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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

"Heroes" Series 1 (US and Torrents edition)

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20:21 / 15.05.07

Ah, but was it onlya half-hour? If Hiro used his time-suspension powers, he could have parcticed with Takei-sama for literally years and returned mere instants after he left.

Yes, that's the only way I can rationalise the outcome of that scene, however if the writers were attempting to articulate that then they failed utterly. Frankly, that's some of the most outlandishly strange storytelling I've seen for some time, and I really, really don't mean that in a good way.

And, well... I know it's a little thing, but how the Christ could Jessica kill DL if he didn't want her to? Someone to explain please? I know it's a little thing but it blasted my suspension of disbelief to smithereens.

Add the usual shitty dialogue (and Mohinder) and that episode actually got on my nerves quite a lot. I might come back with some comments on the plot later, but at the moment I really can't be arsed.

20:56 / 15.05.07

Yeah I was sort of expecting him to say "Fuck that" and disappear through the floor.

For some reason I also thought he was going to say -

"Your destiny....is PAIN." Which considering the alternative might have actually been better.

I really did expect Hiros dad to train him for a number of weeks, it would have made a lot more sense unless he was just teaching him the move he needed to defeat Sylar.

Meh. Last episode will be good though, hopefully. Would be nice to leave the series on a high.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

02:30 / 16.05.07

But of course, Zach can't be gay.

Ah, right. Fair enough then.

03:50 / 16.05.07

"Your destiny....is to give me back my son."
"You were the strong one all along...."

Someone got paid actual money to think of those.

I am in the wrong industry.

03:54 / 16.05.07

how the Christ could Jessica kill DL

Heh? It was a bullet from a gun wot kilt him....

I imagine Jessica could just sneak up behind up and drop a car on him. Or, like, shoot him. With a gun. Very quickly.

Oh, and I think Sylar "woke up" in the time slip because his power works just like Peter Petrelli's. He only *thinks* he needs to look at/absorb the people's brains. Because he's messed up, maaan.

miss wonderstarr

06:29 / 16.05.07

OMG I bet Real!Candace looks like this

The final sequence, with Peter's speech over images of the heroes, reminded me of one of those YouTube videos that kind of plonkingly lay down a rock track and montage in clips that literally illustrate the lyrics (I've seen at least one of these about Claire).

"We have to SET ASIDE our differences." [Someone lowers a gun] "For the sake of our CHILDREN." [Shot of weeping kid] "And for the sake of the CITY." [NYC panorama] "We need people with DRIVE." [Sylar behind the wheel of a car] "And FOCUS" [Bennett puts his glasses on and blinks]

