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Battlestar Galactica Season Three

 
  

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sleazenation
16:12 / 29.10.06
According to articles and interviews linked to on the Battlestar Wiki, The Seven Cylons we have seen are seperate from the ones we haven't seen, which points to possibly an even greater schism within Cylon society... one possibility is that 5 models have been boxed, another is that there is a cylon civil war...
 
 
sleazenation
16:36 / 29.10.06
battlestar wiki...

I've just caught up with the last three episodes...
 
 
PatrickMM
23:45 / 29.10.06
I thought this one was a pretty big falloff from the New Caprica episodes. I was never a huge fan of military/political drama on the ship, and was relieved to have a whole new status quo for the show. However, that was quickly bumped off and we're right back where we were in season two. Yes, there'll be some lingering issues, but generally speaking this seemed to be all about getting back to the old situation. Next episode I could easily see short haired, tough Kara and thin Lee arguing over who's going to lead the Viper squad.

I'm really surprised to see people saying this is better than the New Caprica stuff, for me, that was the best the show's ever been, with huge scope and emotionally wrenching material. This was like stepping right back into mid season two slow times. I hope that next episode gives us some kind of twist and new direction, just having everyone hanging around looking for Earth isn't enough anymore.
 
 
Robert B
00:38 / 30.10.06
Patrick,

Agree about the New Caprica episodes being some of the strongest. The Jammer and Gaeta scenes and Tigh mouthing off about Helo and Adama made this one for me. I'm hoping for more on the Cyclon side this season since we've been given a glimpse through Baltar now.
 
 
Grey Cell
12:59 / 30.10.06
Woah... didn't even know the third season had started until I saw this thread (no TV, no local broadcasts of BSG, no DVD's in local shops so far...). Just got the latest episodes off BitTorrent, and still digesting. One thing that caught my attention though:

Can the Cylons really see the future?

Most likely they would simply have enough processing power to factor in (almost) all variables when assessing a situation, giving them the ability to predict its outcome with an astronomically small margin of error -- much like the TechnoCore in the Hyperion Cantos...

I'm not sure how that would fit with what we've seem of them so far though, the skinjobs seem to have evolved to the point where they can succesfully emulate the concept "it's human nature to screw things up."

So maybe they only "know" the future in the same way that religious hardliners know for sure the Rapture is going to happen soon, or a bunch of neocons "know" they're going to "win" the war in Iraq.

I'd be disappointed if at some point the show's writers were going to come back and explain how everything that happened so far was all really planned by the Cylons from day one. That would feel like the queen-mother of all dei ex machina...
 
 
sorenson
19:27 / 30.10.06
Oddly, I feel that this episode wasn't quite dark enough. I was surprised that Zarek, rather than Roslin, ordered the 'illegal trials' -- weren't she and Tori drawing up lists of collaborators back on New Caprica? It seems a little too easy for her to waltz into the Presidency declaring the start of a truth and reconciliation commission.

Not dark enough! I found it plenty dark. I wasn't at all surprised that it was Zarek rather than Roslin who had ordered the trials. Roslin's prime obsession throughout the whole series has been saving the human race - I just can't see her ordering the death penalty that lightly. That said, I expect the 'truth and reconciliation commission'won't work out quite as smoothly as she might hope. If I was suprised at anything it was the new cozy relationship between the two of them - particularly the bit where Zarek claims that he ordered the trials to protect Roslin's future presidency.

I was also surprised that the jury of six didn't consider at all the ways that cyclons so effectively manipulate people - Starbuck of all people should understand how hard it can be to keep a sense of reality when a cyclon is working on you. Not that that is an excuse for treason - just that the circumstances are far more complex than the resistance seems to be able to cope with. I guess that is a factor in all wars though - oversimplification makes it possible to act.

I don't think the series is going to do a simple return to life aboard the fleet, by the way. I am not sure which direction it will go in, but I think having opened it out, they will use the return to the fleet as a claustrophobic space in which to build conflict that will then have to explode outwards somewhere, somehow. Just a guess...
 
 
PatrickMM
23:27 / 30.10.06
I was unclear at the end of the episode how Laura responded to what Zarek said. There was definitely some tension, but did she end up appointing him Vice President? I was not clear if the scene with Zare and Adama sitting together was meant to show their unbreakable tension or grudging reconciliation.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
00:56 / 31.10.06
I like that Zarek is going to be more of a player in this season, though. They need an unsympathetic vice-president.

And if the preview of next week's episode is anything to go by, we're certainly not returning to normal.

Hello, space race to Earth!
 
 
kowalski
00:58 / 31.10.06
The commentary podcast for the episode admits what we've basically come to expect from BSG: a deleted scene provides a far-better explanation of the Roslin-Zarek-Tribunal imbroglio.

