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The Ultimates 2

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13:36 / 14.01.05

Anyone else think Millar's hinting at the incestuous relationship between Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch is just creepy? I mean, I know Millar has said 'they have a post-human relationship, they're mutants, and don't have to subscribe to human morality'...but...eeeewww.

13:41 / 14.01.05

>> You know what he's trying to do, but he always over-eggs the pudding.

Good way to summarize Millar's style.

ONLY NICE THINGS

13:45 / 14.01.05

Anyone else think Millar's hinting at the incestuous relationship between Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch is just creepy?

Oh, yeah. the consensual sex that harms nobody is far skeezier than the rape and sexual violence.

Identity Crisis Issue 1 - it's good!

Haus of Mystery

13:48 / 14.01.05

When is Ultimate Betty #1 out?

13:49 / 14.01.05

Ok, I totally deserved that IC joke, but I don't know about saying incest is fine compared to violence. But that's a whole 'nother issue and really not for this thread. I do see what you mean about no one gets hurt physically, but still...incest, man. Yikes.

13:50 / 14.01.05

Yeah, what was going on with the whole strip-poker thing? Very, very weird, if you ask me.

Where did Millar say Hank would be on the Ultimate Defenders' team? It makes sense, but I'm hoping to see some "new" characters.

As for Wanda and Pietro, it doesn't really freak me out, TBH. You are aware, Wolfy, that royal siblings used to have it off left right and centre.
Ever seen La Reine Margot?

13:52 / 14.01.05

Good point about the royal families and all. It's not a subject I know much about, incest...

And for the record, I have recanted my initial Identity Crisis stance many times over in the related thread.

13:59 / 14.01.05

it's not incest at all though is it? just raised eyebrows, feverish fanboy imaginings and superheroically dysfunctional families. the fact they may be at it off camera (they're off camera, like, always) is just a silly way of demonstrating 'if you'd been raised by a genocidal maniac your turn-ons might be a bit unusual'. it might get interesting, maybe, when wanda falls in love with the six-billion dollar dildo in a few issues' time: 'but it's just a machine! you've never wanted to marry the dishwasher have you?!'

14:11 / 14.01.05

I'm not sure its good a point on it's own, after all there was a culture of incest amongst European royals.

Frankly, I don't think Wanda and Pietro have very few cultural reference points. They're utterly isolated and making up the whole thing as they go along.

Their pseudo-royal status goes some to explaining their incestuous relationship in so much as it contributes their sense of isolation, however.

14:12 / 14.01.05

ERNEST BORGNINE FISH! YAY SEAGUY!!!

i didn't even catch that! if that's really the intent, i must give a hearty "AYE AYE!" to Mr. Millar.

Ok, I totally deserved that IC joke, but I don't know about saying incest is fine compared to violence. But that's a whole 'nother issue and really not for this thread. I do see what you mean about no one gets hurt physically, but still...incest, man. Yikes.

they're adults. they're consenting. therefore, it's fine.

it's not incest at all though is it? just raised eyebrows, feverish fanboy imaginings and superheroically dysfunctional families.

not yet, but hasn't Millar said he wanted to spend more time exploring their relationship?

and call me a whack-job, but i would love to see Ultimate Cap catching them in flagrante delicto and having them calmly explain to him that they have a posthuman relationship.

14:18 / 14.01.05

for millar, character development may well mean: 'we've been at it of course! are you shocked yet fanboy? wanking?'

14:19 / 14.01.05

Now that really would be TEH ULTIMATE!!!111!!!

14:24 / 14.01.05

Besides, if the Scarlet Witch was your sister... well, you would, wouldn't you?

Gosh, I'll have to go buy the Ultimates again. It sounds almost as depraved as Brookside, these days.

14:26 / 14.01.05

less violence than in your average episode of brookside, sadly.

14:49 / 14.01.05

>>>ERNEST BORGNINE FISH! YAY SEAGUY!!!

i didn't even catch that! if that's really the intent, i must give a hearty "AYE AYE!" to Mr. Millar.<<<

Somehow I don't think it's a Seaguy reference. It would be funny and flattering if it was, but Millar said he didn't rate Seaguy all that much and he and GM tend to throw barbs at one another now rather than give each other shout-outs.

14:57 / 14.01.05

It is referred to as a particulrly ugly fish.
Perhaps the line is a barb.

15:06 / 14.01.05

Don't know what Millar thought of Seaguy but Page 1 made me think it was a slag when I read it. It kinda pissed me off but hearing opinions here made me wonder if I read it wrong. I guess I didn't.

15:22 / 14.01.05

I feel like it's got to be *some* kind of reference to Seaguy/Chubby, be it praising, neutral shout-out or barb.

The mind of Millar, we do not know...

15:32 / 14.01.05

>>>Don't know what Millar thought of Seaguy<<<

Over on his own board Millar called Seaguy Morrison's "least interesting work" (tied with New X-Men) and said "Brotherhood of Dada: Good, Chubby Da Choona: Bad."

So he's not a fan. Maybe the Ultimates line is a dig, I don't know. Whatever.

