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Mafia2: The Game Thread

 
  

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No star here laces
20:56 / 04.03.03
Well, cheers Q, I was going to PM you to retract that suggestion about and/orr, but way too late now, obviously. The description of bendt's death just seemed a bit similar to his writing style, but I'd sorta decided he was innocent so...

Anyway, I don't suspect Qalyn or Iszabelle, and maybe and/orr, but other than that...

As for a 'strategy of baseless allegations' isn't that basically the nature of the game? I'd like to know which allegations in the first few rounds had any bases at all considering we haven't lynched a single mafioso yet.
 
 
Rev. Orr
20:59 / 04.03.03
I never liked the whole pm line of attack, it was never going to work and, frankly, was very close to the line of breaking the rules. Can we just quietly bury it with the unfortunate BC and move on?

Okay, based on the Colonel's reasoning, we are left with too many variables and not enough time to disentangle them. It all comes down to who you trust. Everyone that claims to have a handle on who the mafia are (myself included) seems to have constructed a theory and is then fitting evidence to that model. The fact that I'm right is neither here nor there. There is no smoking gun, no conclusive proof against anyone. Gotta hand it to the mafia this time, they've played it very well. They may have struck lucky with our inability to trust each other or form alliances with the early elimination of the 'tec and with BC being our only exhonerated villager but still, they've worked their dealings nicely. The time has come for drastic action.

Qalyn and I disaggree over our final three, but are interpreting much of the same evidence. My analysis of voting patterns (timing and subject) leads me to a mafia with a little overlap with his, but is predicated on an initial assumption which although convincing to me is not going to carry much weight with anyone else.

Basically, as I see it there are a number of communication 'nodes' amongst the players, individuals whose certain guilt or innocence would help to solidify much of the speculation that is flying around by pm. For example, if I am mafia, it would serve to cast a lot of doubt on the evidence I forwarded to Qalyn as it would have been planted deliberately. So, the upshot is that I'm going to nominate Whiskey Priestess and assume that she will return the favour. I'm sure there is enough doubt over both of us to warrant our mention and hopefully this lynching will either finally bag a mafia or clarify who they are.

Bonne Chance, mes amis.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
23:46 / 04.03.03
Woof. That's confused me. Hmm.

God, can't figure out if it's the suspiciously acting-up, or the suspiciously quiet we need to beware of. As I'm beginning to divide us along those lines pretty clearly.

Bitchlaces and Qalyn and Whiskey have all been pretty noisy at points...

Stoaties been very quiet, almost forgettably so... but something seems innocent about him. But that could just be clever play... argghghh.

And then there's Orr, who stayed pretty quiet early on but seems to be *very* busy all of a sudden.

And who thinks I can't tell he's spiking me. *hic*
 
 
Rev. Orr
00:57 / 05.03.03
Thanks for the advice Platforms, a very nice job in throwing as much generalised suspiscion around as humanly possible.

God, can't figure out if it's the suspiciously acting-up, or the suspiciously quiet we need to beware of.

Or possibly those trying to sow discord and put as many people in the frame as you can? Acting as Whiskey's puppet again?

I'm beginning to divide us
I'm sure that's the intention. Just keep drinking m'dearr,I'm sure you'll show up just in time to swing the vote as usual...
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
01:04 / 05.03.03
I think I should point out that the whole Late Voter/Awfully Quiet thing was a stalking horse I was using to provoke reactions and cross people off the list. It really means very little in itself, and I think the main instigators around here realized that, though they might not put it as kindly. I wouldn't count on it. Things to actually look for are A) who provokes suspicions and B) what they do afterwards.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
01:10 / 05.03.03
As for a 'strategy of baseless allegations' isn't that basically the nature of the game? I'd like to know which allegations in the first few rounds had any bases at all considering we haven't lynched a single mafioso yet.

As usual you start from a reasonable argument and blow it all to hell. Yes, the vote against Flyboy was random. The votes against Todd and bjacques were not.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
07:34 / 05.03.03
I'm thoroughly confused. (Incidentally, I've also been largely steering clear of too much pm-ing as I fear it would only serve to confuse me even further). Considering last time I nearly voted for bjacques, and, had Byron been lynched, was pretty set on voting for him the next night, and it turns out he was innocent.

