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"Stupid" magick, religion and spirituality questions

  
  

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Saturn's nod
11:44 / 20.07.07
I made a first attempt to answer my own question here, but I want to know what other people think.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
12:46 / 20.07.07
Its literal definition is "hidden" and that's what I take from it. Occultism is the study and practice of a variety of things that have been, for whatever reason, "occulted" from the view of the dominant culture that we exist within. This includes the practice of various things consigned to the pejorative waste bin labelled "magic" by the rise of industrialism, but also - and importantly - subtle and internal things about the body and the senses, and our relationship to the natural world around us, that don't really get much of a place in contemporary western culture. It's the study of things that aren't supposed to exist, but seem to. Ways of being on the planet that have been sidelined, airbrushed out, stamped on, left behind, hidden from view, occulted - but which continue to bubble up from the surface no matter how many times they are put to rest, as there is some core or germ of truth there, beneath all of the fuss and window dressing, that speaks to the human heart and is important to the growth and equilibrium of the human species. Occultism is a study of these forgotten and ridiculed areas, in the hope that hidden gems will be revealed of benefit to all.
 
 
illmatic
12:54 / 20.07.07
Yeah. The definition I think of is also "that which is hidden" but not so the powerz that Teh Hatrix is trying to keep us from, and more just simple things about the world, the body, the emotions.
 
 
Unconditional Love
15:50 / 20.07.07
I think the occult suggests the wiring under the board, the forces and powers that work behind the scene defined through a variety of traditions and modern perspectives, science being the most prominent investigation of the occult or occult forces. Revealing what is hidden and theorizing and experimenting to gather results about what is occluded.
 
 
EmberLeo
20:01 / 20.07.07
I understand what is Hidden to be things that no amount of Theory will show you. Theory is important, of course, but the occult is about what you can only find through direct experience. I tend to associate this with spiritual (magical) practice, but then I consider things like being in love, and having an orgasm to fall into this category, too. The fact that a significant portion of the population does indeed find their way behind those particular veils doesn't mean they weren't hidden from understanding to each of us before our first experience revealed the reality of them.

--Ember--
 
 
Papess
23:15 / 22.07.07
When I am meditating, I am noticing something odd is going on with my pupils. They seem to be dilating and contracting rythmically and automatically. I realise this is an automatic function, but this is happening without altering light stimulus in anyway. I know it is not my eyelids, either. Has anyone ever experienced this? I am more concerned about health matters than magickal indications. I have already ruled out the possibility that I have attained the powerz of shooting teh lazarz from meh iz! Any other ideas what this could be?
 
 
EmberLeo
08:29 / 23.07.07
Well, my eyes do that when I'm fatigued, regardless of light levels. I don't specifically remember ever noticing it as a result of altered conciousness, however.

--Ember--
 
 
Evil Scientist
09:02 / 23.07.07
Sorry, question about a question.

Medulla, how do you know they're dilating/contracting? Do you use a mirror in your meditation or can you actually feel it happening?
 
 
Unconditional Love
10:16 / 23.07.07
Is it in rhythm with the breath, as i breath in my face contracts and on the out it expands, perhaps and its a big perhaps the eyes are relating in the same way to the movement of breath. My eyes ever so slightly close when i breath in as well and open just a little on an out breath. I am talking deep breathes here, but the effect may well be more subtle on natural breathing. I would also guess that it depends on how you breath, with the whole body as a movement of contraction and expansion as taught in tai chi, eastern meditation etc or just the lungs breathing, consciously trying to isolate the breath away from the rest of the body. I think it may well have something to do with the body being entrained to the rhythm of the breath, but that is only a guess.
 
 
Papess
12:17 / 23.07.07
Medulla, how do you know they're dilating/contracting? Do you use a mirror in your meditation or can you actually feel it happening?

I feel it, but I can see it too. I know I am not moving my lids, and I meditate with them half-closed (or half open for you eternal optimists) and in a relaxed state. There was an expansion in my vision, and more light let in. Then there was a contraction in my vision and less light.

Well, my eyes do that when I'm fatigued, regardless of light levels. I don't specifically remember ever noticing it as a result of altered conciousness, however.

Ember, I am more concerned that my eyes or brain functions are not working properly. I meditate in the morning when I am well rested, even. Maybe my eyes are having a hard time adjusting in the morning? But, I don't think it is general fatigue. Maybe just eye fatigue? I suppose I should go and see an optometrist.

