, or get a tattoo? Could she grow taller (she's of an age when she could still be growing) or for that matter, would she ever look older (as ageing involves "damage"). Would her body let her menstruate?
 
 
Ness
07:47 / 19.11.06
(hello, my first Barbelith post)

>What did Claire's dad tell the painter again? About his daughter and something 14 years ago? I missed that...

He tells Isaac about how 'a number of us' have been 'tracking, locating and monitoring' people like Isaac for many years and that some people misinterpret their motives and things go wrong. 14 years ago there was just such a case, Claire's mother died during a confrontation and Mr Bennett and his wife adopted Claire at a time when they were trying unsuccessfuly for a child of their own.

Interesting episode, are Mr Bennett and Eden the good guys too?
 
 
miss wonderstarr
08:13 / 19.11.06
Just to add, my point above is that in the human body, change (usually? always?) = damage. So if Claire's body can't distinguish between different types of damage (eg. "painful", "life-threatening" and "other") then she couldn't build muscle, for instance, as well as the other suggestions above. She would presumably keep regenerating to stay as she is now.

Which also makes me wonder: how could someone eat her brains? Why would you have to "save" an indestructible cheerleader? Her salvation is built into her DNA. She's surely able to save herself.

Also, wonder if the series slogan "save the cheerleader" will switch after Monday's episode?
 
 
Spaniel
08:22 / 19.11.06
Lula, your question actually points us towards one of the hard facts of geeky existence: the the magical world of superpowes is inconsistent and only very loosely based on sound logic and science. Take Wolverine, like Claire he has a "healing factor" but different writers have different takes on that ability, some having him regenerate in seconds from a blob of flesh on the floor, others having him take a few minutes to recover from a gunshot wound. Obviously Marvel has some kind of policy on this stuff - he doesn't get drunk or sick - but within that policy there is room for movement because, you know, they're basically making it all up as they go along.

Same goes for Claire. Until the Heroes gang establish the extent of her powers it'll be hard to say whether she needs to eat or drink, or whether she'll age (Wolverine appears to age very, very, very slowly), because it's up to the writers to work that out for themselves - and, even once they have, they'll still have to muddle through from time to time as they come across situations that don't fit the guidance they have in place. And, well, sometimes they'll probably contradict something that went before.

Basically looking for too much sense out of this stuff won't get you too far, although a degree of it is necessary to keep the fictional world believable. More of my fellow geeks would do well to heed these words. They'd have more fun.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
08:40 / 19.11.06
Basically looking for too much sense out of this stuff won't get you too far, although a degree of it is necessary to keep the fictional world believable. More of my fellow geeks would do well to heed these words. They'd have more fun.

I don't fully agree. I think constructing excuses and rationales for badly-thought out comic-book pseudo-science (rather than just saying "oh well, that's just comic-book nonsense... let's not examine it") can be a real pleasure.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
08:55 / 19.11.06
Also, Claire does eat (cupcakes) and doesn't drink (alcohol ~ according to her MySpace profile).

She seems to feel some pain when she's damaged, but less than a normal person would ~ when she was burned, she was wincing but not screaming, and ditto with the mangled fingers in the sink.
 
 
Spaniel
09:46 / 19.11.06
No, I think examination does have a place, but I also think that a) it can, on occasion, kill a story, and lead to disappoinment, and b) that contructing solutions to percieved problems with power related stuff is a very particular kind of fun that doesn't appeal to everybody, and is, to my mind at least, normally unnecessary.

Of course, we don't always do things because they're necessary
 
 
Olulabelle
10:06 / 19.11.06
Well I am definitely amusing myself pondering over it. I'm not asking to try and destroy the story, I'm asking because I'm genuinely interested in what she can and can't do.

Regarding the cupcake thing, she also wanted them thrown away in case she ate them all, which would imply that putting on weight was a possibility.
 
 
grant
13:36 / 19.11.06
Well, she doesn't know what she can do.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
16:09 / 19.11.06
Also, she wants to keep pretending to be "normal" in front of her parents, and presumably being all cheer-girly about calorific snacks is what they're used to from her. Even if she did know that her body saw weight gain as "damage" and wouldn't let it happen, she could well have internalised that kind of attitude to food and really have to make an effort to eat differently.
 
  

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