Arse.
 
 
gravitybitch
15:03 / 05.03.03
This game seems to be lacking the edge of manic desperation the first game had... and everyone seems to be very aware of the importance of this round. Nobody wants to be the one to start the avalanche that may well bury all of us.



...try to remember....it's all a game...
 
 
gravitybitch
15:16 / 05.03.03
The Widow looks around at the drawn faces and furrowed brows.

"I have no stomach for carnage. And I have no doubt that the Mafia will continue to present us with gruesome spectacles - they seem to revel in gore and in raising horror to an art.
"However, it gains us nothing to sit around and mumble. I'm hardly blameless, having been instrumental in the lynching of the stranger known as Todd, and I loathe the thought of sending another innocent to the gallows. But we must choose!!

"I must follow my convictions. I accuse bitchlaces of being Mafia!"
 
 
bjacques
23:47 / 05.03.03
Skreeek...skreeek...my moldering corpse, somewhat picked over by the ravens, swings slowly in the wind, in mute accusation of you all. And, you know, this is the longest I've gone without a drink.

How about a libation?
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
09:02 / 07.03.03
Good god, people, are we mice or are we men? Whiskey Priestess it is, and if it isn't I'm a damned fool.
 
 
Rev. Orr
16:23 / 07.03.03
C'mon folks. We need two more votes for Whisky before we can be safe from the three mafia riding in and voting for Bitchlaces and saving her. They've voted late to swing the outcome every time so far and the only way to stop it happening again is to trust me and bag our first mafiosa. Just two votes and we're guarranteed at least a run off. Free drinks for everyone who helps us survive - can't say fairer than that!
 
 
gravitybitch
16:44 / 07.03.03
"What's this?? All that mouthing off about BiP and suddenly there's a chase on after the Priestess? This is sufficient to make me suspect the both of you..."
 
 
Rev. Orr
16:53 / 07.03.03
It's quite simple, BiP and Whisky are both mafia along with Lolita. I didn't get enough support against BiP and didn't see any reason for that to be different this time and Lolita was nevver going to fly. I figured that there was enough suspicion over la Priestess to finally lynch one of them. Hence the change in target. Clear enough for you? I know you don't agree as you voted for Bitchlaces, but in this case, the simplest answer is the right one.
 
 
lolita nation
17:08 / 07.03.03
Iszabelle, are you still offering tea?

OK, obviously if we are going to win, we all need to agree on who to lynch so the mafia can't split the vote and get a majority with just three. As of now Whisky Priestess and Bitchlaces have both been nominated so it would make sense to vote for one of them. So no one else is feeling my suspicion of Maominstoat? I guess that's fair, I was wrong about Todd. I (like Bitchlaces) thought that the mafia PM sounded like And/Orr's writing style - it just reminded me of the "Louis IV dresser with the smell of mescalin and bodice-ripping" kind of stuff that he usually says, but I guess it's not really enough to go on. Both Iszabelle and And/Orr seem convinced that they're right. They could either know who's in the mafia because it's themselves and be trying to divide the villagers, or they could have come up with a plan and stuck with it. Does anyone else have an argument to make? I feel like trusting my suspicions will be wrong, because it always is.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
17:09 / 07.03.03
Think Orr is *actually* going for a 'hang all the wimmins' strategy...

Jeesus.

Being lynched is bad enough, we have to be burned at the stake as well?

But if (as he's kindly let me know I'm next) my charred cinders are proved innocent, that'll be alright.

I'm pretty sure there's some concerted planning here.

Tranlation of Orr's post:

BiP and Whiskey are dangerous as they seem to be suspicious of me, both have singled me out. Therefore I shift the suspicion onto them (but I have to mention a third party to be convincing, so Lolita will do, as I think people won't vote for Iszabelle) and tried to bump off BiP. Failed last time out and have shifted to an easier target for now, knowing that my bloc vote should be enough to get her hung and win.
 
 
Rev. Orr
17:39 / 07.03.03
I'm pretty sure there's some concerted planning here.

Yup, and double-teaming me with Lolita is really helping to prove that you're not working together...

