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X3

  
  

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PyD
06:50 / 02.06.06
She couldn't phase in the presence of Leech, remember?
Yeah but she didn't need to be anywhere near Leech in that fight, cross-cutting to Leech listening to the sounds of the Juggernaught crashing through walls would have added the requisite tension. The moment was between Kitty and the Juggernaught with their fairly diametrically opposing powers. Leech was irrelevant to their fight other than a end goal.
Similarly to the Phoenix powers being so badly set up by the writers to the extent that they realised they couldn't have her do anything during the main fight I think they had Kitty and Leech in a room with the Juggernaught on his way, realised that no one would ahve their powers and insetead of goign back and changing things phoned in the most boring cheesiest and only resolution they could come up with.
The general level of how 'first-draft, no thought' most of the character and event moments in the film came accross just makes me sad.
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
10:31 / 02.06.06
Shows what you know. Kitty Pryde's not just about phasing, her defining characteristics are her resourcefulness and bravery (and her cute nose, I guess). Having her go after Juggernaut, get suddenly depowered and take him down with split-second strategy and timing is classic Claremont Shadowcat. Loved it.
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
10:46 / 02.06.06
But the film was, by and large, bloody awful. Wolverine taking over Cyclop's narrative arc in the Phoenix story, despite barely having time to develop a crush on her. The script needed a serious polish to remove clunky dialogue. Ratner's awful, awful framing/blocking meant that so many scenes were laughably put together (the worst of which was when Xavier, Logan and Storm are approaching Jean's parents' house to find Phoenix, and suddenly Magneto steps into shot three feet away from them, unspotted until that moment. Then five seconds later, as they all move towards the house, we see it crawling with Brotherhood. I'm sorry, are we to assume that they were invisible up until that point? And that Wolverine had a cold or something? Pathetic). Why did Madrox give himself up to be the decoy, knowing he'd be a likely candidate for depowering? Why would anyone? Why did Magneto just sit there and watch the big battle at the end, instead of helping out with his HARDCORE POWERS OF MAGNETIC DOOM? I understand him not being able to control Phoenix, but why just watch - isn't he actually trying to win? Why introduce Bolivar Trask when you've just prevented any chance of Sentinels ever appearing by having them be an invention of the Danger Room? Why introduce Colossus and Angel if you don't have sufficient FX budget to make the former look cool (ditto the awful CG for Iceman) and you're not actually going to use the latter at all?

Kelsey's Grammer's Beast was great. I've always liked James Marsden as an actor, in and out of the X-movies, so it was no surprise to me how good he was in this, albeit briefly. Jackman did well, as usual (although the NOOOOO! at the end was tragic), as did the future Mrs Famke Hellbunny. But what a waste of time, otherwise.
 
 
PyD
11:58 / 02.06.06
Having her go after Juggernaut, get suddenly depowered and take him down with split-second strategy and timing is classic Claremont Shadowcat.

Totally agree with the first sentiment of her going up against him. It a great juxtapositon. But the climax is cinmatically weak. If Claremont had written it and Byrne had drawn it from a dynamic angle with a big old Sound FX word across the panel it could have looked cool. But being true to the spirit of Claremont in this case is bad cinema, it looks dull, it feels dull, and its lazy cinema writing.
And personally I feel having her pahse leap though him and take his helmet would have shown her as brave, resourceful, and requiring of split second timing. That and it could have looked good on screen cause the cinema is about motion. The ducking action is very much about the frozen moment within the drawn sequence.
Full theatre and it didn't even get a chuckle.
 
 
FinderWolf
15:26 / 02.06.06
But hey, Chris Claremont's and Stan Lee's cameos were titanic!

(at least this movie Stan got a cameo that was more than a split-second...well, in FF he did get to speak)
 
 
FinderWolf
15:36 / 02.06.06
Apropos of nothing, I did enjoy the use of the old-school orange NY license plates as a time-establishing device at the beginning of the 'let's meet the kid Jean Grey' sequence.
 
 
---
16:14 / 02.06.06
I feel that I've been a bit out of order saying that the film made me so pissed off, (even though it did.) and not adding much else.

When looking back at it I enjoyed quite a lot of the film, and think that some of it was done really well, it's just that for me Jean was always my favourite character, and it really got to me when I saw how her storyline in this film seemed so average. I think that the way they wrote her character here, or the lack of what they put in for her, made this film fairly good when it could have been pretty outstanding.

When the box set comes out with all 3 films I think I'll buy it anyway, and might even go back and watch this again at the cinema. If I didn't like the X-Men so much I probably wouldn't, but I do so I might go back and see it one more time.
 
 
PatrickMM
20:19 / 02.06.06
David O. Russell making an Emma Frost film!

