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Grant Morrison's Batman

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11:02 / 06.05.07

I'm hoping there's something to using these characters other than the fact that they're comedy racial stereotypes. Seriously. Because there's nothing more than an and that's alright, that's cool handwave towards anything more.

The actual mystery part will be fine, I'm sure. And it's Morrison; I have faith that there's a different angle going here, besides nostalgia for the dodgy, awkward portrayals of not-us in the past.

And if half of these guys, the one's apparently still pushing some real buttons, the ones living in worlds apparently locked into comics-ethnography where Scotland is ruled by lairds and full of huts, where Native Americans all still where buckskins and have never seen a lightbulb, or whatever - even if it's Morrison (and really, I'm not worried about Scotland with him, so much as, oh, Argentina or another retread of The Invisibles's horrible trope of only giving the cool new magicks to white people, while almost everyone else draws on their ethnic specialities) - and they are not protrayed as totally off their rockers?

I know, it's a ploy and to a degree he's totally winding people up, but, y'know? It's worked. I really want to see how he dances through a minefield like that.

12:20 / 06.05.07

DD, I'm not sure the humour is in the stereotyping, actually. It's in the villain being a guy who runs the local grocers.

As far as I can see Grant's already moved some if not all the way beyond that stuff.

01:06 / 07.05.07

well, he didn't came up with those Batmen...

very funny stuff, can't wait! [hm, I'll have to]

some typos there: Diego Maradona, El Paraguayo.

01:58 / 07.05.07

He didn't invent them, but he is choosing to revisit/revive them. And, really, because it's Morrison I hope he's going to make it work. I know there are people who have much more of a problem with some of Morrison's racial/ethnic portrayals (That Invissy magick complaint above? My only racial complain with his work, really.), and it's inherently hazardous material to come back to and play around it. I wouldn't trust it from Johns or Byrne, certainly. But, Morrison, sure, I'll take it on faith it'll have a point beyond the jokes (for the record, it did stick in my craw a bit that it's the Native guy who's going to be stuck fighting at the grocer level, perhaps unfairly, but it's just - the European Bat-knockoffs seem to mostly be doing alright for themselves, in terms of being semi-celebs and doing the real adventure/smash thing; it wouldn't if the distribution of badassery were more smoothly distributed in supercomics overall) and I know odds are very in favor of me enjoying it.

I am honestly and sincerely interested in how he dances through the minefield he's decided, deliberately, to go waltzing through. And not really in a bad way. I don't want him to fail, to step on a landmine and have it pop up and spray ball bearings in his face at mach two.

11:29 / 07.05.07

LOL.

17:18 / 07.05.07

Actually interested in what's up with Knight and Squire, since they got a lot of screen time in GM's JLA Classified 3-issue stint. Also wondering if there'll be mention of the International Ultramarines Corps/Superbia concept that no writer other than Grant seems to have wanted to pick up since they were introduced.

Does anyone even remember the Ultramarines? Vixen was part of them, as well as some other heroes...(I feel like I'm geeking out, LOL.)

12:06 / 08.05.07

off-topic:

i've never seen anything wrong with the INVISIBLES in terms of racial portrayals. the Jim Crow issue was so great.

my problem is only when I think of Fanny; Brazilian pantheist mythology has A LOT more to Crow's Voundoun [given our culture, an European-African-Native mashup] than a native Central-American belief system.

it'd feel a bit repetitive to have Fanny as a Macumba follower when you think of Jim Crow, but would be so cool.

if the title is ever adapted into Film or TV, Fanny should certainly be reworked either as a Mãe de Santo or simply a Mexican - would make more sense.

Grant's Rio was spot-on, but everything else felt a bit off, like having her family in the back of a pick-up truck at the Amazon the next panel [it's SO far from Rio].

threadrot ends.

09:57 / 09.05.07

So the next issue's out in a week. And DC Solicits say 666 is now out in July (jeez).

I've been thinking about the Three Ghosts of Batman, three greatest traumas externalized, three biggest failures as tulpas, or demons made manifest in the world through his exorcising them from himself, like Marriage/Dally suggested. Maybe this is just recap. Wording on my mind.

Murder of his parents. Bane breaking his back, obsolete, impotent. Letting Jason Todd die, neglectful, stupid.

The Gun, the Spine, the Son - as Dickensian regret-ghosts of Batguys past, present, and future. Failures of the boy, the man, and the father. (Although I think in comicsworld his back was broken awhile after Jason Todd's death).

I wonder if we'll actually see the 3rd ghost, or if he'll be conspicuous by his absence. Damien, or something else we've seen.

I thought there was more, but that's all I've got for now. Something about that tryptych is saying something to me.

I wish this came out more often, it's good comics.

The Natural Way

12:50 / 09.05.07

Actually - and very weirdly - the DC solicits say 666 is out in July and 667 is out in June.

What. The. Fuck.

13:11 / 09.05.07

Does anyone even remember the Ultramarines?

They turned up (relatively) recently in the first JLA: Classified storyline. S'a good story (Morrison naturlich) and explains why they're not around anymore and is a sort of prelude to Seven Soldiers.

14:37 / 09.05.07

It also gives a small lead-in to some of the issues The Knight has had to deal with, and might be touched on in The League of Batmen arc.