Think Orr is *actually* going for a 'hang all the wimmins' strategy...

Could you not? This is a nice, friendly game and that's really below the belt. I didn't appoint an all female mafia. It's hardly my fault that it's worked out that way. I realise that it's a very effective tactic, but frankly you're better than that and it's a cheap shot.

Look, I screwed up my tactics on this one. I spent too long trying to avoid getting killed and not enough time forging links with the other villagers. I bloody wish I had the 'bloc vote' you claim I have - we wouldn't be so close to losing. As it is, there's only one person who knows how long I have suspected the three people I named and can refute your reasoning. Mea Culpa. I'm sure Whisky has shared my pm to her with you so you know full well that you three were named by me before I came clean in the thread. You can make all kinds of protestations of your innocence knowing full well that as your not in danger this round you cannot be proved to be mafia until it's too late unless I'm right and believed.

All I'd say, people, is try looking over this thread with my theory in mind. Watch the way these three vote, the way they work together, the way that at least two of them are alway key in deciding who is lynched. Note the way that any time they are threatened directly or indirectly, the smokescreens go up, waters are muddied and extra suspects are suddenly thrown into the mix. They were very pally with me until I started naming names and now all of a sudden I'm public enemy no.1?

As for the literary fingerprints on BC's death don't forget that the entire persona I've been working under in this game was dropped on me by Whisky. You think I'd have labelled myself as an ex-crim out of choice? As hardly anyone is familiar with my writing style out in the big bad world other than Whisky herself how could you identify it as my work? Wishfull thinking I'm afraid.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
17:57 / 07.03.03
I'm really not sure how to take the 'below the belt' thing. Will think about it. Sorry, best I can do right now, am off down t'pub (not that your libations aren't yummy, now I'm building up immunity).

I'm in no way suggesting that you're mysogynistic, not as barkeep, ficsuit or human being. And I'd like to acknowledge at this point that I *know* Orr IRL a little, so I know whereof of what I speak. I *do* apologise if that's how that came across. Not at all my point. Really not.

What I *am* suggesting is that for a mafia, any strategy that seems to create easy dividing lines is a damn good one. And that it's an obvious strategy to follow.

But, in other news: you think I'm 'better than that.' (Am I? If I'm not, does that neccessarily make me guilty or just scared by the targeting and trying to id a mafia?) I'm frankly a little insulted that you don't think I'm 'smarter than that'.

To post just after 'my fellow mafiette' and say almost exactly the same thing would be pretty bloody stupid.

There is such a thing as coincidence. Even here.

There is also such a thing as two people weighing up the gameplay, reading, as you suggest, people's moves and votes and coming to the same conclusion. Because it may well be the right one.

I'm not certain, like I say. But am rapidly becoming more convinced of Orr's guilt, which lead me onto seeing links between Orr and other players scattered all over the latter half of this game...

right, off down t'pub. Gasping.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
18:08 / 07.03.03
OK people, sorry to have been away so long. Busy thinking (and watching Angel ... ahem). I've got a theory, and I suppose it's about time to air it before a bunch of desperate and scared people start voting for me. And/Orr was kind enough to share his me/Lolita/Bengali theory with me by PM, although it's pretty clear from who he has voted for (Lolita, Bengali, me, in that order) whom he has chosen to blame.

So anyway, I discounted that theory because, duh, I know I'm innocent and I don't see much evidence of Lolita and BiP colluding either (I think one of them even voted for the other at some point? don't have time to check). And Orr, I know we are posting right after each other and you can fuck off. I've been wanting to post this all day and haven't had a second to do so - I finish work at 7 and that's why I'm posting now.

At first I had my suspicions of Maominstoat because he's been a sort of popping-up at crucial-moments eminence grise ... but then I thought no, let's look at the votes and see who's been working together.

First off, in order to save my own neck as much as my deep and (read on) well-founded suspicion of Bitchlaces, I'm going to accuse him. Not because I don't think And/Orr is the closest thing Granton has to a bloodthirsty Italian Stallion, but because I'm damn certain Bitchlaces is mafia. For the record, I reckon that the other two are And/Orr and Qalyn. Sorry boys. It's just a theory, of course, because there is of course no way to know for certain, but I reckon it holds water.