Wolfangel: I find meditation is much better using whole body breathing, so that is what I do. However, I have never noticed this before, maybe I wasn't paying attention to it, but it is rather "in my face", you know. Rather hard to miss, especially in a quiet state of meditation.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:25 / 23.07.07
I get something like that myself. I've never observed my pupils during meditation or trancework so I don't know what they get up to, but I do get a sort of gentle pulsing variation in the degree of light.

The best thing to do if you are at all concerned is to check in with a doctor, and maybe see an optician too. They sometimes catch things that a GP will miss.
 
 
---
22:17 / 23.07.07
It might just be something wierd that's started happening as your meditation has progressed too, so if you get it checked out and there's nothing wrong, there's probably a good chance that it'll pass. That'll probably happen naturally if you stop paying attention to it (or don't get attached to it, as many Buddhist meditators would probably advise.) and just carry on with your meditation. afaik there's all types of strange things that happen to people as they get better at/spend more time meditating, so it might just be something like that.
 
 
EmberLeo
00:14 / 24.07.07
If you're worried about your health relative to your eyes, and not simply about a potential need for corrective lenses, I suggest you look into an opthamologist rather than an optometrist.

--Ember--
 
 
Make me Uncomfortable
01:34 / 24.07.07
New question:

My practice has become a little slow lately, mostly because things that were new and different practices are now routine.

Things I currently do pretty much daily:
Sing in public
Call IXAT the traffic god to get busses to show up, and praise him appropriately when they do
Recite a few different mantras
Try to look at things in new and different ways
Make sure to smell and touch things


Any quick suggestions to spice things up? Micro-rituals, macro-rituals, critiques of what I currently do?
 
 
electric monk
02:51 / 24.07.07
Lovely spice for the borrowing.

If you're after something meatier, you could start getting a centering ritual of your choice memorized and honed. Or you could start working with a divination tool of your choice. Or turn your focus to a regular schedule of meditation. That's just starters, really.

I feel out of place critiquing your practice based on a few lines of text.
 
 
EmberLeo
19:02 / 26.07.07
I have yet to get bored with a significant focus on Religiously/Spiritually/Magically inspired art and craft projects. I pretty much never run out of inspiration. Quite the contrary - I usually have too many projects in mind.

Studying the tarot towards making your own deck could keep you entertained for years, if that's the sort of thing that interests you. Developing or learning a divination method that works for you is also good, if you're not as interested in the more common methods.

--Ember--
 
 
Unconditional Love
20:41 / 27.07.07
Has anybody engaged with Quimbanda and the Exus, it seems presented in a very different way to Santeria or vodou, has a relation to umbanda some would suggest, but i would not mind hearing of any experiences with Quimbanda in particular.

I have this book coming in the post to get my teeth into Kiumbanda - A Complete Grammar of the Art of Exu
 
 
EmberLeo
22:32 / 27.07.07
I definitely have dealt with various paths of Exu as He manifests in the Umbanda house I am in. I'm told we would be considered a Quimbanda house simply because we are an Exu house, but I doubt other Quimbanda practitioners would say so...

--Ember--
 
 
Unconditional Love
20:21 / 28.07.07
What are your experiences with Exu like? How do they compare to written accounts?

What interests me about Quimbanda is the way in which it seems to incorporate Grimoire like structure into spiritism, Congo based belief, European witchcraft and native south American cosmology. While seeming heavily related too Umbanda. It appears to be a more hands on approach to the latter. Also it seems to be a living traditions that incorporates Romany spirits, the only other information i can gather about Romany deities comes from reference to saint sara la kali. The Romany people become an official peoples in the European union this year if my knowledge is correct. Which will hopefully mean that some more knowledge will become available about Romany relationships to god and spirit work in general and how it fits into the Romany perspective on life.

One website i have read describes Exu and Pomba Gira as like astral police persons, is that close to your experience of Exu? Have you read any of Carol L Dows, Morwyns books based around Brazilian magic, if you have what do you make of them?

