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Lost (US thread)

  
  

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Spaniel
10:27 / 13.05.07
I've just paused the scene and I can't make out what colour the eyes are. I even had a twiddle with the brightness and the contrast.

BToG, do you have access to some clever image manipulation gubbinz that I don't?
 
 
gridley
12:20 / 13.05.07
Is it simply a coincidence that Ben's mother died at childbirth and that pregnant women die on the Island?

Exactly. Especially given the possibility that Walt retroactively added polar bears to the history of the island because he happened to see one in a comic book. In Ben's personal mythology, mothers die and so that has the way it is.
 
 
A beautiful tunnel of ghosts
16:21 / 13.05.07
Boboss, after reading your post I watched the scene again, and there are at least two ways in which it can be read: the shots preceding the extreme close-up are of Ben, which can be read as Ben looking from Locke to Jacob; or it could be the camera moving across the room from Ben, to Jacob and then to Locke, eschewing a close-up of Jacob for an extreme close-up as he looks at Locke to maintain the scene's atmosphere. This reading might explain Locke's sudden scramble out of the house.

Ben has grey eyes, and they're admittedly difficult to see clearly in that scene, but this link, from Keith's link above, shows the close-up with stronger lighting in which the eye does appear to be brown. I was responding to the Colonel's assertion that Jacob looks like Locke, with which I don't agree, but I could well be wrong.
 
 
Eskay Uno
16:31 / 13.05.07
Hmm.. that looks to be Desmond's eye, if you ask me... but what would he be doing there? Could he or will he be having a vision regarding this whole scene?
 
 
Spaniel
17:03 / 13.05.07
I was responding to the Colonel's assertion that Jacob looks like Locke, with which I don't agree, but I could well be wrong.

I appreciate that, I was just further illustrating my point that it's difficult to draw anything like a solid conclusion about who does or doesn't look like who.

Those eyes do look like the might be brown in that link.
 
 
Tsuga
09:36 / 16.05.07
I finally saw this last night, very interesting. So eyebrow doesn't age, but he seemed to be the only one, and he's also not always on the island, if he's out recruiting people like Juliet.
The whole Jacob thing? I throw up my hands. A Luddite poltergeist who needs help. It's got to be relevant though, as was pointed out, that Locke heard him but Ben didn't.
I don't know what's up with that ash, I don't think volcanic ash ever forms in channels, it just snows down. And why would they need to show another volcanic sign? What the hell were they trying to show? It probably is supposed to be ash, though.
Locke is left for dead, which I'm sure is important later.

As buttergun said And as enjoyable as this show is, sometimes when you sit down and think of it, the entire edifice is pretty damn ridiculous. I suppose the more important part of that sentence is the first part. It's still fun to watch. I don't know when I'll be able to watch tonights episode, but I'm about to pee myself with excitement. Well, maybe not that excited, but...
 
 
Spaniel
16:42 / 16.05.07
I'm trying to hold off for a week and watch it all in one big splurge. Not sure I can do it, but I managed it last year so there is hope.
 
 
juju eyeballs
00:32 / 17.05.07
I think you should, and I think it'll be worth it. Wish I had the patience.

Lost seems to be working better in the binge format. I just finished watching season 2, it was so much better than I remembered it. Maybe because it got scattered all over the year(s) instead of the two chunks we got this season. Looking forward to seclude myself for a weekend and watch all of season 3. When's the dvd set coming out?
 
 
wicker woman
09:38 / 17.05.07
A quick thought before I start discussing tonight's episode at some point this week...

what happened to the numbers, exactly? I mean, the Swan station obviously went belly-up after Desmond's heroics, and that seemed to be the only station where the numbers played a vital role, but our dear friends 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, and 42 don't seem to have put in an appearance in quite some time. They usually had a habit of popping up here or there, in one form or another.
 
 
Spaniel
10:53 / 17.05.07
Go and have a look at the screencaps site that's been linked to all over this thread - I think you'll find the numbers are alive and well.
 
 
Rhayader
17:02 / 17.05.07
Filler episode. Cliché-ridden Charlie flashbacks, which includes the world's longest daylight robbery, since four people passed through the alley and the mugger was still aiming for the purse. Honestly, how many times have you seen such a scene in movies or tv? Or the ring-whatever that has passed through countless generations-thing?

