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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

Torchwood- Season One Discussion (As It Happens) SPOILERS

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All Acting Regiment

11:19 / 27.10.06

I hope they never explain the pterodactyl, just have it flying about.

I liked this. Not sure what to add, except that it seemed to hold together well, whatever individual weaknesses might have been there. I did think she should have been much more scared of the Weevil. In fact he should have been wearing a big hood or hat or so, and she took it off or something and it surprised her.

I wasn't quite sure about the way the show handled the sex virus, though I'm sure it could have been infinitely worse and it certainly wasn't bad.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

13:02 / 27.10.06

I'm sorry, but I really find it funny that a few on the board are upset about Captain Jack Harkness--see? that bastard always has me typing his full name--being an American. I honestly don't think it has a thing to do with wanting to compete with current American sci-fi shows, or using Barrowman to make it more palatable for its intended British audience. It's just that he was an interesting and compelling character from series one and RTD and company felt like they could do a lot with him.

ONLY NICE THINGS

14:01 / 27.10.06

One person, to be fair - Fianna, who hadn't seen Doctor Who.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:07 / 27.10.06

I think there was one other. I'm pretty sure.

14:08 / 27.10.06

Hey, I'm not going to argue with someone called Kali,(!) but just to clear up :

It's just that he was an interesting and compelling character from series one and RTD and company felt like they could do a lot with him.

That's totally fine, I'm assuming you mean the new Doctor Who series 1 or something, and if I was a fan of this and had seen him before, then I'd surely be happy to see him.

Honestly, it was just me being cynical and thinking that the beeb has tried to get an American in to make it look more credible, but I'm obviously wrong, and feel better about the program knowing that's the case. Apologies to any Harkness fans that I annoyed, and I can't see anything wrong with the guy anyway, so I'll probably end up liking him too.

[addition] I'm also one of these British sci-fi/fantasy fans that's dying to see a British sci-fi/fantasy series that's original as possible, not a spin-off from anything else, and something that manages to work with British lead actors/actresses, (or at least the main lead chars anyway.) so that's the root of where my whining (I repeat, I was whining, admitted!) came from. I just hope that we can manage to do this at somepoint, because we surely have the talent to pull it off, but that's a whole other gripe, and in the meantime I'm completely fine with watching this and other American stuff anyway, because I'm a huge fan of this type of thing.[/end addition]

Arghh, hopefully the thread can move on now.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:08 / 27.10.06

Moving on.

ONLY NICE THINGS

14:13 / 27.10.06

I think there was one other. I'm pretty sure.

Nope - just Fianna, by the looks of it.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:30 / 27.10.06

Hence the moving on, Haus.

Still haven't had a chance to watch the 2nd episode.

Kiltartan Cross

14:31 / 27.10.06

Honestly, it was just me being cynical and thinking that the beeb has tried to get an American in to make it look more credible, but I'm obviously wrong, and feel better about the program knowing that's the case.

Oh, I don't know. I'm sure they weighed up the pros and cons of having an American lead right back before he appeared in Who; it will have been a deliberate decision to introduce a "cool character to head the planned spin-off".

On the subject of standing on the roof, wasn't he doing just that at some point in The Empty Child? Standing on Big Ben or summat? He does have some claim to hang about on the skyline. And maybe he just likes the view?

(I also seem to remember there being a few rooftop-staring bits ("King of the World!") in Queer as Folk, so if it's copied, it's not being copied from Angel or whathaveyou so much as from RTD's earlier stuff.)

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:35 / 27.10.06

Oh, you're talking about the slow-dancing on his anchored spaceship near Big Ben in "The Empty Child."

Perhaps Jack is an acrophiliac.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

15:13 / 27.10.06

Maybe he just likes the view.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

15:31 / 27.10.06

Because it makes him feel like a superhero.

16:10 / 27.10.06

Hey, that's why I do it.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

16:27 / 27.10.06

Do you wear the outfit too?

Kiltartan Cross

17:30 / 27.10.06

Mmm, period military.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

17:44 / 27.10.06

Very hot.

Or is that just me?

04:12 / 28.10.06

I've only just seen the episodes and I thought they were fun, though not brilliant. Very reminiscent of Angel's first season. Jack needs more screentime, though.

My favorite reference to Doctor Who was probably the echo of the Christmas Invasion music playing when Jack was cradling The Hand. Or the invisible lift where the Tardis was parked.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

06:14 / 28.10.06

Charlie Brooker reviews Torchwood.

10:51 / 28.10.06

From that review:

Cute and dark, sweet and sour, up and down. It's like tuning in to watch Deadwood, only to discover they've replaced Al Swearengen with the Honey Monster.

It's what the world is waiting for.

I'm also one of these British sci-fi/fantasy fans that's dying to see a British sci-fi/fantasy series that's original as possible, not a spin-off from anything else, and something that manages to work with British lead actors/actresses, (or at least the main lead chars anyway.)

