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Doctor Who, Season Four, Non-spoiler Thread

 
  

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_pin
07:19 / 25.06.08
@Kali - But! But! She looks so sad, when Donna doesn't understand that she's going to die!

I think the fact that she was all super-soldier just made the threat seem scarier.

Does anyone know the politics of her coming back, though? I remember RTD saying people didn't feel her story ended properly, but it really did. Did they want to bring her back? Are they going to End of Evangelion her coming back by making you getting what you want seem like a really bad idea?
 
 
Whisky Priestess
09:22 / 25.06.08
I want her to ascend to Godhood or TimeLadyship like Cordelia at the end of Angel Season 3(?)

I think it could happen.

Thirding the teeth thing. I actually thought she had Billy Bob joke teeth in for the first scene, to somehow indicate that she was different from the Rose we formerly knew; that she was from a parallel universe where she'd never gone to the orthodontist.
 
 
uncle retrospective
13:10 / 25.06.08
The Deus ex has to be Donna this year, all the hints are there and are beating you round the head by the end of the last ep. Wonder how it's going to work though. Will she become Jesus like Doctor Dobby last year?
 
 
Evil Scientist
13:25 / 25.06.08
Well all the indicators from Turn Left seem to suggest there's more to Donna than meets the eye. It'd be a bit of a con for her to get Mad Bad Wolf skillz too though.

Perhaps she has a fob watch lurking around at home too.

That'd really be nuking the fridge though.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
13:29 / 25.06.08
Geez, the BBC Who website has a big fat spoiler in its News section. I was like, "Way to ruin the excitement there, John Barrowman."

Back to topic: I am really curious as to why Donna is so special. All the parallel world coincidences as well meeting the Doctor again and traveling with him. I hope the grand reveal (if there is one) is not too idiotic.
 
 
_pin
13:56 / 25.06.08
Well, yes. I don't think Rose is going to be a deus ex machina, and didn't mean that by mentioning EOE; I just meant a succession of horrible things will happen to her, now that she's returned, to punish people who thought she should.

It also didn't occur to me, wrongteeth aside, that she was a paralell-universe Rose, although it did to people I've talked to. Did it to you?

They're perfectly welcome to nuke the fridge; nuking the fridge was awesome.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
14:12 / 25.06.08
What do you mean, parallel-universe Rose? Do you mean from Pete's World?
 
 
Whisky Priestess
14:40 / 25.06.08
Yes.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
14:45 / 25.06.08
Technically, she's Rose from our world who now lives in Pete's World because in Pete's World Rose was a dog.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:09 / 25.06.08
I'm going with the notion that Donna's somehow going to provide some way of solving the Time War stuff. Reversing the timeline, or bringing back Teh Multiverse (not that it was ever present in Who before RTD decided that it was and that he didn't want it to be).

Bringing back the Timelords.

Because it does seem, as the show's lifespan keeps expanding and more old characters are given a reboot, that the only people who actually died out during the Time War were the Timelords themselves. And even then only the unimportant ones.

Probably not, of course. If anything, it's most likely just a thread that's being left for Moffat to run with as he sees fit.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:10 / 25.06.08
"That was Gwen Cooper and Ianto Jones up there."

Eeeee. Okay, that totally made up for Torchwood.


Shame it was an alternate timeline, really.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
17:01 / 25.06.08
Nothing became their lives like the leaving of it, clearly, but it was telling that I liked, empathised with and got on with Torchwood a lot better in that single line than at any point in series 2 - not least because they were doing what one might expect - operating as the front line in the defence of the Earth against extraterrestrial threats - rather than investigating really quite domestic and minor oddnesses before at the end of the series jammily averting a Cardiff-threatening catastrophe for the genesis of which they were completely responsible.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
17:12 / 25.06.08
Ah, yes, the only time Torchwood ever did their job properly and it was in an alternate timeline. Indeed.
 
 
_pin
19:42 / 25.06.08
I've been thinking, because my job is very demanding, that you're probably right, Randy. Following on from raggedman above, I'd been expecting, if not an actual picture of beavers building dams, at least a picture of Tennant over a headline about beavers building dams. Instead, to one side, quite small, apropos very little, comes:

"Beavers build dams! Doctor Who doesn't know if chopping down trees is pacifist!"

De-Time Warring might just be big enough, and secret enough, to justify how much they've already given away, to get people expecting something big.

And Rose's fate... I don't think it's been mentioned yet, but of all "Midnight"'s 10th-Dr-writ-small moments, the bit where his pacifism aggravates the situation to the point where the person who's idea he'd shot down for contravening his principles has to go ahead and execute said idea, killing herself in the process because that's how bad things had gotten, all to save him.

Haus noted above that River Song was the (then) latest in a long and venerable line of people who could back up the man who never would; I'd imagine Rose will make Tenth see the error of his ways, by taking up arms and dying in the charge.
 
 
osymandus
11:45 / 26.06.08
I believe this pacafism , came about becuase he had to firebomb his entire planet and propably the survivors (ok that was 9th ) remember teh first thing 10 did was kill an alien in single combat (ok it was with an ornage ) .

I dont believe he rejects "violence" just knowing the correct moment to apply it.
 
 
Rev. Orr
13:18 / 26.06.08
Erm, you do realise that there were a few episodes before RTD took over, right? The pacifism (or, more accurately, a personal preference for the non-violent solution) has come and gone in terms of degree since the show began but it's hardly a contentious statement that it is one of the essential character traits. Jon Pertwee and his dodgy 'Venusian' martial-arts is the nearest Who has got to an action-hero and he was still a grey-haired, wrinkled dandy who avoided guns.
 
 
osymandus
14:42 / 26.06.08
Oh fully aware , and the agnst ridden strains of Peter Davidson's Doctor having been forced to shoot a cyberman.