18:52 / 09.05.07

Great hypothesis, Dones

15:04 / 16.05.07

and is there REALLY a new issue out today of this, too? Oh my stars and garters...

16:27 / 16.05.07

One hopes.

Spyder Todd 2008

23:41 / 16.05.07

Indeed it came out! And it was Joycore.
Mild spoiler-

...

Best opening line in my recent memory: "Face down in my own blood and vomit in the pouring rain. Must be a better way to strike terror in the heart of criminals."
Freakin' awesome.

13:35 / 17.05.07

Indeed.

And the 'jealous Talia' subplot is interesting -- it certainly may have the virtue of never really having been done before in Batman comics, to my knowledge.

Here we see the 'Three Ghosts of the Batman' idea more fleshed out, and now we know it Wasn't Really Bane After All, definitively so. I like the idea of the Black Casebook for Bats' zanier or more sci-fi adventures.

The Natural Way

09:14 / 18.05.07

So the third ghost represents Batman's overdeveloped sense of responsibility towards his city? What happens when he's not there to protect it? What happens if he lets the darkness in?

The Natural Way

09:15 / 18.05.07

When did Gordon get reinstated as Commissioner? Is it a recent thing?

Regrettable Juvenilia

10:06 / 18.05.07

Black Adam did it.

Phex: Dorset Doom

10:36 / 18.05.07

During the 52 year Gordon and Harvey Bullock came out of retirement and cleaned up the Gotham PD, which had been riddled with corruption since the events of (the absolutely awesome and much missed, by me) Gotham Central.

Johnny fighters

10:49 / 18.05.07

I enjoyed this issue but it felt a bit slight in lighht of what we'd been promised. What happened to 'Buddhist isolation rituals' and indeed 'Joe Chill'? Do the DC solicits bear any connection to the actual issues anymore?

The Natural Way

11:05 / 18.05.07

They never have in Morrison's case. Tru fax.

13:35 / 18.05.07

there will probably be a reference to his isolation during 52 in the final issue of this 3-story arc, methinks.

The Natural Way

14:40 / 18.05.07

A reference, perhaps, but it seems Grant wants to drag the mystery out for a little while yet, which is a shame, but I'm sure there's some over-arching narrative/dramatic purpose to it. Each of the Ghosts inhabiting the cops represent essential Bat-fears, and the time frame fits with Gordon and the cover-up in the GCPD, etc., so I'm sticking with the tulpa/negative karma idea for now. Also, I don't think the story would kick off with a reference to Bruce 'getting over it' unless there was a relationship between the events of this arc and the ritual in Nan Parbat.

18:15 / 18.05.07

Didn't Bruce 'expunge his demons' during that Ten-Eyed Men sequence in 52? I mean, as an explanation for how he recovered during the missing year? And if so, could these Three Ghosts be those demons made manifest?

Spyder Todd 2008

22:43 / 18.05.07

I think that's the general idea, yeah.

The Natural Way

10:24 / 19.05.07

I guess it is a long thread, but.....

21:15 / 19.05.07

D-, andy.

11:55 / 20.05.07

The three Bat-doppelgangers don't seem to represent his fears (plural), but his GREATEST fear (singular). The fear of losing his humanity in his quest for vengeance.

Perhaps that's how Joe Chill ties in. Because this post-IC Batman has never caught the object of his vengeance, he is that much more capable of becoming obsessive to the point of inhumanity.

14:15 / 20.05.07

Waugh sorry guys! Got so excited; posted before reading. Sorry sorry. How embarrassing.

Anyways, back to the latest issue--does anyone know if the Black Casebook's been mentioned prior to GM's latest run on Batman? "Vampires. Flying Saucers. Time Travel...All the things we'd seen that didn't fit and couldn't be explained went into the Black Casebook." Regardless, it seems like a good vehicle for bringing in Zur-En-Arrh, Bat-Mite and all the other wacky stuff from Bat-history back into prominence...

14:19 / 20.05.07

The black casebook may've been namechecked in his last JLA story, or it may just be an extension of that scifi closet Jim Gordon need never know about.

Morrison seems to be one of the few writers to tackle Bats and understand that if he's going to live in the DCU he might as well live in the DCU. Especially since vampires, spacemen, and weird science appeared in his title even before he was properly linked into a great big shared universe. It was never all ground-level punching gunmen and smiley pale psychotics, back then.

04:48 / 21.05.07

This felt like a nice uptick from last issue. But if Kubert is going to be this damned slow - I'm assuming he's the issue, but I might be wrong - I'd prefer another artist to finish out the run.

13:40 / 21.05.07

Hear, hear, Decadent. Totally agree.

06:24 / 22.05.07

Yeah but I mean, he's in the JLA. If he writes down everything to do with aliens and time travel and other weirdness, when does he get time for anything else. Why does a guy who hangs out with Superman and the Martian Manhunter, etc., think there's something strange or even noteworthy about UFOs?

06:29 / 22.05.07

Why does a guy who hangs out with Superman and the Martian Manhunter, etc., think there's something strange or even noteworthy about UFOs?

Batman's a bit anal and obsessed with all the details? That plus detective are kinda what make most Batstories. Well, those, and fighting smart.

They would presumably be UFOs still un-identifiable, and he, being who he is, would want to identify them. In case. Same with every other mysterious mystery.

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