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Marvel Mythology Surgery

 
  

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FinderWolf
18:09 / 13.02.07
I think REIGN just looks so bad and such a shameless Frank Miller: DKR ripoff that I don't give it any of my time or attention. I didn't know about this particular tidbit. Sounds like writer/artist Kaare Andrews' attempt to back to grim 'n' gritty "oh so horribly REALISTIC!!!!" superheroes. Yawn.
 
 
Spaniel
18:44 / 13.02.07
I dunno about outrage, more like incredulity.
That is without a doubt the most ridiculous thing I've heard in months. What the fucking fuckery were they thinking of. God, and to think a few years ago I was singing Kaare Andrew's praises. Jesus, I'm embarrassed.

UUUUUNNNNNNHHHH!
 
 
matthew.
18:52 / 13.02.07
First two issues of the tripe follow a fat Peter Parker as he stumbles his way through the super-future. Ooh, look at the shininess. This shit is fucking twenty years too late. Hello, DKR! Hello, William Gibson and fucking hello, Kingdom Come - I mean, Earth X or whatever the fuck that thing was called. In Earth X, we had a fat Peter Parker stumble around a shiny future until he put on his suit.

I'm going to go read Promethea right now. Fuck off, Marvel.
 
 
matthew.
19:01 / 13.02.07
Ironically, or maybe not ironic, but stupid, my name has been "matt, agent of shield" for 31 days, and I just changed it to "matt, agent of hydra". Both Marvel properties.

Whoops!
 
 
FinderWolf
19:16 / 13.02.07
Well, Andrews is often a very good artist. He changes up styles quite often, usually to good effect. Too bad his visual style in REIGN is a literal Frank Miller: DKR in 1985 ripoff. Many panels (faces, especially) look like Miller & Janson could have drawn them.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
19:27 / 13.02.07
Matt - I'm also rereading Promethea right now. Sophie remains one of my favourite protagonists.

RE: REIGN. That premise about MJ's death sounds suspiciously like it was cribbed from Janey Slater's cancer in Watchmen, which as I recall was induced by Ozymandias, wasn't it? But blamed on Manhattan? Suggests something might be foul, and not just the obvious plot cribbing.
 
 
matthew.
19:44 / 13.02.07
Will it be - yawn - Norman Osbourne behind it?
 
 
Triplets
20:51 / 13.02.07
Is it wrong? Listen, punk!
He's got radioactive spunk.
How's the patience of this thread?
Take a look: his girlfriend's dead.
Hey there, there cries the Spider-man!
 
 
Chew On Fat
13:48 / 14.02.07
Yay Triplets!

Anyway, I presume the writer of the incredibly daft plot development above is referencing this piece of ongoing american history

A survey of 10,051 ill veterans performed by Operation Desert Shield / Desert Storm Association found that 51% of spouses were ill and 22% of children. While not scientific studies these surveys seem to show a widespread incidence of illness among family members of ill veterans.

Female spouses have reported a high rate of miscarriages, menstrual and reproductive problems, and burning semen during sexual intercourse. The Association of Birth Defect Children (ABDC) provides information, resources and a registry of children with birth defects possibly related to their parents service in the Gulf.

Quotations are from the first page I found when I googled 'Gulf War syndrome spouses'

gulfweb.org

This is what happens when you spray a given area with minute particles of depleted uranium and then get your soldiers to run around there for a few months/years. Some people have to live there permanently. (or fleetingly, if you've been severely radiation-poisoned!)
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
16:00 / 14.02.07
Well, I suppose old Peter Parker could team up with Bruce Banner and they could both go on 'Trisha: My Radioactive Love-Juice Killed my Wife'.

Let's hope that Reign's writer doesn't go on record as saying he did it just to piss off an ex-wife.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:44 / 14.02.07
Ah, I had forgotten about PAD's putting "Bucky" in the Pantheon....I wonder if Brubaker will ever reconcile that with his "Bucky-returned-as-The Winter Solider" storyline. Prob'y not.

