BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Battlestar Galactica Season Three

 
  

Page: 1 ... 678910(11)1213

 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
17:27 / 20.03.07
Tori is so gay for Laura. Cyb0rganize was right!

What I don't understand is what's going on with the 'special bonus episode aceness!!1!' stuff. If you've got the time to show it afterwards then surely you can fit in in the episode can't you? Is it canon?

I'm not sure about Laura's cancer coming back. Whilst it possibly gives an opportunity for her to go crawling to Athena for some more special babyblood again I'm not sure it gives us any interesting stories. I am glad that Admiral Adama tries to shut the trial down again as in season one and gets slapped down by everyone else. It does surprise me that Adama and Laura don't seem to have had any idea before the trial started that it is going to be difficult to legally show Baltar's culpability and that Lee's presence in the courtroom is going to allow the defense to air so much dirty laundry.

I wish I'd managed to get back to my computer before they showed the 'next week' stuff because it does suggest some worrying shark-jumping possibilities.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
17:39 / 20.03.07
I think the bonus scene is a case of them not having enough room to show the entire scene. Every time they show one of these "bonus" scenes, its always cut off and doesn't make a whole lot of sense... just normal editing considerations, I suppose. Not sure if they are canon.

On Laura with the cancer again - It's always bothered me that the scrolls said 'a dying leader will take them to earth' but then she was healed and no longer dying. the cancer coming back rectifies that for me, in a lot of ways. However, I've always thought that her sickness pointed to a Leoben-style sickness from the miniseries... basically saying she's a Cylon. Perhaps they are approaching this nebula and it's emitting some kind of radiation like the one in the mini-series. I suppose Athena would be getting sick, too, though.

Regarding the "As Yet Undisclosed Third Party" theory... I'd like to propose that these Head Six, Head Baltar, and Head Leoben entities could possibly be the Lords of Kobol continuing to the guide the human race (and the Cylons) towards some sort of destiny (living in harmony on Earth?). What say you?
 
 
sorenson
22:26 / 21.03.07
I was thinking in the shower this morning, as one does, about this final five bizzo.

Remind who the four that heard the music were again? Tigh, Anders, Tori, and who was the other one? Was it Celix? And was she one of those most avid in booting anyone out the airlock who cooperated with the cylons just after they escaped? (should go back and do some re-watching, clearly).

Does it seem significant to anyone that Tigh and Anders were both engaged in guerilla warfare against the cylons (Anders was the leader of the resistance on Caprica, and Tigh on New Caprica). We don't know much about Tori but we do know she is in a position where she is deeply anti-cylon. Ditto Celix (if my memory is right). It would be a total head-fuck if the final five turned out to be those that were most against the cylons.

Also, if Tigh is one of the final five, how long have the cylons been in among the humans? We have a lot of backstory for Tigh, more than for almost anyone else, right back to his early days in the army with Adama. That's a long time and very deep in for the cylons to have infiltrated.

Thoughts, anyone?
 
 
sleazenation
00:16 / 22.03.07
Could it be that those four plus starbuck constitute the final 5? I hope not.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
02:28 / 22.03.07
Season 4 expanded from 13 episodes to 22 episodes starting in 2008, plus a 2 hour movie in 2007.

My first thought is "Shit."

I was getting used to the idea that we were 13-14 episodes away from the end of the show, but a full season order makes me think that we are in danger of Sci Fi/Ron Moore wanting to milk the series for even longer than 4 seasons... this show seriously needs and end point in mind. I thought that's where we were until now....
 
 
sleazenation
06:25 / 22.03.07
It seems to me that the experience of seasons 2 and 3 shows us that 13 episodes is probably the optimum number before the quality drops off.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
06:28 / 22.03.07
Or, on the bright side, maybe they looked at the amount of story they felt they had left to tell and realised it was too much for half a season?

It's looking like some of the regular crew may well turn out to be Cylons (Neither Ceelix or Tori heard any music, so whatever the music does or does not signify it's nothing to do with them) but maybe they were really the first five, the Cylon equivelent of the human raiding party sent into their space. Because Saul was already there with Adama at the time that would mean that they made the first move rather than the humans, presuming he is a Cylon.
 
 
sleazenation
06:58 / 22.03.07
Just one more thing...

