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Doctor Who, Season Four, Non-spoiler Thread

 
  

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Evil Scientist
22:12 / 27.06.08
Wait....so Tamara is Flyboy's new ficsuit?

Yeah, his leaving Barbelith thing lasted about five seconds.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
22:19 / 27.06.08
Making sure. Because, honestly, I've really not been paying attention to that whole hoo-ha. I knew there was hoo-ha afoot but I prefer to stay out of that sort of hoo-ha so I apologize for being hoo-ha free.

Anyway, onward to proper topic!
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
22:30 / 27.06.08
My dear three thousand year old mother recently told me that she much preferred Billie Piper to Catherine Tate.

"She's too fat!" she exclaimed.

"I thought Billie Piper was too fat," rejoined I.

"She's too old!"

"Billie Piper," quoth I, "was too old."

I'm just saying.
 
 
Lama glama
22:49 / 27.06.08
Once latched to the Barbe-teat it's mighty difficult to escape.

And Kali, I'll have you know I'm in my mother's living room, thank you very much.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
00:49 / 28.06.08
*sigh*

Was nowhere trying to be a pain, Llama love. Just that I apparently made a statement that was construed as assholism and I really didn't mean to be.

Back to topic: I barely remember the McGann Who movie and can't find it anywhere where I can go, "WHO are you???"
 
 
Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero
03:07 / 28.06.08
I actually like Tate because she's shaped like an actual woman, really. It makes me feel nice inside.

While I agree that Flyboy's response was more vitriolic than was called for, I have to admit I find comments to the effect that some women are shaped like "real women" and others are shaped like, I dunno, fake women? a little unsettling. There was a comment in the Scott Pilgrim thread expressing a similar sentiment, lemme find it--

I just don't want Ramona and Kim to be played by ubergeneric American TV babes with toned midriffs, which seems all too probable sadly.

Perhaps I'm assuming too much when I infer that the above statement implies that artist Bryan Lee O'Malley portrays Kim and Ramona as shaped like "real" women and that having them played in the film by attractive young women with toned mid-riffs would be a transgression against the source material, which, of course, portrays the female characters as "normal shaped" (despite the fact that just about every character in Scott Pilgrim is shaped exactly like the next). I could be wrong. But comments like this make me feel like there's a popular idea out there that people whose appearance appeals to a broad demographic are somehow not normal.

Apologies for making a big deal about this. I realize, of course, that there is a problem with the way women are sometimes portrayed in the media, and there's no fault in identifying with an actress because she's shaped more like yourself than another actress. But I sometimes take this personally because dammit, the way my face and skeleton is shaped is not my fault, and I occasionally am made to feel like having a fast metabolism and doing a sit-up occasionally places me beyond the realm of normal folk.

Shit I dunno. It's sounding, now, like a weird thing to get upset about. But there it is.
 
 
Evil Scientist
06:12 / 28.06.08
S'not weird. I personally think the thread can get along without focusing on Companion phenotypes.

Anyone seen the 30 second spoiler trailer on the BBC website?

Obviously not going to discuss it here. But I couldn't resist watching it.

Oh yes, oh yes indeed.
 
 
Mysterious Transfer Student
07:01 / 28.06.08
Since it was my comment that Tuna Ghost sampled above, I feel I ought to say a little something. Like most people here, it seems to me that the 'real women' mode of discourse about women's appearances, bodies or lifestyles in the media is a particularly counter-productive phantom. All women are real women, just as all men are real men and all people who do not exactly fit in either category are as real as both. Congratulating either the producers of Doctor Who on their casting choice, or Catherine Tate on not being a slender teenaged model, isn't really doing a service to either, but only serves to continue a system where some women are placed high on an imaginary hierarchy of deserved success and favour, some low.

For all that, it certainly sometimes seems that the women who appear in film and TV productions and who are positioned by the media as attractive and attention-worthy come from an increasingly narrow spectrum of physical types, and this is a source of frustration and annoyance to some of us, leading to attempts to counter the trend by positioning those of different physical types as 'real women'. I think that this can sometimes be a positive effect and that at other times it only perpetuates divisions that we're better off without. If Tuna was offended by my remark in the other thread I apologise, just as I apologise to everyone who just read my mangled argument which would have been made much more fluently by over 9000 other Barbelith posters.
 
 
Seth
08:47 / 28.06.08
If I wanted to watch a show with *real* people I'd sit in a huge open plan James Bond set wearing a kinky authoriarian costume in front of four monitors that plug me in to a whole county's worth of CCTV cameras and be barking commands into a headset mic under the illusion that I am a *controller.*

Hang on...
 
 
■
17:41 / 28.06.08
Loving it even more this time. "She wouldn't let me, she said they were naughty!" Go Cribbins, dodge those pies!
 