Luke Cage has become an A-list player in the Marvel Universe under Bendis, thanks to his appearances in ALIAS, his having married Jessica Jones and fathered a child with her, and having become a New Avenger in the Bendis-written title of the same name.

Danny Rand aka Iron Fist is enjoying a solid new ongoing series co-written by Ed Brubaker and Matt Fraction, if I recall correctly. And Iron Fist is about to join his old partner Luke Cage aka Power Man (although everyone just calls him "Luke Cage" or "Cage" now) in the New Avengers.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:47 / 14.02.07
How sad of me, I thought I was looking at the most recent page of this thread when, distracted, I was actually looking at the first page. Many embarrassed apologies. At least the one valid thing here is the mention of Peter David putting a character who all signs pointed to as Bucky in his HULK run, and the idea of the compatibility of lack thereof of that idea with Bru's Winter Solider. (Very likely the PAD "Bucky" will never be mentioned again and fade into 'retcon by means of never mentioning again' obscurity/oblivion...)

Back to talking about REIGN's suckiness then. Carry on.
 
 
Mr Tricks
21:25 / 01.03.07
Can someone remind me of Terminus (I think) who was created during Byrne's run in Fantastic Four. "This planet belongs to Terminus" he carved into NORTH AMERICA when he arrived. What was the deal with that guy?
 
 
Mario
21:41 / 01.03.07
The Pantheon-Bucky was eventually revealed to be an Asgardian (and possibly son of Loki) named Vali. Odds are he'll never be referred to again.

Terminus was basically an evil yellow Stay-Puf Marshmallow Man in armor. The Marvel Appendix writeup is pretty comprehensive.
 
 
This Sunday
22:21 / 01.03.07
Terminus was in the Avengers/JLA thing quite recently. He's a giant midget in even gigantic-er armor, with an energy-blasty staff, who goes to a planet and basically keeps carving things up and breaking stuff until he's stopped, and then he comes back and does a little more... and a little more... until the odds give up and basically he has to luck out and win just the once... at which, he goes to another planet and repeats.

A life so boring, you'd think any self-respecting alien would just quit and go become a Lila Cheney groupy or something.
 
 
Blake Head
12:19 / 02.03.07
Ok: I was snubbed by the overbitches in the Civil War thread when I posted this:

Ok, not entirely on topic, but related: I've not been following Civil War, but I recently went through Iron Man: Inevitable and thought it was good solid stuff. In a nutshell, it's about Stark's struggle to move beyond a point where being a superhero involves bouncing villains off nearby buildings and in general "Iron Man" meaning more than a hulking tin can with rocket boots and energy beams, and in turn not so much about finding new ways to deal with the old problems but having found new methods and a new identity being dragged back into his former role by his heritage of villains. Anyway... it's the sort of thing that if developed could make the character intereting for me, and certainly would better characterise a "radical change" for the character than pciking sides in a big scrap.

What I want to know is if anything from that mini-series has been incorporated into the main Civil War story or Iron Man's solo book? I suspect not, because secret mind control and cock fighting and general divisiveness seem to be exactly what that version of Stark was trying to avoid, but it seems a shame if that aspect of his evolution is going to be so immediately elided in the forseeable future of the character. Has anyone read both and want to let me know?


Tell me about Iron Man's recent history. What's good, what's consistent, what's... going on? Pretty please?
 
 
Mario
12:39 / 02.03.07
Let's see...

After revealing his secret ID (again) he was Secretary of Defense for a while, but lost that job thanks to Wanda and Avengers: Disassembled.

Then his series was relaunched by Warren Ellis, and he ended up getting the ability to communicate with computers, thanks to a techno-organic virus called Extremis.

Then the Civil War thing started, and he turned into a real SOB. And now, he's director of SHIELD.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
15:52 / 02.03.07
I know that Iron Man was Evil Kang-Controlled Iron Man and then Pure Plucked From The Timestream Teen Iron Man and then A Franklin-Richards-Created Ideal Iron Man On An Alternate Earth and then an Amalgamated Teen And Post-Evil Iron Man when he returned, and that everything got sort of mushed up into a single Iron Man again.

