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Grant Morrison's Batman

 
  

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Aha! I am Klarion
21:38 / 14.02.07
663 was an excellent issue. I esp. enjoyed how it told part of the story in images in addition to the prose narration (for example: the batmoblie rocketing to Arkham).

Also, did anyone think it ironic that the very day this issue came out Robbie Williams went into rehab?
 
 
Aha! I am Klarion
02:52 / 15.02.07
Also just want to add that I think this issue was Morrison's best super-hero work (other than Super-man which in a giddy fan-boy category of its own) since Doom Patrol.
 
 
onorthocrasi
07:36 / 15.02.07
I really felt like i got a lot of comic for my money.
 
 
The Natural Way
18:16 / 15.02.07
Damn right you did. I read it aloud to my g/f in bed this afternoon and there was a general consensus that 663 rocked. The Joker revamped and horribly scary? It's all there in the white hot flush of selves as they rocket into the radioactive, black kryptonic hole he calls a soul. The "deep" exchange between Bats and Mr J at the end of Killing Joke where they discover that they are the mirror image of the other ("Take a look! We resemble each other!" or whatever) is rendered terrifyingly meanigless when we realise the Joker, depending on what self he's accessing resembles anyone or no-one at all. Grant's new, ultra-psychotic, Clown at Midnight incarnation could seem a little lacking in imagination or cheap if we hadn't just taken a prose road-trip into the Joker's thought bubbles.

Right now he just makes me shit myself.
 
 
The Natural Way
18:20 / 15.02.07
And I want more Clown at Midnight before the end of Mozzer's run. There's no point setting up an evil baddy and then leaving him for shitter comic writers to DO NOTHING AT ALL WITH. 'Cause that's what'll happen.
 
 
This Sunday
19:07 / 15.02.07
Wasn't the omni-shifting-identity, supermodern becomes-always-what-he-socially-needs-to-be Joker the reasoning given back in 'Arkham Asylum'? To be fair, it's the only Joker that makes sense and the only way you can either up his bodycount potential or drop him to a more comedic kiddie-safe figure.
 
 
vajramukti
19:48 / 15.02.07
the whole sleeve less white butchers apron look was pretty fucked up. step up from the purple tuxedo i think,

i wasn't quite getting the stitiches in the face thing, until i realised that the doctors had stitched joker's mouth shut to a normal size and he used the scalpel to open it up again... ick.

I'm still not entirely clear on how this joker differs from the killing joke/death in the family/arkham asylum permutation we've had for awhile. besides the fact that he's funny and scary, no one has really gotten a handle on him for some time. looks like morrison is trying to cement his arkham asylum interpretation as the defintive one for at least the next while.
 
 
Aha! I am Klarion
00:15 / 16.02.07
Joker as Ichi the killer?
 
 
Spaniel
09:12 / 16.02.07
Well, he's supposed to be different from the Killing Joke incarnation in that he's supposed to have a new personality. Quite what that personality will look like is still up for grabs, but I strongly suspect that we haven't seen the last of Morrison's Joker. This story was just an introduction - the set-up. The meat of the story is to come.

Obvs.

Oh, and I wouldn't count out the purple suit just yet.

What did that line about being able to kill Batman "right now" mean?
 
 
The Natural Way
09:13 / 16.02.07
Yes, Mr Daytripper, the Bowie Joker did first appear in Arkham Asylum, but Grant's really filling in the fine detail with this Batman run; cataloguing [sp?] the different selves and dumping us there at the moment when a new self is born.

The Clown at Midnight seems to me to represent some kind of annhilating nihilism, pure and simple. Just death. A void. This Joker doesn't play with funny toys, he just destroys.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
09:17 / 16.02.07
I thought the way the new incarnation viewed Ivy at the end was particularly chilling. I really felt Morrison got a handle on the Joker's lethally unpredictable 'moodswings'. One minute he's a brightly coloured 'theme' criminal or a camp wheezing Cesra Romero, the next a blankly dispassionate psychotic, almost alien in his detachment.