This episode also made me realise how they've kind of ruined Desmond's character in this season. He has stuck with Charlie this entire time, and for what? What will be doing after Charlie's gone, which I'm beggining to doubt it'll ever happen? All of this vision thing is just too poorly explained, and I've no idea where the writers can go with this. Wouldn't it be obvious that Desmond should be one of the most interested parties on the island's mysteries, on par with Locke? I mean, he should be questioning what he was doing inside the hatch pressing the button for years, not hunting for meat or have flashbacks on how he had an religious calling.
Where was he for the entire Season 2? Where's his boat? Do they care?
 
 
buttergun
18:48 / 17.05.07
But did you notice WHO Charlie saved from the mugging? None other than Sayid's flame Nadia...man, she must be like a world traveler or something. Whose backstory will she bump into next?
 
 
buttergun
18:51 / 17.05.07
Also, your questions are just more to add to the pile I asked a few pages back -- namely, the many unanswered threads left dangling from Season 2. I'm positive this is due to the writer overhaul which ocurred between Seasons 2 and 3, even though others here disagree with me.

But how about this -- I recently learned that the actor portraying Ben was only supposed to be in a handful of episodes, back when he was "posing" as Henry Gale and was locked up by the Losters. The producers liked him so much, they decided to keep him on -- only as a "different" character, as the Others leader was apparently supposed to be someone else, originally. Yet more proof they are making it up as they go along...but of course this was in Season 2, it seems like they're at least tempting to answer things this season.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
19:18 / 17.05.07
But did you notice WHO Charlie saved from the mugging? None other than Sayid's flame Nadia...man, she must be like a world traveler or something. Whose backstory will she bump into next?

Mind = blown. I didn't notice that! I wondered why there was such an emphasis on her in the scene.

Also, your questions are just more to add to the pile I asked a few pages back -- namely, the many unanswered threads left dangling from Season 2. I'm positive this is due to the writer overhaul which ocurred between Seasons 2 and 3, even though others here disagree with me.

I don't think there was a staff overhaul, but I think the writers just got more focused and organized between the seasons due to plot points introduced throughout season 2. Which is good.

But how about this -- I recently learned that the actor portraying Ben was only supposed to be in a handful of episodes, back when he was "posing" as Henry Gale and was locked up by the Losters. The producers liked him so much, they decided to keep him on -- only as a "different" character, as the Others leader was apparently supposed to be someone else, originally.

Well, he's awesome, so aren't you glad they did find and like him so much? I certainly am.

Yet more proof they are making it up as they go along...but of course this was in Season 2, it seems like they're at least tempting to answer things this season.

I don't think anyone needs to 'prove' that they are making it up as they go along. Of course they are. All shows do... you can't plot an exciting 5-7 year story without adjusting storylines as they go along. Even JMS did that with B5, even though the major beats were mapped out. But he was forced to change things quite a few times.

Lost is hanging together pretty well these days. They are addressing more and more dangling threads this season, which is great.
 
 
buttergun
20:32 / 17.05.07
>They are addressing more and more dangling threads this season, which is great.<

A sentiment I share, even though it looks like I didn't properly convey it in my above posts. As for making it up as they go along, I agree with you -- but weren't they claiming last year that they weren't making it up, that it was all patterned out? Either way I don't care, as long as they keep up the quality, as they have for the second half of this season.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
22:27 / 17.05.07
what they've been saying in interviews i've seen lately is that they knew the beginning and the end, but weren't very clear on the middle on account of not knowing how long they would be trying to tell the story... with the push for a definite end date, I think they refocused this season... culminating in the network giving them their wish.
 
 
X-Himy
01:55 / 18.05.07
As I remember, they also claimed that everything was science-based, no magic, no aliens, nothing that out there. I think Jacob the pirate ghost argues against that. Which means that all the rules of physical logic go out the window and every crazy theory is game again.
 
 
aeonite
05:21 / 18.05.07
I don't know what's up with that ash, I don't think volcanic ash ever forms in channels, it just snows down. And why would they need to show another volcanic sign? What the hell were they trying to show? It probably is supposed to be ash, though.

It wasn't naturally placed, IIRC. It appeared to be in a ring around the cabin, much like a ring of salt or a pentacle in old world magic that would be used to keep a spirit or demon within.
 
 
Querelle
07:14 / 18.05.07
Something that bothered me about the last episode re the Looking Glass, was that they didn't just physically cut the power cable leading to the station, instead of sending Charlie on his dangerous little mission. Surely that would have solved the signal jamming problem and inconvenienced the Others in other unknown ways. Even if Charlie had to do it per Desmond's vision, don't you think someone like Jack would have just been like "Uh, no, just cut it".
 