We never saw who was on the basestars that have been trailing the galactica - could it be that the cylons in these ships are actually the final five?
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:38 / 22.03.07
sleazenation It seems to me that the experience of seasons 2 and 3 shows us that 13 episodes is probably the optimum number before the quality drops off.

Before picking up again for the last three or four episodes...
 
 
sleazenation
11:45 / 22.03.07
yeah - it seems like there is a bit of bulking out going on in the middle. Less so in the first part of the season (just Hero and Unfinished Business) more in the second half (from taking a break through to dirty hands).

I take your point about BSG having more story than will fit into its current time slot. Maybe the solution is to write a much tighter arc ala The Wire...
 
 
Seth
13:15 / 22.03.07
I would be surprised if they can milk this show for much longer than the next season, and I hope the writers realise that. The notion of having twenty-two episodes and a movie makes me think that they may have the end in sight and are looking to wrap things up at the end of the movie, although there will probably be room for spin-offs. If Ron Moore's previous record is anything to go by, he might choose again to frontload the fourth season with the filler/standalones so that it can gain pace at the end with more arc plotting.
 
 
kowalski
00:00 / 23.03.07
Just for the record though, the order is two-hour tv movie first, and then new season begins in January 2008.

As for the final five, it may be worth recalling that Deanna apologizes to one of them when she meets them via the Eye of Jupiter. Perhaps she was part of the interrogation of Tigh on New Caprica? Alternately, maybe she's apologizing to Anders for what went down in the collapsed parking garage in the cylon episode back in season two? (I can hardly remember the details of that one though.)

Those are the only two I can think of that she'd had direct on-screen or implied contact with that would conceivably trigger an apology from her. I think that apology, while fleeting, was probably an important clue. Can anyone think of any other incidents?
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
07:43 / 23.03.07
What about Laura dreaming of Hera as a young girl at the start of the episode? Where does that fit in?

Season Three gag reel. There's a joke with Starbuck about two minutes in which might be a spoiler but on the other hand may just be a big joke.
 
 
calgodot
06:05 / 24.03.07
(RE: the "stop watching" comments. Bite me. I'll watch and complain all I want. I keep watching in the perhaps vain hope that the series will improve. If you don't like it, stop reading.)

That said: this first part of "Crossroads" was a return to the true heart of the series. I've watched the episode three, maybe four times already and each time I notice a few new things, little moments. Not staring contests and endless wanking about family and relationships, but rather good character studies, as well as a fine examination of what may happen to the social order during such a conflict. The damned, doomed human race is pulling itself apart, almost quite literally. The Cylons have some kind of weird sonic weapon; not unlike putting "It's a Small World" on an endless loop, the tune appears to torment those who hear it. It may be some kind of "thought virus." It may simply be frayed nerves. Whatever the case, it's a clear threat, and a mystery.

Good to see the Colonel back to his sotted ways. I was beginning to wonder when he'd crack. The exchange between him and Caprica Six was quite tense - I'm becoming more impressed with Tricia Helfer's acting ability. And the in-her-head Gaius is just too damn good.

The Adama-Adama conflict reached near mythic proportions with this round. The Admiral appears to be pulling a Tigh, and Lee has finally shown his true, petulant colors. "I'll see you in court" indeed. Nice of Dualla to be so principled as to have no principles, but that's what those Sagittarons are, I'm told. Can't trust 'em.

Myself, I'm ready for a new President, both IRL and on the show. Roslin has begun to grate on my nerves more than a bit. Perhaps its the self-righteous religious tenor she has taken upon herself. (Though I will admit her reply to the reporter was quite tasty.) Perhaps it's Mary McDonnell's 1.5 note performance. I have to admit I've never liked the actress. Initially I had great admiration the character's resolve to maintain the letter of the law, but it looks like Roslin has thrown her regard for justice out the window. Cheap of her to beg Lee not to "do this" and then play up her illness. Maybe it's because of the cancer or the chamalla. Or maybe it's just that she is, after all, a politician.

Maybe the best thing was that nobody had a cheesy dream about Starbuck.

All in all, a good episode. The first time in a long time I'm looking forward to the next one.

(PS. Did any of you clever wits notice there wasn't a body count at the start of this episode? Took me a third viewing to catch that.)
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
02:49 / 26.03.07
YES! Best end of season ever!
 
 
calgodot
05:05 / 26.03.07
WOW!