But what exactly does he (and all the other heroes) remember of the whole pre-Crossing "I have been a puppet of Immortus since I was old enough to shave" incident? It hasn't been erased or retconned, and it seems a little ... cavalier ... to entrust Tony "Mindwiped!" Stark with, well, the keys to the Marvel Universe like everyone seems to do at the end of Civil War.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
00:05 / 03.03.07
My god.

What if Civil WAAAAAH was engineered by Kang?

You know, I miss Young Kang, who spent a good deal time as a mini Iron Man, Iron Lad (irony!) and the rest of the time running around in his boxers while his friends saved the day from...him as an adult. Now that was a Civil War.
 
 
This Sunday
01:18 / 03.03.07
There's a way to increase some readership: aim for the yaoi audience with a Teen Tony and Ironlad/Kang slash series.

Somewhere between that girl from 'Runaways' totally going for Julie Power... and Marvel's ability to kill Northstar three times in one month... there lies 'Iron Boys'! A six-issue Marvel Comics Event.

Which feeds into the recent 'Iron Man' analogy, for that matter.

Actually, other than Northstar and Misty Knight, who's been outed in the big ol' MU?
 
 
The Falcon
16:16 / 03.03.07
Misty Knight is Iron Fist's on-off girlfriend?

The Karolina/Xavin relationship is pretty genderfluid, as you say, and the former is quite clearly gay. I think Mar-Vell's kid in YA is likewise? There's the infamous Punisher 'gay' issue of Tieri's Wolverine - Frank's musclemags are canon, in a kind of Beard-Hunter way.

Um. Rawhide Kid. Oh, Mystique and Destiny had a relationship, didn't they? In fact, Mystique was originally intended to be Rogue's father. There's a few more if you check the gay heroes website, including I think maybe Weather Wizard.
 
 
This Sunday
16:33 / 03.03.07
Misty Knight is, yes, Iron Fist's sometime girlfriend. In some random comic, plausibly an issue of 'Heroes for Hire' she makes a comment about the discomfort of having been intimate with everyone in the room, which included men and women and made it appear that she really got around (in a world where Peter Parker was a virgin until marriage), whereas, in the real world, having slept with three people over the years is not terribly advanced rank.

I should have thought of most of those others. I namechecked Karolina, after all, and her SkrulLover should have come to mind.

Also, probably, Rictor from X-Force. And plausibly half the women Claremont's written in the past twenty-two years. But not openly, I suppose. Except for Mystique and Destiny, which he snuck by, and then Nicieza secured.

I thought Rawhide had been un-gayed, though?

And, my new question: Night Raven; how comes he to the MU? He wasn't started there, I'm relatively sure, and for some reason, I'm convinced I must have read something with him when I was a tiny kid, because the image, his icon especially, seem so... er... iconic to me, I suspect it was early imprinting. He's also horribly fucked up and was kinda the McGuffin of an interesting Black Widow oneshot a while ago.

Did Marvel resurrect an old property? Buy one off somebody? Or am I totally off?
 
 
This Sunday
16:44 / 03.03.07
Wow, wikipedia cleared up a lot. Still, if there's anything I should know about Night Raven, or how he's been fitted into more Stateside continuity, feel free.
 
 
doctorbeck
12:55 / 05.03.07
is that the same nightraven that alan moore used to write in (i think) hulk weekly or captain britain, art by david lloyd?
 
 
Evil Scientist
13:09 / 05.03.07
Who was the dude who showed up in (I think) Spiderman with a sentient (but non-symbiote) suit, he could basically morph the cape to do stuff (kind of a Spawn rip-off I guess). He'd taken the suit off of a dead future version of himself.

What, in the blue hell, was up with that?

Also Cardiac and Solo (Spiderman anti-heroes) they still kicking?
 