I'm sorry to say, Bitchlaces, that in order to try and work out who the mafia were I started off with the assumption (like you did with BiP) that you were a mafioso and worked from there. Ignoring the first vote for Flyboy, whihc was a landslide except for BB and me accusing each other, during the Todd vote there were only four players who didn;t vote for Todd: these were
Bendt Chromeo (Bitchlaces)
Qalyn (lolita)
And/Orr (lolita)
BiP (lolita)
Interesting to see how early patterns emerge. Clearly the mafia had fixed on an innocent victim pretty early on and thought what the hell, might as well spread some suspicion around while Todd's being hanged.

So BC, our only innocent, had his suspicions of Bitchlaces too - at first. When did all that go away? Was it around the time Qalyn started cosying up to BC as his new best friend? (To be fair, BC also voiced suspicion of pretty much everyone and his dog, but the only person he openly accused was Bitchlaces).

So, BC was trying to establish people's innocence by getting their forwarded villager PMs. I would like to know whether Qalyn saw BC's first, or vice-versa. Was this the first leak? Or did the mafia simply guess at what the PMs contained, take a risk and get away with it? Either way, it was certainly convenient to have one of the mafia thick as theives with our only known innocent, and therefore above suspicion by association.

I seem to remember there was a certain amount of suspicion of Qalyn floating around at that point, and then it all mysteriously drained away. He managed to convince me that a) he was doing things I regarded as suss to protect BC, who had previously told me (falsely) as it turned out) that he was the doctor.

As Qalyn said in his PM to me after Lionheart was killed, this was BC's trap to see if I was mafia - the idea being that if BC had died that night and only I had known he was (or thought he was) the doctor and unable to protect himself, then I was clearly mafia. I know that BC not dying that night doesn't prove anything, but I think it's at least a point in my favour.

But when did BC die? Wasn’t it the next night, just after his “innocent PM” idea - which had so far exonerated all three of the mafia, presumably because they were either very daring or got hold of a clean villager PM – went tits up? Presumably Qalyn, BB and And/Orr realised that from now on BC would prove to be more of a liability than a help and so decided to kill him before he stated getting suspicious of those he had [previously believed to be innocent.

Let’s look at the voting stats for the bjacques lynching – up until then I wasn’t ruling BiP out because she too had gone after lolita with the mafia bloc. But surprise! Who do they turn on next? Why, it’s Bengali! Votes as follows (in chronological order)

BC – bjacques
And/Orr – Bengali
Qalyn - bjacques (it doesn’t matter which one dies, they’re both innocent)
Bjacques – Qalyn
Bitchlaces – Bengali
Me – bjacques
Iszabelle – Bitchlaces (aha!)
Stoatie – Bitchlaces (one of the other reasons I don’t think Stoatie is mafia – the three have never once voted for each other)
Lolita – stoatie
Bengali – bjacques (self-preservation)

Notice how the mafia never vote completely together – it’s always 2 out of 3, and the pair varies as well. Nice work, which is why they’re still alive. Bengali did look suspicious at the beginning, but I never thought a Mafioso would be so dumb as to refuse to cooperate with BC – a one-way ticket to the chair, surely? I’m pretty sure that some of the only people who are clean are the ones who didn’t play along with BC’s PM nonsense. I think that all people like stoatie and Bengali are guilty of is playing a slightly infrequent and thoughtless game – the kind of game you might play if you were a villager, rather than a Mafioso who had to watch every single step they took in case it betrayed them.

So, based on voting and killing patterns, I reckon it’s pretty clear who is trying to steer suspicion away from themselves and onto pretty much anyone else.

Lovely reliable And/Orr, the town’s barman, who has been machinating behind the scenes with a quite unsuspected fury. Didn’t realise he was quite such a mover and shaker – but what is interesting is that if (as I suspect) he was the one spreading rumours about my being mafia (thanks Qalyn – or was that all made up to spook me?) he got some of his evidence wrong. Like:

“Whisky and Flyboy share a PC.”
No we don’t. Flyboy will attest to the fact that he borrows my PC to go on Barbelith occasionally and unless I were reading over his shoulder, I would not be able to see any PM he had from grant. He also has to log off before I can log on so there is literally no way I could have got a villager PM from any source but grant.