15:48 / 14.01.05

Maybe Pietro and Wanda don't have sex whatsoever? The whole isolation theme might go that far. Sex may be seen as crude submission to their animal-human passions. That would be even weirder than incest. Neither of them have ever had an orgasm.

17:27 / 14.01.05

interesting thought, Chad.

We love you Cam! If Millar doesn't like Seaguy then nyah nyah on him!

messages from MM on his board about this arc of the Ultimates:

>> Cheers, mate. Buzz on this issue seems to be very strong. I just got back from England last weekend and saw Hitchy's art for issue five (HUGE fight with someone you might not expect) and I think it's going to put the book right over the top. Hitchy's just is the absolute best at this kind of stuff. Nobody can touch him.

Also saw the art for The Defenders (issue six) and it's fantastic. They're just this really shitty team one of the Ultimates ends up in and they're comprised of Hellcat, Darkhawk, Luke Cage, Son of Satan, Black Knight and someone I can't tell you about yet. But it's a lot of fun and quite a change of pace.

Anyway, glad you're all digging it. We try our best,
MM

>> These guys come back into play in issue four as we get Thor's secret origin from SHIELD. It's not what you're expecting. They're some of the European Union Ultimates and still something of a secret, their powers still being readied.

They play a huge role in Syria and North Korea at the end of this arc. I just saw the art for some of this stuff at Hitchy's last week too and it's stunning. We're starting small, building up all the characters again in their new situations and then just going nuts.

You'll like it as much as Bendis digs large black guys.

MM

17:31 / 14.01.05

another comment from MM himself on the trends at DC from his board...

>> PS Rape is the new AIDS at DC, but there's still hope.
PPS Incest rules at Marvel after Ultimates 2 ish 2?

MM

Haus of Mystery

18:58 / 14.01.05

Yeah, 'cos the guy never uses rape in his storylines.

23:08 / 14.01.05

Can I also just mention how nice it was to see Professor X conducting therapy for Dr. Banner. That in-his-head sequence was very reminsant of the Peter David era Hulk. Also the chit-chat between FURY and Cyclops. Seems like Hytch is using film footage for reference... Though he should be slapped on the wrist for that soulpatch.

rabideyemovement

03:47 / 15.01.05

Wanda and Pietro are twins, right, and I've known a few sets of that twins that close. Still, I hope they are incestuous. Seems I've always had that thought about them in the back of my mind. I think I've seen them acting that cheeky before, maybe West Coast Avengers...

15:28 / 15.01.05

Wanda and Pietro are twins, right, and I've known a few sets of that twins that close.

Really?

Thanks for the heads-up, Finder. Sounds good.
It's got to be Pym who ends up in the Defenders.
Oh, and who is the mystery character, and why the mystery?

01:47 / 16.01.05

I'd guess Namor. Being underwater in this issue and all...

08:40 / 16.01.05

I hope not. I'm pretty sure Millar has described the Defenders as a bunch of losers (see the characters above). Would be doing Namor something of a disservice, methinks.

14:27 / 16.01.05

so namor's the toughie they rassle in ish 5 maybe? would make sense to bring him in as a baddie to start with of course, and would do fury good to realise there's another legitimate terran agency with power and resources to rival/better his own.

14:41 / 16.01.05

I really don't see Namor hanging out with losers like Darkhawk, assuming he actually is the Atlantean king. Sounds absurd to me.

Also, wouldn't Namor/Atlantis be rather a big diversion from what seem to be the core plot-threads - Thor, Loki, Banner, etc...

Surely Namor will be introduced in UFF?

14:47 / 16.01.05

yeah, good points. you'd reckon the same of ultimate galactapuss though innit?

15:51 / 16.01.05

Nah. Galactus is flippin' 'uge. He deserves a series unto himself.

14:37 / 17.01.05

Picked this up today. Apply x2 to most of the comments above.

That full page splash of the Hulk just came out of nowhere didn't it? Add the comments from Fury that Bruce hasn't let the full scope of his impending Texas Grill sink in yet. If Thor doesn't spring him loose does anyone seriously think The Hulk is going to sit by and let some puny humans turn him into ash?

HULK SMASH!

yawn - thing's buddy

15:00 / 17.01.05

actually found some of the story telling a bit tricky to follow this month(i know, how thick can i be?)

scene in the nightcclub was embarrasingly shit. (tho not tricky to follow)

mainstream always seems to get clubs down wrong.

it was all a bit too channel 5) for my liking this time round. (a kind of glammed up children's film foundation logic was at play (that spitting bit was kinda rubbish) or perhaps dramarama with thongs is a better aethetic reference point)

This guff that millar is somehow fleshing out his characters, giving them time to set up
so he can let rrip in ssue five - yawn. The fact that he's plotted a fight for 5 is really, really dull. s'what he did in book one. (or was it six, you know what i meean)

Also - that was a seaguy ref. of course it was.

also - we need a one-off dedicated to fury - cos his personality is beginning to disappear.

still,

enjoyed it all the same.

15:09 / 17.01.05

due to appearances in other ulty books fury is most likely the character we've seen most of (not to say seen deepest into though). his character is basically just exposition and being tough. and y'know, a pimp.

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