I thought this was aces - just the right amount of pulpy lashings, but with a distinctly Morrisonian flourish.
I can even forgive the horrible 'Digital Justice' artwork. Just.
 
 
Spaniel
09:41 / 16.02.07
Yeah, the art was tres shit.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
12:06 / 16.02.07
Yowsa! Jog certainly didn't think much of it.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:45 / 16.02.07
Van Fleet is a great artist when he actually draws ink line stuff, but this was a bit too computer-generated for my tastes (which unfortuntely seems to be Van Fleet's new direction, as I recall some project he did a year or so ago which took the same CGI approach), although the texture/tone of the background stuff in particular was pretty cool, I thought.

And yeah, I'm sure Morrison will bring back his "new" Joker before the end of his run. He's also hinted that Talia will come back as well during his tenure.

The "new" Joker seems to nicely summarize a lot of Morrison's favorite ideas about our being able to infuse ourselves with different personalities in our everyday lives, like putting in a new disk and downloading a new persona/style depending on your wants/needs for a given situation.
 
 
Spaniel
14:23 / 16.02.07
I hope he doesn't go in for that stuff anymore. It's utter bollocks.
 
 
The Natural Way
14:32 / 16.02.07
Wolf, the new Joker isn't some Invisible with a conscious interface between hirself and the MeMeplex, he's The Clown at Midnight and he's an evil bastard. Grant's always understood the Joker as a roiling sea of personalities struggling for ascendancy (so nothing "new" there then), but he seems to be developing the idea that, historically, the Joker has condensed into specific identities at specific times. This is not a process the character controls, rather it strikes me as purely reflexive/reactive. I love the fact that this book is about the moment when this occurs.
 
 
Janean Patience
15:28 / 16.02.07
diz: The first few pages [of the first GM issue] are taking the grim-n-gritty Batman status quo from the past two decades or so through to their brutally logical conclusion, so as to get it out of the system early to clear the decks for his run.

Didn't clear those decks of Psycho Joker for long, uh?
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
17:16 / 16.02.07
for about 6 months in 87/88, i modeled myself on the joker.

I was obsessed.

wore spats. got a quiff (was into morrissey at same time). bought a purple waistcoat. laughed into the mirror.

pure channeled the c*nt so I did.

remember fighting with my big brother, got really upset bout summat, started crying/laughing.

brother pure rumbled me tho. said, 'you think you're the joker!'

never been so embarrased in my life!
 
 
Aha! I am Klarion
19:18 / 16.02.07
One thing that I did notice was all the metaphors relating to film in the issue. It was slightly irksome...but I wonder if this is some sort of comment about us, the spectators of these battles between the Joker and Batman. Or is it trying to emphasis the porno/subterrean element of this issue...all the dirty smells, the physical deformity, etc.

Is this own some level supposed to read like some kind of slash or pornographic fan-fiction?
 
 
Spaniel
19:18 / 16.02.07
That is embarassing.
 
 
Aha! I am Klarion
19:19 / 16.02.07
"Is this on some level"...I'm retarded
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
19:29 / 16.02.07
I think you'll find you mean retardent, dear. And, while I'm not sure I believe you, I'm certainly not going to test the theory.
 
 
Spaniel
19:40 / 16.02.07
Above post to my good frence Yawn.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
20:58 / 16.02.07
and with hindight, even more embarrassing sharing it.

fuck you joker!!
 
 
Triplets
22:49 / 16.02.07
I bet you made a great Joker, yawn. Not a comic goes by that you don't... see him listening to the Smiths.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
00:06 / 17.02.07
for about 6 months in 87/88, i modeled myself on the joker.

I was obsessed.

wore spats. got a quiff (was into morrissey at same time). bought a purple waistcoat. laughed into the mirror.

pure channeled the c*nt so I did.


And did you wear lipstick and a lot of white pancake? Did you dye your hair green? Were you on a lot of speed and acid?