Lovely innocent Qalyn. I honestly had no serious suspicions of him until after BC’s death – I guess they thought that maybe BC knew too much or would eventually work out for himself that he had been duped with the villager PMs, and decided to off him, as he was no longer useful.

Bitchlaces – I hardly need to reiterate the times when he’s tried to spread suspicion around, laid false trails, etc. etc. It was all in “helpful villager” mode, rather like Qalyn’s voting stats, but I still think that of the three he is the one I am most certain of.

So there. That’s what I reckon, take it or leave it, please don’t kill me etc. I have already spent far too much time trying to outline my ideas and I hope that at least some of the villagers get what I’m banging on about. I might just possibly be wrong about the other two, but consider my shorts eaten if Bitchlaces isn’t Mafia. And we’ve got to get a Mafioso this time, or we’re stuffed.

In fact, feel free to lynch me if he isn’t, because then I’ll have been totally wrong about everything and won’t even know which way is up. Er, but remember that anyone can make mistakes, etc.

I thank you …

God I need a drink. Barman? (actually, maybe I’ll just go to the bar across the road …)
 
 
Whisky Priestess
18:20 / 07.03.03
Just seen your post, Orr. Yes, it does remind me very strongly of your prose, but I didn't mention the writing style thing because I felt you could easily have claimed that someone imitated it.

And then it occurred to me that that someone would not have known that grant wasn't going to post it all under his name. Now I'm not sure whether the previous "themed" killings were grant's idea or the Mafia having fun, but either way it's clear enough that the Mafia would have expected grant to post everything as his, depriving people like me of what is a pretty vital clue to the identity of the mafiosi.
Kind of lucky that it was so gruesome that grant felt he had to deny reponsibility for it.

I know that Bitchlaces also has a way with words, so I'm just about willing to believe that it was him, but after the incredibly cunning manipulativeness (and chumminess) you and Qalyn have suddenly shown, you've still got an awful lot of explaining to do.

NB - the reason the mafia have never had to vote each other out of sticky situations is that they have been clever enough (at least two of them have) never to get nominated. Which is bloody lucky for them. People like bjacques, todd, lolita, flyboy, bengali and now myself have not been quite so smart. Excuse the fuck out of us ...
 
 
gravitybitch
05:00 / 08.03.03
Oh, my head hurts...

I'm still very suspicious of the sudden accusations of Whiskey Priestess. Is it an attempt to draw votes away from bitchlaces? Is it actually a sacrifice move to provide cover for and/orr and crony?
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
05:32 / 08.03.03
I'm going to hold off on defending myself against any of WP's allegations until I've actually been accused, and my charges against her have been made. Please consult them, or contact me privately if you want to go over it again. The only question I'd add is why she voted for bjacques after BC's scheme fell through -- for those of you who don't know, though all of you should, BC sent around a PM telling everyone not to follow his lead in lynching bjacques. I'd already voted, so it was too late for me, but Whiskey and Bengali polished him off. Bengali I can't blame, since she surely would've had trouble in a revote.

Obviously, I don't mind if people vote for Bitchlaces instead, since I think he's guilty, too, but be ve-e-ery sure of yourself when you do. Iszabelle, it does look like an attempt to split the vote but Whiskey would have to do that whether she was guilty or not.

For the record, And/Orr first contacted me with suspicions of WP, lolita and BiP, just after I refused to lynch Todd -- after I accused lolita but just before he did.
 
 
lolita nation
05:41 / 08.03.03
And/Orr: Could you not? This is a nice, friendly game

Well, yes. It is a nice, friendly game. I'm new to internet mafia, but in real life, it's a nice, friendly game which almost always ends up in a big, screaming, friendly, shitstorm. Which I like, but I guess it's already been observed that I'm strange.