A question on another tangent, has anybody heard or seen anything by Michael Tsarion, particular in relation to his notion of the subversive use of sacred symbolism in the media, it strikes me as having conspiracy like overtones but what i have seen was interesting in a round about way, especially in relation to the presentation of corporate logos and advertising, he makes great reference to national and corporate use of astrological symbols and seems to place them in the context of collective memory, the idea being that collective memory creates cues that filter into individual perception, reminds me of the notion of ancestral heritage, How is the notion of possession by ones ancestors say different too experience of remembered past lives or is there an overlap? Ideas like collective memory, Genetic memory, reincarnation, past lives and ancestral worship seem to share a common thread, obviously not the same phenomena but the ideas bear a similar function.
 
 
epona
17:29 / 30.07.07
hello! new question for you voudouisants out there.

i am trying to find someone to connect with for a met tet, that is the reading that helps you figure out who are your patron/matron lwa, correct?

i live up here in new hampshire where there are slim pickins of practitioners, to say the least! there is a santeria house in boston, but i am not sure that is the path i which to take.

you see i have also have been trying to figure out which "flavor" is for me.....santeria, haitian vodou, or new orleans voodoo? perhaps it is due to my 13 year stint in catholic school, but i think i would like to find a path that does not have so much catholic prayer in it. i noticed some of mambo racine's rituals included 3 our fathers and a few hail mary's. i wonder if i could transcend my bad childhood religious experiences into something more positive today? maybe it would be a good method to "reclaim" catholic icons that were profound to me before the poison of organized religion and guilt culture worked its way into my little heart?

though i must say i think it is partially the city of new orleans' fault that i have such a fascination with voodoo. i was mildly interested before my visit as i was a pretty eclectic pagan (mostly of the celtic and native american bent). then i visited new orleans and felt such an intrinsic tie to that city and its energy.....

also i think i did not pursue this as a path for so long despite my interest because of racial issues. upon doing research it seems that being white and practicing a religion originating with the african peoples is not as frowned upon as i feared.

i have heard both good and bad things about mambo racine, and have looked at web pages of both mambo sam and houngan steve.

does anyone have any recommendations, or can anyone give me insight on what i should be looking for in a house, or what i should steer away from?

as an aside, i have just finished reading the book "urban voodoo" by s. jason black and christopher hyatt, phd., given to me by a friend, and i did not like it at all. i found the authors to have a very condescending tone. the author(s) repeatedly made snide comments about other religions, and i have a hard time taking anyone seriously who trashes on other's chosen paths. seems to me to signify a lack of confidence in your own. has anyone else read this book also and found it similar?
 
 
grant
19:40 / 30.07.07
Well, that book also had a fair amount of stuff in that had SQUAT to do with vodun. Hyatt's a Temple of Set character, isn't he? Definitely one of the left-hand Western Occult guys. I think they just thought "voodoo" made for a catchy name for the other stuff they were doing.
 
 
EvskiG
20:49 / 30.07.07
Interesting character, that Hyatt.

His book Secrets of Western Tantra is worth buying solely for Israel Regardie's Reichian exercises. Ignore the rest of the text and everything else he's ever written (except perhaps the Goetia he edited with DuQuette).
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
20:55 / 30.07.07
i wonder if i could transcend my bad childhood religious experiences into something more positive today? maybe it would be a good method to "reclaim" catholic icons that were profound to me before the poison of organized religion and guilt culture worked its way into my little heart?

It's worth pointing out that the cultures which produced these syncretic faiths also had some pretty horrendous experiences with organised religion, like oh say being sold into slavery and forced to convert to your new "masters'" religion on pain of death while your own faith was sidelined at best and brutally suppressed at worst. The icons don't belong to the oppressors.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
23:13 / 30.07.07
Sorry, just realised that might come off as sounding horribly dismissive of your experiences. It really wasn't mean to be.
 
 
EmberLeo
01:15 / 31.07.07
Wolfangel: I'm not ignoring you, but it's going to take me a while to get back to you about Exu. Sorry for the delay.