And what was it like at the office, being the Joker? (I'm assuming you were in your late twenties at the time.)
 
 
FinderWolf
01:05 / 17.02.07
Apparently next issue will feature Bats dealing with the famous Joe Chill, and the issue after that will cover more of 'Batman undergoing spiritual cleansing to rid himself of the cumulative effect of being an asshole as Batman' in the 52 series.
 
 
mightybroke
13:42 / 17.02.07
I've finally read this and was pleasantly suprised. After the eye-gouging art of Kubert, this was a nice change of pace.

The shattered psyche of the Clown Prince as a result of a bullet to the head was shit-your-pants frightening indeed. I felt Morrison's run on the Bat had a bumpy start, but this issue has renewed my faith.

I'm looking forward to The Issue of The Beast. How perfect is that? The devil's scholar writing the most Satanic character in DC's six hundred and sixty-sixth issue? It's a match made in Hades!
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
15:46 / 17.02.07
Alex:

LOL/sob
 
 
TimCallahan
02:21 / 18.02.07
After reading 663, I'm more curious about Morrison's other prose work in the Batman and Superman annuals. Does anyone know where I can read a copy of those?
 
 
andrewdrilon
06:33 / 18.02.07
Tim! The invaluable Dan Fish has got Grant's old prose stories for Superman, Batman and Captain Britain archived at this link:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fish1000/index/lostandfound.htm

That said--I know Grant had a couple of prose stories published before, and I've only read "The Braille Encyclopedia" (it was in one of the Best New Horror anthos) and the Disco2000 one so far. Does anyone know if Lovely Biscuits is still in print?
 
 
Alex's Grandma
06:39 / 18.02.07
That was much better than I thought it was going to be.

It did read like a fairly lurid shade of magenta to begin with, but once it settled down it did make sense as an experiment. George would have struggled to fit all that in about the Joker's new way of looking at things otherwise. And I suppose he might have been worried about the artwork as well, and a possible 'Arkham Asylum-'related f***ing bollocks misinterpretation of his ideas about the characters; best to get it down in cold, hard text, then.

Not quite sure about the wisdom of redesigning him along the lines of the early, pre-Columbine Marilyn Manson, though. I suppose it doesn't really matter, but it's not a look that going to last much beyond the end of the current run, I fear. More pertinently, George is going to need a much better artist than the current series regular if he's planning on getting the new, short-lived, scary, post-ECT god of death Joker across at all.

The other thing is, the treatment of the character here reminded a lot of the Clown in the recent 'Nighthawk' mini-series by Daniel Way, in the sense of his being portrayed as a semi-catatonic, homicidal maniac (the Joker that is, not Daniel Way.) It's not a good thing or a bad thing, it's just a thing. Only, there was very little in that series that recalled the swinging 1970's playboy Batman, for all Nighthawk's basically, and self-consciously, much the same character, had Bruce Wayne been born as an African American. And seen his parents gunned down by a white American. And ... well there are some tricky issues raised, really. (It was a good effort I thought; for anyone who missed it, I'm sure it's still available from your local comic shop, possibly at a substantially reduced cover price, but you shouldn't let that, or Daniel Way's increasingly troubling work since, put you off. Arguably.)

So is all this a sign that George has abandoned the idea of trying to brighten up 'Batman', and has decided, instead, to go one more dark? Well I certainly hope so. Whatever, I'm looking forward to the Joker's (surely inevitable) next appearance in this, in a way that I'm probably not wrt the ninja man-bats.
 
 
TimCallahan
14:31 / 18.02.07
I tried Dan Fish's site, but the Morrison prose stuff shows up as gibberish. Any idea why?
 
 
miss wonderstarr
14:42 / 18.02.07

There's a joke hanging there just waiting for someone to punch it home.
 
 
andrewdrilon
16:05 / 18.02.07
LOL let's not, miss wonderstar. i think your message did it already.

Tim, are you opening them with the right program? I've been reading them with CDisplay Comic Reader, which you can download HERE.
 
  

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