This news just confuses me, Russell is a fantastic filmmaker and Emma's one of the best X-Men characters, but I never thought I'd see Russell doing a film like this. If he's given free reign, there's a ton of potential there, but I'm not really sure what direction he'd approach the character from. Would it be adventures in the Hellfire Club, or more of a Grant era Emma?

That article also mentions that they're working on a spinoff about the kids at the school. I think there could be a good Rogue/Kitty/Bobby/Colossus film, I hope it's not a movie about just random kids at the school that we haven't met yet.
 
 
PatrickMM
20:20 / 02.06.06
Here's the proper link. The one above should be fixed soon, but in case you catch it before that here it is.
 
 
FinderWolf
20:55 / 02.06.06
Emma Frost movie news: soooo weird.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
21:01 / 02.06.06
Emma Frost illustration- so, well, dodgy...
 
 
FinderWolf
02:34 / 03.06.06
from a recent Newsarama article:

>> [at the Philly comic con, Quesada was on a panel discussion, and...] When asked about X3, Quesada said that the movie was a lot of fun and a good X-Men story. "Sure, it had some holes," Quesada joked, "But hey, so do the comics." Over 40 years of monthly stories, Quesada said alter, there will always be things that don't fit together as tightly as readers would like.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:53 / 03.06.06
Joe? Let's see what David Bowie thinks of you.
 
 
Dead Megatron
12:58 / 03.06.06
Shows what you know. Kitty Pryde's not just about phasing, her defining characteristics are her resourcefulness and bravery (and her cute nose, I guess). Having her go after Juggernaut, get suddenly depowered and take him down with split-second strategy and timing is classic Claremont Shadowcat. Loved it.

Yeah, and she calling Juggernaut "dick-face" to his face was really cool. It was all "Do you know who I am? I'm the Sprite, bitch!!!"

Plus, her phasing through Cain Marko and removing his helmet would do no good without Leech, because, as we all know, Juggernaut is invulnerable.
 
 
Spyder Todd 2008
14:47 / 03.06.06
Regarding X3 there was one point strongly in it's favour.

No. Sodding. Gambit.

I'll grant the film that much, Evil S.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
05:45 / 04.06.06
There was no indication that Juggernaut on this film was full of Crimson Jem of Cytorrak goodness and not just another mutant. Presumably if he had been anything like the character from the comics then Magneto would have made him spend the climatic battle standing next to Phoenix and not doing anything, on the grounds that it would be unfair to fight the humans with mutants powerful enough to kill them.
 
 
Catjerome
06:08 / 04.06.06
About Magneto and the bridge - I'm willing to accept pretty much any big crazy thing Magneto does as being for the sake of intimidation and showboating. He could've easily crept over to the island in secrecy and safety, but he wants attention. Completely screwing with an enormous historic example of human-built architecture with just _his bare hands_ - that's a great "look at me! My kind and I are *this* much more awesome than you!" I just wish he'd gone the full distance and pushed all of the cars off, too.

I'm willing to overlook attention-getting things like the bridge, but the rest of his battle strategy was crap.

Also: How did he manage to get away after the battle?
 
 
FinderWolf
17:28 / 04.06.06
>> I just wish he'd gone the full distance and pushed all of the cars off, too.

I thought it was sweet that for all his 'puny humans' rhetoric, he smiled at the frightened family locking their doors and let them all live.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
22:24 / 04.06.06
There was no indication that Juggernaut on this film was full of Crimson Jem of Cytorrak goodness and not just another mutant.

Thank fuck for that. They've taken that out of the comics too these days, because it's pointlessly complicated. He doesn't seem to be Xavier's half-brother in the film, either: again, a perfectly understandable choice.
 
 
John Octave
00:57 / 05.06.06
"Taken that out of the comics" like "We don't mention it anymore," or like "His magical powers were a LIE and he was a mutant all along"?

I was also glad to see Juggernaut streamlined for the film, as the movie didn't have time for that on top of everything else. They may not have committed to doing the whole Dark Phoenix thing very well, but it could've been worse--they could've over-committed and brought in the Shi'ar, and still try to squeeze it in to an hour and forty-five.
 
 
Triplets
01:53 / 05.06.06
They should've fought the Shi'ar during the credits. No decompression here!
 
 
thomas the doubter
08:34 / 05.06.06
i left the cinema with mixed feelings...

+ phoenix going crazy. c'mon, u don't have to be ashamed to giggle fanboy-like when jean shows her power. also very emotionally tense moments. power + chaos + rage + sex = fucking phoenix

+ the near-sex-scene with logan when jean wakes up.

+ the portrait of charly x as manipulator. of course he had his reasons but trying to tame jean with mental control shows that he is not always such a shiny father figure

+ magneto - strong characterization with some defiencies

+ the mystique scenes when she*s still the old shapeshifter we loved, changing from the president to a little girl which promises that she will kill the guard herself when getting freeing in that innocent child voice. i found it funny.