Ultraviolet was the last thing I can think of (which, as has been noted, this borrows heavily from). Ever since they cancelled Classic Who the Beeb has been notoriously unwilling to risk any sci-fi outside of CBBC. The problem was that all of the sci-fi that they did that is still well-liked today (Who, Blake's 7, Red Dwarf) is still seen by the majority as "crap rubber aliens running around a gravel pit". Which is not inaccuarate but ignores the fact that with a little willing suspension about the SFX the storylines were high-quality. Well, except for Delta and the Bannermen.

It may be because I have seen Doctor Who but (and, let's face it, this is furious fanwanking here) I'd assumed that Jack's American accent was something he used to cover the fact that he's "not from around here". Pretend to be the foreigner so that anything odd you say just gets written off as cultural differences.

Thing is, this is a spin-off from a show which has technically only just finished it's second season (without them accessing Classic Who characters). They were kind of limited on popular recurring characters that could be transplanted across. Part of the attraction of a spin-off is seeing a supporting character or two grow and develop as main characters (Wesley in Angel and O'Brian in DS9 spring to mind).

12:47 / 28.10.06

Obviously Ultraviolet was a C4 production.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

13:05 / 28.10.06

Dammit--because Torchwood occupies my thoughts asleep or awake--I just thought of something else. For all of Torchwood's technology, the most effective way of catching the Weevil was tackling it all at once and putting a bag over its head? And how did Torchwood Two acquire the Doctor's hand from Torchwood One? Did they find it amongst the detritus from the Dalek/Cybermen war?

Somebody's going to tell me to lay down, aren't they?

14:31 / 28.10.06

As an aside I'd like to see a DVD release for Invasion: Earth - It was BBC TV SF that came out of BBC Scotland, ran to six parts and I'd like to see it again...

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:39 / 28.10.06

Have to Wikipedia that one, never heard of it.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:41 / 28.10.06

Apparently, sleaze, Invasion: Earth was released on DVD here in the States.

20:59 / 29.10.06

SQUEE for the trailer...

Didn't want to talk about the first two episodes because I wanted to love this series and after the double bill I didn't but it looks like it's starting to eke into it's potential now

dodgy sex predator Owen becoming the avengening spirit of Justice (and moving into Gwen's role of caring about/being involved in humanity)
and the horrible stupid farce of the final killing...I almost couldn't believe they'd just done that. POOR Gwen, give the girl a break from causing all the grief

(too much running, too much gunplay, too much het Jack and rubbish comforting at the end but apart from that thoroughly enjoyed)

Does Ianto get something to do next week? bit rich him slugging down whisky at the end, maybe he'd foiled a seperate alien invasion on his way to the take away?

21:10 / 29.10.06

I'm looking forward to Helen Raynor's two parter in season 3 of Doctor Who after watching tonight's episode. I thought it was excellent and really tightly plotted and executed. At the time, I thought Owen arriving at the same time as Bernie (Burny?) was pretty ridiculous, but fortunately Raynor justifies the coincidence later on in the show. Anything less probably shouldn't be expected from somebody who constantly spends her time editing and plugging the plot-holes of other people's scripts.

There were a few cringe-worthy moments: "Jack's "NOOOOO!" was horrific, as was the slightly misjudged music during Owen's chase scene with Burny. Another dodgy Owen bit: His gurning during the murder of Lizzy Lewis really distracted from the horror and truth of the moment and I'm ashamed to say I couldn't help but laugh at how ridiculous he looked. I was slightly disappointed that Ianto was window dressing again this week, with what..four lines of dialogue, but next week looks like we'll finally see him doing something other than delivering people's food.

Jack and Gwen's erotic gun montage was risible, but I still found myself enjoying it, especially the beginning. It's obvious that Gwen will be embarking on the affair that RTD won't stop talking about, with Jack.

Also: "Coughs and sneezes spread diseases!" I love the little details that the set dressers put into this and Doctor Who.

Kiltartan Cross

22:03 / 29.10.06

"I've seen things you wouldn't believe..."

*ahem*

Thought this one was a definite improvement, and the range scene almost had me diving for the back of the sofa with Gwen swinging that gun around. Loved the bit where they were sat around eating pie on the job. I'm unconvinced on the "hey, this alien macguffin is too powerful for us (and it's the end of the episode) so let's just throw it into the X-Files bin" resolution; it's kinda cool that they'd just lock it up, but it felt more like they had to to satisfy the scriptwriter. Pretty cool though.

ONLY NICE THINGS

23:35 / 29.10.06

I'm sad to say that I didn't get a lot out of that. Owen's conversion from happy-go-lucky date rapist to avenger of the ladies might have worked better if he showed any awareness of what he was doing in episode 1, and indeed if he had a character at all, beyond "twatty and looks a bit like Lee Evans". There's really not a lot to suggest either that he is acting out of character by going all stabby mcknifeloon, because I don't really have a sense of what his character is.

The same applies to Tosh, to Ianto.. Gwen's a bit better, and Jack has already got some backstory, but his portrayal is also currently a bit bewildering. Three episodes into a series I should have a better idea of what makes the characters tick. What motivates Tosh, beyond the chance to cross-reference somebody's face against CCTV records?

