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Underground > Policy & Help >

What exactly does get you banned on Barbelith?

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12:44 / 09.08.06

I don't think anyone is or has been arguing for banning Dragon, or censuring Dragon, because he's right-wing... but because his disagrement is based on racist and Islamophobic rubbish.

I'm a little late here, but to what degree are "right-wing" (or more specifically, "conservative", as opposed to for example a radical libertarian right-wing view) and "racist and Islamophobic" separable in this context? I'm finding it hard to see how positions beyond a certain position on a spectrum of views could not be racist, much as I'm unable to see, for example, how a "conservative" position on teh gays could be distinct from simple bigotry. Is there a more conservative position than, say, elene's on immigration that doesn't draw on nasty, nasty things?

17:21 / 09.08.06

In the case of the immigration issue, there are arguments to be made for limiting or reforming US immigration policy that are not based on racism or xenophobia, but on economic protectionism. If Dragon were making them, I'd be a little more inclined to take him seriously.

But they're a little dry, they require a reasonably strong understanding of corporate profit structures and international trade, and they lack the immediate gut-punch appeal of "Mexicans cannot be trusted because, through no fault of their own, their character is shaped by their nation's culture of corruption."

08:34 / 14.08.06

>Islamophobia
has been mentioned a few times regarding posting, is this the right place to say i find this term very unhelpful?

a phobia is an irrational fear of an object or idea leading to patterns of high anxiety in it's proximity or behavioural or cognitive avoidance of that thing,

the present pervasive antipathy towards islam in the west is a result of centuries of historical, ecomonic and military processes that have led to a discourse about Us (the modern enlightened tolerant West) vs Them (medieval, repressive violent Muslims). Dislike of or fear of Muslims is quite rational if you buy into the core arguments and historical ideas that the US and UK use as a smokescreen for their ecomonic prgrammes of resouce capturing. i think it is as unhelpful a phrase as 'negrophobia' might be to describe racists, or homophobia to describe people who have strong dislikes of lesbians and gays. it obscures more than it illuminates iow. might be best described as racism really as that is basically what it is.

10:19 / 14.08.06

Except that Islam isn't a race, and anti-Muslim sentiment tends to extend across ethnic distinctions, lumping Arabs and South Asians together.

12:04 / 14.08.06

i agree haus, and 'islamaphobia' also involves white converts to islam but the creation of an outgroup with the baggage of a set of supposed characteristics that is threatening to the host nation is basically racism, and anti-muslim sentiments are clearly hiding racist ideologies in many instances(for example the BNP is now more vocally anti-muslim because outright racism is not well tolerated in this country). mind you i really don't like the phrase homophobia either, for similar reasons, unless it is used in the title of a particularly ggod simsons episode and spelt homer-phobia.

13:50 / 14.08.06

Except that Islam isn't a race, and anti-Muslim sentiment tends to extend across ethnic distinctions, lumping Arabs and South Asians together.

The underlying assumption behind UK and US foreign policy at the moment seems to be; that it's all right to stand by and watch a nation state's infrastructure be torn to pieces (at least when not actively contributing to said efforts,) just as long as the population concerned happen not to be white.

Religion doesn't seem like the issue, so much as the idea that dark skin matters less than pale.

It won't be resolved any time soon, but that's basically the problem.

07:15 / 15.08.06

I'm not sure it's ethnicity as much as it is general alienness - it's okay for people to be in conflicts if the contexts of their conflicts make it harder to directly idenfity with them. That is to say if they're a funny colour, or a different religion or live in deserts or jungles or seem to live in huts or don't like Britney or speak in words that sound like they're speaking in tongues or whatever. All these things allow people to think that there's something profoundly different about the people concerned that somehow makes them less civilised, more prone to violence etc.

Goodness Gracious Meme

12:51 / 15.08.06

It *is* general alieness, certainly, but most apparent/easily caricatured 'evidence' of difference is via visual cues eg skin colour/'alien' appearance/dress/costume, I'd say. See the whole fucking unpleasant 'towel head' taxonomy...

Goodness Gracious Meme

22:36 / 16.08.06

Been wondering where to put this, but I want to point out that 33 seems to be making a bit of a speciality of insulting those ze percieves to be f-identified posters. There was a dig at Flowers, and now one at Miss Wonderstarr

This is really fucking unpleasant and I want to see if I'm the only person who thinks some warning (more than I've done on that thread) is warranted, as I think it is.

22:47 / 16.08.06

No, you're not. I just posted there because reading him is utterly depressing.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

22:48 / 16.08.06

I'd certainly think so.

*

22:49 / 16.08.06

It wasn't just making fun of hir name— "so what size are you" following that is plainly harassment and against board policy. I can't support tolerating this any longer; let's move.

Goodness Gracious Meme

23:05 / 16.08.06

Agreed. This it out and out mysogynistic harassment. Shall I drop him a pm?

23:06 / 16.08.06

Do it.

23:09 / 16.08.06

If his mode of delivery wasn't so very inept I'd find it even more loathsome. As it is it's beginning to make me a little weary. The thread itself was in the crapper long before and now it's just another ugly little blight on the board.

Yes, please, pm him, someone, just so I don't feel compelled to it.

Goodness Gracious Meme

23:12 / 16.08.06

guys: stoatie/id/df, if any of you are still about, mind if I send you the PM, so we have it for reference and someone else has seen it before I send it?

23:13 / 16.08.06

PMs were ignored before, he's not going to suddenly start listening now.