 
■
17:59 / 28.06.08
Blimey, wasn't expecting that. I'm worried that looked a bit too much like Nesbitt in there.
 
 
uncle retrospective
18:21 / 28.06.08
I watched Jekyll last week and am now over my Nesbit hate.

As for this ep.

WHAT THE FUCK?
 
 
Ava Banana
18:24 / 28.06.08
Just loved 'Ultimate Code Red', you know, for when the shit REALLY hits the fan!
 
 
Spatula Clarke
18:56 / 28.06.08
Too little Doctor, far too little Donna, too much ex-companion, far too much Torchwood, about ten different rabbits pulled out of hats with no backstory (most of which appeared within the space of five seconds, during the mobile phone signal stuff).

It was kind of exciting, I guess. Mad Dalek was a cool idea, pulled off pretty well, although it took until Davros was talking to the Doctor before I realised which Dalek it was supposed to be, and even then I was struggling between a choice of two.

I'd been working on the possibility of the big surprise being a regeneration - like you said earlier, pin, given what they'd already spoiled there had to be something pretty big still to come in there, and I was a bit sus on Tennant's silence regarding another series - so it wasn't such a huge moment for me. Not as much as when we got the regen at the end of series one, which everybody knew was coming, but had presumed would be in the Christmas special. And its impact was dulled by the horror over who might be taking up the part next.

Better than this point last year, but there wasn't a huge amount of content in it apart from a lot of bangs and whistles.
 
 
A Bigger Boat
19:05 / 28.06.08
So Dalek Khan said 'the dark lord is coming.' Rose said 'the darkness is coming.' Possible hints about the newly regenerated Doctor?

Doctor as antagonist in 2009s specials?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
19:13 / 28.06.08
Or Donna.
 
 
Imaginary Mongoose Solutions
19:38 / 28.06.08
Still haven't seen the most recent ep, but...

As much as I hate to mention it, the coming darkness was a big deal in Torchwood, too with only a half-payoff. Like many things Torchwood.

Also, speaking of Torchwood and regenerations and the like, given that this next season of Torchwood is undergoing a complete format overhall... I'm wondering what the odds of the Valeyard showing up as a possible soon-ish future regeneration and antagonist for a short-run Torchwood. Completely pointless speculation, indeed but It distracts me from the progress bar of a certain download.
 
 
Poke it with a stick
19:56 / 28.06.08
REgarding the regeneration (or not) -

Dalek Caan: 'The threefold man dances in the lonely places!', 'He's coming! The dark lord!'

If you saw the confidential and two persons interviewed about their dealings with the Daleks then might that suggest the same thing to you as it did to me?

Or is it going to be some sort of deal with the hand in the jar?
 
 
GogMickGog
20:01 / 28.06.08
Ay, but isn't Le Tennant signed for the 3 specials too?

I'm thinking they'll backtrack, possibly via the whole 'one second out of sync with the rest of the universe' thingy.

THOUGHT - when Donna was on the stairs at The Shadow Proclamation, did anyone else hear the slightest, uh, percussion?....
 
 
Poke it with a stick
20:05 / 28.06.08
THOUGHT - when Donna was on the stairs at The Shadow Proclamation, did anyone else hear the slightest, uh, percussion?....

Yup... but I don't think they'd do that. Would they?

And the thing on her back is still there? Does this mean Tennant's going to emerge from the Tardis' shower?

"Oh, you meant my other left?"
 
 
■
20:33 / 28.06.08
Or is it going to be some sort of deal with the hand in the jar?

Uh, yeah, they did foreground that quite heavily, didn't they? That and the fact that there's Ms Who running around the cosmos with Chronoton energy or whatever hand-waveyness they care to come up with, I think there's a good possibility that it's going to be a bit of a repeat of the end of season 1, with everyone dead and a new evil Doc (please say Nesbitt is only temporary), only to find that Donna can somehow pull something out of her back pocket (or Rose, given that the Abomination is probably part-her) to fix everything so that no-one really dies at all and we get back to fun and games. And Cribbins.
You do realise btw, that this is the first time the Cushing films hav been made canon (unless, of course, he was referring to The Pirate Planet, which is unlikely).
And, no, there are no DVDs of next week at all, so I'm allowed to speculate.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:16 / 28.06.08
Incidentally, and before it becomes a problem, any information regarding potential hints as provided in Confidential is out of bounds for this thread.

Confidential on the details of things seen on-screen within the episode just aired, fine. But Confidential has been awful at keeping future secrets secret.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:56 / 28.06.08
One thing that worries me about the final episode is that unexplained key that Martha's got. If that proves to be the thing that saves the day, then it'll be woeful. I'm kind of hoping that they forget all about it, or she loses it, or it just doesn't work. Anything other than having it tie everything up.
 
