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"Stupid" magick, religion and spirituality questions

 
  

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Sekhmet
12:26 / 13.04.06
Is that meant to be a stupid question? I think perhaps it should be its own thread...
 
 
Isadore
12:34 / 13.04.06
Do witches keep just their notes and procedures in a Book of Shadows? It might be very much the same. I never did keep a very good BoS when I was practicing Wicca, though, but then I never really got Wicca even when I was practicing it. I'm much more comfortable with the concept of a lab book, just applied to my spiritual experimentation as such. (Mordant pegged it!)

Unfortunately I still have a block against not using pen for Lab Books (tm), and I also have a block about crossing stuff out in a Magickal Reckord (tm). So that's been interesting.

The book I'm currently using is a bit small to take pages and pages of procedures. However, the procedures really do need to be with the records of dates and times and tests and whatnot, so now I'm just putting all of this in my current record book; small or not, it'll just have to manage until it's full. Keeping more than one book at a time just confuses me.

Funny observation: Up til now I thought I'd been taking Ye Olde Traditional approach, and now while actually writing down a procedure for the LRP, I figure out that the Kabalistic Cross I'm using to open and close came out of a Llewellyn Almanac version of the LBRP that I tossed the rest of. It seems to work, though, so I'll try stuff the other way and see how that works.

Experimenting is fun.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
12:36 / 13.04.06
You do realise that Ye Olde Traditional LBRP is just over 100 years old?
 
 
Isadore
12:40 / 13.04.06
Yes, actually, thanks.

I guess my problem is just that I'm familiar with the nine-planet system, and not the more classic seven-planet one. I certainly don't want to rewrite everything from the ground up! So it looks like I just need to go read more on the subject until I am comfortable working with the seven classical planets.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
12:46 / 13.04.06
I don't see how this is a stupid question either, and it's easily enough for a new thread.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
12:48 / 13.04.06
In that case, maybe it's best to think of the "planets" as masks for the Sephiroth, or the "powers" expressed by the Roman Gods that the planetary bodies share names with. When you invoke Venus in the Hexagram rite, it's got more to do with the mysteries of Aphrodite than it has the physical ball of dust and gas floating in space, etc.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
12:51 / 13.04.06
I guess it's a thread by itself. Haven't started a thread for a while and I guess I was just throwing something out that was on my mind so I put it here.
 
 
Quantum
13:19 / 13.04.06
'According to the Ptolemaic system, there were seven planets, the Firmament or the Fixt, and the Crystalline. Above these nine came the Primum Mobile or First Moved, and the Empyrean or abode of Deity.'

The order is Earth, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Sun, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Stars, Primum Mobile. Corresponding to the ten Sephiroth of course (in reverse order there).

Ptolemaic System
 
 
Bruno
18:29 / 25.04.06
I've seen the term 'glamour' used on Temple and also in Promethea but never come across it in a book on magic. What exactly does it refer to? And from which author/tradition did it start being used?
 
 
Quantum
18:41 / 25.04.06
It's from the Scottish. 'The original meaning of the word glamour was the act of casting a spell over someone'
 
 
Sekhmet
18:47 / 25.04.06
It's used a lot in connection with faery lore.
 
 
Unconditional Love
02:39 / 26.04.06
Could anybody recommend a good book detailing the patakies, afrocuban stories of the orishas and other associations.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
08:37 / 26.04.06
For patakis, I like the little books put out by Original Publications, one for each of the Orisha. The titles of the book are the names of the Orisha. They are very light, brief, little pamphlets but they have several patakis and songs and stuff in them. There are two authors writing them, Baba Raul Canizares, who is coming from a Santeria angle; and Awo Falokun Fatunmbi, who writes from an Ifa perspective. I prefer the Santeria ones myself, just because I find Canizares a better writer. His little books makes me think of storybooks that you might give to children to teach them about the Orisha. I like them. The Oshun one is really good.
 
 
Unconditional Love
14:54 / 26.04.06
Looking to learn about elegba and oya for the mo, but also oggun,oshun and yemoja at some point. What is the difference between santeria and ifa? I just started a convo with a guy from an ifa background, he was mainly talking the metaphysics of ifa, which reminded me of chi ideas from some areas of taoism, i think hes describing the process of healing via spirit, spirit that is accessed through the physical nature, which would also apply to root working, dance etc.

Which reminds me, i am also coming across reference to salsa and santeria, any idea? Maybe i just take up salsa to find out.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
15:05 / 26.04.06
Ifa is the pure Yoruban stuff, Santeria is the new world version of Ifa syncretised with Catholicism and other influences.
 
