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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

Torchwood, Season 2 (NO SPOILERS)

  
  

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Our Lady Has Left the Building
08:37 / 26.03.08
It started off okay but then descended into the kind of mess that someone who had broken their back and was off their face on pain killers would write.

I saw absolutely no reason why Jack would hide the existence of the hospital from Gwen, other than the fact that if he didn't the story would be over at the twenty minute mark. The relationship conversations between Gwen and Rhys would have been better positioned if they had happened before they were married, putting them after doesn't make them seem 'confused' or 'edgy', but two people talking about things that should have been sorted out before they made a commitment to one another.

Even though the thrust of the story was towards Gwen finding out what had happened to the kid and telling Mum I was amazed that she went through with it, and the whole phoning of her policeman friend to 'reassure' the Mum that she wasn't a crazy person, presumably right after she explained she works for a secret government agency, involved with aliens, that her son fell through a rift in time/space and that he's aged and suffered burns and Gwen doesn't even bother to find out exactly how ill he is before taking Mum to see him, then when she says her life is worse now she can't hope he'll come back as he was she doesn't offer her Retcon?

Oh, and with the Rift being dangerous and the Doctor leaving it to casually fuck up innocent people's lives? Thanks Torchwood for making the Doctor seem more of a bastard.

What's frequently messed up this series is that story is driving characters and not characters driving story, hence the pregnant Gwen nonsense and this.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
08:56 / 26.03.08
On the plus side, I think that this is the first episode where it would not be possible to resolve the story more satisfactorily by cutting someone's arm off. However, cutting off the _head_ of any of the major characters would have worked just as well.

Jack keeping the location of the rift refugees' home secret was oddly pointless - you would think that that the rift sometimes takes people and then returns them is the sort of thing you would want your employees, who are notionally there to study the rift, to know - as it is, you just wasted an entire studying montage from Gwen and Tosh to establish something you already know. Also, if it were on the audited accounts, you could possibly make it a bit _nicer_ - which ties in to the question of the mystery of the status and funding of Torchwood 3 (which is not a mystery, really, so much as something that has not really been thought through).

And, having been discovered, would it really have killed him, or the nurse, to say, "Gwen, much as we'd like the consequences of your soft heart to backfire on you, we have a duty of care to Jonah (DO YOU SEE! SWALLOWED BY A RIFT!) and his mother. He spends twenty hours a day screaming. Might be best to try to get his mother here less than three hours and fifty minutes after his last big scream concluded. Just FYI."
 
 
Evil Scientist
09:02 / 26.03.08
Was I the only one who wanted the first thing to be shown after the "One Week Later" to be Jonah still screaming?

Leave me alone, it's been a hectic couple of months. My humour centres are all messed up on coffee and enforced sobriety.

I only saw the second half, but I gather the storyline was basically "Jack fracks about with Gwen's head for no readily apparent reason.". I take it the first half was just a big build of indicators that something hidden and terrible was going on in Torchwood (and not just the scripts, bah-dum-dum)?
 
 
Ex
09:36 / 26.03.08
Was I the only one who wanted the first thing to be shown after the "One Week Later" to be Jonah still screaming?

I'm afraid that I wanted a montage of Jonah involved in therapeutic activities - playing volleyball, making a nice clay sculpture, having a daytrip to the seafront - all with him screaming.

I'm not a nice person. I'M BROKEN.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
13:39 / 26.03.08
Hee hee. You're bad.

Did anyone else notice what they did with the title, "Adrift", where it both evoked the sea-whale-Jonah element and also included the word "rift"? Surely that alone should guarantee some sort of BAFTA?

Hmm, yes, not really thrilled with this one. The Rhys/Gwen argument did seem very out of place as, if they'd not got married just the week before (although God knows where we are in Torchwood time. Especially Rhys going "If you don't blah blah b;ah you and me aren't going to last very long?"
WTF?! No shit Sherlock - you've only been married A WEEK! Even Britney Spears doesn't consider that very long!

I've pretty much decided that without the Doctor - or some other figure who is just as powerful, clever and hard to kill as him (Spike, Martha) - Jack as a character doesn't work. He's got much of the Doctor's power (and "history") with none of the gravitas and *actual* history. I'd like the tragic events to be happening to him now, as we watch - not offscreen or offplanet and hundreds of years ago.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
13:40 / 26.03.08
Tragic events like his arm being cut off.