 
Billuccho!
00:19 / 29.06.08
You do realise btw, that this is the first time the Cushing films hav been made canon (unless, of course, he was referring to The Pirate Planet, which is unlikely).

Or, more likely, they were referring to the William Hartnell serial "The Dalek Invasion of Earth," which the Cushing movie was a rip-off thereof.
 
 
Evil Scientist
09:13 / 29.06.08
Urm, the big black ring on Donna's finger. That always been there?

Da da da dum. Da da da dum.
 
 
Evil Scientist
09:15 / 29.06.08
Final episode will be 65 minutes long.

Sweeeeet.
 
 
Axolotl
10:22 / 29.06.08
I really enjoyed that. Sure Harriet and her subspace network was a deus ex machina that wasn't really necessary (why couldn't the bee's trail just have led him to earth) but during the episode I got swept up in the spectacle and excitement.
 
 
Lama glama
10:32 / 29.06.08
For an episode that mostly featured people staring at video screens with worried looks on their faces, that was intensely exciting. It feels like the finalé hasn't blown its load yet. At this point last year, The Sound of Drums had featured most of the interesting and exciting material, while the Last of the Time Lords was just the Master's perverse circus and didn't feel very much like a finalé (or Doctor Who for that matter).

My only worry would have been that people who haven't watched Sarah Jane Interferes or Torchwood won't get who these people are: "Why are these two strange people hanging out with Capt. Jack worried about Martha's death? And how the hell does Sarah Jane have a son, when we last saw her she said she never married or had children?"
Except I do know who all of these characters are and the appearances of the spin-off crew was one of the most gratuitous pieces of fan service on anything ever. We even had Sarah Jane taking the piss out of Mr Smith's fanfare! Fantastic.

My only criticism is that there was so little of the Doctor and Donna. What was there was wonderful, but next week will hopefully make up for their criminal under-use. Julian Bleach was a great quiet Davros, but the complete role can't be judged until he does raving insane Davros next week (hopefully). Tennant's totally not regenerating. Eccleston got his farewell speech and his final utterance of "fantastic," and Tennant just sort of slumped there saying nothing especially interesting or emotional. RTD would wring every last ounce of emotion out of that scene if it were for real.
 
 
raggedman
12:48 / 29.06.08
Harriet Jones vs The Daleks

God I love her

And Bernard Cribbins vs the Daleks
with a sodding paint gun
that so should have worked
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
12:53 / 29.06.08
I'm going with the "one second out of sync" bit re: the regeneration.

Watched this late last night (big YAWN! So sleepy). Was very excited to see all the Companions again, but it was a bit of a mess. The Shadow Proclamation was underwhelming. The thing on Donna's back better be effing awesome because I'd thought we'd got rid of it by now. The reactions to transmitted word "EXTERMINATE" by all the Companions' was really ace. The terror, the tears, the resignation. I liked the subwave contact thing until it all came down to Torchwood again. (Anyone else get the feeling all they've been doing since the team got decimated is drinking and watching telly down there in the basement? It feels like that.) I did get a kick out of Harriet Jones telling the Daleks who she was and she received the standard answer. The Mad Dalek was actually pretty funny; he reminded me of the mad drunk uncle at your wedding, the one who can't keep his mouth shut about family secrets. Davros was gross and creepy as ever.

As for Rose's reaction that no one was remembering or including her: Well, not everyone knows you survived, for chrissake, on a parallel world! What, is the Doctor like an old boyfriend whom you hoped would stop Companioning and mope around in THE TARDIS in sweats with a spoon firmly planted in a pint of Haagen Daz? He moved on! He had to! That's what he does!

As for the Osterhagen Key: I suspect it will be some stupid deus ex machina because it's RTD. And I will probably be pissed.

Oh yes, and Cribbins. I want him as my granddad.
 
 
Imaginary Mongoose Solutions
14:08 / 29.06.08
Indeed. I want Tennant to regenerate into Cribbins and then come hang out at my house.
 
 
sleazenation
14:16 / 29.06.08
Da da da dum.

Was that beat a reference to the archangel network/whatever the thing was called that Harriet Jones was using?

Or was it a hint that there might be a few more surprises in store...
 
 
Evil Scientist
15:41 / 29.06.08
Was that beat a reference to the archangel network/whatever the thing was called that Harriet Jones was using?

I was just pondering about the ring that Donna is wearing in the episode. I didn't get a good look at it but I wondered if it was one that we may have seen before.
 
 
sleazenation
16:18 / 29.06.08
No, i don't think so.

It would actually undermine Donna as a character.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
18:29 / 29.06.08
I am really not watching close enough. I didn't hear the drums. Dammit.
 
  

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