 
Shrug
11:14 / 27.04.06
Does anyone know the significance of the marigold in Hindi culture? I've been searching on-line but to no avail.

Also: Any chance of modding the thread title to something like
"'Stupid' Magick and Religion Questions"?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
11:40 / 27.04.06
(Good call, Shrug. Have put in the request.)
 
 
Sekhmet
13:01 / 27.04.06
Shrug - that's an interesting question. I know that in Hispanic culture the marigold is considered the flower of the Dead, and is used extensively in Dios de los Muertos decorations and altars.

(*google break*)

Wow. Apparently the marigold has lots of cultural baggage from all over the place...

Let's see... it looks like in India the marigold represets luck, and that it's sometimes offered to the gods Vishnu and Lakshmi, particularly in the month of December. It's often used in wedding garlands along with roses, and in religious ceremonies, draped in garlands over statues and on temples. They can be used to make dye - which I would guess is probably saffron-colored, so there's a connection with monks, too, perhaps.

Here's a mythological connotation:

Among the aboriginal tribes of Central India, known as the Gonds, legend connected the origins of marigold with the God of the Gonds, Gondmuli. He abducted the wife of another god and, in a fierce battle, the other god emerged victorious after cutting off Gondmuli's head. The wife wept for Gondmuli as she was dragged back by her husband. She dropped her hairpin and a marigold sprouted from the place it landed.

Marigolds are used as offerings and decoration for places of worship, at funerals, weddings and other ceremonies. During the festival of Holi, when people splash each other with coloured water and powder, yellow water is obtained by soaking and boiling the flowers and then leaving them overnight in the liquid.
 
 
Quantum
14:50 / 27.04.06
Holi is amazing. They have huge water-cannons, like the riot police use, but coloured and scented and with flower petals in, and the crowd gets drenched and parties frenetically. I'd love to go.
 
 
Quantum
14:52 / 27.04.06
Here's a stupid magic question- why isn't the Placebo effect proof of magic? I'll prolly start a thread on it but if there's an easy answer give it over now.
 
 
Shrug
12:01 / 28.04.06
Don't know about your question Quantum but thanks very much to Sekhmet. All very useful. Cheers.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:11 / 28.04.06
Quants--As I understand it, there are 'mundane' psychological and physiological reasons as to why the placebo effect does what it does, even though we don't fully understand them yet. It's explicable on a physical level, it just hasn't been fully explic'd.
 
 
Sekhmet
15:17 / 28.04.06
Which may or may not be the same thing as magic, depending on how you define "magic"...

I think Granny Weatherwax would have called it "headology" and had done with it.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:32 / 28.04.06
True, but even if you extend the definition of 'magic' to include things like the placebo effect, you still haven't proven that anything else exists besides systems for which we already have nonmagical definitions.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
16:31 / 28.04.06
Hey there all,

I've finally buckled down and started work on my Big God Magic book in earnest. I was actually making a decent amount of headway, but I've hit a couple of snags.

I want to include a rough outline of the year of crap that followed my first evocation of Loki, but getting a few paragraphs on that down seems to take more out of me than three or four pages on anything else. It's like the whole issue just drains my batteries on the spot. I've tried to get around it by just skipping that bit and moving on to something less grim and more inspiring, but somehow just knowing it's there and i'm going to have to tackle it properly is enough to suck all the wind out of my sails.

Also, still not quite seeing the shape of the text in question. I'm going for more of an autobiographical thing than a how-to manual, basically because I don't really know what I'm doing and have no business telling people how-to anything. What I did, what happened next, that sort of thing. If you were to buy a book on BGM/Loki/heathen mysticism/related issues, what would you hope to find in it?

(Thanks to the people who helped me with the shirt thing, BTW. I have a Plan, but it's got to wait for Midsummer now.)
 
 
Sekhmet
17:39 / 28.04.06
Try writing that bit in second or third person.

Ooh ooh ooh - even better, write it from Loki's POV instead of your own. Have him describe the events and explain the why of all the things that happened, the reasons that you had to go through all the shit.

You might ask His Nibs if he'd help out, even.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
16:51 / 02.05.06
I did think about writing parts of it from Loki's perspective, but I feel sort of, I don't know, cheeky doing that. Like, what if I got it wrong and said something really stuid while speaking as a God or a spirit in that way? I always get more than a little irked when I see people putting on the god-voice to trot out their own assumptions, preconceptions or wish-fulfillment excercises.
 
