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Grant Morrison's Batman

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21:00 / 16.10.08

or is rikdad ONE OF US!

12:28 / 22.10.08

Something's been re-occuring to me over the last few days. Bat-Might says he's a product of the 5th Dimension, which is what we know as imagination. Bruce creates Bat-Might after his parent's deaths to help him cope. A guardian figure.

Now, in an earlier issue Alfred tells Tim that Bruce underwent that spiritual cleansing ritual in Nan Par Bat. Bruce links this with 3 demons and, later, The Three Batmen. Three replacement Batman who, horribly, represent some of Batman's greatest failiures and losses. Gunbats getting beating by a crowbar is Jason, Banebats is Bane the bat-breaker, Devilbats with his religious imagery, suffocating batsuit and flamethrower is Azrael.

Devilbats, years into the future, tells Tim that he met the devil personally.

In the first issue Commissioner Gordon asks Batman what he'll do now Gotham has been cleaned up.

The idea that Bruce is the Black Glove or behind the planning and setting up of the Black Glove has been running through this since the beginning. The idea that the ultimate hero would create the ultimate villain for himself is nothing new. I've seen the idea discussed elsewhere of theories/fanwank that Sherlock Holmes himself was Moriarty, and so on.

So, what if Bruce created the Devil, a personal devil to test him and to give him focus? The idea of the Thogal ritual was to test Batman's soul. What if this process is still in motion? The initiation never ending is one of Morrison's strongest writing tics.

There's also the unresolved issue of what the thing on Bat-Might's back is.

13:22 / 22.10.08

The idea that the initiation is ongoing is one which has been in the back of my mind pretty much since the beginning of Grant’s run, and I’ve been wondering for a while now whether the forces of the initiation have been manifesting though synchronicity, a kind of determinism: the broader experience (the events of the bat-run) mirroring precisely the micro experience (the cave based ritual itself). Does that make any sense? It’s a kind of it’s all true solution: the bat-men get to be tulpas of a sort, just not the kind made from exotic magic stuff; the Joker gets to be a big baddie in his own right, with crazy joker free will (in a way); there’s room for Dr Hurt to be Joe Chill’s son and have his own motivations; and Bats.. well he gets to be a sort of Black Glove but without having been the architect of a scheme that hurts people.

Stuff.

Next issue please!

Aha! I am Klarion

13:53 / 22.10.08

The return of the Thin White Duke
Throwing darts in lovers' eyes
Here are we, one magical moment, such is the stuff
From where dreams are woven
Bending sound, dredging the ocean, lost in my circle
Here am I, flashing no colour
Tall in my room overlooking the ocean

Here are we, one magical movement from Kether to Malkuth
There are you, you drive like a demon from station to station
The return of the Thin White Duke, throwing darts in lovers' eyes
The return of the Thin White Duke, throwing darts in lovers' eyes
The return of the Thin White Duke, making sure white stays

Once there were mountains on mountains
And once there were sunbirds to soar with
And once I could never be down
I got to keep searching and searching
Oh, what will I be believing and who will connect me with love?
Wonderful, wonderful, wonder when
Have you sought fortune, evasive and shy?
Drink to the men who protect you and I
Drink, drink, drain your glass, raise your glass high

It's not the side-effects of the cocaine
I'm thinking that it must be love
It's too late - to be grateful
It's too late - to be late again
It's too late - to be hateful
The european canon is here

I must be only one in a million
'cause I can't pass the day without her
It's too late - to be grateful
It's too late - to be late again
It's too late - to be hateful
The european canon is here

Should I believe that I've been stricken?
Does my face show some kind of glow?
It's too late - to be grateful
It's too late - to be late again
It's too late - to be hateful
The european canon is here,
It's too late
It's too late, it's too late, it's too late, it's too late

The european canon is here,
And yes it's too late
It's too late, it's too late, it's too late, it's too late

The european canon is here,
And yes, it's too late
It's too late, it's too late, it's too late, it's too late
The european canon is here,

The return of the Thin White Duke, throwing darts in lovers' eyes
The return of the Thin White Duke, throwing darts in lovers' eyes
The return of the Thin White Duke, making sure white stays

-Station to Station by David Bowie

14:09 / 22.10.08

Anything to add, Adam?

The Thin White Duke's relationship to that particular song may or may not be of interest. I suspect not, but if you've spotted something I haven't (other than a reference to Kether and Malkuth) why don't you mention it?

Barbelith is weak sauce these days, but it's still nice to shoot for some actual commentary.

The Natural Way

15:42 / 22.10.08

Yeah, Station to Station's a good song and all, but pointing out a reference does not anything interesting equal.

17:25 / 22.10.08

the broader experience (the events of the bat-run) mirroring precisely the micro experience (the cave based ritual itself). Does that make any sense?

It makes the good sense, Boboss. In the torture drill issue, when Devilbats has Bruce chaired up ready for pain, Bruce himself wakes asking himself, "Did I die? Is this the 31st day of Thogal? No, it's the isolation chamber experiment...". Things are getting mixed up and confused. Instead of showing the ritual I think we might be getting fractals and echoes of it. Seeing the process without seeing it.

