Moving over from the Barbannoy thread, following Papers lead.
If you follow most of the links on the search results(new window), a good portion of those, when followed, have what I'm talking about, what I percieve to be use of the word “misogyny” when it seems “sexism” would be more appropriate. I will still reiterate that while I believe this distinction is real, doesn’t mean I’m sure I’m right about the particulars. I mean, I feel right enough to say something, obviously, but I welcome and encourage other thoughts on this, please.
So, for links.This very thread, Feminism 101, was started by Nina, saying,
some posters think it's acceptable to generalise women or claim that misogyny isn't a problem when they are the people using sexist language. The argument tends to be that they have personal evidence that some women behave in a specific way in certain situations.
That sentence may not be the best illustration, though, because I’m not sure if Nina is saying that the posters claiming misogyny is not a problem and using sexist language are actually misogynistic. If she is, I may disagree, though I certainly can’t say, without knowing the context, so I hit the links above her statement. John, the boy from the future said something that could certainly be construed as sexist, but I don’t think it crosses into misogyny, from what I can tell. In the Fathers for Justice thread linked to, Nina does distinguish the two terms here:
You've generalised an entire women's rights movement and actively denied that women are sometimes treated less fairly than men. That's sexism. You're unwilling to admit to yourself or anyone else that in some circumstances women are treated better and in others men are treated better. That's sexism.
The misogyny was here: it's also a fact that mom will illegally keep dad from kids, and because of the way the laws are set up, dad can do little. The use of the word fact shows more than simple bias against women.
Now, with Shadowsax, those posts certainly smell more like misogyny to me, the deeply thought-out justifications of resentment bullshit. Paying some faint lip service to feminism, always with a caveat. He didn’t write it (that I read), and it may be unfair, but I could just imagine him muttering about “bitches” or some such as he interacted here.
Okay, some others. The Woman-friendly Barbelith thread has many hits on these terms, and without linking to every instance, if that’s okay, may I say again that there are a number of times where I feel that “sexism” may be more appropriate than “misogyny”.
The Misogyny and sexism: are women to blame?
thread, which I would have thought might address this issue, really made no distinction at all, except who cares saying:
Can we define misogyny for the purposes of this thread? Because, much like homophobe, it's one of those words that often seems too strong to fit some of the people it's thrown at. but never really seeks to delineate it from sexism.
Elene says here:
On the other hand I'd be saddened if, for example, we considered the Feminist 101 thread and did not become on average more aware of the misogyny on the board, but misogyny here doesn’t disturb me more than in society at large, and actually considerably less than in the workplace
Again, no real big deal and I know it’s been a big debate at times, the climate on the board. But I can’t imagine how one could truly perceive this site as having a prevalence of misogyny rather than (arguably) sexism.
I suppose the reason I feel that this is important enough to mention is not to be a grammar cop or to say people are wrong, but I think that sexism and misogyny, while closely related, are not the same; it may be more helpful in the end when discussing these subjects to make these distinctions so that each term is more clearly understood when it is used. It’s kind of like the distinction between the words stupidity and ignorance, words that are more commonly used by most people and more commonly confused (not here, I might add). They are also more disparate terms, really, but maybe illustrative?
God my writing is extra choppy today. I hope this is helpful, and I'd spend more time on this, but I've got to get a starter in a truck before it gets dark and really cold. I promise to come back. |
