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All Star! Challenge

 
  

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Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
22:45 / 03.04.06
In light of the Villain Workshop thread, I thought it'd amuse to write up proposals for All-Star miniseries in the vein of Morrison & Quitely's Superman or Miller's Ass-Bats (there can be no other name); basically, you take a character, characters, or concept and run it through as an imaginary miniseries, preferrably around twelve issues to fit with the existing All-Star format. Rather than doing "Ultimate" versions of characters and situations, I'm talking about a self-contained continuity that possibly builds off of previous happenings, but in a simple and direct fashion. They don't have to adhere to the Silver Age like Superman, but why not an All-Star Wonder Woman set in the Golden Age? Hawkman? Think you can do better than John Byrne with a Silver Age Doom Patrol, or pull off a madcap mini with Morrison's menschs? I'd like to see an All-Star Human Target or Atom. Revise the Blackhawks for modern sensibilities.

Emphasis on setting up what you want as a status quo, whether it's a full reimagining or something less drastic. Outline villains and adventures you'd want to use in the series, and possibly set up an overarching plot, not unlike Superman's terminal sunstroke...how would you do it? Would you have that bigger plot, or would you do modular stories that are completely self-contained? What artist would you want to work with - besides Denfield, obviously, because he can't draw every single book in the imaginary line.

Challenges are to be made -- someone suggested someone or something they'd like to see revamped, and then someone else gets to have at it. It need not be a hero franchise either, but someone could ask to see a little old lady superhero and then somebody gets to play from scratch.

By way of example, I was thinking of redoing Metal Men with the gang as real robots again, not just transplanted humans, and Doc Magnus as a human being once more. I'd take Tina and follow through on her "platinum blonde" origins to take her away from the typical "dizzy blonde" characterization and play her more as Lorelei Lee from Gentlemen Prefer Blondes -- "dizzy," maybe, but that's more of an act, she's shrewd and knows more than she lets on. Actually, it'd be kind of intriguing to do a Metal Men in drag routine, with Gold dripping into a curvier shape for a day when Tina abandons the guys to go play at being the world's first robotic entertainer (Probably to be called "Gentlemen Prefer Platinum")...which could lead into Magnus introducing his "Metal Women" and the Platinum Man.

So, any takers? First challenge is the Atom. Bonus points for including the Power of the Atom sword and sorcery stuff for a chapter or two of the outline.
 
 
Aertho
23:12 / 03.04.06
Hey Papers! I can't find the link, but I swear to God I found this Silver Age Metal Men review online somewhere. Anyway: It veiwed Metal Men as an analogy on gay stereotypes. Gold was the bronzed prettyboy, Iron the muscled gymrat, Lead was a sweet chubbie, Tin was a nervous twink, Mercury obviously had the wit of your average mo, and Platinum was a drag queen/tranny. Magnus was seen as ridiculously closeted, and the Metal Men were his desires being externalised. It was brilliant. If someone just went for it and did something with that... I'd read it. Metal Men, Saviours of San Franscisco!

Now, as far as Atom goes: What was the whole deal there? He's a scientist and a teacher, but why the sword and sorcery stuff? Was scale explored as a motif, or was the size change merely a way to explore new realms(Microverse)? Any good links?
 
 
Mario
23:15 / 03.04.06
OK. First, we have to ask ourselves, "What is the essence of the character"? It seems to me that, if you take into account the Time Pool and the Sword era, the key to the best loved stories of the character appears to be "exploration".

So here's my quick & dirty outline. Ray Palmer isn't shrinking, per se, but using exotic matter to map himself into a smaller form. At first, it's merely an exotic oddity. He uses it to gain a new perspective on various scientific phenomena. (the first couple of issues) But when DEO agent Adam Cray steals the second prototype (it'd be incredible in espionage), they fight, shifting sizes and mass in a duel of quantum forces.

Something goes wrong. The interaction causes Ray to shift into a different harmonic dimesion, one of sword & sorcery, where he helps fight off invaders while trying to retune the belt to return home. Along the way, he'll discover that the leader of the invaders is Cray himself, who used his commando training to give his forces an edge.