+ the scene when the golden gate bridge hovers over to alcatraz. they could have also taken a boat...but that wouldn't have looked so fan-boy-tastic



- scott dies to soon...and we don't even see it.
he should have killed jean in the end. that would have been more dramatic and tragic

- lack of time for proper characterization: beast, angel, collossus, ... (how has it come that kitty and collossus are suddenly on the team - shortage of characters?)

- the rogue/iceman/kitty-triangle. could have done with out it. unnecassarily took away time for other characterization

- magneto using the weaker mutants as pawn - out of character. as uncompromising he is he would not let mutants being slaughtered. least of all he would order it

- mytique as a traitor - out of character

- phoenix showdown: jean waiting and waiting and waiting...standing there doing nothing. oh yes, she is uber-powered mutant godess and the writers just don't know what to do with her. poor dramaturgy

- no phoenix raptor. fuck she was standing on a burning car... what about forming a phoenix raptor with the fire???
(and these spooky black vessels in her face reminded me of evil willow by the way.)

- the sentinel in the danger room scene - cheap

- ms. superspeed evil mutant...secondary mutation: being a plot device
 
 
thomas the doubter
12:07 / 05.06.06
>>I thought it was sweet that for all his 'puny humans' rhetoric, he smiled at the frightened family locking their doors and let them all live<<

They were in one of the burning cars he threw at the human soldiers. He locked it because they couldn't escape then, hehehe.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:49 / 05.06.06
>> (and these spooky black vessels in her face reminded me of evil willow by the way.)

YES! Which is a weirdly wonderful chicken/egg thing since Dark Phoenix comics-version came first, then redhead evil Willow-as-Dark-Phoenix (with Xander always cracking wise & calling Willow "Dark Phoenix") with larger-than-normal black eyes and veiny face to show power corrupts eeevviiillll, now movie version DP showing the same large spooky black eyes and veiny face.

Although the veiny skin effect when Rogue uses her powers in the previous 2 X-Men films is somewhat similar to the veiny Phoenix Jean Grey effect, if I recall.

I for one was very glad we didn't have Juggernaut as anyone's half-brother or Crimson Bands of Cytorrak or hoary hosts of Hoggoth (the crimson bands always sounded like a Dr. Strange reference/spell/mystical hoo-hah to me).
 
 
FinderWolf
13:51 / 05.06.06
oh, and X3's box office dropped by 66% this weekend. Apparently previous X-films have dropped by about 55%...so I guess week 2 of X3 didn't carry amazing word of mouth (no huge surprise there).
 
 
H3ct0r L1m4
16:23 / 05.06.06
unused design for dark phoenix effect
 
 
Hieronymus
16:37 / 05.06.06
Other than the ones that look like Jean Grey trapped in bad Madonna video, those pics show that they could've at least TRIED to tie this film to the 2nd one visually.
 
 
Liger Null
21:06 / 05.06.06
- magneto using the weaker mutants as pawn - out of character. as uncompromising he is he would not let mutants being slaughtered. least of all he would order it

I dunno, I was reading some of the old Stan Lee/Jack Kirby comics where Magneto regularly sacrificed or abandoned his soldiers whenever it suited the occasion. The scene properly exposes him for the hypocrite he is, like a right-wing Leader preaching about a "Culture of Life" while waging wars and building torture camps.

- mytique as a traitor - out of character

Was she a traitor? After all, all the feds found at the camp was Madrox. I like to think she was in on it.
 
 
thomas the doubter
06:08 / 06.06.06
>>I dunno, I was reading some of the old Stan Lee/Jack Kirby comics where Magneto regularly sacrificed or abandoned his soldiers whenever it suited the occasion. The scene properly exposes him for the hypocrite he is, like a right-wing Leader preaching about a "Culture of Life" while waging wars and building torture camps.<<

I have to admit that my critic was a rather subjective one. There some different characterizations in over 40 years of comic history. Actions like this just don't go with my personal view of Magneto. I don't see him as a hypocrite. Extreme in his opinions but he sticks to them.

I don't think she knew that Magneto would give up this base. They had no contact since she had been transformed. He abandondend her and that shows how uncompromising he is. This element would have been destroyed if he had worked with a human Mystique.
 
 
H3ct0r L1m4
19:38 / 08.06.06
shit, my double-post disappeared; did i just delete one and a mod the other? =P
 
 
Lama glama
18:20 / 09.06.06
I've been considering posting onto this topic for ages, but felt that I didn't have anything worthwhile to add to the already deafening cacophony of negative reviews.