"These are the secrets of death" Bat-Might teaches. Coping skills, strength and reinvention... because of seemingly lost or destroyed purpose? Like having your entire rogues gallery imprisoned or on the run?

The run has referenced three shattering, traumatic events, the Wayne murders, the isolation chamber and Thogal. And now we get a fourth in the form of the Black Glove's Dance of Death. It's all about building a better Batman.

So says Hugo Strange.

EDIT: Hell, if you count the three Replacement Bats then the number of traumatic events referenced in Morrison's run goes up to about seven. Possibly the most gritty Bat-run in recent times, except not.

19:10 / 22.10.08

Yes, there's lots of blurring of boundaries between the ritual and later events. Additionally, that whole business with the machine-that-builds-a-Batman could well be flagging the idea that the fictional universe is aligning in a similar deterministic way for this story arc

Aha! I am Klarion

15:00 / 24.10.08

Besides the psycho-sexual and capitalistic decadence that Bowie is known for fitting well with the “dark psychedelic” aesthetic and themes of Morrison’s current Batman run, the last issue titled “The Thin White Duke of Death” is a direct reference to this song. And it contains some interesting parallels:

- One of themes of the current run is how the environment (i.e. the architecture) has a twisting effect on (and is in turn effected by) its citizens. So the idyllic reframe: “Once there where mountains and mountains!” It is a nice expression the sort of twisted desire of a rich boy (i.e. Bruce) to recall the wonderful time in childhood at your mountain estate (preferable in white clothes with butterfly nets, polo, and parents sipping on mint juleps). Imagine aesthetics of “childhood wonder” and “flashes of memory” mixed with that of the gothic/Edwardian upper-class culture. It is as though Morrison is borrowing from the “the Prisoner” in this run. However, in Gotham the cultural surfaces are more neon while the dark basements of the unconscious are straight out of the Saw movies rather than the geometric freak-outs of no. 6’s show.
- “I must be one in a million,” that would be Bruce: unique privileged/damned rich boy/Demon god. “You drive like a demon from station to station” in search of happiness.
- “And once there were sunbirds to soar with
And once I could never be down
I got to keep searching and searching
Oh, what will I be believing and who will connect me with love?” Sunbirds not only refer to Robin, but to the adventures in outer-space during the drug trippy moments.
- “It's not the side-effects of the cocaine.” Bruce dosed with “weapons grade” drugs.
- “I'm thinking that it must be love
It's too late - to be grateful
It's too late - to be late again
It's too late - to be hateful”
Ultimately if Bruce is to survive this betrayal, he must move past any sort of emotional hang-up. As a middle aged man it’s to late grateful, hateful, or delayed in any way.
- “The European Canon is here.” would be the ultra rich Black Glove organization: the priest, the general, the judge, etc. Also, the European "cannon" would be the gun, or the ultimate symbol of evil to Batman.

The Natural Way

15:04 / 24.10.08

Adam, we all get the Bowie reference, but, mate, you are reaching.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

16:26 / 24.10.08

The problem with the 'the ritual never ended' theory is the resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul.

Aha! I am Klarion

20:20 / 24.10.08

Oh I am definitely over-reaching.

But my interest is less in the parallels as they "exist" than how this would hypothetical be a great ironic soundtrack (a la Kenneth Anger) for an animated R.I.P.

Nevertheless, the vibes and themes do match rather nicely.

20:59 / 24.10.08

Absolutely.

21:30 / 24.10.08

The problem with the 'the ritual never ended' theory is the resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul.

In what way is it a problem?

ONLY NICE THINGS

21:30 / 24.10.08

So, hang on. Robin's going to connect Batman with love?

Is that legal

Aha! I am Klarion

16:04 / 25.10.08

Well it a familiar love (not in the Taboo series, Kay Parker sense) of having a son or a best friend, totally platonic.

But seriously your parents do fuck you up...just hopefully not literally.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

08:30 / 01.11.08

Me The problem with the 'the ritual never ended' theory is the resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul.

Boboss In what way is it a problem?

We have something which has happened both inside and outside of the Morrison Batman run.

19:02 / 01.11.08

Sorry I was being a bit disingenuous. I appreciate that it's a bit of a problem, but personally I'd be happy for Morrison to gloss over it.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

09:22 / 02.11.08

I think that's what everyone is hoping for. Perhaps we could all say that Ra's represents the death urge or the desire for foolish facial hair and all agree it didn't happen?

18:16 / 02.11.08

Yes

15:36 / 25.11.08

5 page preview of # 681

15:56 / 25.11.08

I've been a bit late catching up, considering we'll all know by tomorrow, but I was wondering if there's any chance of an Aztek angle here. There's so much about the family history, it would be odd of Morrison to ignore the angle of the Clarence Vane/Thomas Wayne feud that he set up all that time ago and never used. The general tone of nastiness isn't too far removed from that of Aztek, and the errr.. Q people who trained Aztek weren't averse to being total bastards when they had to. Nah, Bruce couldn't be a sleeper agent for an organisation like that, could he? This isn't a very long initiation? I wish I'd had more time to think about this...