So. Last round, nothing personal, all bets off, etc. And/Orr, it may have been Whisky P who cast you as a dyslexic criminal assclown, but I haven't seen much to indicate that she was too far off the mark. You write It's quite simple, BiP and Whisky are both mafia along with Lolita . Simple... you mean in the sense of "not very bright"? You have no proof; the only people who know for certain who other than themselves is and isn't mafia are the mafia, and stating your opinions as fact only makes you look really guilty. I can't see any other reason why it should be so simple for you to pick three people to accuse.

I also know you're wrong on at least one count. I've played and continue to play looking out exclusively for myself, as the only person I know isn't in the mafia. (With the temporary exception of Chromeo.) So if I've been accused, I've wanted to know why.

And look: Hmm, thinks. I've always hated Russian writers - far too few bodices and none of them get ripped so Lolita it is." Hey And/Orr, the Ministry of Bullshit Reasons to Lynch People called. They want to make you Dictator for Life. I get that the Lolita ref. (must...change.. fucking.. screen name) was just a smokescreen, and you really suspected me because you thought I knew Tez was the detective before the mafia killed him, but it's still bullshit. That's not so much accusing me as accusing the rest of the town of being stupid. And even the most inattentive skimming of this thread will show that I'm far and away the stupidest person here. Tez said repeatedly that he was the "ratcatcher." What did everyone else think he was talking about? I thought it was actually too obvious, and therefore he had to be mafia.

And/Orr demonstrably had access to Chromeo's PM database (I don't know at what point), as he admitted having forwarded them to Qalyn. Have we decided that the PM evidence is inadmissable? Because that's a serious black mark in my opinion. If so, the only piece of hard evidence we villagers have is that assassination request reprinted by Grant. Look at it, y'all. I'm the laziest and worst of readers, but Whisky, Bengali, and Bitchlaces noticed it too, and they're way smart. Cui creditis? Whisky even knows his style in real life.

Unfortunately, And/Orr isn't on trial here, Whisky and Bitchlaces are, which is a choice I really don't like. I also find it damning that And/Orr came out first with an accusation, knowing that this round it would be harder for the villagers to get a majority with the 5:3 villager/mafia ratio. Limiting our options from the beginning was a good move for the mafia, because now we have to choose between two people who may very well both be innocent. My top three are actually Bengali, And/Orr, and either Iszabelle or Stoat - he's accused Bengali just enough to make it look like they aren't working together without putting her in any real danger, whatever, that's irrelevant at this point, since it's down to Whisky and Bitchlaces. I still think Whisky has played too loudmouthedly for the mafia (same goes for Qayln). So, let's look at Bitchlaces. I don't really put too much stock in anyone's created Granton persona (look at mine. A waitress? At a buffet? WTF?), but he comes off pretty tongue-in-cheek as the "inconspicuous villager", and immediately wants to know if Flyboy is the real doctor. Then he says the fact that he didn't vote for Flyboy (when he had a landslide anyway) means that he's innocent. He's stayed pretty well below the buzz of the general conversation, but so've I, so it can't mean much (as it meant nothing for bjacques and Lionheart), and indeed I don't really think he's in the mafia. (Possibly because I'm really grateful for the phrase "quiet, unsexy despondency," which describes how I feel most of the time.) But I, unlike And/Orr, cannot be sure about anything except myself, so I'll just say on the could-be-mafia scale Bitchlaces rates slightly higher than Priestess.

Why higher than Priestess? Is anyone still reading this? Anyway I feel obligated to give my reasons: to Bengali and Maominstoat, if you two aren't in the mafia, everything depends on you right now (I'm assuming Bitchlaces is going to vote for WP to save himself), and if you two vote together to hang Whisky and the doctor can save us tonight, well, we'll probably still lose, but it will be really obvious that you're in the mafia. I know that quiet/loudness isn't a good heuristic but I think on some basic level it does benefit the mafia to lie low. And Whisky has voted for seemingly independent reasons, not forming any obvious alliances, usually just voting for whoever accused her. She suspected Qalyn's "divide and conquer" scheme and Chromeo's teasing PM manipulations, and seems to be looking out only for herself like I do. Anyway, it's a piece of crap situation, and I already voted for Bitchlaces once out of being boxed in and Bitchlaces I feel like a first-rate shitheel about it, but I have to stop this post now. Sorry for rambling everyone. I hope when And/Orr's boys come for me they make it quick.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
14:27 / 08.03.03
And/Orr demonstrably had access to Chromeo's PM database (I don't know at what point), as he admitted having forwarded them to Qalyn.