--Ember--
 
 
illmatic
07:25 / 31.07.07
does anyone have any recommendations, or can anyone give me insight on what i should be looking for in a house, or what i should steer away from?

epona: This thread is kind of a masterclass in degenerative threadrot and flaming, but there are some useful comments esp. Rising and Revolting's on the first page. I'd say look for people you like, who you could hang with socially, who have a sense of humour etc etc.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
08:12 / 31.07.07
To be totally honest, if somewhat controversial, I would avoid looking for a House and simply make your introduction to the Lwa. Who is calling to you the most strongly? Whose voice do you hear most clearly in your heart? That is your best starting point, as opposed to trawling the web for above-the-radar Mambos and Houngans offering initiation. Make your introductions to the Lwa and begin a practice with an honest and open heart, and then have faith that the Powers themselves will guide and direct you towards the Godparents you are supposed to be with (or not, as the case may be, I'm not formally a member of a House and I get along just fine). Place more store on what you feel in your heart, your gut instinct, what feels wrong and what feels right, than anything you read on the internet about these matters.

And yes, you can reclaim the actual Mysteries that are inherent in the images of Christ, the Virgin and the Saints through this sort of practice, in a way that has absolutely nothing to do with organised religion and all the problems that go with it. Possibly to a greater degree than you can imagine at the moment.
 
 
illmatic
10:40 / 31.07.07
Gypsy: If you're doing that, wouldn't it be best to get the Crossroads representative for whichever tradition on side first, or build then into your devotions? To aid smooth communication.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
14:23 / 31.07.07
Well yeah, in terms of practice that goes without saying, but if you are interested in exploring such areas, it is important to look at where that pull is coming from. What is it about these traditions that really calls to you? Who is speaking to your heart? If you are going to follow that call up, then you will need to do so via the crossroads power of whichever tradition they belong to, and start to develop a relationship with them and a relationship with your ancestors.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
14:43 / 31.07.07
you see i have also have been trying to figure out which "flavor" is for me.....santeria, haitian vodou, or new orleans voodoo?

I'd caution against looking for something to sign up to in this way, as I think it almost commodifies it to some extent. My practice is hugely influenced by New Orleans Voodoo, but I don't think you can really practice "New Orleans Voodoo" outside of New Orleans. I don't think you can really practice "Haitian Vodou" outside of Haiti. It is a living tradition and it tends to adapt itself to the place and circumstances where it is being practiced. It is so much about ancestors and place, that - if you are, say, a Scotsman living in Japan and you start practising Voodoo, it would be difficult to keep Scotland and Japan out of what you are doing. It doesn't exist in a bubble. It has to contain a healthy feedback with where you are and who you are, the environment where it is being practiced, the landscape and its mysteries, the ancestors that walk with you personally. This is how such things as Haitian Vodou, New Orleans Voodoo, Santeria, Candomble et al came into being, and how they differ from the cultural forms you will find in places like Benin and Nigeria. Each African Diaspora religion reflects the lives, circumstances, history, landscape, environment, ancestors and culture of the specific people who formed it and sustain it. When these religions travel elsewhere in the world, this history comes with it, but it also takes on new cultural factors wherever else it goes.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:39 / 31.07.07
Roy Medallion: Gypsy: If you're doing that, wouldn't it be best to get the Crossroads representative for whichever tradition on side first, or build then into your devotions?

Gypsy Lantern: Well yeah, in terms of practice that goes without saying, but if you are interested in exploring such areas, it is important to look at where that pull is coming from.

This is v. true and important. See, there are many and varied crossroads powers. I doubt you're the sort to go barking up the wrong axis mundi for long, but it's good to go into the crossroads work with an idea of Who you might encounter out there.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:49 / 31.07.07
"You're" in the above post referring to epona, obvs.
 
 
epona
16:45 / 31.07.07
Sorry, just realised that might come off as sounding horribly dismissive of your experiences. It really wasn't mean to be.

no problem, live things in me, i completely understand what you are trying to say.

thanks gypsy and roy for your thoughts and comments. i hadn't thought about doing this completely on my own. mayhaps it's the organized religion pre-conditioning that makes me think i need to search externally to discover who my spirit guides are instead of empowering myself by asking them directly. but i digress. it sounds like i have some meditation to do.

luckily, i live in a very rural area and there is a crossroads not too far from where i live. i think perhaps a pre-dawn stroll is in order.

i have already made some offerings to papa legba in my yard with very positive results. i do not so much hear him calling me specifically as i find it very easy to just begin speaking/singing to him, but maybe that's enough...
 
 
epona
16:46 / 31.07.07
er, i apologize for messing up your name. probably was a freudian slip of some sort signifying my abhorrent ego-centricity....
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
18:13 / 31.07.07
I quite like that. Live things in everyone else...
 
  

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