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Buffy Season 7- spoilers

 
  

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ONLY NICE THINGS
09:58 / 02.10.02
Some well-meaning soul got me "Pretty Maids All in a Row" for Christmas. Now, the books are, as we know, non-canonical, but it had a number of potential slayers being trained by watchers across the world under the auspices of their watchers and unltimately the Watcher's Council. As a result of circumstances, the potential slayers are gathered together in the Council headquarters, where they are attacked and systematically eliminated by a demon. It all goes wrong when Spike disobeys orders and kills the current slayer, at which point her powers transfer to one of the slayers-in-training, and when she is killed they transfer to another, until eventually the big bad is beaten down by a succession of slayers. In this instance, the girls are normal humans until their predecessor dies, at which point they are *instantly* granted Slayer strength, speed, etc.

I think one thing that has been made clear repeatedly is that Buffy's journey into Slayerdom is highly unusual. She appears to have "slipped the net", which is why her watcher was not assigned to her in childhood but only when she actually *became* the slayer (although changing attitudes to letting middle-aged men hang out with your daughter may also be a factor here). It is possibly as a result of this that her attitude and performance are so different, a difference commented on implicitly or explicitly by almost every Council member she has ever met, including Merick and Series 1 Giles. Giles himself seems rather unusual for a Watcher, although much of this can be attributed to the effect Buffy has had on him. Presumably until he was assigned to Buffy he was not watching another potential Slayer, so he was presumably (is there backstory here?) a reserve or research Watcher, who is as hacked off at the beginning of S1 to be uprooted and sent to LA as Buffy is to see him. Buffy's strength, and the reason she is not dead yet, has always been her unconventionality; she and Giles were clearly idiosyncratic in their approach.

Whether this is mere dumb chance (the Council presumably has methods either genealogical or magical to detect potential Slayers, and for some reason she was not found), or indicative of a different relationship to the primal force of the Slayer is another question.
 
 
Trijhaos
10:01 / 02.10.02
The girl was probably a potential slayer. When she was talking about the evil attacking from below or whatever; she didn't mean Ronnie. I think she meant the Hellmouth. It did seem odd that Anya and Spike went all gruesome and nobody really ran out screaming. Everybody just stood around like it's normal occurence for a vampire and a demon to start attacking each other in the middle of the club. Anya's demon face looked kind of "fake". It didn't look as good as it usually does, it reminded me of one of those rubber halloween masks you can get for $10.
 
 
Mazarine
11:43 / 02.10.02
They probably blew the SFX budget on their wee shai'hullud.

So was "Pretty Maids All in a Row" any good, Haus, or will you be sticking with the Seniors series?
 
 
Harold Washington died for you
12:58 / 02.10.02
Another great episode. I imagine these mysterious monks will lead us back to the lovely Faith sometime soon. I hope so.

Spikes soliloquy was pretty cool too, esp. that second to last shot where he hugs the cross and the smoke starts drifting up. Simple and powerful imagery. I have a feeling Spike will not survive this season ("Can we rest?" sure Spike, you'll get to "rest" soon enough) but he'll get the "forgiveness" before it's over.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
13:43 / 02.10.02
Yet there is no indication that Faith was brought up a slayer simply that she had a watcher a little before she arrived in Sunnydale on the run. Could we not subscribe the treatment of Kendra as the attitude of another culture towards the myth? Buffy had a slayer before she moved to Sunnydale and he died just as Faith's did.
 
 
Tamayyurt
02:07 / 03.10.02
Trijhaos- Everybody just stood around like it's normal occurence for a vampire and a demon to start attacking each other in the middle of the club.

That's because it is a normal occurence. How many times has the Bronze been under attack? These people are probably regulars seeing as how it's the only cool place in town so they've seen this a million times.

I hate adult Xander!
 
 
doglikesparky
17:59 / 04.10.02
I'm starting to wonder whether these girls are actually 'new' slayers and not just potential ones. Going back to the whole 'Shouldn't there be another slayer' thing from earlier in this thread it would make sense that there was indeed another new slayer after buffy died and these guys hunting down the unnamed girls are actually killing fully fledged but as yet untrained slayers.

This weeks (presumably) German girl seemed to put up a pretty good fight. She got thrown against a wall, took a right hook to the face, got knocked to the ground and still managed to block the first knife before it was all over...
 
 
RadJose
20:15 / 04.10.02
well first off Faith is the next slayer and she isn't dead, so these are prolly potential slayers, that is if there's a slayer connection at all... and these girls didn't have the super speed that a slayer does so... yeah...
 
 
doglikesparky
22:23 / 04.10.02
But faith got the gig 'cos Kendra died and Kendra got it 'cos Buffy died once for a bit but now Buffy has died again for a bigger bit.

This is all very confusing...does anyone actually *know* what the score is with Buffy's 2nd death and any new slayers? I know Joss Whedon has said some stuff and it's been interpreted in various ways but do we have a definitive answer....anyone?