That was frakkin' cool.

But...

2008?!?!?!

 
 
MJ-12
06:26 / 26.03.07
I'd say, compared to what I was dreading, it was not nearly as FUCKING WEAK as it could have been.
 
 
Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!
11:41 / 26.03.07
That cover of All Along the Watchtower was pretty fucking weak, though.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
12:06 / 26.03.07
yeah, it was a particularly bad cover.

but i really don't think this episode was anywhere near "fucking weak."
 
 
Mistoffelees
16:09 / 26.03.07
No reason to get excited, the thief, he kindly spoke...

SPOILERS!


So was Lee hallucinating or was she for real? This series is well known for people seeing noncorporeal people, but my impression was, that it was really her. So whoever picked her out of the maelstroem took her viper too, and knows Earth´s location.

And who picked her up? It was not the fabulous five, since they don´t have a clue right now. Or maybe it was the fifth of them, since Starbuck being one of them would just be too much. That Fifth is probably some mastermind, that has been manipulating cylons and humans all along.

So what exactly is the purpose of those four new Cylons (besides drinking that is)? Being close to the president, the admiral, the one human who knows Earth´s location and being in charge of the squadron´s maintenance, the cylons have the upper hand. And even if Tigh denies his new knowledge and acts as if nothing has happened, the other three will still have enough leverage to wreck havoc or whatever they choose to do. But do the other cylons even know of that vital change on board the BSG?

And now we have another halfcylon child, though the writers don´t seem to know what to do with the first one anyway. Two McGuffins without a purpose?

Will the cylons/humans reach Earth in the next season or maybe already in the upcoming 120 minutes tv movie? BSG better reach any safe haven soon, since the closeups of the last half a dozen episodes have clearly shown that its fighting days are over, and those were four baseships in that last shot.

It´s a good thing the writers know how important Balthar still is to this program. I hope his new admirers will take better care of him than Roslin. I´ve lost that last shred of sympathy when she made that (paraphrasing) "I got an appetite for some nice book burning" comment.


/SPOILERS!

With all these revelations and questions dangling, I´m realloy looking forward to that movie in autumn. Let´s hope, the next season will be able to follow through.
 
 
Robert B
16:22 / 26.03.07
I thought it was a great episode. Lee finally got some good character development (he really needed it) and his speech is probably one of the better parts of the episode (and possibly Season 3 as a whole).

I also liked how the four basically all realized they were cylons and then were just kind of left wondering (like the audience) what exactly that meant and acting kind of stupid... well, except Tigh. Got to love Tigh.

Ah, and Baltar. Rushed off by the three ladies to his "new life" of possible godhood with whatever cult has sprung up that thinks he can heal children.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
16:33 / 26.03.07
SPOILERS FOR FINALE, SOME HINTS ABOUT SEASON FOUR.

Post finale interview with Moore.

Some interesting answers in there, plus a confirmation or two.

Still processing my brain...
 
 
Planet B
22:47 / 26.03.07
YES! Best end of season ever!

If the previous six episodes hadn't sucked so thorougly, I might be able to agree. As it is, I find this notion preposterous. It was, however, a really good episode (bad cover notwithstanding).

I find it amazing that they really only have about six good, tight episodes a season and then get an order for 22+ for next year. Ugh. Please end it there. Though from what I've been reading on the SciFi message boards, they are hoping for a fifth and final season.

And did anyone else find Lee's courtroom speech, although accurate, an indictment of the writers and all of their decisions to make people drop the law whenever they feel like it? They've been pretty loose, and this seems like they're even calling themselves out.

On another note, it appears as if the next season could be based around an idea that I think they should have been exploring for the past two seasons, IE the question of what does it mean to be a human versus what it means to be a cylon. If Tigh can hate the cylons and, in every aspect look and act like a human, and decide to BE human and fight for humanity even though he knows he's a cylon, then isn't he human after all? Is THAT the cylons' plan? To show humans that we aren't so different after all?

The problem is, I think this philosophical idea is far beyond the abilities of this writing staff.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
23:53 / 26.03.07
If the previous six episodes hadn't sucked so thorougly, I might be able to agree. As it is, I find this notion preposterous. It was, however, a really good episode (bad cover notwithstanding).