(Speaking of which, if Jonah's Mum had been looking for her severed limb rather than her lost child, I think it could just have saved the episode. They could have called it "Armless". Do you see?)
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
15:25 / 26.03.08
"Now Jonah, we're going to do some music therapy."

"But Doctor, I scream for 23 hours a day."

"That's not a problem, I've found the perfect song for you. Have you ever heard 'Come to Daddy' by the Aphex Twin."

I like the idea that Jonah's particular brand of crazy is that he's normal but cannot help but scream for most of a day. As presented on screen it would suggest to have a physiological rather than psychological basis. Still, it's believably Torchwood, just as Jack doesn't care about the psychological well being of those of his staff that don't like to play with Little Jack he doesn't care about the wellbeing of any of the refugees in the hospital. And how on Earth does Tosh not know about the hospital?
 
 
Evil Scientist
16:16 / 26.03.08
It's probably policy, stops her falling in love with one of them, who would then die.

Possibly of an arm related injury (I haven't seen Haus's script yet).
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
22:30 / 26.03.08
Torchwood should unionize. And then they should go on strike until Jack starts revealing basic important information about their jobs and Torchwood facilities, so that they can, you know. Do their jobs, rather than constantly spending their time investigating themselves without knowing it.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
01:07 / 27.03.08
One thing that does come out, especially in the ropier episodes, is that not only is Torchwood often written without serious thought about how covert agencies might function, but also apparently without knowledge of how jobs function. Nobody in Torchwood seems to have a job description, or in the case of Gwen actually anything to do, except run around with a gun, which _everybody_ does, regardless of qualification.

It's quite odd.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
09:28 / 27.03.08
No, I have to disagree with you there, Haus: the team members are very clearly labelled as Doctor, Techie, Tea-Boy, Boss and Gwen. It's just that none of them do their actual jobs, they just pretend to for a bit while people are looking. I mean when was the last time you saw Ianto making tea?

Exactly.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
14:23 / 27.03.08
...or Toshiko`s randomly appearing medical credentials? "C'mon touch, we need you to examine the body--" "But Owen's the doctor, why didn't you bring him along?" "Look, don't question me, I have spooky and ill-defined reasons for bringing you and not Owen but I can't tell you what they are. Because of Torchwood."

I swear, actually, that Torchwood's secret premise is to see how much of a random asshole Jack needs to be before Ianto stops shagging him.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
20:51 / 28.03.08
Fucking hell, a bloody good episode! And those are words I didn't expect to be using again in conjunction with this show.
 
 
Poke it with a stick
15:23 / 30.03.08
One thing that does come out, especially in the ropier episodes, is that not only is Torchwood often written without serious thought about how covert agencies might function, but also apparently without knowledge of how jobs function.

What I liked about Fragments is that it gave a pretty good explanation for why Torchwood is such an unmitigated disaster - it's basically a refuge for all the total screw-ups Jack has taken pity on/fancied the pants off of and not the well-oiled alien thwarting machine Torchwood London thought itself to be.

Jack's basically squatting there because there's nobody else left to tell him to find a new job and he's amassing his own little army of waifs and strays who are, at best, annoying doe-eyed do-gooders (Gwen); proficient but socially inept thieves (Tosh); conflicted obsessives (Ianto) and grieving medics who've gone off the rails (Owen). Incidentally, the Haus-patented appendage removal might have worked had the surgeon accidentally sliced his own hand off, rather than the fiance's skull.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
10:19 / 31.03.08
Yep, I liked that one. Gave me hope for the future of the human race - I mean, the finale episode this Wednesday, when I've really fucking stupidly agreed to go to a friend's for dinner. I don't imagine they'll take kindly to my turning the telly on mid-conversation, alas.

Very, very pleased to see Captain John back, and a grown-up Gray/Grey, as well as what looks suspiciously like a story arc that lasts for more than one episode (although admittedly at opposite ends of the series). I've decided that the three Cs are what is mostly desperately missing from Torchwood - consisitency, coherence and continuity, which is ridiculous because it's what Dr. Who does so well (the over-arching theme, thread or threat). Perhaps RTD should not have left the inmates to run the Torchwood asylum after all?

Very chuffed that John and Gray are more than one-episode wonders though. Well done someone with a brain.