Nutshell: Torrie provided Zarek with information that she and Roslin had assembled about collaborators during the occupation (ie. Roslin's journal), and conceivably steered Zarek towards the secret tribunal in the first place. This explains her prominence in the way Roslin's announcement of the amnesty is cut. It's a pity she's getting the short-end of the screen time stick, her pragmatism and shrouded intentions have the potential to make her one of the most interesting and unpredictable characters on the show. She certainly has a lot more potential than Billy ever did.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
04:29 / 31.10.06
I knew it. Damn the editors.
 
 
lekvar
01:24 / 03.11.06
I was a little disturbed but Roslin and Zarek so easily side-stepping electoral law, especially with Roslin being the stickler for due process. Zarek is just going to give the Presidency to her? She came to power through the law of succession. By the same token, Tom Zarek is the President no matter who likes it.

/rant rant rant

That said, I like to think that this is just a jumping-off point for some interesting political drama as the populace gets fed up with Roslin's Nice Tyrant act. I'm also curious to see what the writers are going to do with Zarek's character. He's been the gadfly outsider, he's been the gadfly insider. Will he be the "Bad Cop" to Roslin's "Good Cop"? Will this season be the Political Re-Education of Tom Zarek?

And is it wrong of me to want the writers to introduce a robot dog?
 
 
Grey Cell
12:23 / 03.11.06
Politicians, can't trust 'em.

He already explained it all, anyway. His past makes him too much of a controversial figure to be an effective leader for long, and he doesn't have the support of the military. Better to strike a deal, take a step back and keep working from behind the clean façade provided by Roslin. I suspect they both see the benefits of this arrangement.

The writers did put Boxey in the pilot episode, but probably never found a way to include him in the storyline afterwards. New Caprica provided some excellent opportunities to reintroduce a young boy and his pet dog (real or robot) in my opinion, but I guess it wasn't to be...
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
13:54 / 03.11.06
It is amusing that Zarek assumes that Roslin wants to be lilly-white/doesn't have the balls to 'do whats necessary', totally forgetting sheincited half the fleet to open revolt at Tight's command at the start of series two, ordered that Sharon's baby be taken from her and be told that it died and (I can't quite remember on this point ATM) possibly outlawed abortion in the fleet? She can be plenty hardcore if needed.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:16 / 03.11.06
I'm pretty sure she didn't outlaw abortion in the end, but, like you, I'm finding it fading into the mists of time and had in fact completely forgotten that episode until you just mentioned it.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
07:59 / 04.11.06
She did outlaw abortion - I imagine Baltar revoked that, unless he forgot.
 
 
Tom Coates
22:14 / 04.11.06
And now we have more insight into the Cylon condition and I have questions all over the place. What the crap is the hybrid?! Where did that come from?! Is Gaius a Cylon? Is there a split between the seven and the five? What's going on with Athena?!
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
22:43 / 04.11.06
WAAAAAAAHHH!

That was ace! I, too, have questions all over the shop. But I think I've stopped worrying that they were just going back to business as usual after New Caprica.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
00:11 / 05.11.06
this show is not afraid to be utterly geektastic at times. That was perhaps the most science fiction fan wetdream episode of the series, haha.

The hybrids were certainly interesting, but "we never speak of The Five" was the best bit. Possibly the Cylon Elder Council or something... I get a very Grey Council feeling from that statement.

And, well, shit... they are actually on the bleeping road to Earth.
 
 
sleazenation
13:35 / 05.11.06
The idea with the hybrids, as revealed on the podcast, is that one hybrid is in control of each basestar...
 
 
Tom Coates
17:50 / 05.11.06
What are they highbrids of!? Are they humans or Cylon? They're not one of the human form Cylons?!
 
 
Grey Cell
19:16 / 05.11.06
Not to mention the new tidbits about Cylon psychology being based entirely on projection -- as Six said: "We don't have to imagine, we project. We choose to see our environment in any form we wish, whenever we wish." Unless she was only referring to the way they decorate the Basestar interiors (which I don't believe), the implications of this are... vast.

I'm no expert on psychology and I'm going to refrain from using phrases I probably don't half understand myself, but as far as I'm concerned that was the biggest revelation of this episode.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
23:58 / 05.11.06
Yeah, great episode. And how about that plague.

I'm thinking of the projection thing in terms of Cylons having the potential to permanently operate in a kind of kinetic, virtual reality. They have enough memory to render every object in their actual environment differently.
 
 
penitentvandal
12:12 / 07.11.06
Is there any word of when this is gonna be on British telly? I'm going all headmelty just from reading descriptions of the episodes and I'd really like to be able to see them...
 
 
Robert B
14:54 / 11.11.06
Pretty good episode last night. Spoilers:







Rosalyn ready to unleash the plague on the entire Cylon race and Helo sabotaging the whole thing because genocide is "wrong." Funny how he is becoming the moral compass of the humans yet Rosalyn is supposedly all spiritual and thinks she's chosen to lead the humans to Earth.

Baltar tortued and professing his love to mental Six only to have Lucy Lawless think he's talking to her. That could be interesting...
 
 
kowalski
17:19 / 11.11.06
Will she just see it as Baltar professing his love to her? Or rather, is it her God professing His Love and Forgiveness to her through Baltar? Does Baltar now become God's Avatar/Mouthpiece/Son?
 