I find it amazing that they really only have about six good, tight episodes a season and then get an order for 22+ for next year. Ugh. Please end it there. Though from what I've been reading on the SciFi message boards, they are hoping for a fifth and final season.


Well, I disagree. And, honestly, it sounds like "good, tight" means "arc centric," which is just an opinion I don't hold with. An episode can be good and "standalone," although BSG's standalones are never really standalone, as they fill in all the motivation and causes for what characters do later on. Sometimes they are awful, and a complete mess (the patient killing doctor one, springs to mind, and the ungodly long love triangle), but sometimes they are great and just as tight (labor issues one).

I'd love for them to go arc arc arc arc, but it's becoming all too common that any episode without cylons in it gets huge criticisms and declaration about how bad they are.

Out of this season, I could say there are about 11 excellent episodes, 5 good, 2-5 unnecessary or bad episodes. That's not terrible, in my mind, but perhaps I have a higher tolerance.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
00:13 / 27.03.07
the next season could be based around an idea that I think they should have been exploring for the past two seasons, IE the question of what does it mean to be a human versus what it means to be a cylon.

Um, DUDE, the whole SERIES is about exploring the difference between human and cylon. Or are you watching some other show?

I really liked it. I had spoiled myself totally, but was still biting my nails. It's great that there are more cylons we didn't know about; it's great that Starbuck is back (whatever she is, who cares at this point); it's great that base stars are pursuing the fleet once again.

But the revelation that Tigh, Anders, Tyrol, Tori and possibly Starbuck are all Cylons also sheds some light on the (murky) historical backstory. If Tigh is a Cylon, and always has been, that means humanoid cylon models have been around for a lot longer than anyone thinks, right? (I'm working on the theory that since Tigh has been around in Adama's life since they were both young, a human Tigh wasn't replaced with a Cylon model that looked exactly like him. And so for the others.)

Possibly, the existence of humanoid Cylons actually predates the first human-Cylon war. So who made them? I have a theory: I think humans made the Final Five, which were the first five models, in some top-secret experiment. The first five models maybe escaped or were let loose, secretly, and that's why the first war happened. ("They rebelled." Tell me the centurions rebelled and organised themselves.) Then they retired and made the next seven models. Meanwhile they implanted single copies of themselves in the human population, starting with Tigh. Or maybe the first five were simply implanted in the population by someone (who?). The next seven models were like the next generation; they didn't care about the humans and wanted revenge. Maybe they had a dispute with the first five (if the first five were around) or maybe they simply knew that five prior models existed, but not what they were.

But here's the thing: if the first five models grew from children rather than having their bodies constructed as adults, doesn't that mean they're somehow closer to being 'human', on a biological basis, at the level of the cells, than the seven? Maybe they're a little like Hera, hybrids. This explains those crazy references to the Final Five being the doorway between life (bios) and death (machine); the place between the light and the darkness.

And I think the writers know what they're doing. If this pays off as I think it might, I can forgive them for the crappy showing of recent weeks.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
01:41 / 27.03.07
Disco, I think you are on the right track... the one thing that really confuses me about the Final Five is their relationship to the Eye of Jupiter and that temple. Let me try a theory of my own.

"All of this has happened before. All of this will happen again." Okay, the humans and gods lived together on Kobol for a time, until the humans left. What if the "gods" were "Cylons" from the cycle before? This story happened before (perhaps with bad results), and at the end of it, the Cylons/Gods decided they needed to make it right so they went to the humans posing as Gods, and tried to influence their lives for the better. However, there was a rift between them and Five of their number (1 feisty one in particular, let's call him/her Satan) and the Five were cast out. They went to live on Planet Algae and made a temple. When the 13th tribe passed their way, they decided they needed to make sure the other 12 tribes were okay, so they went back, bringing with them prophecies, scriptures, etc., and themselves. Somehow they seeded themselves into the population as children (downloaded into new young bodies? Do Cylons age?) and forgot who they were (after thousands of years, who wouldn't?). This somewhat explains why Kara had always drawn that symbol (if, in fact, she is one of them).

I've always been very suspicious of the "Gods" that the humans lived with on Kobol. Perhaps they are the Third As Yet Unknown Party instead. Would make some sense.
 