 
This Sunday
16:14 / 05.03.07
Apparently Moore wrote several prose pieces for Night Raven, whose regular, initial artist was David Lloyd; created by Dez Skinn. This is presumed by many to be the genesis (apparently) of 'V for Vendetta'. I must've actually mistaken some of the earliest comics for, well, American, because I assumed from the early eighties that he was a regular Marvel U. type character, and at the time, a lot of them, just weren't. Took Walter Simonson's FF to get Death's Head into the proper American MU, didn't it? As a kid I don't think I payed attention to any of that; Marvel was Marvel, and DC was DC, but inside those, they were all one big... and as I aged, I realized some people took this stuff really seriously, as far as canon and what shouldn't be.

He's a Spawn-ripoff now? That sucks.

Anybody remember the 'Stormwatch' changer-cult guy named Eidolon? I connected him to Night Raven, before it was (and this is really sad) pointed out to me that he was more Spawn's archetype than any other commercial entity.

Besides, didn't they already rewrite The Prowler as a Spawn-lite?
 
 
Mario
16:43 / 05.03.07
Evil: Sounds a bit like Devil-Slayer, but I need more data.

Last I heard, Cardiac was still around. Solo was part of the anti-reg "Secret Avengers"
 
 
Mario
16:51 / 05.03.07
Found the character: Nightwatch. He had his own series for a short time, and was eventually (and unceremoniously) killed as part of the "Great Game" storyline.
 
 
FinderWolf
19:16 / 05.03.07
Tom Breevort mentioned in a recent Civil War-post mortem-type interview 'oh, that Civil War-tie-in IRON MAN issue where Happy Hogan dies was really good.' [Hogan is a longtime IM supporting character; he and Pepper Potts were IM's main supporting cast long before Bethany Cabe, Justin Hammer and Jim Rhodes showed up in the 80s]

They killed Happy Hogan?!? What? Did anyone actually read this issue??

and many people think Jeff Bridges has been cast as Happy Hogan in the upcoming Iron Man film, so watch him get resurrected real fast in the comics, most likely....
 
 
Mario
19:20 / 05.03.07
A quick Google says yes. He had a bad fall in issue #13, and Tony pulled the plug in issue #14.
 
 
Essential Dazzler
19:21 / 05.03.07
Happy got put in a coma and brain damaged. His wife (Fiance? Girlfriend? The Civil War Tie-ins are the only Iron Man books I've read apart from Extremis, so I have no idea who these characters are) begged Tony to use his machine-brane to turn off the life support machine, telling him a story Happy used to tell about another old boxer who had the same happen. Stark refused.

After pouring himself a whisky and getting slapped around by Sue Storm, he changed his mind.
 
 
tickspeak
19:22 / 05.03.07
For the record, Peter Parker was not a virgin when he married MJ. At the very least, he slept with her at the end of the first clone saga, and it's implied that he and Gwen are gettin' busy every so often before she gets thrown off the bridge. But Betty Brant never gave it up.
 
 
Essential Dazzler
19:22 / 05.03.07
Sue Richards?

Do comic characters take each others names when they get married?
 
 
This Sunday
20:43 / 05.03.07
I believe, as of recent revelations regarding Gwen and a certain older, psychotic industrialist/chemist with a penchant for greens, purples, and big grins, Peter was meant to've not been sleeping with her, with MJ, or even with Felicia whatserface while they were living together.

Or, so I've come to understand. If this is truly in error - and who knows why I even care - can someone confirm or elaborate on what was really going on? I know there were some sort of clone superaging children of Norman and Gwen... or something like that.
 
 
tickspeak
14:07 / 06.03.07
JMS actually retconned Peter's virginity? Really? Wow. Cause, even leaving Felicia "I love rooftop sex and jewel thievery" Hardy out of it, it's made quite obvious in (I believe--I don't have my Essentials at work) the last issue of the first Jackal/clones story that Peter has come home to his apartment, where MJ is waiting--a little confused, a little hurt, a little hot. He's exhausted, she calls him Tiger, he follows her in and shuts the door. The timing and framing of the last few panels make it quite clear what's about to happen. I guess they could have played Boggle or something, though.
 
  

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