On the other hand, how icky was the retconning of Jack and Ianto's attraction to one another, which, let's not forget, was not even hinted at for the majority of the first series (until the infamous "stopwatch" non-sequitur)?
Also:
- C19th Torchwood ladies: OF COURSE they're ass-kicking lesbians. Yawn.
- Spooky Tarot-reading little girl - haven't we seen her, or a character very like her, before somewhere?
- Tosh's theft of secret papers (and building sonic disruptor) would have been much hampered by having had her arm cut off, methinks
- Equally, I would have liked to see a one-armed Ianto trying to catch a pterodactyl
- Captain John seems like the sort of guy who'd cut Grey's arm off just because he was bored, so I have high hopes for next week
 
 
Whisky Priestess
10:24 / 31.03.08
I'd also like to see more of Ianto constantly comparing Torchwood Cardiff unfavourably with its London counterpart, in that sniffy, talking-about-the-perfect-ex kinda way: "Torchwood London never did it like that ... Torchwood London would have remembered my birthday/caught that alien/cut off my arm." (etc.)

And shouldn't Tosh be shit-scared of UNIT (having been imprisoned without trial by them) and therefore show some sort of emotion when Martha said she was working for them a few episodes back?
 
 
■
10:52 / 31.03.08
Spooky Tarot-reading little girl - haven't we seen her, or a character very like her, before somewhere?

Yeah, Jack went to see her at the start of the "Owen becomes Weevil-god" episode.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
22:53 / 31.03.08
I think the 19th Century Lesbians are hampered more by the fact that Jack's introduction to Torchwood seems incredibly tacked on. "Well, we've only got the budget for maybe three period sets, so..." It seems odd, having queer characters charged with preventing invasions by the Other.

On the other hand, how icky was the retconning of Jack and Ianto's attraction to one another, which, let's not forget, was not even hinted at for the majority of the first series (until the infamous "stopwatch" non-sequitur)?

Really? You didn't think it was hinted at? Pretty much the first dialogue relating to the pair of them was the sexual harrassment lines. The attraction isn't the problem for me as much as the abrupt shift between the Cyberwoman murder doom hate and the "Hey, baby, wanna time me?" Part of the problem, as you state, is that it's inconsistent, because I swear each episode takes place in a different universe depending on who's writing that week.

I hadn't really thought about the Tosh thing, but now that you mention it...

Actually, the Tosh/UNIT fiasco fucks up several things, between Martha Jones and all the admin work Jack was making Tosh do for UNIT (back in Greeks Bearing Gifts). On the other hand, at least Tosh got to do something for once. She should cut everybody's arms off and set herself up in Jack's job.
 
 
Mug Chum
00:14 / 01.04.08
Wasn't there a Firefly episode written very much like this one?

So, mistreated prisoners in secret prisons with no rights become excitedly willing to work for/with their glamourously secretive captors and become their buds? "Winning hearts by Stockholm" as a method for winning Wars on Crime and Terror, that could work.

And Past-Torchwood is a state-sponsored agency working in torturing/killing folks sleeping on the street they semi-randomly pick up and shooting inter-gallatic low-level delinquents (possibly pushing "chavs"-type buttons in scifi forms of representations?) in the head with Zero Tolerance? Hardcore kweel!

I've only watched a few random episodes so far, but with this and rapey irksome Owen (and I'm sure some other moments I can't recall), I'm thinking either:

a)I'm not automatically supposed to root for their well-being (and therefore the show is more nuanced than I originally thought, altough I didn't picked up much signals from the show that it's conscious of the disaster this group is) or

b)that the show is somewhat repulsiv--FALL WINDOW FALL!!! Ahm, sorry. But it would be nice if Owen gained part of Jack's power and became the show's Kenny, always resurrecting in the next episode just to be killed right after in new imaginative and painful ways (until eventually you wouldn't even have to mention he resurrected at all -- he'd be just walking through the office and the pterodactyl pulls him up out of frame, and the scene goes on as if nothing happened. And some episodes he'd just shoot himself in the background, in depression avoiding whatever coming death).

And Ianto meeting Jack on a random late-night park cruising was rather... interesting. Ok, still far better than every Jack-Gwen moment I've seen so far.
(And during Ianto's day-after stalking shot of him in front of Jack's car, I swear there was a boombox over his head)

It seems odd, having queer characters charged with preventing invasions by the Other.