 
Sekhmet
18:03 / 02.05.06
Point. It might be worthwhile to ask himself what he thinks of the idea, though... Have you ever tried channelling him in writing, like with the spooky guides?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
08:32 / 03.05.06
I did ask (about the write/channel thing). Um... apparently it's not a good idea to try. Bit presumptuous, and likely to overload the circuits. The spooks are essentially well-disposed to communication, like to talk, and don't mind being poked for an informal chat. Our Friends in the North seem to need a bit more of a run-up. It's still a possibility but would need to be done in the context of a full altar service, I think.
 
 
Quantum
09:55 / 03.05.06
Might it help to be explicit? I mean, include the difficulty writing about it in the description? Seems to me I want transparency and honesty from my magic writers.
I've been reading the introductions to dozens of books in the shop, from Silver Ravenwolf to Jan Fries, and I've noticed the writers I respect have a 'voice' that's recognisably... sensible, or grounded, or some word like that. Pragmatic, that's the word. The rubbish ones affect a magicker-than-thou stance, dispensing their amazing wisdom on pizza magic or whatever, the better ones approach it as a journey of discovery like a native guide or take a more autobiographical approach. In my opinion.

The placebo effect- it turns out it can't be explained by mundane means (Lab Thread with links) and it's better termed 'meaning response', and it's almost impossible to even define-
"The placebo effect is the therapeutic effect produced by [things] objectively without specific activity for the condition being treated." This makes no sense whatsoever. Indeed, it flies in the face of the obvious. The one thing of which we can be absolutely certain is that placebos do not cause placebo effects. Placebos are inert and don't cause anything."
I'm going to start a thread on it, it's the only way to be sure.
 
 
electric monk
14:31 / 03.05.06
Where would I have come across the phrase "The true magician always has everything s/he needs"? It could have been in a book, it could have been here in the Temple...
 
 
Dead Megatron
21:07 / 03.05.06
Here's a very broad question

In the last few day, the sumbol/theme/sigil of coiled serpents have been sprouting around me in an alarmly high rate. I do know it from Hermes staff, the caduceus, and a few other more recent (like in a trans-humanism icon) but what do they represent, after all? (the serpents, I mean). I get the feeling they represent earthly wisdom/knowledge, but I'm not sure such insight is right at all. Need guidance here. thanks

I'll accept any insight, link, connection, symbolism you may have to offer. Ties to DNA's double helix a plus.
 
 
ghadis
01:07 / 04.05.06

I am the flow out of the Primeval flood
The one who emerges from the water
I am NEHEBKAU,
The Serpent of many coils


That is a very loose translation fron a part of the Pyramid Texts. Egyptian stuff. Long time ago...


The cosmology that somtimes goes with NEHEBKAU as a serpent goes like this...

In the begining there was NUN. NUN was or is without form.
Within this nothing, and all was this nothing, was ATUM. ATUM was a creative fucker. ATUM wanted to create. ATUM looked around and saw stuff to create with. NUN,at this point was the serpent NEHEBKAU. The serpent was all about holding him back. ATUM had to cut himself free. This he did and went on to maifest more of the universe through ATUM-RA-KHEPRR....SHU-TEFUT-GEB-GEB-NT...etc etc

I guess what i'm saying through all that is that that NEHEBKAU as a (before) creation god is intereting to look at. That sort of stuff is very primeval. The unmanifest as it were,
 
 
+am
01:33 / 04.05.06
How do other intelligences communicate with you in your head? How does it feel from a sensory perspective? Is it the same voice as your inner monologue, or noticeably different? Can you be wondering about something else and a different "voice" cuts in, or must the mind be silent? I am currently doing a lot of reiki/earth-energy work, seeing abstract colours and pulses, entering seemingly altered states of consciousness, but so far no sense of communication with anything "other". When I do try to say "hello? anyone there?" referring to possible guides/higher self etc., it feels.. wrong. And i feel foolish. And go back to the combination of free-association (or maybe it is something deeper) and concentrated "no-thought" that makes up most of the conscious part of me doing energy work upon myself.. More meditation practise required perhaps, to still the tricksy conscious mind?
 
 
ORA ORA ORA ORAAAA!!
12:21 / 05.05.06
ok, here's a dumb one: is a crossroads just a crossroads? Is the crossroads outside Town Hall in Sydney, the one that pretty much everyone who goes through the city goes through, bigger/better/more important than the one around the corner which very few people go through?

Is it based on both roads (Sydney Town Hall crossroad has George St, the main street in Sydney, and some other useless street no-one goes on, for instance)? Or an aggregate, or nothing, or my personal opinion?

There are places where highways cross, somewhere around my town, and they've always not felt important at all, but the Town Hall one does feel much more important. It also has the town hall on one corner and the Queen Victoria Building (big oldschool shopping mall, famous building) on another, which might help.

I don't know. I also don't know why I'm asking, but it's been sitting in the back of my head for a while.
 
  

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