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DC Universe Surgery

 
  

Page: 1234(5)678910... 44

 
 
Lord Morgue
10:37 / 16.07.04
Ohhhh yeaaaahhh! He was from back before you had to set a motorcyclist's head on fire before he could get his own story. Hey, remember the original Vigilante? Not the Punisher clone with goggles, the Country-and-western singer who fought crime in a bandanna and spangles! Hee, or the Human Cannonball who used to hang around with Lois Lane when she was a kung-fu hero. Or, (snort) HORNBLOWER, the black guy who was the Guardian for a while. Hornblower. HAHAHAHAHAHAAAA! Oh shit. "Can't let them know... I had to go back to the Guardian costume... because SOMEONE STOLE MY HORN!" BWAH-HA-HA-HA-HA-HAHHH!
Oh, I think it was Supergirl who had the centaur, except he was Comet the superhorse. Peter David brought Comet back as a hermaphroditic lesbian half-equine stand-up comedienne superhero love angel who was always macking on to Supergirl. Which... sounds like the worst lemony fanfic EVAR, when you try to describe it...
 
 
Mr Tricks
16:29 / 16.07.04
the original Vigilante also plays a significnat role in the history of Opal city and the STARMAN series...
 
 
diz
18:51 / 26.07.04
thanks to Dan Fish for the link. most helpful.

so now i have more questions, regarding Wonder Woman, the Fury, Hector Hall, and Sandman continuity.

please correct me if i have any of the following wrong:

pre-Crisis, Wonder Woman was involved with the JSA back in the Golden Age. however, her origin was retconned after the Crisis so that she was never part of the Golden Age at all. a Greek action heroine named the Fury was basically invented to fill WW's former role in the Golden Age.

the Fury had a daughter, Lyta, who also became the Fury, and married Hector Hall. Hector Hall died somehow, and ended up in a pocket dimension within the Dreaming, playing at being the Silver Age Sandman for the amusement of Brute and Glob during the time Dream was imprisoned. Lyta lived with him there, pregnant the whole time with the baby who would become Daniel/Dream. when Dream reassumed control of the Dreaming, he went into their happy pocket dimension, he dispersed Hector and basically evicted Lyta, who later gave birth to Daniel who was kidnapped and blah blah blah The Kindly Ones. right.

now, later on, Diana died and her mother Hippolyta became the new Wonder Woman. the new Wonder Woman ended up going back in time and becoming the Golden Age WW before returning to the present and giving the WW mantle back to a returned Diana.

two questions: first, where does that leave Fury I, and then by extension Fury II, Daniel, and all the events of The Kindly Ones?

second, how did Hector Hall go from being the Silver Age Sandman, to being essentially erased by Dream, to being the new Dr. Fate?
 
 
Mr Tricks
20:09 / 26.07.04
the convoluted histories are collected in this JSA timeline

highlights:
  • Secret Origins #12
    In Nazi-occupied Greece, Helena Kosmatos becomes the Fury when is endowed with superhuman strength, speed, and a suit of magical armor by Tisiphone, the Blood Avenger, of the ancient Greek Eumenides (Furies). When enraged, Helena transforms into Tisiphone and kills her brother Michael, a Nazi collaborator, causing a massive explosion in an Aegean harbor. She is rescued from the sea by newsreel reporter Johnny Chambers (Johnny Quick), who takes her back to America to live with her aunt and uncle in Florida. Notes: The Fury was not a Golden Age character; she was created to take the place of the Earth-2 Wonder Woman in post-Crisis continuity. This is her first chronological appearance; her first appearance in print was as an image in Infinity, Inc. #35 (1987).

  • June 4, 1942: Fury encounters the Eumenides (the Three Furies), who allow her to retain her powers (which now come from all three sisters) as long as she remains a virgin.

  • Wonder Woman v.2 #130
    Jay Garrick and Wonder Woman III (Hippolyta) travel back in time from the modern era and help Jay's past self escape the Fiddler. Afterwards, they clash with the JSA.

  • Wonder Woman v.2 #131
    While Hippolyta and Jay Garrick confer with the JSA, Johnny Thunder is attacked by Paula Von Gunther, who steals his Thunderbolt. Notes: The Flash and Green Lantern are depicted as JSA members; technically, they were honorary members at this time.

  • Wonder Woman v.2 #132
    In Germany, Paula Von Gunther is possessed by the Dark Angel when she attempts to use Johnny's Thunderbolt. The Dark Angel temporarily removes the Sphere of Influence, luring the JSA to Europe and capturing them.