Well but I'm not so sure they're reeally "queer" in the sense of the word. It seemed they mostly represent the rather common lesbianism trope that's dressed around the old geek's/scifi's heteronormative male gaze desires (with passing sexy reference to possible inclusion of male parties into what they have). No more depth than is required in porn. "To them, by them" etc.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
06:31 / 01.04.08
True, true. I forget that Torchwood's approach to maturity is that "We're Sci-Fi! But Primetime! So there can be sexy-sex!"

Bloody Torchwood.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
08:55 / 01.04.08
Well, indeed. I think somebody just looked at a script, clutched their head and said "OMG!! We haven't had any superfluous, unconvincing innuendo for at least a page! FIX IT!"
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
12:00 / 01.04.08
ziparrow kent haz wiipuns? But it would be nice if Owen gained part of Jack's power and became the show's Kenny, always resurrecting in the next episode just to be killed right after in new imaginative and painful ways.

"Oh my God, they killed Owen!"
"Yeah, thanks for that."
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:01 / 01.04.08
You know, I could buy into the Gwen/Jack more if Owen was always dying randomly in the background during their scenes.
 
 
Mug Chum
15:46 / 01.04.08
Exactly, they could even make some of the killings into seeexy killings...
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
16:04 / 01.04.08
What, Owen being strangled with lingerie, sort of thing?
 
 
Mug Chum
16:45 / 01.04.08
Nah, probably just the usual killing of the week, but with Goldfrapp's "Ooh La La" playing in the background or something, or somebody making an innuendo before/after he's gone.

(Owen's decapitated head rolls into frame into Tosh's feet)
Jack in cheeky-manner: "Well look who wants to give head now, oh hoho."
(secretly cuts off corpse's hand and runs away -- Adams Family's Thing workforce soon ready)

etc
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
19:15 / 01.04.08
(secretly cuts off corpse's hand and runs away -- Adams Family's Thing workforce soon ready)

Which would dovetail nicely (wretch) with the "Resurrection Gauntlet #2 as Thing" sequence. It could become a leitmotif and people could write papers about it. Not that we want to encourage that kind of thing.
 
 
penitentvandal
20:02 / 04.04.08
Haus...take it away.
 
 
Rev. Orr
23:17 / 04.04.08
No, seriously, was Mr.Chibs reading this thread or has the Hausly one started sharing brainspace with RTD? His arm was a bomb?
 
 
Lama glama
00:02 / 05.04.08
Gray was poorly cast, I thought, but other than that it was an enjoyable finalé. Sure, the melodrama reached Star Wars prequels levels of farce at times, but it wasn't bad at all. I'm disappointed that Owen and Toshiko, who've (arguably) had the most character development this year were deemed unworthy of survival. Their deaths were nicely handled, especially Toshiko's and her recorded farewell surprisingly managed to evoke a somewhat tearful reaction from me. Owen's fade-to-white death leaves it open for his return.

Jack, John, Ianto, Gwen and possibly Martha for season 3?
 
 
Lama glama
00:03 / 05.04.08
Where was the giant goat demon though?
 
 
uncle retrospective
10:34 / 05.04.08
So I stopped watching this on the ep Owen realised he was DEAD FOR LIFE (do you see?!?) Should I bother watching the end of series or is it giant goat demon bad?
 
 
Lama glama
12:09 / 05.04.08
It was actually good. It had the wild inconsistencies in tone we're used to with Torchwood, but it was remarkably coherent when compared to last year's season finalé. After the Owen-centric episodes mid-season, the episodes in between have been a mixed bag. I'd recommend the last two episodes though, as they're Torchwood at its best: silly and wildly over-dramatic.
 
 
uncle retrospective
12:48 / 05.04.08
Cheers. I'll watch them after Who and the new BSG.
I think I'm going to have to use the phrase is it giant goat demon bad a lot more.
 
 
Feverfew
20:38 / 05.04.08
Captain John: Why are you cryofreezing Gray? Surely death would be the release he needs?

Captain Jack: There's been enough death. Plus, if we're renewed for season three, we may need a plot point.

*

Jack: Now we carry on.

Ianto: No, wait, there's another video. It's from Owen.

Dead Owen: Um. Hi, all. I guess I'm dead. If this is the case, please delete the contents of my personal drive in the folder marked "Special Films". Also: Rhys, if you're there, I've had your wife.

*

Apart from that, it was, as has been said, surprisingly good.
 
  

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