Eventually, they have a final confrontation. Cray, maddened by his experiences, tries to use his belt to increase his size... it isn't pretty. Ray, now the savior of the kingdom, must choose to stay, or use the circuits from both belts to return home.

In the final issue, we discover his choice, as he reappears in the lab, and discovers that his experiences only took an hour or two. He works out what happened, and that he can use his shrinking belt to access so-called "virtual wormholes", allowing him to traverse wide distances of space... and even time.

Last page, he puts together a costume for himself, and for his fiancee (to protect them from the rigors of dimensional travel). And in a splash page to close the issue, the Atom & Nuclea vanish on their next adventure.

No flamethrowers needed
 
 
Mario
23:22 / 03.04.06
Oh, and should there be a sequel, it'd be the perfect excuse for an All-Star Chronos.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
23:22 / 03.04.06
I'll see what I can scrounge up for the Atom.

I'd love to read that review if you can find it! Reminds me of one panel of the "super-porn" sequence in Flex Mentallo -- "Intelligent alloys flowing and melting across shuddering flesh, forming pleasure armour." The sexual transformation aspects of the Metal Men would be a lot of fun to play with, especially if you take your closeted Doc and make him constantly trying to dismantle the Metal Men because his unconscious sexual discomfort keep manifesting when he rebuilds them. And Tin as the nervous twink is intriguing; uncomfortable with all the built and studly guys or the glamour-queen Platinum, he builds himself Nameless, tragically doomed to be his gal-pal and never get any. OH! The secret tragedy of the sexless Nameless. That would be worth an entire spotlight issue just for her.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
23:25 / 03.04.06
Sweet, Mario! I enjoy the use of elements like Adam Cray. Anyone want to take a crack at "All-Star Chronos?"
 
 
Mario
23:26 / 03.04.06
I meant to use Chronos as a villain. But if someone wants to use him as a hero, go right ahead.
 
 
Aertho
23:35 / 03.04.06
You guys gotta pick more mainstream characters! Not all of us have Official Guides to all known universes uploaded into their left brain. Mario, I'm talking to you.

I've been stewing an All-Star proposal for Aquaman that's only slightly the sword and sorcery take of the new series. But before I fully unroll the plot, you guys got any ideas, suggestions, curveballs?
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
23:40 / 03.04.06
Aquaman in....SPAAAAAAAAAAAAACE! (Heh).

Actually, for Aquaman, I'd be really tempted to an "Aquaboy and Lagoon Man" mini based off the Sins of Youth rigamarole. Only with better art (possibly Wieringo) than the oneshot for those two got. Aquaboy was so much less dignified than Aquaman, the kingly pretentions were gone and something cruder was there...you could pull a total Psycho Beach Party with bopping sixties grooves...
 
 
Aertho
23:49 / 03.04.06
...


Okayyy... I was thinking something with a bit more political intrigue and an impending war on the surface-dwellers, but I guess I could hire Annette Funicello to play Mera...
 
 
Mario
23:59 / 03.04.06
Aquaman, huh?

I'm thinking the best way to start is from the beiginning. Have him gain his throne for the first time, but make it a more interesting trip. I think the key here may be to take a page from the Obsidian Age, and actually think about what kind of civilzation would exist underwater. Since we can start from a clean slate, why not make it _truly_ alien, not just people in tights who ride seashells & use a lot of seashells in their architecture?

Given that his character arc is more or less pre-ordained, this is a story that may need to be carried by the art. I'm thinking Michael Zulli. He can do lush & exotic. And he can also give the book a fairytale quality that will make it feel more fantastic, less superheroic.
 
 
Mario
00:02 / 04.04.06
Ride seaHORSES, I mean.

And yeah, we could include some political intrigue.
 
 
Mario
00:30 / 04.04.06
How's this work?

Start with the standard origin... exposed on Mercy Reef, found by a lighthouse keeper, etc. This time, tho, rather than him finding Atlantis by accident, they find HIM... when scouts from Atlantis attack his home (which, naturally, is on the coast) in a mission to test the surface world's security.

He repels their attack, and (borrowing one of their copper & green uniforms) goes to seek Atlantis for some answers. He discovers his heritage, but now has to fight his younger half-brother, the present ruler, for the throne. Not only because it's right, but to save the land he loves....
 