So, that's a problem, really. Some good set pieces - the absurd gunnery range flirtation (Torchwood-branded ear protection, which rocked), the memories of Gwen and Rhys - were let down by a flabby script that did nothing to develop the characters and depended far too much on protracted chase/race sequences and supporting characters.

The other thing is that Torchwood appears not only to be outside the United Nations, but also any training at all. Can't find someone? Have a pasty. Finally catch someone? Have a pint, debrief them in the pub and then wander off, having apparently lost interest in them, depsite having identified alien technology and coins in front of them. Once more, everyone feels free to borrow technology, despite 1.1, and nobody seems to have any sense of their being any kind of procedure or incentive to obey orders. Did Captain Jack specifically ask for a team who are prone to stealing artifacts and stabbing people, or is he very unlucky with his HR?

Ah, well. Trailers for the next episode look promising - some actual fighting and a bit less Rockliffe's Babies.

09:09 / 30.10.06

What Haus said. It really is Amateur Hour for paranormal investigation teams. I mean, they're a real shower: Gwen takes the toys home even when you know it's a bad idea, Owen goes off on some bizarre vendetta to prove to the viewer he has a heart, Tosh has become "the boring one" again... and Jack doesn't need to sleep, he just stays up all night shooting stuff because the others wouldn't buy him an XBox.

As paranormal thriller, it's worryingly un-thrilling. Some highlights, though; I thought the Gwen/Rhys flashbacks were really good, if only for how underwritten and "normal" they were - compare that to the hyperbole and excitement that Jack and the writers love to throw around, and it's quite a highlight.

But there's still too much of people Telling Us Things We Can See With Our Eyes ("he's claustrophobic", but surely, if he doesn't like going OUTSIDE, he's agoraphobic, right? Or do claustrophobes get so afraid they stay where they are?)

I hope the next one picks up. Unfortunately, watching the trailer, it seems to be an episode that explicitly ties into the Whoniverse. I've actually already forgotten that TW is a Who spin-off; the Cybermen were suitably spooky and unnerving in Who, but in Torchwood, I fear it'll all be a bit silly.

Charlie Brooker's review isn't bad, really. It very much feels like a kid's show with some grown-up trappings. The viewer is always smarter than the characters; the fuckups are always totally obvious. And it's not scary enough.

This was something I feel Ultraviolet (sorry to drag it up again) got spot on: it presented horrible things straight-up. And, most notably, the horrors it presented were, pretty much, horrific regardless of whether or not they involved vampires. The supernatural elements took horror, and made it uncanny.

And no matter how spooky or mysterious Torchwood is, or how many rubber monster-suits they make, they completely fail to capture the uncanny. Last night's episode was a prime opportunity to do so, and I found it very perfunctory.

10:35 / 30.10.06

Not particularly impressed with this one. The story had a bit of potential but was only entertaining in parts.

I quite enjoyed the Gwen moments (although her graudating from never firing a gun to John Woo two-gun action overnight was a little hard to swallow). It's nice to see that they're developing her relationship with her boyfriend and presenting him as a relatively nice guy rather than as a dick in the mold of Micky (circa episode 1 of Who).

Her ditching him to run off with Jack will have me slamming my face into the ground repeatedly.

Owen's little vigilante moment could be argued away by him being truamatised by sharing the thoughts of a rape/murder victim. But yeah, it would have been nice if someone had drawn a parallel between drugging people up with love-dust and what happened under the bridge all those years ago.

They described Ianto as their clean-up man. So why couldn't we at least have a moment with him threatening/mind-wiping Burny? Still, looks like next week's episode will have a bit more of him in it.

Can I get a Cyber-Yeah?

Whisky Priestess

16:43 / 30.10.06

I will personally write a letter of protest to RTD, the BBC and my MP if Gwen gets off with Jack.

Surely our twisty-turny little Russell wouldn't do something so cripplingly obvious? Surely? It must be a red herring, right? Please?

My money's still on Ianto as her love interest, with Toshiko as an outsider. And if that's not right, I'd rather be wrong. Or something.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

17:11 / 30.10.06

("he's claustrophobic", but surely, if he doesn't like going OUTSIDE, he's agoraphobic, right? Or do claustrophobes get so afraid they stay where they are?)

I noticed that too- I'm pretty sure the word "claustrophobic" was only used the first time, then "agoraphobic" thereafter- I'm assuming that was just a fuck-up.

20:49 / 30.10.06

I just like Ianto. Not in 'that' way, although if Ianto/Jack slash fiction's not already been written I'll eat my hat, but I like his presence in the background at the moment as, well, the one who sorts everything out without the big four knowing what's going on...

I'm talking utter trash, I suspect. I just like the idea of a Torchwood Civil Servant.

Tryphena Absent

21:09 / 30.10.06

I like Ianto too. He's a bit like Bunter. Dear Russell, please make him Bunter.

21:15 / 30.10.06

How can anyone like Ianto as a character - all he done is bring in refreshments...

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