I'm terribly muddled...
 
 
some guy
02:01 / 05.10.02
do we have a definitive answer

Not in the context of the series itself, no. We know there can be two slayers, as evidenced by Kendra. It doesn't seem unlikely that there could be three, if the same death hiccup of the current slayer occurs. The other option is that Faith is actually the current slayer and Buffy was knocked out of the lineage with her first death ... which could explain why slayers don't seem to last very long and Buffy has. Perhaps she's more than a slayer?

However, I would suggest that the obvious grooming of Dawn to continue the series after Buffy's departure points to Buffy still being a slayer ... which means there must currently be three. The monks are obviously trying to kill either this third slayer, or the other slayers in training.

there is no indication that Faith was brought up a slayer simply that she had a watcher a little before she arrived in Sunnydale on the run. Could we not subscribe the treatment of Kendra as the attitude of another culture towards the myth?

But aren't we told Buffy is the exception with her very late identification as a slayer and assignment of her (three) watcher(s)? This would suggest that Faith, like Kendra, grew up in training (and perhaps just had a poor watcher).
 
 
RadJose
07:08 / 05.10.02
isn't Dawn like a clone of Buffy or something? therefore be a lot like Buffy even down to the fact that she'd be quite slayer-like as she comes of age? to tell the truth i'm pretty new to all this and haven't scene S3-5
 
 
Tamayyurt
16:48 / 05.10.02
Yes, by the end of this season Dawn should get a slayer power boost. But you really can't tell what they're going to do cause they like to play with expectations. Someone mentioned the evil monks going after Faith. But I think if they're going after potential slayer I think they'll go after Dawn first.
 
 
Captain Zoom
15:25 / 08.10.02
And way off in left field....

Going back to the very beginning? It's about power?

Who has the ultimate power in the BTVS universe? Joss Whedon. Maybe it'll be a meta-fiction where the characters come to realize that they're characters in a TV show and Whedon is the bad guy, throwing nastiness at them. A la GMs Animal Man, right? There was a subtle taste of this last season with the ep where Buffy's in an asylum and told her slaying life is a delusion (a storyline I would have loved to see). We cycle back through all the villains, representing the previous seasons, and then see Buffy herself, representing the movie perhaps, which is the beginning, where the whole concept started.

Ah, it'll never happen, but it'd be neat to watch.

I've mentioned this before, but Whedon is writing Fray, a comic series for Dark Horse, and in it he says that the last slayer was a girl in the early 21st century who banished all the demons from earth but vanished mysteriously afterwards, along with all her friends. I could see him contradicting the novels a bit maybe, but do you think he'll contradict himself?

And what about a movie? It seems the thing to do for long-running tv series, so Buffy can't really die at the end of the season if they're even considering the possibility. Whedon himself, while talking about Buffy's death at the end of season 5, said it's called Buffy the Vampire Slayer, not Dawn or Faith or Willow. It's all about the Buffy, and I don't think they'd have much of a show without her.

My two cents, probably not even worth that.

Zoom.
 
 
doglikesparky
15:32 / 08.10.02
the last slayer was a girl in the early 21st century who banished all the demons from earth but vanished mysteriously afterwards, along with all her friends. I could see him contradicting the novels a bit maybe, but do you think he'll contradict himself?


We're only assuming that Buffy is the last Slayer here. He can do what he likes and just say there was another slayer after Buffy - no contradiction. That said, I read Fray with exactly your viewpoint Zoom and wondered pretty much the same thing.
 
 
gridley
16:10 / 08.10.02
I think that at the end of this season (or the series) Willow is going to cast a spell that gives every vampire on the planet his soul back.

Maybe demons too. I'm not sure how they work in terms of soul.

And that's the end.
 
 
Captain Zoom
18:11 / 08.10.02
doglikesparky - I just wish he'd get off his ass and finish the fucking series. 2 issues to go and it's been like 5 months since one came out.

phffft!

Zoom.
 
 
Saint Keggers
19:59 / 08.10.02
If Buffy's going to be the last slayer does that mean Faith is going to die?
 
 
Tryphena Absent
15:34 / 09.10.02
Well Faith as slayer is pretty much dead isn't she? She went mad, she would have been killed eventually, she wanted to die.
 
 
gridley
18:31 / 09.10.02
Marti Noxon (do I have that name right?) said she's still considering Faith as a possible lead character replacement in case SMG leaves.
 
 
cusm
15:07 / 23.10.02
Hey, the web site with the morbid poetry of the girl who knew she was going to die from a couple of episodes ago is actually a real site!

http://www.geocities.com/newcassie/index.html

Now that's detail! The guestbook is interesting as well.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:58 / 23.10.02
The last Slayer disappears in the early 21st Century? Well, on the current rate of Season:Slayer, that leaves another 5.875 possible new Slayers.
 