  • Wonder Woman v.2 #133
    The JSA outwits the Dark Angel, but she manages to escape. Jay Garrick returns to his own time; Hippolyta elects to remain in 1942.
    Note: This issue restores Wonder Woman to most Golden Age adventures between 1942 and 1950

  • Legends of the DCU #31
    Hippolyta meets the Fury, becoming her mentor. Fury later names her daughter Hippolyta, in her honor.

  • Infinity, Inc. #27(After "Crisis ON INFINITE EARTHS")Mourning the loss of her parents, (Hippo)Lyta Trevor recalls her first meeting with Hector Hall, Al Rothstein, and Rick Tyler when they were all 12 years old. As an act of mercy, Brainwave Jr. removes her memory of her real parents; he and the other Infinitors also lose their memories of the Earth-2 Wonder Woman.

  • Infinity, Inc. #44
    The Infinitors battle the Silver Scarab and Hath-Set. They discover that Hector Hall is actually dead and the Scarab is now an inhuman creature.

  • Infinity, Inc. #49
    Joan Dale, the former Miss America, recalls her days with the JSA. She notes that powers began to fade after the JSA disbanded in 1951, so she never emerged from retirement. Nuklon offers to marry Lyta so that her child will have a father; she says no. Hector Hall returns as Sandman III. Note: This is the first textual reference to Miss America taking the place of Wonder Woman in the JSA.

  • Infinity, Inc. #50
    Hector reveals that he became the Sandman after Garrett Sandford (Sandman II) committed suicide. Lyta agrees to accompany him to the dream world.

  • Infinity, Inc. #51
    ector and Lyta marry and return to the dream dimension.

  • Sandman v.2 #12
    Morpheus reasserts his control over the Dreaming. He encounters Hector and Lyta Hall and reveals that Hector has been a pawn of Morpheus's former servants Brute and Glob. Hector dies again and Lyta is returned to the waking world.

  • Sandman v.2 #22
    Hector and Lyta Hall's son Daniel Hall is born. Later, Morpheus pays a visit to mother and child.

  • Sandman v.2 #40
    Lyta Hall suffers from memory lapses while her sleeping son, Daniel, meets his future subjects in the Dreaming.

  • Sandman v.2 #57-68
    Lyta Hall's son Daniel is kidnaped by Loki. The distraught Lyta is manipulated by the Furies as a weapon against Morpheus. Note: Helena Kosmatos, the original Fury, appears briefly in Sandman #62 (12.94) as an old woman in a nursing home, her first postwar appearance. Her history following the birth of Lyta Hall remains unknown.

  • Sandman v.2 #72
    Daniel (the new Dream, of the Endless) shows his human side to Lyta Hall, offering forgiveness and a promise of protection to the woman who had once been his mother.

  • Sandman Presents: The Furies
    Lyta Hall travels to Athens, Greece to meet the Furies. Note: Occurs sometime after "The Wake" and several months before the latest JSA series revival.

  • JSA v3 #2
    The new JSA (their informal initial roster includes Atom-Smasher, Black Canary, Flash, Hourman, Sand, Sentinel, Starman, and Wildcat) tries to save a baby destined to become the new Dr. Fate from Mordru. (The baby's soul is Hector Hall; it's body, the son of Hawk and Dove II [Dawn Granger])

  • JSA v3 #3
    Dr. Fate's tower (formerly in Salem, Massachusetts) reappears in the "Subtle Realms" outside time and space. Inside, the Helm of Nabu, the Cloak of Destiny, and the Amulet of Anubis are restored to their original forms. The Star-Spangled Kid finds herself inside the Amulet, where she encounters the spirits of Kent and Inza Nelson. Kent helps her use the Scarab's Scarabaeus as the catalyst for the baby to become Dr. Fate IV. Note: The Scarab first appeared in The Scarab #1 (11.93); he was a retconned Golden Age hero.

  • JSA v3 #4
    After defeating Mordru, the new Dr. Fate is revealed as Hector Hall, whose disembodied soul was contacted by the spirit of Kent Nelson after his second death. The Justice Society officially reforms with the addition of Dr. Fate, Star-Spangled Kid, and Hawkgirl; Hippolyta declines full-time membership. The new JSA takes up residence in Wesley Dodds' former mansion in Manhattan. Sand collapses into a pile of... sand! Note: Hector Hall was originally said to have been born without a soul. So how can he be reincarnated?
 