 
Robert B
21:00 / 11.11.06
Hmmm, you're right. Mine is way too simple. Baltar as God's voice? Makes sense with some of what he was telling her.
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
22:03 / 11.11.06
Helo's fu- frakked. Even with Adama closing the books on the Case of the Busted Bioweapon it's going to come out someday, and when it does there's going to be a lot of people looking to push him, and Athena, out of an airlock. He's effectively got the blood of every human that dies from here on on his hands, and that's going to dawn on him sooner or later.

Yay or nay: Was Helo right? I'm going to say nay.
 
 
Seth
00:26 / 12.11.06
Right or wrong, it's a good job he was around for all those high level important briefings that he's never been party to before. Good jawline, though.
 
 
jebni
02:35 / 12.11.06
Hasn't Helo been Galactica's XO for at least four months?
 
 
sleazenation
07:48 / 12.11.06
Even with Adama closing the books on the Case of the Busted Bioweapon it's going to come out someday

I don't see why this is necessarily so, after all, Galactica has time and again shown its willingness not to follow things up, such as the civillian fleet abandoned by Pegasus, the use of gang rape as an interrogation/torture technique, the investigation into the explosion on Cloud 9...
 
 
sleazenation
07:58 / 12.11.06
Something else that is slightly bothing me. At the start of every episode since season one we have been told that the Cylons have "A Plan" but this appears not to be the case.

The plan in season one was much speculated upon and now appears to have been 'wipe out the humans' this appears to have been modified later to 'co-exist with the humans' and now to 'find earth'.

That isn't A plan, it's a series of three or more changing plans. The Cylons appear to be making it up on the hoof as much as the writers are, which is all well and good if we haddn't been told all the way through that the Cylons had A (singular) plan.

Don't get me wrong - I'm glad that the cylons are no longer being played as monolithically as it was initially implied they were, I just wish i could escape the nagging feeling that show is going to avoid going all 'Alias'...
 
 
Tom Coates
10:02 / 12.11.06
After the last episode, I thought this one was significantly less interesting and actually quite clumsy in a range of ways. For a start it was pretty bloody obvious that you could use the disease as a weapon from the middle of last episode when they first discovered ill Cylons. Not really a revelation when Apollo comes up with his 'brilliant' idea. Yeah, Apollo, give yourself a chocolate bar.

I thought Helo's, "But then we become like them" line was bluntly offensively stupid. I can't tell you how many times you hear that line in sci-fi shows and how cheesy and stupid I've found it over the years. And for people to have accepted Athena into their lives and still view all Cylon as robots was also pretty ridiculous. One - accept that they're sentient creatures, just extraordinarily alien and weird ones. Two - accept that they've destroyed many billions of your people and want to exterminate you, your family and your civilisation at all costs, that there are many more of them than you and that there are very few possibilities that will emerge from this space. The BSG crew and their audience are smarter than this. They're not going to buy these arguments. It might be an unpleasant or desperate move, but I'm afraid it's pretty clearly the right move to make in the circumstances.

And finally, what the fuck!? I mean how many more traits will the Cylons have to evidence that make them clearly biologically different from humans before people start actually saying that they can easily spot them! For example, they produce an enzyme or whatever that humans don't that breaks down the virus. Secondly they can stick electrical cables in their arms and connet with them through some kinds of ports. Hello! Spottable!? Also, and I know this is an off the wall notion - their fucking spines glow when they shag things. Maybe look for people with three bar electric heaters in their vertebrae!?

Now no one's really talked about Cylons in the midst of the human population for a long time now, but it might be a good time for them to say that with Baltar gone and Doc Cottle exploring the case that actually it's not enormously hard to test for Cylon in the fleet.

All of which is not to say that I'm not enjoying the series, becuase I totally am. Just that this last episode really fell straight in the middle of a bunch of boring old clichés and exposed a bunch of crappy problems that they've been able to avoid interrogating but probably can't now...
 
 
sleazenation
10:29 / 12.11.06
There was apparently 8 cylon agents hidden in the fleet midway through last season - one of those was Number three - another was brother Cavil, which leaves 5 more - gaiven that the humans can identify all of the significant seven cylons we know about now it isn't an incredible leap to postulate that the cylons that remain in the fleet are the secret five we haven't seen yet...

Not that this revelation helps the fleet peeps at all - wasn't Baltar the only one to discover this little nugget? And didn't he actually keep it too himself.

Of course, I'm not puttting it past the writers to have forgotten all about it/or consider it as just a lie Boomer told to save The Chief...
 
 
Tom Coates
10:57 / 12.11.06
Ah but eight Cylon agents doesn't mean eight different models. Haven't we had one of the Aaron's, a Cavil, D'Anna, Shelly Godfrey and a Leoben as well?
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:56 / 12.11.06
Why on earth would you talk about the possibility that Boomer never even knew how many Cylons were/are in the Fleet - she just had to give Baltar a number to save Chief's life - as if it were some kind of cunning trick or lame excuse on the part of the writers? It always seemed the most likely option to me.
 
  

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