You get the idea.

~~~~~~~~

It struck me again how much of this storytelling (eclipses in the background ~ one more in this episode) and word/image juxtaposition, is a tribute to WATCHMEN.

07:04 / 16.05.07

I imagine Jessica could just sneak up behind up and drop a car on him. Or, like, shoot him. With a gun. Very quickly.

I'm not saying that DL can't be killed (that would be excessively dumb), I'm saying that Jessica was no threat to him in that scene.

And

Oh, and I think Sylar "woke up" in the time slip because his power works just like Peter Petrelli's. He only *thinks* he needs to look at/absorb the people's brains. Because he's messed up, maaan.

Surely Hiro losing his concentration is a much more elegant explanation? 'Course that doesn't make it true, but I see no reason to think that Sylar doesn't really need to eat brains - I kinda think Heroes is straightforward like that.

10:58 / 16.05.07

Heroes might be straightforward, but I don't think Hiro would lose concentration enough to unfreeze one person without unfreezing everyone -- it's not people he freezes, it's *time*.

On the other hand, maybe Sylar entered the time slip simply because Hiro touched him. Maybe with the sword.

------

I think everyone here is overlooking the fact that Malcolm McDowell had his brain removed on camera on network TV.

Let us take a moment to dwell on this thing.

10:59 / 16.05.07

Did anyone get the idea that Hiro's dad is immortal in some way, probably the original sword's samurai owner? Takei said something along the lines of "I have been waiting for a Nakamura to ascend, I never thought it would be you." This seems to me like he has been around for centuries, sowing seeds and waiting to see if any of them would grow up and have powers.

Also, in terms of time lapse sword training, the obvious way to show this would have been to have Hiro grow his future goatee during the montage. But then Ando would not have been able to leave.

And any guesses on the swordsmith's power?

11:03 / 16.05.07

What, Claremont? Spinning an endless stream of soap-opera clichés and dialogue tics into a long and inexplicably well-loved career, I would guess. Perhaps, in a truly postmodern bit of storytelling, he will be revealed to be writing the story OMG LOLZ!!!one!

miss wonderstarr

11:53 / 16.05.07

Surely, "realistically", a comics fanboy like Hiro would have recognised the name Claremont and made some kind of "this is another sign of my destiny, Ando!!" nod to it.

14:27 / 16.05.07

I was just about to type that I think Heroes takes place in a world without Marvel Comics, but I just remembered that Micah was given a stack of Marvel books in the last ep (I hate that kid, by the way - there's not a line of dialogue that comes out of his mouth that sounds in any way genuine or convincing).

How did DL get behind Linderman? He gets shot, he drops to the floor next to Nikki, Linderman and Nikki don't seem to change position, and then the next thing you know DL is jamming his hand into Linderman's skull from behind.

And why didn't DL just push Nikki out of the way and then become intangible so the bullet passed through him?

Also - why, after clearly showing from above the thin dividers and flimsy curtains separating the populated voting booths, did Micah and the Mastermind girl openly and at audible volume talk about election fraud?

Heroes had a decent increase in quality in the second half of this season, but this was a sloppy, sloppy episode, harking back to that terrible first half...

Keith, like a scientist

14:58 / 16.05.07

How did DL get behind Linderman? He gets shot, he drops to the floor next to Nikki, Linderman and Nikki don't seem to change position, and then the next thing you know DL is jamming his hand into Linderman's skull from behind.

He, um, phases. So he probably phased into the floor and phased back up again.

15:04 / 16.05.07

And why didn't DL just push Nikki out of the way and then become intangible so the bullet passed through him?

Or grabbed her. Seemed to work well enough getting past security and through walls.

15:09 / 16.05.07

On a sidenote, that statue redux is a riot, Msw. I never understood why they even released a moronic maquette of her doing Spidey's laundry. Such a stupid crumb thrown to the misogynistic fatbeard set.

15:32 / 16.05.07

>>>He, um, phases.<<<

Thanks for the condescension.

My problem with it is that Nikki and Linderman don't change position, so DL is lying on the floor between them, and would very likely be noticed if he suddenly dropped through the floor.

Also, he can phase but it hasn't been established that he can fly, so even if he did drop through the floor, it's a considerable stretch to suggest that he'd hover near the ceiling in the room below, float over to a spot behind Linderman, and then lift himself up through the floor again. And if he had the ability to do that it's probable that he wouldn't take the fucking bullet in the first place.

15:55 / 16.05.07

Actually, I wonder if he could swim through solids -- of all the characters, he seems to have the greatest handle on what he can and can't do. I'm not saying that's what he did, but it's interesting to think about.

I liked the fact that he ripped the brain out of the one guy who could have healed him right there.

Bad, bad Alex.

16:38 / 16.05.07

You know, powers really are as much of a narrative minefield as time travel aren't they.

I'm still betting quids that Sylar really does have to eat brains.

Keith, like a scientist

16:47 / 16.05.07

Sorry, Cameron. It just seemed like the in-show logic was telling us that he used his phasing powers to get a drop on Linderman. Perhaps I'm wrong, though, and it was a continuity error of that scene...

miss wonderstarr

17:37 / 16.05.07

I was just about to type that I think Heroes takes place in a world without Marvel Comics, but I just remembered that Micah was given a stack of Marvel books in the last ep (I hate that kid, by the way - there's not a line of dialogue that comes out of his mouth that sounds in any way genuine or convincing).

Also, Hiro namechecked Kitty Pryde in episode 1 or 2, I think. How exactly did she get hold of a genuine Silver Surfer #1 anyway? Are we meant to assume Candice morphed someone's perceptions at a rare comics mart and just happened to grab that one as well as Loeb and Sale's "Hulk: Gray"?

I think Mohinder, especially Mohinder-and-Molly, is even more ghastly than Micah. There's something so creepy about his wide-eyed, big-smile earnestness and near-babytalk when he's talking to her. "My name is Doctor Suresh. I want to help you! Are you playing a trick on me, Molly? My blood is full of just good things, that can save you. It might hurt a little bit, but then you'll be all better!"