This is misleading. The only person who saw all the PMs was BC. I never saw anyone's unless BC subsequently forwarded them to me. To my knowledge, And/Orr never saw them or claimed to have seent hem.
 
 
lolita nation
15:43 / 08.03.03
And/Orr: For example, if I am mafia, it would serve to cast a lot of doubt on the evidence I forwarded to Qalyn as it would have been planted deliberately.

Just sayin'.
 
 
Rev. Orr
16:33 / 08.03.03
Lolita - Yeah, I got bored with typing 'in my humble opinion' every other line. Plus I'm not humble, and... well we'll have to see whether I was right.

it may have been Whisky P who cast you as a dyslexic criminal assclown, but I haven't seen much to indicate that she was too far off the mark.

Why thank you. It called staying in character. I never wanted to be a barman. I always wanted to be a cobbler. Stitching the mighty brogues of British Columbia. With my best gal by my side... Er, sorry.

Simple... you mean in the sense of "not very bright"?

Well, yes. I was asked why the switch in targets and I pointed out that it was far from a masterstroke of cunning genius but rather a question of gunning for the target I thought I had most chance of garnering support from.

Hey And/Orr, the Ministry of Bullshit Reasons to Lynch People called. They want to make you Dictator for Life.

Really? Cool. Imagine for a second that you're not mafia, but a confused villager who thinks ze might have sensed a killer early on, but doesn't want to paint a large bulleye on hir chest. Is it possible that you might toss their name into the ring in such a way that fits the character you've been assigned but hopefully won't arose the ire of their fellow dons? Could it be I just didn't want to nominate someone I thought was innocent but wasn't ready to come right out with an accusation? Might I just have been trying to avoid the later accusation that I'd just thrown a random third name in to finish my suspect trio (cf Iszabelle)? Or maybe I was just trying to be funny. Still working on that...

Unfortunately, And/Orr isn't on trial here

And that's an interesting point. All three of you have been quick to point out that I was the first to nominate in this round, but none of you have mentioned that that tactic also opened me up to nomination myself. It was explicit in the post. You're so keen to lynch Mr.Laces that I'm safe until tonight. You accuse me of being overly confident in my naming of the mafia and yet you're willing to let me live on accusing you in order to nail your previously determined target. The only way your voting for him and unified attack on me makes sense to my simple brain is if you know we are both innocent. Laces must be lynched and Whisky saved, therefore you cast you votes one way and try your hardest to discredit me. Succeed and the game is over.

I'm the laziest and worst of readers, but Whisky, Bengali, and Bitchlaces noticed it too

Of which (only assuming I'm right, of course!) three are mafia. Hmm, that's an iron-clad case. I very much doubt that Whisky wrote it in 'my' style. Everyone was aware of how much BC had wound her up by that point and she was probably just letting off steam. I suspect it was only after Grant actually used it verbatim and with a disclaimer that she realised the potential. I wish it were mine - it certainly made me laugh but is it so clearly not her work?

And/Orr: For example, if I am mafia, it would serve to cast a lot of doubt on the evidence I forwarded to Qalyn as it would have been planted deliberately.

Just sayin'.


Just tryin' to be fair.

Chairman, it's up to you. Three votes to go. Bitchlaces can't vote for himself. BiP can't vote for her fellow mafia. So we are left with 4:3 and only you can save us now. I won't contact you directly but should you wish to discuss why I claim to be so certain feel free to get in touch. Otherwise I'll just wait for the final act.
 
 
Rev. Orr
16:38 / 08.03.03
P.S. just have to say that the three of you teaming up on me like this. Not helping to disprove my case, y'all
 
 
gravitybitch
17:19 / 08.03.03
The only question I'd add is why she voted for bjacques after BC's scheme fell through -- for those of you who don't know, though all of you should, BC sent around a PM telling everyone not to follow his lead in lynching bjacques.

Maybe this was yet another test/red herring from BC? I never got a pm from him about voting, and I was the 7th vote...