18:17 / 25.11.08

I fear I'm getting a whole 'xorn is magneto' vibe off these preview pages...

ra's al ghul seems painfully, heartrendingly, excruciatingly obvious at this point. say it aint so.

19:13 / 25.11.08

Oh. I have a sneaking suspicion I might be more on the money than I thought. Just checked the article in Aztek and Vane died in 1938, a year after Bats was "born". Also note the bit in 679 "a machine to make the Batman". Could Gotham have been Wayne's version of Vanity? Sod it, we'll know soon enough.

19:57 / 25.11.08

Perhaps we could all say that Ra's represents the death urge or the desire for foolish facial hair

Given the nature of this run, can't it be both?

Imaginary Mongoose Solutions

19:03 / 26.11.08

Wow, just wow.

That, my friends, is the Goddamn Batman.

19:24 / 26.11.08

All the threads of other boards have been seething. (I don't really care about spoilers on this one.) I'm hoping it's because they haven't really read it properly... or they are lying about having seen it. When does the spoiler moratorium get lifted here, tomorrow?

20:29 / 26.11.08

Good story - as a reader, I feel completely satisfied.
But I have the feeling something went wrong in the editing stage. The final pages expecially feel... hurried, confused.
Anticlimatic, in a certain way.

20:46 / 26.11.08

Oh hell yes. Best psychological thriller...mmm...ever? The last two lines of the book reached out and finished me off quite well.

huckleberry glove soup

00:58 / 27.11.08

Sooo many great thingsabout the ish. Damien and Joker, the bit about JJ's letter, Talia's revenge...

I pulled over in a parking lot to read it, looked up halfway through it and THERE WAS A CAR BURSTING INTO FLAMES ACROSS THE STREET!

Seriously. Fire trucks and all arrived shortly after.

I pose a few ?'s to the 'Lith.

The thing about Pierce being "my father's double and mine"... anyone know what Bruce was saying?

ZurrEnArrrhhh=The final slurred words of a dying daddy? Zorro in Arkham?

And finally, was that trigger implanted in Brce as a child? Was the big D plotting this moment all of Bruce's life?

01:06 / 27.11.08

no spoilers till tomorrow? hmmm

I guess I could say this is really the apotheosis of batman, as it were. grant elevates him above the obsessed psychotic, the gothic vigilante, all the other incomplete interpretations of the past and makes it utterly clear what he really is. he's the incarnate force of life-giving order, who descends over and over into the worst places imaginable and defeats them, not out of vengence, but because he can. the worst thing that could ever happen to him has already happened,as a child, the rest is just an excercise. he's the reason to superman's raw emotionalism. he thinks of everything. that's his power. he's the child in us who can't understand why bad things have to happen and won't settle for it, so he just thinks and thinks until he can fix it. the joker's line about boxes is absolutely the best.

through this whole run I've been wondering when the jla uber-batman was going to show up. as soon as you see that
patented "hh", you know he was there all along.

and that last page really pulls everything together, all the way back to the arkham asylum graphic novel. I'm just stunned to think that this was supposed to be his first arc. it feels like it's been twenty years of GM building up to the defintive batman statement, because it litteraly took that long to lay the groundwork.

Essential Dazzler

03:17 / 27.11.08

No-one is dissapointed in the slightest? Everyone feels that the issue delivered everything Grant and DC promised it would in interviews and solicitations?

I thought it was a great comic, for sure, but what Grant was selling wasn't what I bought.

03:35 / 27.11.08

well, I'm not sure it was the most shocking moment in seventy years of batman, and I'm not even sure we know who the black glove really is. no one even says outright that hurt is 'the devil' which I suppose is smart, because who wants to be in the same category as neron or something...

the art was sevicable but uneven. some things seems severely rushed. there is the trademark morrisonian sense of the asburd, the anticlimactic, the glaringly obvious and predictable dressed up as the new. but yeah, all in all I thought it was was great, in spite of all that. for every moment that falls flat, there are two that are pure poetry, and some that are so perfectly batman, that you know it will form the basis of what the next generation of creators will be doing with him.

07:55 / 27.11.08

Yes, the problem was definitely not on the issue itself, but on the way it was marketed and overhyped.

Anyway, the "Black Glove" ends up being sort of a Batman's Sublime, the living embodiment of everything Batman stands against, just like the Sublime gene/meme represented everything and everyone opposing Xavier's dream and the X-Men's way.

In Grant's typical fashion, the Black Glove can be even seen as a Tulpa created by Batman, the ultimate enemy he imagined and brought to "life". The ultimate training, the ultimate exercise to achieve the ultimate perfection. Batman can defeat even "evil" itself.

The way I see it, Batman created the Black Glove himself, so we can even dismiss the supernatural angle if needed. Hurt only had to take all the details from Bruce's mind during the isolation chamber experiment.

As for Damien's "deal with the Devil" from 666...

Our Lady Has Left the Building

11:15 / 27.11.08

I think this all boils down to 'don't read promo material before you read the comic it's promoting'. It was good and all but it had impossible expectations to meet.

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