 
Planet B
06:09 / 27.03.07
Um, DUDE, the whole SERIES is about exploring the difference between human and cylon. Or are you watching some other show?

lordy... really? there is a huge difference between alluding to these issues and having the characters themselves dealing with the issues head on. you know, talking about it and acting on it.

reading the Ron Moore interview just had me shaking my head. they only started thinking that these people would the be five cylons as they were writing this season? way to plan ahead there. pretty haphazard and, imo, it shows.

I'd love for them to go arc arc arc arc, but it's becoming all too common that any episode without cylons in it gets huge criticisms and declaration about how bad they are.

yeah, well when the cylons don't really appear for the better half a season... that's what you get. part of the appeal IS the cylons and their inherent coolness. but if they want to write a courtroom drama, I guess they shouldn't let the fact that this is a scifi show get in the way.

I'm rewatching the first season right now and -- though it's not holding up as well as I thought it might -- at least each episode moved multiple plots forward. That is something I think they've lost and something they seem to have gotten bogged down by ever since the "action" has been confined almost solely to the Galactica.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:48 / 27.03.07
way to plan ahead there. pretty haphazard and, imo, it shows.

Can anyone name a single television show in which the entirity of the plot has been laid out in advance and not developed subject to factors such as actor availability, number and length of seasons commissioned, or just the writers changing their minds or having new ideas (HOW DARE THEY, PUT THEM ON TRIAL!)? I ask because the people who love to complain (again, they don't have to cancel the show for you to stop watching it) seem to always, always, always seize on this idea of everything not being planned in advance and obsess on it, whereas it seems to me to be just a characteristic of long-running serial fiction (see also: comic books).
 
 
sleazenation
10:17 / 27.03.07
Ultraviolet.
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
10:50 / 27.03.07
Six episodes.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
11:12 / 27.03.07
there is a huge difference between alluding to these issues and having the characters themselves dealing with the issues head on. you know, talking about it and acting on it.

Two words: Athena. Boomer.

Thank you kindly.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
11:14 / 27.03.07
Also, Keith, excellent spotting there about the Gods and/or Cylon God. And the cyclical nature of Galactiverse history.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
12:17 / 27.03.07
yeah, well when the cylons don't really appear for the better half a season... that's what you get. part of the appeal IS the cylons and their inherent coolness. but if they want to write a courtroom drama, I guess they shouldn't let the fact that this is a scifi show get in the way.

Oh. Cylons are cool therefore they should be in the show all the time. Cool is more important than relevant issues. Also, BSG should not stray from being a show about space ships and robots and laser battles.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
12:36 / 27.03.07
Well, I always thought the show was faytalee flawed by not having that robot dog.

If the earth we saw in the last few seconds of the episode is 'this' earth that we all collectively hallucinate together that's going to be weak. I'm in two minds about the revelation of the final five, while Flyboy is right that almost every show out there has an element of improvisation in it's development it does speak to me the fact that the writers probably hadn't even invented the final five at the start of the season, let alone decided who they were when it was decided midseason that this was heretical knowledge and turned Deanna off for knowing it.

I'm tending towards the 'colony' of Earth seeding both human and Cylon societies before retreating, the Cylons no more know the truth than the humans do.
 
 
Seth
13:27 / 27.03.07
reading the Ron Moore interview just had me shaking my head. they only started thinking that these people would the be five cylons as they were writing this season? way to plan ahead there. pretty haphazard and, imo, it shows.

Don't really have a problem with this. It's the nature of most telly to work on the fly, sometimes it shows more than at others. But I've seen some fantastic writing done this way, so I don't take issue as long as it's good. In a way, this season seems to justify an end to the previous one that I didn't like, in that it's been all about the fallout from New Caprica, I like the idea of the two episodes/movie focusing on Pegasus flashbacks because it's another idea I think they pissed away too fast, and as much as it's possible to be glad that anyone - fictional or not - has cancer I'm glad Roslin has it again.

Each of these things really should have had more consequences, and I'm really happy that they're becoming major elements again. They seem to be addressing a few of my major gripes with season two and I'm enjoying it more again now.

Never underestimate the value of a good retcon.
 
  

Page: 1 ... 678910(11)1213

 
  
Add Your Reply