 
Uatu.is.watching
15:19 / 18.05.07
I don't think we know that the cable was in fact a "power" cable. The schematic Sayid had labeled it "anchor to land".
 
 
buttergun
16:05 / 18.05.07
I have to admit, I did see some irony in Jack, the white American, forbidding Sayid, the Iraqi, to go on a suicide mission. That scene was just asking for a smart-ass Sawyer comment; either the writers didn't think of it, or they thought it would be in poor taste...but remember Sawyer's lines re Sayid being a terrorist early in Season 1.
 
 
thewalker
02:56 / 21.05.07
from "lying in the gutters"

relax........no spoilers


THE ENDING OF LOST

[Green Light]Brian K Vaughan will be pitching a new graphic novel to Vertigo shortly and following that up with a new ongoing series.

He had four pages of notes from Joss Whedon regarding his first script for his upcoming arc on "Buffy" Season Eight.

But what we all wanted to know is that yes, he does know the complete picture of "Lost," he knows there's always been a complete picture about what's really going on, he knows all about the Dharma Initiative and he's only nine drinks away from telling people at any point.

And, yes, he did write the Superman/Flash sequence.

Enough Brian K Vaughan! Before I go all Alan Moore over him.
 
 
wicker woman
06:02 / 21.05.07
Whoops.

Assuming you have the ability to check out the episodes online, or have it recorded, watch the last episode again. Right after Charlie tells Hurley he can't come along with he and Desmond in the boat, and as Charlie starts jogging after Hurley to hug him, when the camera shifts off to the left you can see a cameraman's leg and a sizable part of the camera he's holding.

It's actually on-screen long enough to where you'd think that's something that they would have caught during replays.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
07:33 / 21.05.07
As I remember, they also claimed that everything was science-based, no magic, no aliens, nothing that out there. I think Jacob the pirate ghost argues against that. Which means that all the rules of physical logic go out the window and every crazy theory is game again.

I don't see how Jacob's ghost is on a different level to the polar bear, the smoke monster, Kate's phantom horse and Ben's visions of his mother. Or, for that matter, Sun's pregnancy and Locke's legs. The island has been able to do the uncanny since early in Season One ~ it could all be "science we don't yet understand", rather than magic.
 
 
CameronStewart
02:27 / 24.05.07
Finale just finished.

SPOILERS OF COURSE





Through the episode my girlfriend kept mentioning with irritation that Bearded Jack's cellphone, a Motorola Razr, wasn't available in 2004, which is when the story is set. She thought it was a pretty bad continuity mistake. Turns out it wasn't a mistake at all...

The name of the funeral home Jack visits, Hoffs/Drawlar, is an anagram for "flash forward." Ho ho.

So who was in the coffin? Kate registers disgust when Jack shows her the obituary clipping, so...Ben?

Very interesting closing scene, definitely a big shakeup. Far more interesting and satisfying than the Heroes finale.

All that and Charlie biting it!
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
02:27 / 24.05.07
HELLO????

HELLO.

HELLO?>?????!?!?!?!?!!!1111
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
02:46 / 24.05.07
I'm usually the last to guess stuff (Sixth Sense, for example), and I hate to toot my own horn, but I completely guessed the flash forward thing within the very first scene. There was just something tonally about it that made me suspect that this was Post-rescue Jack dealing with his inner demons like usual. They threw in some red herrings but the phone and the Saturn Ion that almost hit Jack cinched it. So who makes it off? Who doesn't? Why does Jack want to go back so badly?

Do I like this? I love this development! That was a great finale like usual. I thought last season's finale was great, but this was even better. Beats Heroes finale to no end.

Casket... it was definitely small sized...

Boat...It's gotta be the modern day version of Dharma/Hanso, which is why Ben is so afraid of them.

Charlie...did he go limp at all? My general rule is not to believe any death (and I define that as 'last breath') that doesn't happen onscreen.

Me love Lost.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
03:10 / 24.05.07
an AICN Talkbacker (yeah, those guys) had the brilliant idea that the rest of the seasons will be set in the 'Jack & Kate in LA' time frame, and the flashbacks will be to the island. Perhaps that explains the Terry O'Quinn selling his Hawaii home thing. Whoa!
 
 
CameronStewart
03:14 / 24.05.07
>>>Casket... it was definitely small sized...<<<

Ben is considerably shorter than Jack.