18:00 / 16.05.07

That child is horrid, stage-school, precocious nastiness personified. Ugh.

18:18 / 16.05.07

>>>Sorry, Cameron. It just seemed like the in-show logic was telling us that he used his phasing powers to get a drop on Linderman.<<<

I'm sure that is exactly what was intended, but my point is that it was so clumsily staged that it didn't make a lick of sense. All that would have been needed would be to show Linderman advancing on Nikki, her backing away, or something else to get them in the position where DL was on the floor behind Linderman, instead of between them. Then he could do his surprise brain-squeeze and all would have been well.

18:31 / 16.05.07

>>>How exactly did she get hold of a genuine Silver Surfer #1 anyway? <<<

Maybe it's not an actual copy. She could make him see it as a Silver Surfer book, but it's actually a Rob Liefeld comic.

19:08 / 16.05.07

Ah the cruelest joke of all from her yet.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

20:05 / 16.05.07

Of course that begs the question. If Micah were to read the book, would he see the actual Silver Surfer #1 or just some generic silver surfer story? Candace would need to have a pretty good idea of what the interiors of those books looked like to convince Micah they were the real deal.

Is the dark secret of Real!Candace that she is a comic book fan?

miss wonderstarr

20:23 / 16.05.07

I still don't understand her powers, I'm afraid. If Candace walks into a polling station, is she warping the perception of every single person there into believing she's an African-American mother? What about when she's walking down the street ~ does her power work on everyone within sight of her?

20:40 / 16.05.07

I think you are currently asking more questions about it than the writers ever have.

The stupidity of that election rigging scene still floors me.

02:41 / 17.05.07

Actually, I'm not sure anyone who did overhear anything would understand what was being said in the booth -- it was all about talking to machines and stuff. Nothing they said *sounded* like a hacker or someone breaking into the system in conventional ways. (Heh - and in my precinct, most of those booths are empty anyway.)

Candace would need to have a pretty good idea of what the interiors of those books looked like to convince Micah they were the real deal.

I *think* she alluded to letting people see what they wanted to see, didn't she? As in, part of the illusion came from the mark's own mind.

03:50 / 17.05.07

I was kidding about the Surfer comic being an illusion, by the way.

04:02 / 17.05.07

>>>Actually, I'm not sure anyone who did overhear anything would understand what was being said in the booth -- it was all about talking to machines and stuff. Nothing they said *sounded* like a hacker or someone breaking into the system in conventional ways.<<<

They talked about "making it a landslide" and travelling to 12 other precincts to do the same thing, before Micah said all the machines were networked and could do it all from there. If I heard that coming from the booth next to me I think I'd assume something was up.

>>>(Heh - and in my precinct, most of those booths are empty anyway.)<<<

There was a deliberate cut to a bird's eye view of the voting booths, and all of them were full. And the people in the adjacent booths were about 2 feet from Candace and Micah.

What bugs me about this is that it would have been so simple to avoid - all you needed to see is Linderman say to Micah "now here's what I need you to do" and then cut to Candace and Micah in the booth, executing the plan without explaining it at full volume in a crowded room. Or have slightly more isolated voting booths. This happens a lot in this show, particularly in the recent episode - clumsy storytelling that could have been easily fixed with little effort. It's sloppy and it drives me batty.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

04:15 / 17.05.07

I was kidding about the Surfer comic being an illusion, by the way.

I figured you were, however the way the scene is set up makes it highly unlikely that they were the real deal either.

What are the odds that she was tasked to babysit a kid who likes comics, and she goes out and picks up a pile of older rare issues? More likely then not she would hear he liked comics and pick him up a pile of Archie Digests at the local gas station, at least thats what I ended up with half the time as a kid...

miss wonderstarr

05:12 / 17.05.07

Also, if she picked up a Tim Sale comic, she'd be all "hold on, that looks like Isaac Mendez art..."

08:50 / 17.05.07

clumsy storytelling that could have been easily fixed with little effort. It's sloppy and it drives me batty.

Absolutely, Cam. There was nothing, not a thing, wrong with the last episode in terms of storytelling that couldn't have been fixed very easily, and that's what's so annoying

10:54 / 17.05.07

I think you are currently asking more questions about it than the writers ever have.

Yup.

Not in the Face

09:16 / 18.05.07

I also initially thought Hiro would use his time travelling powers to speed up training montage but Ando has made it clear that Hiro has spent a lot of time training as part of his pre-power infatuation with being a hero. So I took the point the montage to be for the Dad (who as part of the Linderman cabal initially may well have known the broad outline of the plot) to bring him to the point where he would be able to kill. I also think the reference to a heart is a reference to Ando and sacrifice.

There is also a question on whether the George Takei we see is the real image. When he first drew the sword the reflection of his eyes was sufficiently different to those of the actor's that there must be some implication? Also the statement 'I've been waiting a long time for one of the Nakamura's to ascend' - what both his kids? How long? Could imply that he is the original sword master, and losing his heart is symbolic for gaining immortality? I'll agree it was clunkily done, perhaps now they know there will be a 2nd series they are holding back some things they would have revealed when they were initially plotting it out?

I also think Sylar doesn't need to eat brains to gain the power - he just thinks he does because thats how he did it the first time. Similarly Hiro doesn't need the sword to use his powers - when Sylar broke it, he jumped out of a desire to protect Ando

As for the ending I'm afraid they will use a rather poor Deus Ex Machina - the virus that Molly has will be used to suppress Sylar's powers

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