 
Saint Keggers
02:16 / 24.10.02
Whats the chances that the prophecy about Angel playing a role in the appocalypse actually refers to Spyke now that he has a soul?
 
 
betty woo
14:23 / 24.10.02
Spike taking Angel's place in the prophesy has been discussed on some of the Buffy spoiler boards, although the general impression seems to be that the two shows have diverged sufficiently that it won't happen. The whole Angel prophesy hasn't really been mentioned in BtVS, so it would be coming out of left field for those viewers who don't watch Angel.
 
 
Seth
19:40 / 03.11.02
I happened to catch the Season Seven opener in my hotel room while in San Francisco, and thought you'd all love it if I commented (you usually do). Specifically, on The Buffy Villain Montage, or Selected Big Bad Hi-lights Knowingly Organised In Reverse Chronological Order Omitting Those With Troublesome Scheduling Or Contractual Obligations.

Whedon's just blatantly ripped this narrative device out of the old TMNT coin-op, in which vanquished end of level baddies return en masse in the final level to amp the tension and difficulty without having to use up memory space by introducing brand new baddies and obstacles. D'ya know, I'd have been a lot more impressed with an appearance from the vicious old bloke who shed Dawn's blood at the end of Season 5, or the reappearance of any single one of the nasties from that list. As it was, the final sequence totally took me out of the show: it was too knowing, too self-referential, something they'll only be able to logically follow through on by making this season all about breaking the fourth wall, or by scrambling around in the dirt of previous seasons trying to find a story arc to tie the whole series together. I was left with the overwhelming impression that it was a sequence intended purely to impress the viewer, and I'll always resist any attempt at manipulation (if it's a good attempt at manipulation I'll usually have some grudging respect for the orchestrator. This wasn't). Maybe Whedon should pay more attention to the story (which has suffered since the end of Season Three) than he is to what he thinks the fans want, and dreaming up ways to impress them. The only way that scene could have had any bite was if Angelus had been included: his omission was the lamest case of contractual difficulties since Worf's inability to remember his wife in the final episode of DS9.
 
 
Saint Keggers
02:56 / 04.11.02
was the episode that aired last tuesday a repeat?
 
 
Tamayyurt
05:33 / 04.11.02
Yeah, which sucks cause if this is the final season of Buffy I would have liked to have seen one last Halloween episode!
 
 
Tamayyurt
05:34 / 04.11.02
Oh and did anyone catch what the one for next week is going to be about?
 
 
RadJose
05:51 / 04.11.02
next week... the ads would have you belive it's all about Buffy hittin' on the one boy in school Dawn is interested in and has started connecting w/... or something... i watched it as i dubbed it into my comercial server... as i work at a UPN affil... woo for me
 
 
Saint Keggers
12:52 / 04.11.02
Impulsivelad: Thats why I was wondering. I only get Buffy on Sat. night instead of Tues. So I was wondring if the chanel I got it on screwed up because I REALLY wanted a Halloween episode too.
 
 
Tamayyurt
05:03 / 05.11.02
So is Anya going to die at the end of this season? I hope not cause I really love her... but it was sure hinted at and, you know, she's not contracted to come back.

Damn it, and I wanted her to be in the Buffy movie I've imagined!
 
 
Tryphena Absent
16:04 / 05.11.02
I think the problem with Buffy in season six (and most likely season seven and I'm itching for it) is the lack of concentration by Whedon. He isn't writing, directing and actually he has very little influence over the series and it's becoming well... bad.

I'd really be interested to know how much of Buffy is pre-planned story arc because I want to know who to blame for it. I don't like the decisions that are being made, the season six finale was (of course) appallingly lame, season seven sounds OK but not great. I'm worried.

This idea that the three original scoobies are all important is a real let down and it's constantly reaffirmed by the death of everyone else around them. It's the Hollywood Messiah complex coming to play in one of my favourite shows, it's Neo from The Matrix and John from Die Hard. Buffy was always based around that complex but never bowed to it and seeing it begin to do that now is really upsetting.
 
 
Tamayyurt
14:25 / 06.11.02
Man, last episode sucked! And what's with the lame music?
 
 
The Natural Way
14:35 / 06.11.02
Can someone PM me w/ the date it begins on Sky (if anyone knows), PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSE!!!!!!!*

I don't even want to glance at this thread.
 
 
cusm
20:09 / 06.11.02
Oh, I don't know, I thought it was extremely funny. Hardly an intense drama, depending much on the increasingly involuted details viewers are assumed to know at this point, and full of gimmicks like the Charlie's Angels bit (was that the lame music you were referring to, imp?), but still damn funny. I do like it when they can have fun with the show a bit sometimes.
 
 
Trijhaos
21:44 / 06.11.02
I thought it was alright. I felt sorry for poor Dawn, making a fool of herself because of some dumb jock and his magic letter jacket.
 
  

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