 
Mr Tricks
20:11 / 26.07.04
here's some more:
Dr Fate & FURY
 
 
Spyder Todd 2008
20:41 / 26.07.04
Gods.... Dr. Fate is supposed to be cool, not freaking Hector Hall....
 
 
LDones
04:58 / 20.08.04
It was my understanding that Prometheus, JLA-Villain and Anti-Batman extraordinaire, has been essentially unheard of since the World War III arc (except for, like, one panel in JLA/Avengers or something...).

Now I hear he's just shown up in the regular Batman titles after years in limbo, and that he's some part of the whole hyper-bloated 'War Games' thing. Does anybody know what the deal is with his most recent appearances?
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:39 / 20.08.04
revenge?
 
 
quinine92001
20:54 / 14.09.04
Can anyone explain Legion of Superheroes, L.E.G.I.O.N, Legion Lost, Legion ad infinutum? Tie is the Legion of Superpets too. The only thing that I know about Legion is that it was written by a 14 yr old and that Chameleon, Saturn Girl and Cosmic Kid came back and helped Superboy become Superman. Can you fill in the rest? What were the best stories?
 
 
Mr Tricks
21:10 / 14.09.04
Most everything you'll need to know about Legion
 
 
Warewullf
21:23 / 14.09.04
In Teen Titans, how did Raven go from being disembodied spirit to Teenage Witch and how did Cyborg go from golden liquid metal guy back to the way he used to be?

(I mean, I know it was to bring the characters in line with the cartoon...)
 
 
Dan Fish - @Fish1k
08:07 / 15.09.04
Cyborg - I read the answer to this one recently: Apparently, the Russians cloned his body (presumably during the Titans Hunt story), and his brain was transferred into this, but then he was injured, so they rebuilt him into his original style cyborg-body
 
 
gridley
12:55 / 15.09.04
When Jim Corrigan first became the Spectre, he was just a ghost who solved crimes. I remember him as having no other powers than invisibility and intangibility.

Does anyone know at what point DC upgraded his powers and at what point they actually started claiming he was the literal Wrath of God?
 
 
Mr Tricks
18:51 / 15.09.04
The Spectre has always had some pretty hardcore powers. In his debute he stares one of the thugs in the eyes, and he drops dead from fright. Another of the gangsters opens fire on Corrigan, but to no effect. When the gangster merely touches Corrigan, his clothing and flesh wither away to nothing, and the thug is quickly reduced to a mere skeleton, which collapses to the ground in a heap.
 
 
Warewullf
21:17 / 15.09.04
Is that really an early Spectre story?

Blimey. That bit where he turns that guy into a skeleton then yells "DIE!" was a surprise!

Never knew that sort of thing happened in the Golden Age.
 
 
Mr Tricks
21:20 / 15.09.04
Remember, Batman used to carry a gun and such... check out the archieve in the above link.
 
 
Dan Fish - @Fish1k
07:24 / 16.09.04
I think the 'Wrath of God' stuff was made explicit in Ostrander/Mandrake's run, somewhere in the first twenty or so issues, but it may have been alluded to in the Swamp Thing appearances, and possibly earlier. The late 1980's series certainly focused on the ghostly investigator angle.
 
 
Lord Morgue
13:43 / 16.09.04
Hey, didn't golden age Spectre THROW PLANETS at people who pissed him off?
 
 
Jackie Susann
00:45 / 28.09.04
I just read the first (so far as I know) De Matteiss/Giffen Justice League trade, and I was wondering what turned out to be going on with Maxwell Lord.
 
 
doctorbeck
11:58 / 28.09.04
>Hey, didn't golden age Spectre THROW PLANETS at people >who pissed him off?

all that and more, true believer
i have a JSA / JLA cross over where he grows massive and stops earth 1 and earth 2 crashing into each other for some reason i can't remember and which was possibly never explained. then the 2 teams have to team up to fight a 4th dimensional being from the anti-matter universe who decides to walk along the spectre for some unexplained reason but who will destroy earths 1 and 2 if he gets there (matter / anti-matter science stuff). the spectre covers the teams in his forcefield that stops their matter bodies exploding in contact with him. and soloman grundy shows up.

i miss the days when writers just invented stuff as they went along, for the sheer hell of it.

a
 
 
Dan Fish - @Fish1k
12:29 / 01.10.04
Maxwell Lord:

One day, while out potholing, Max discovers a robot (I think it belonged to Metron, I could be misremembering). The robot saves his life and helps him achieve his powerful position by manipulating events. Part of the plan is the creation of Justice League International. Max eventually has a crisis of conscience, and the JLI destroy the robot, max collapses because the robot is no longer keeping him alive. When he recovers, the JLI forgive him and keep him on. This would probably have been covered in the second volume, up to about issue 12 or so.
 