 
Aertho
01:01 / 04.04.06
Hm... I was thinking more Elizabeth than Camelot.

Atlantis is a four billion year old civilization based on the Middle Eastern and Mediteraennean cultures. Does anyone think for a moment that they'd have a peaceful and unified way of life? I'm thinking of superadvanced technologies based on thought active plastics and organic structures. Telepathy and deep sea bodystrength is not a genetic certainty, but a magic ritual done to babies. All kinds of cultures and religions and spread out from Egyptian, Middle Eastern, Indian, Greek and Etruscan lineage. Mermaids were a slave race designed by ancient wizards. Oceanus and Tethys run a bar for exiled watergods in the Gulf of Mexico. All in all it's crazy down there and full of diversity. Atlantis Proper is similar in many ways to the most liberal of surface states, with a democratic government and a bubbling economy. Religion isn't as necessary there as it is in more dire grottos. Other undersea nations are somewhat anti-Atlantis.

Alright. First issue is President Vulko of the Atlantic Nation sitting with his council going over the warlike happenings in the Pacific states. Seems some upstart is rallying and uniting the disparate kingdoms in the South Atlantic, Arctic and Indian Oceans with those of the severely wartorn Pacific. Vulko sits and listens to the story of this already legendary foreigner who claims to be the rightful heir and emperor of the Drowned World. Issue ends with Arthur, Atlan (as Merlin), and the combined forces of several undersea kingdoms just beyond the capitol dome of Atlantis. He demands surrender.

President Vulko turns to his cabinet and asks "is he for real?"
 
 
Mario
01:16 / 04.04.06
I guess the question is... do we want to reinvent the character, or distill him down to his essence? I was doing the latter, but your take sounds like a better story.
 
 
Billuccho!
01:17 / 04.04.06
The story of Aquaman is a modern underwater Arthurian legend that's a mix of fantasy, western, and sci-fi. Aquaman as roaming adventurer king, a man of two worlds who can't sit still on the throne and is always off saving maidens. Imagine an underwater Captain Kirk on a seahorse. Atlantis as an evolved Camelot, or perhaps the lost sunken Avalon, which has built itself up into a deepsea continent. There, high scientific technology blends with ancient magic into a modern ancient Greece, if you catch my drift: a little bit of Athens, a little bit of Sparta, plus Camelot, of course, and maybe the knights of the seashell table.

And yeah, Aquaman would uncover the Crime of the Ancient Mariner, face the deadly Fishermen, tackle the Monster from the Mariana Trench, and other kooky stuff. And we'd have seahorses, and Topo, and Tusky, and the royal guard would be called the Aquamarines or something, because, you know, what the hell.
 
 
Aertho
01:35 / 04.04.06
The above post of mine was basically the teaser.

The origin comes the next issue when President Vulko requests an audience. Arthur's a half breed like the original origin, but is discovered by mad Atlan, who's down with the enormous protogenoi Pontus, and knows that his mother's family is descended from the first kings of Atlantis. Shades of Da Vinci Code and Hero when Atlan compels Arthur to use the legends of Ye Olde Atlantis to end the wars in the superstitious Arctic and Pacific colonies.

Instead of all-out war with Atlantis Proper, Vulko abdicates rule of Atlantis to Arthur, while stying on to handle political affairs as is his station as President. Vulko knows something must be done about the waste and destruction that the surface world is doing to his people, and the suffering that prolonged inaction is propogating. With Atlantis's support, Arthur can unite the disparate clans and tribes strewn about the oceans, and get them all to work together to build filtration stations at the Great Gyres. But without that unity, things can only get worse. Enemies behind enemies behind enemies. There's also a secret that the watergods know about the surface world that must be revealed... That they'd been exiled for a reason.

So yeah, Arthur crowned King of a thousand year old democratic nation in issue three, and you know that's comedy + assassination attempt.
 
 
Aertho
01:42 / 04.04.06
I think I'm making up Ultimate Aquaman. I'll stop now.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
01:48 / 04.04.06
Was sort of brilliant, and you stuck with whole overarching plot idea. I might write up something more specific with the Metal Men - something fuller - when I get the chance. Who's got the next challenge?