We've got a fairly clear repeated pattern of behaviour here. The most sensible option would be to ensure that he can't post again.

miss wonderstarr

23:14 / 16.08.06

I did flag that up in the Moderation Requests thread. Wasn't really sure how to respond on a personal level, but in board/community terms I think it's entirely right that this kind of behaviour is nipped before it's allowed to be seen as acceptable.

23:15 / 16.08.06

Throwing up a hand for action to be taken against 33. Preferably in the style of Robert Patrick. Knives, stabbing weapons and swords.

It really is nasty stuff he's posting now. Some of us, I reckon, wanted to believe his comments about the homos was a product of bad judgement or bad grammar. But it's not is it?

23:17 / 16.08.06

Question tho: why does yet another of these people appear 30 seconds after we nip the last one? It's like dealing with the fucking borg and I for one won't deal with an endless parade of foul mouthed Patrick Stewarts.

Goodness Gracious Meme

23:21 / 16.08.06

Just logging here that I've pm'd 33, as well as cc'ng the pm to several other posters, and have pm'd tom alerting him to these last few posts.

*

23:43 / 16.08.06

Should we start an accusation/apologia thread like for ShadowSax, or did that not go down so well?

Goodness Gracious Meme

23:46 / 16.08.06

Personally, I think we should wait for Tom to see my pm and comment. But that does need to happen soon.

and/or 33 to comment here. But I don't hold out much hope of that

a)happening
b)being of any use

23:59 / 16.08.06

Also, see here.

01:12 / 17.08.06

I have read the thread in question, had suffered through his "teh homos are taking over real men's fashun" nonsense, and see no use or hope for 33. I support a movement to ban--the case seems much more clear cut than the Shadowsax one, to me, and I don't think should require a thread. His contributions have not been nearly so extensive and complex as Shadowsax's were.

01:59 / 17.08.06

If it comes to voting, I'd stand behind a ban. He's offensive, incoherant, disruptive, and seems to be resisting any attempts by board members to meet him halfway.

And, for the record, he made a positive statement about W*rr*nt in the Slayer thread. Ban. Him.

Goodness Gracious Meme

02:04 / 17.08.06

In case it's not clear, I agree entirely with alas.

02:38 / 17.08.06

He's burned through any goodwill I may have once had towards him. I'll not be sorry to see him go, if it comes to that.

03:00 / 17.08.06

Add another log to the ban-fire. The creep's gotta go.

*

04:08 / 17.08.06

why does yet another of these people appear 30 seconds after we nip the last one?

They've heard rumours about those stylish "BANNED! ON! BARBELITH!" t-shirts we've been giving out.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

05:10 / 17.08.06

Damn, and I was thinking the message was starting to get through and he was tidying his act up in the Humpty Dumpty thread in Conversation. Oh well...

33

06:06 / 17.08.06

by the way i realise now i jsut pressed the self fucking destruct button by referring to her whatevers as knockers..
I should of known that that was no no and degrading and that any reference to apologise about something i referred to was pointless given the thought of it is offensive in the first place..

for record ..this little thing about me being off topic ?

well it was miss w who actually made a comment that bore no relation to my thread in the first place and it has been her lady also that has been consistnetly making off topic sarcastic references to my previous threads in some way to get all my fans out here started or satisfy myself..

You do not seem to consider any of these things and thats only the tip of the iceberg..

I dont see the need to defend what wasnt intended to be offensive , you create meaningless wars if you like i apologised to her but no doubt you will reason this as means to avoid being banned..

You can do what you like then as im sure you will but your objectivity in the matter went out the window ..

i could make a clear case for harassment right off the mark amongst other comments made by so called mods here that conviently slipped through your all so seeing eyes..

wanker so forth
question on intellegince so on etc etc

Also for every negative here i note no mention of the positives or the so called attempts you think i should make as with the case in the noise thread..

If you ask me i think what bothers you all the most is the fact i am not a troll or anything tab you can give reason to fit too ..the fact you live in such singluar world with singluar rules is obviously a major flaw exposed glaringly if it takes over a month or so to debate what sort of person I am..

Didnt you know ?

i am human

33

06:17 / 17.08.06

By the way I siad her if someone wants to be offended they will be offended ..

In reference to her lady she has proved that , i give crdit to other like paranoid writer who do otherwise but for her I can see no point..

Much like i see no point in what is obviously a popular decision..

No wonder you all come here , I thought i was in bad way with my health and all but if you live your life in the same way you display yourself here you truly must be fuckin miserable and i actually encourage you to bann me if it helps jsut so you know that i actually care enough to let you have that 5 mins before you life becomes fucking miserable again ..

OH and that was bad enligh with no full stop ..

thats another one for the bad guys right ?

Although i hate the damm word - whatever

Jake, Colossus of Clout

06:21 / 17.08.06

Gosh.

33

06:27 / 17.08.06

My final little point is that you hypocrites for while you accuse me of being a troll , this and that it is clear form the popularity of threads in the film / tv section -s specifically BIG BROTHER - sheesh

That you are also hypicrites too considering the amount or lewd , unintelligent , fuck driven pathetic piecies of so called human clones that find their way into your meaningfull lives..

- what you aint got enough drama of you own ?

Point is like i was saying that while you feign dsigust at me for little more than being unspecific at times or tongue in cheek you appauld all out vulgarity and unimaginative predictability

And you do so by talking about it hence the posts..

Ahh but thats entertainment , it aints real right ?

Well guess what so is this ..

No one in this forum will figure in my life or be part of it or help , care give a shit one way or the other what happens your just there to satisfy yourselves for your own reasons the same way i am .. the trounble is you cant handle it when some else reaonsons are clear enough defined for your to know how to respond..

bit like a computer huh ?

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