I really, really wanted to enjoy this movie and for an almost miniscule amount of time I was. I thought the opening scene with young Xavier and Magneto was nice, if incredibly ugly and uninspiring. The opening camera sweep of Jean Grey's street was horribly boring and I should have just given up and walked out at that indication.

I thought things picked up a little bit with the bathroom scene and as soon as the opening music exploded out of the speakers the hairs on the back of my neck stood up. That was the only time that happened during the movie. When the musical composition of a movie is the best thing about it, then you know there are several fundamental problems with your movie.

The three new teen X-Men were used terribly. They were introduced in a rather enjoyable scene, but after it they were pretty much dropped while the rest of the cast exchanged banal clichés every other sentence. I mean, did the writers just open up a copy of the "Big Book of Movie Clichés" and transcribe them into their own shambles of a script in order to pad it out? When the president quipped "hell hath no fury.." I burst out laughing, along with most of the rest of the cinema. It was just delivered so poorly, like much of the additional cast's material (I'm looking at you, prison truck guy).

Still, though, for some reason I've recommended friends to go and see it, if only for novelty value. The special effects are admittedly impressive, especially Magneto's effortless destruction of the prison convoy. The appearance of some of my favourite mutants was pretty cool too, and I can forgive the movie some of its sins for allowing the first and probably last cinematic appearance of the Stepford Cuckoos, Anole and some of the other New Mutants.

X-Men 3:A little less enjoyable than bowel cancer.
 
 
Hydra vs Leviathan
22:37 / 10.06.06
Well, i actually enjoyed that (possibly because i had fairly low expectations, particularly after reading some of the reviews on here, and also i'm not too much of an X-Men geek (never heard of Arclight, frinstance... tho i too thought she was a boy in goth drag (or maybe intersex/transsexual... thought maybe he was playing with gender-variance-as-mutancy))... but then, i'm always a sucker for incredibly unsubtle political imagery in film anyway, and the plot revolving around the "cure" thing resonated particularly strongly, for disability-rights-movement reasons, with me)...

Some of the criticisms on here taken on board. Yeah, it was shorter than the others, could have done with a bit more tying up of loose strings at the end, plenty of characters were only there as pointless cameos, etc. Angel as the son of Worthington (or rather, Angel's dad as the cure-merchant), and the kid being exploited as the source of the "cure", felt to me like a bit too much of a rehash of X2 with the mutant-hating senator's mutant son being the source of the mutant-controlling serum thing...

Xavier and Magneto both came over as total dicks IMO. Initially, my sympathies were all with Magneto, particularly re Jean and what Xavier did to her head (not just nasty, nasty, nasty, but it didn't work with the Hulk either, did it, or even with you...), but then Erik just leaving Mystique there naked and powerless like that was cooooold... still, it was kinda poetic justice he got the same treatment at the end (even if it was heavily reminiscent of Blade I)... good point that Wolvie could have done the same to Jean rather than killing her tho...

IMO it made more sense in a film context for both Phoenix and Juggernaut to be just mutants rather than any kind of alien/mystical stuff... would be just too silly and "off-topic" of the whole mutant-as-minority theme to put the Shi'ar or Cytorrak in. Vinnie Jones, tho... why the fuck does anybody think he can act? He sounded more like an American pretending badly to sound English than any actual American pretending badly to sound English i've ever seen...

My interpretation of the chess-piece scene at the end wasn't that Magneto was regaining his powers, but that Xavier had passed on the destruction of his body into some sort of astral plane and was now a purely psionic entity, able to move chess pieces from beyond the grave (as X1 ended with a parallel Charles-vs-Erik chess scene)... i didn't see the scene after the credits tho, but if it's true, Xavier could plausibly also have long-range telekinesis now... dunno if there will be an X4 tho, cos i heard this would be the last one (tho i did also hear rumours of both Wolverine and Magneto prequel/spin-off movies)?

"They want to cure us. But I say that we are the cure... the cure for the imperfect condition called... Homo Sapiens!"

TOTALLY NEEDS SAMPLING! (preferably in a tune also containing the wicked noise when Magneto rips apart the bridge...)
 
 
Seth
22:43 / 10.06.06
It is plausible that Xavier could have long range telekinesis... NOW!
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
18:45 / 12.06.06
Damn it Brett Ratner, stop posting here!
 
 
Hydra vs Leviathan
19:54 / 12.06.06
I've got to say i have no idea who Brett Ratner is (if that was aimed at me)... i just kinda liked the idea of Xavier, due to his psionic powers, being effectively unkillable, because if his body is destroyed, he can continue to live as a sort of telepathic/telekinetic poltergeist...

Oh yeah, it also sucks that blatantly loads of people are going to think that the whole Dark Phoenix thing was ripped off from Buffy, rather than vice versa...
 
  

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