Actually, speaking of challenging - what about the Unknown? The Challengers of the Unknown would be a good place to start. Some mid-point between the classic Kirby and the later Chaykin stuff. I'd actually be quite intrigued to do a twelve-issue mini focusing on a lot of the different adventuring types - the Challengers, Rip Hunter, Blackhawks, et cetera - all being members of the Challengers umbrella organization.

Except, wait, I'm basically just pitching Planetary, aren't I? Elijah Snow used to work with a gang called the Conquerers of the Uncanny (breezed through Gotham once), and in that "Zeropoint" issue with the Matrix ripoff, the Prof he's seen working with seems to be the Prof Haley analogue.

But, does anyone have some fresh ideas for a Challengers revival?
 
 
Aertho
02:08 / 04.04.06
Challenge the unknown superdimensional places... kind of like I wanted to do with Alex Thoth. What would a comic advenure be like if the protagonists were taken to, and thus rendered as Flatlanders? Or explored theoretical positioning... like a comic that had to be read forward and backward to get to the point - the staples? One issue could just be challenging the unknown human capacities for violence and revulsion... very NC-17, but that's another Challenge. I suppose the final Challenge would be one of discovering "meaning", but maybe it ends with the lead character opening, and reading Promethea. That's kind of meta.
 
 
grant
02:15 / 04.04.06
I'm not up in the field enough to know the difference between "All-Star" and "practically every comic released from '85 to '95," but I'm guessing "not really retconning" is the key difference.

My first thought was All-Star Kamandi, Boy from the Future, but that's just novelty for novelty's sake. My second thought was All-Star Swamp Thing, but some mountains really shouldn't be climbed. What I'd really like to see is All-Star Green Arrow, but, basically, it's "Robin Hood, here and now," and you're done.

No, what I think I want to read (but don't know how exactly to do it) is All-Star Sgt. Rock & Easy Company.
 
 
Aertho
02:19 / 04.04.06
In Iraq?
 
 
Aertho
02:36 / 04.04.06
I think a few retcons are okay — Lois and Superman aren't married, and which goddamn Robin is this exactly? I figured All-Stars were rewinds and do-overs. When I realized I'd rewound Atlantis a few thousand years, that's when i decided to stop.
 
 
CameronStewart
11:03 / 04.04.06
>>>The Crime of the Ancient Mariner<<<

That's brilliant.
 
 
Mario
11:11 / 04.04.06
RE: All-Star Challengers.

I've had notes for an old-fashioned "science adventure" book for _years_.

I also have an idea that could work for All-Star Green Lantern....
 
 
grant
14:44 / 04.04.06
In Iraq?

I don't know. To do some behind-the-scenes/backstory talk, I think our attitudes to war have changed significantly since the 50s and the 70s -- but Rock has always been popular enough to be a draw. Except I don't think he's been around much lately, has he?


>>>The Crime of the Ancient Mariner<<<

That's brilliant.


Seconded.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
14:48 / 04.04.06
grant- There's a new Sgt. Rock book coming out in a few months, I believe. It may feature -- gasp -- the paranormal! Or something.

Mario- do we get to see some of your science adventure notes? Please?
 
 
grant
15:02 / 04.04.06
Mario: Spill.

I think I just started to get an idea about a Sgt. Rock called out of semi-retirement (drill instructor for the reserves) and rotated into active duty. But I need to know more about what the character's really like.
 
 
Aertho
15:08 / 04.04.06
I know Rock flew the payload into Imperiex years ago. "Died" according to the gubment... but like I said: years ago.

With regard to battlegrounds, who would he fight? Maybe it's not important. Maybe the book's really about survival in a strange land and apprehension of some terrible enemy? And when he does fight the badguy, it turns out to be children or Amazons or something.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:30 / 04.04.06
You could follow that line and do a "Rock by way of Kafka" routine where he's sent on a classified mission and not even told any specifics about where he is, what the mission exactly is - he's just given coordinates, or something - and has to figure things out for himself...
 
 
grant
15:45 / 04.04.06
Got it.
The DC Secret Files pdf. And the Wikipedia entry.

Screw the rotated into active duty malarkey, and fuck that "survived to become Luthor's general" business. He died on the last day of World War II, killed by the last bullet fired in the last battle. That's the original writer's version, and it suits the guy I half-remember reading as a kid.