The charcter has always abored using such actions yet has done so as a neccesary.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
14:56 / 26.06.08
He is rather directly responsible for the death of the Sycorax (no second chances), and indeed for the death of the Arachnowhatsit in the Christmas special... in both cases, strictly speaking, what actually did them in was physics rather than the Doctor, but it's a bit of a narrow line. It isn't presented totally consistently, but it seems that eight wiped out the Daleks and the Time Lords in the Time War, Nine was traumatised by that and was avowedly non-violent (physically, while being very angry and shouty) except when it came to Daleks. Ten gives aggressors a chance to leave, and then while he won't shoot them himself will be reasonably tolerant about them dying as a direct result of his actions (the Sycorax leader, the Rachnos, the Sontarans (twice)), while getting very angry when people die without his permission or when they are not immediately showing aggression (the rest of the Sycorax, his ladyclone). There's a gray area around people killing other people or otherwise doing damage specifically to save his life like Mrs Moore or the stewardess - although I suspect, strictly speaking, that he did for that cyberman - he can be grateful and snippy in roughly equal measure.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
17:22 / 26.06.08
Isn't this season's finale supposed to explain why the Eighth became the Ninth? (I personally like Haus' theory.)
 
 
_pin
18:31 / 26.06.08
Does that mean some McGann? McGann himself wasn't bad, was he?

If we're going to get them all back, you might as well really get them all back, no?

Season ends with UNIT taking over Torchwood for it's different-format season 3, while we're here?
 
 
DavidXBrunt
19:18 / 26.06.08
Nope, McGann wasn't bad. He was pretty good and got a lot better. But I doubt we'll see him back.
 
 
Lama glama
20:09 / 26.06.08
First I've heard of the McGann to Eccleston regeneration explanation, but as with every finalé fans are frantically wishing him into the episodes.

Oh yes, before I stop ranting with my infinite diarrhea of the mouth, we only notice that it says Bad Wolf all around, even on the TARDIS?

It's my understanding that Bad Wolf only started appearing everywhere after Donna had been pulled out of the alternate universe and rejoined with dead Donna. Or, y'know, whatever.

Re: Rose's teeth: The Billie Piper teeth comments are getting really old, very quickly. A lot of previews and reviews dedicated an entire paragraph to bizarre comments about her teeth, calling her Janet Street Porter Jr, horse-mouth, blah hateful blah. It's just boring and a little mean to point out anatomical details of an actress which have very little to do with her performance. Y'know what else really grinds my gears? Snide and smug little comments about Catherine Tate's body-shape, which include jokes about how she's too fat to keep up with the Doctor when she's running. British newspapers (tabloids broadsheets are really depressing.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
20:20 / 26.06.08
I actually like Tate because she's shaped like an actual woman, really. It makes me feel nice inside.
 
 
Lama glama
20:32 / 26.06.08
Yeah, that's what I was getting at. I like her shape, but find it tiring that boring body fascists just go on and on about what they perceive as an unattractive body.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
20:46 / 26.06.08
One thing I've noticed about tabloids here in the States and ones in the UK is that yours tend to be much more vicious, but that's either here nor there in this thread. I, for one, am glad the Doctor's Companion is not some stereotypical thin fashionista (I'm not saying either Freeman or Piper were, mind you) but a woman who's built like everyone else.
 
 
Evil Scientist
10:48 / 27.06.08
Isn't this season's finale supposed to explain why the Eighth became the Ninth?

I always presumed it was out of shame at the truly awful movie.

Much more traumatic than blowing up your Homeworld.
 
 
raggedman
13:22 / 27.06.08
please god don't let them bring up Mcgann
the film sucked and Mcoy did not deserve such a cruddy death
i understand that the radio/novel/comic spin offs did some kind of redemption on Doc 8 but those really are secondary secondary media and they wouldn't ask da kids to go and care about them
would they?

i like the time lords being dead
i like that we don't have many details about the time war
it was horrible, there was much death, the doctor did
something terrible to save everything
what else do we need?

'I was at the fall of Arcadia, some day i may even come to terms with that'
is more beautiful, evocative and heart-breaking than any attempt to show/explain it all/'solve it'

and the british press are the scum of the universe
 
 
Jawsus-son Starship
13:35 / 27.06.08
Re: Rose's teeth: The Billie Piper teeth comments are getting really old, very quickly.

I find it really odd that the comments appear at all, especially from papers who showed Billie Piper in her skimpies when she was playing Belle de Jour proclaiming how "hoooooot" she is. While she might not be the most typical beauty, she is still pretty, well, pretty.

I much prefer playing Charlie Brooker's game of which part of her face is bigger.
 
 
Evil Scientist
14:35 / 27.06.08
One more day and then...super-squee.

Seriously people. You'll hear me on Mars.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
18:51 / 27.06.08
an actual woman... a woman who's built like everyone else.

So true. Yesterday I actually had to murder a couple of short skinny women, and then one who was very lean and 6 ft 3, and then a couple of really really fat ones, because they were all Auton imposters, not actual women, who all have Catherine Tate's exact body shape.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
20:22 / 27.06.08
Wow. Snarky AND ouch.
 
 
DavidXBrunt
20:53 / 27.06.08
The teeth thing baffles me.

Surely it's Billies eye-brows that deserve the focus?
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
20:55 / 27.06.08
Yeah, Fly, I appreciate the attempt at reductio ad absurdum, but that was a little dubious, especially when directed at a relatively innocuous comment.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
21:21 / 27.06.08
Wait....so Tamara is Flyboy's new ficsuit? I really should get down into my mother's basement more.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
21:22 / 27.06.08
Aahh. Cannot post that without profuse apologies all round. I'm sorry for that. It just came out. I am really sorry.
 
  

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