 
Benny the Ball
15:25 / 01.10.04
Maxwell Lord.

Is correct. You didn't really find out about the computer that was manipulating with Lord until about issue 10 or so. Metron did pop up, though I don't think that he was connected with the computer so much (although there was a robot that was sent out by the computer to help boost the Leagues image that was connected to him). Lord, who post invasion developed telepathic powers (mainly suggestion) smashed the computer up at the end of the first years arc. I must dig out those old JL's and re-read them.

Does Lord still have the powers? His nose would bleed when he used them as I remember.
 
 
Warewullf
10:16 / 02.10.04
Maxwell Lord is a cyborg now, isn't he? How did that happen?

Also, whatever happened to The Floronic Man?
 
 
Simplist
04:01 / 03.10.04
The Floronic Man was chosen by the Guardians of the Universe to be one of the New Guardians, whose series flopped pretty hard after their introduction in the Millenium crossover (which itself was so ludicrous it probably merits a whole separate discussion). Not sure what ever happened to the rest of the New Guardians, but "Floro" eventually returned to the cast of Swamp Thing briefly in much the role he'd occupied back in Alan Moore's run, ie. an employee of the Sunderland Corporation studying Swamp Thing and now Tefe. Beheaded by Tefe, he was forced to regrow his body from the surrounding plants, which happened to be, no kidding, marijuana, so the Floronic Man is now permanently stoned. His incurable chemically-addled condition was used as an excuse to return him to supervillian-hood (dope makes you unstable, you know), and nowadays he's basically a Batman rogue housed with the rest in Arkham Asylum.
 
 
Triplets
22:56 / 03.10.04
Hang on, why does marijuana effect TFM? I mean, if he's part stinging-nettle or poison ivy wouldn't he be in a terminal condition or constant pain?

And putting aside that it's a stupid fucking idea anyway wouldn't he just be constantly mellow yellow?
 
 
Simplist
03:42 / 04.10.04
B-b-but DRUGS MAKE YOU CRAZY, man! Haven't you seen those D.A.R.E. commercials?
 
 
Simplist
03:42 / 04.10.04
B-b-but DRUGS MAKE YOU CRAZY, man! Haven't you seen those D.A.R.E. commercials?
 
 
Simplist
03:51 / 04.10.04
So crazy you repeat yourself, apparently...
 
 
Benny the Ball
18:16 / 04.10.04
Okay, Lobo. Now I don't know much about his origin, but when he first appeared in JLI I remember Mr Miracle saying that he shouldn't be hit as each drop of blood grew another him - what was that about? When did it change? Was it just too much of a piss-take to expect artists to draw him so much when all he does is get into bloody fights?
 
 
osymandus
18:24 / 04.10.04
Which i suppose was a great idea , unless he faced someone who just killed the last one and as the new ones born incinerates it ! (Mr Moore what we're you thinking !) Pastiche of inherant anti-hero viloence indeed !
 
 
Mr Tricks
18:30 / 04.10.04
I thought Lobo was orinally introduced as a bounty Hunter in that old OMEGA MEN series by Giffen. He even wore orange & purple spandex back then.
 
 
FinderWolf
18:57 / 04.10.04
>> B-b-but DRUGS MAKE YOU CRAZY, man! Haven't you seen those D.A.R.E. commercials?

>> So crazy you repeat yourself, apparently...

Don't worry, he's just one of those comic-reading schizophrenics...

(couldn't resist, sorry)
 
 
Uatu.is.watching
19:06 / 04.10.04
Wasn't Maxwell Lord a Manhunter? I seem to recall something like that from, I believe, the Millenium crossover.
 
 
Benny the Ball
19:51 / 04.10.04
Lord was a suspect, but he wasn't - the then Rocket Red was the Manhunter. Also Lana Lang, who were the others?
 
 
Simplist
21:56 / 04.10.04
Most everyone in Smallville was a Manhunter, IIRC. Also Flash's Dad. Somehow I doubt any of it will ever be referred to in continuity again.
 
  

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