But he left a diary.

And some poor schmo in a field hospital in Basrah or somewhere is looking at the empty spot in the bed where his left leg used to be, thinking about how easy it'd be to improvise his own explosive device to get the gung-ho lieutenant who cost him his leg, and he finds it. And since he's got nothing better to do, he starts reading it.

So: 12 issues, each one a separate story, but all within the framing story of a soldier in Iraq, wounded by a war he never believed in, reading about the gut-wrenching WW II exploits of Sgt. Frank Rock. Of course, each one ends with some kind of dark lesson about human motivations and, you know, the idea that war has always been hell. The spy issue. The mission-as-propaganda issue. The civilians-in-the-crossfire issue. The horrors of triage issue (picking which soldier gets the life-saving medication). The heroic-but-doomed enemy issue (c.f. None But the Brave, my favorite war movie ever). The Big Lesson at the end which finally gets absorbed by our nihilist narrator is, of course, Frank Rock's credo: hate the war, hate the causes of war, love your team. And never, ever give up.

There.

I could write that thing.
 
 
Aertho
15:49 / 04.04.06
Then do it. Tuesdays with Saving Princess Bride? That's brilliant.
 
 
grant
15:56 / 04.04.06
It'd be sweet if one of Easy Company (probably Jackie Johnson) was revealed to be the C.O. of the hospital at the end of the story. Or at least is a high-ranking officer. Or... hmm, to get the ages right, it'd have to be the guy's kid or grandkid. Anyway, there's some Easy Company connection at the end of the framing story (thus, the idea that Rock's comrades are keeping his diary in circulation).
 
 
Mario
16:59 / 04.04.06
It actually started out as sort of an FF riff, but I've let it drift pretty far from that basis. It's possible that, with a little tweaking, it could work as a Challengers book.

**

Basic Concept

Approximately 25 years ago, the archaeologist Cyrus Wilde succeeded where all had failed. He found Atlantis. To his surprise, it was inhabited, and they were willing to have limited contact with the outside world. This caused him to acquire two things.

1. Atlantean technology, which has allowed him to become extremely self-sufficient.
2. A wife, namely Danae Atlantides, Princess of Atlantis and Priestess of Her Gods.

Together, they continue their explorations into the strange, the rare, and the unusual, gaining a certain amount of celebrity in the process. Time passed, and Danae gave birth to twins, Perseus and Andromeda Wilde. As they grew to adulthood, they joined their parents on their expeditions, and have since become full members of the team.

If it's exotic, dangerous, or downright weird, the Wilde Pack will be there.

Characters

* Cyrus: Archaeologist, Historian, Explorer. Not particularly buff, but he's the sort of person for whom this line from Indiana Jones & The Last Crusade is actually non-fiction:

"[He]'s got friends in every village from here to the Sudan. He speaks a dozen different languages, knows every local custom."

* Danae: As a priestess, she's capable of communicating with genii loci... dryads, nymphs, et cetera. She used to be able to interact with greater spirits (i.e. gods) but lost that ability when she wed...well, actually on the wedding night.
* Perseus...did not enjoy childhood very much. In early adolescence, having studied the more martial magicks of his heritage, he became rather reckless, and a bit of an adrenaline junkie. He took upon himself the sobriquet "Maxx" (he thought the two X's made it cooler), and answers to nothing else. *Never* call him Percy. He has a tattoo on his left arm, given to him by his mother, which acts as an invocation to the gods for strength and protection. (In her own words, "If you are going to scar your body, it might as well be something _useful_".) He's also the star of "The Wild Side, with Maxx Wilde", a hit with the in crowd, who regularly tune into his online web broadcasts. He looks something like this.
* Andromeda: Andromeda takes after her father, although she prefers more practical sciences, and is in fact the creator (by the time of the first story, she's 23) of much of the team's equipment. She gained the nickname Tinker many years ago, and answers to it as easily as her real name. When not in the field, she acts as the producer/videographer of Maxx's broadcasts.
 
 
Aertho
17:44 / 04.04.06
Sounds like Tom Strong. What's the tone like? New Pulp?
 
  

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