Since he didn't send that pm to everybody, it would be interesting to see the list of people he did send it to.
 
 
lolita nation
18:17 / 08.03.03
P.S. just have to say that the three of you teaming up on me like this. Not helping to disprove my case, y'all

It doesn't prove anything, either. You've accused three people. What do you want me to say? "Well, I'm convinced, I guess I must be mafia and Grant was wrong"? It makes sense for each of those of us who's been accused to go after you in self-defense. So it could just as well prove the theory that you singled out three targets and waited til we naturally defended ourselves to be all, "See? Told you so." Tautological.

Imagine for a second that you're not mafia, but a confused villager who thinks ze might have sensed a killer early on, but doesn't want to paint a large bulleye on hir chest. Is it possible that you might toss their name into the ring in such a way that fits the character you've been assigned but hopefully won't arose the ire of their fellow dons

Okay, that's fair. But you have to recognize that to me, an actual confused villager, it also looks like you could have chosen three innocent people to paint with large bullseyes arbitrarily to draw suspicion away from yourself.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
19:21 / 08.03.03
And/Orr: For example, if I am mafia, it would serve to cast a lot of doubt on the evidence I forwarded to Qalyn as it would have been planted deliberately.

lolita: Just sayin'.


Ah, I see. No, the "evidence" he's talking about there is his suspicions of WP, BiP & yourself. He never forwarded me anything about people's status-PMs. It could very well be that he's tricked me -- see my Caveat 1.

Iszabelle, here's the PM from BC I'm talking about. I assumed everyone on his To: list got a copy. It certainly doesn't make any sense for him to have sent it only to me.

Subject: Status
From: ~~~B C~~~
Date: 27.02.03
Time: 18:46

To:
And/Orr
bjacques
Byron Bitclaces
iszabelle
lolita nation
Qalyn
Whisky Priestess

We now have 8 players who have passed the Status PM test, and although Maominstoat hasn't replied when I pressed him a week ago and BiP has completely remained silent in regards to my general enquiries, this nonetheless means someone has lied.

This basically means I may be completely wrong about my accusation towards bjaques.

This basically means someone has had access to someone's Status PM.

This basically means someone could have bluffed.

This basically means we are on our own, excepting me who has been officially cleared and a handful of others (u know who u are).

So, anyone want to look at the clearing Status PMs and try to see who might have bluffed?

BC.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
19:38 / 08.03.03
Just to keep things up-to-date:

Whiskey Priestess: And/Orr, Qalyn
Byron Bitchlaces: iszabelle, Whiskey Priestess, lolita nation

Order of votes: And/Orr, iszabelle, Qalyn, Whiskey Priestess, lolita nation.

Waiting on: Byron, Stoatie, Bengali
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
20:01 / 08.03.03
(This post is modified from its original version because I misread lolita's accusation of Bitchlaces -- that is, I didn't understand that it was an accusation. I'm leaving the below in place since And/Orr responded to it, but please disregard it.)

Hrm. I think we're heading for a tie. I think lolita, Bengali and Stoatie are all waiting for Byron. Byron, if you vote for And/Orr, I bet they'll all follow you. If you vote for Whiskey, lolita & Bengali are going to vote for you. Stoat will either tie things up or finish you off -- I have no idea where he stands.
 
 
Rev. Orr
20:54 / 08.03.03
Well, except that Lolita has already voted for Byron so the poor fella really has no choice. Thanks to the femafia gunning for him, a vote for me would be signing his own death warrant. The only person who hasn't tipped their hand is the stoat who can either seal Byron's fate and win them the game or take us all into a 4:4 tie. At which point I've no idea what happens. If we re-vote, the mafia won't change and as Iszabelle simply doesn't believe me, I can't se her changing either. We either get a stalemate or someone who voted for Whisky will defect. What happens if we stay at four all?
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
21:47 / 08.03.03
Huh, I guess she did. I totally missed it. I'll to ammend my posts.

Lolita, your reasoning is very strange. How did And/Orr split the vote? His was the first one out of the gate.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
22:15 / 08.03.03
What happens if we stay at four all?

Play the dozens? Yo mama is so fat...
 
  

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