It makes sense for it to be Ben - Kate is incredulous that Jack would even suggest she would go to the funeral. Ben has no family (they died on the island), and no friends (having spent almost his entire life on the island). And Jack, already in the depths of depression at having left the island, breaks down crying and is ready to jump off a bridge when the one man who might possibly be able to get him back to the island turns up dead.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
03:29 / 24.05.07
Unfortunately, though, the picture has already been blown up and deciphered.

"The body of J..." is visible and it looks like a bit of an O after the J.

Poor John Locke.
 
 
CameronStewart
03:51 / 24.05.07
Yeah, I dunno about that. It could be anyone, really.

The location of the funeral appeared to be quite specific - it looked like they were quite deliberately showing that it was in a black neighbourhood. What that means, I have no idea.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
04:02 / 24.05.07
I think it was more supposed to be a run down neighborhood.
 
 
wicker woman
04:40 / 24.05.07
Well, that was about the most depressing finale since season 5 of Buffy. I don't like to think about no more Charlie.

There's a part of me that hopes that flash-forward is something that can still be changed, or at least added to. That's not exactly a great deal of fun to look forward to, and it just colors everything Jack does from this point forward on the island... "Well yeah, Jack just did _______, but he ends up drunk, alone, and suicidal. Yay."


I'm also beginning to wonder how exactly Mikhail continues to survive all this crap being done to him. Not that I'm a doctor of any sort, but it looked to me like the shaft of that spear went in deep enough for him to at least have a punctured lung.

Good lord, did the Others get their collective asses handed to them in this episode, or what? I'm kind of sad about Tom as well, despite his wanting to shoot Jin, Sawyer, and Bernard. From the look on Juliet's face, she might be starting to wonder about some of the people she's decided to throw her lot in with.

I'm not sure the boat is Dharma goons. If this island is as valuable as it seems to be, why would Dharma wait 16 years to try and take it back?
 
 
NewMyth
05:53 / 24.05.07
This morning on the National Public Radio Show, "Day to Day," they aired a piece on Michael Emerson, who plays Ben. Lite stuff, but kinda cool to hear him talk out of character. It's a bit over 6 mins:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10347856
 
 
buttergun
12:37 / 24.05.07
That was a fantastic season finale. Two taut hours of suspense and action. The only boring part, I thought, was Jack's flashback, which began to grate after a while. But it was redeemed with the "Sixth Sense"-worthy twist at the end, which was one of the best "WTF?" moments in the series.

So this "futureback" throws everything into a new direction. I hate to speculate about Lost...but if it's true, if the theories are right in that Jacob is really Locke, then that would mean Locke is somehow displaced in time. And could perhaps control it. His last line last night, when he dropped the gun he was pointing at Jack, was "Jack, you're not supposed to do this." Maybe on some subconscious level -- because he is Jacob -- Locke knows that if Jack leaves the island, he will be unhappy. And I'm also thinking the show could pull off some "super-happy" ending in a few seasons, with the timestream being fixed in some way...Future Jack's history being written off, and all the dead people (ie Charlie, Boone, etc) coming back to life. Hell, it would be no more out-there than Kate's phantom horse.

Highlights, and there were many: Juliet saying the Others runway was "for the aliens" (Juliet is my favorite new character on this show...I love the lines they give her). Sayid snapping the neck of the Other who was guarding him. Hurley coming to the rescue...they'd been building that scene up for two episodes, and it came off great. Charlie's heroic last moments*. Desmond harpooning Mikhail. And saving the best for last, Sawyer's "That's for taking the boy off the boat." That was great writing -- I'd actually forgotten about those final moments of the Season 1 finale. But it makes such perfect sense that Sawyer would of course carry a grudge...not for the "chain gang" stuff he was put through early this season, but for the stealing of Walt, way back when.

*One question on Charlie's sacrifice. Was it necessary? My wife and I were questioning why he had to shut the door. Couldn't he have rushed out of the room, yelled for Desmond, and dove into the entry pool, then swam back up to the surface? I don't think the station would've filled with water that fast, once Mikhail's grenade blew up the hatch window...I think Charlie and Desmond would've had plenty of time to escape. However Charlie's sacrifice was riveting television, and succeeded in depressing the hell out of my wife.

So many nagging questions...whose death did Jack read about in the paper? I want to say Locke. Notice no one was at the funeral...but then why would Jack call Kate? Makes me also think it might've been Sawyer...but then who was Kate referring to when she said "he'll be wondering where I am?" And where was Juliet in this future world?

This was probably my favorite two hours of Lost ever. Earlier this week I was nonplussed by the Heroes finale, mostly due to the anticlimatical nature of how the final events went down. But Lost got it all right.
 
  

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