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7 Soldiers: The Bulleteer

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16:28 / 16.03.06

And acts similarly to the effects of Sublime.

19:42 / 16.03.06

Anyone wanna give me some Spyder spoilers?

19:44 / 16.03.06

No Spyder this ish, Jack.

20:33 / 16.03.06

Haven't read it yet, but it sounds like Bulleteer does *not* end with the same "let's go get the Sheeda" page/panel that the 4 round one books have. Same holds true for MM. Thoughts on that?

Guardian is taking it to the Sheeda at Slaughter Swamp with Baby Brains and Guardian Girl.

Zatanna was called upon by Misty to take it to the Sheeda.

Shining Knight made her proclamation that she was coming for Gloriana.

Klarion takes the drill tank up to earth proclaiming "today I am a Soldier!"

Why not the others?

20:45 / 16.03.06

These are the three that don't necessary see "enemies". Granted, it's hard to not see what the Sheeda do as being "friendly or benevolent", but the last three are more interested in compromise, consensus, solving the real problems, and seeing the big picture. Instead of going off to fight, Shilo, Alix and Frank may deal with the invasion in other, more complex ways.

21:03 / 16.03.06

Could the fact that these three minis were part of the "second wave" be relevant?

21:10 / 16.03.06

Cassandra - somehow, I don't think Frankenstein vs the Fairy Folk is going to be particularly subtle. From what I gather, it's going to be a gore-fest "the likes of which have never been seen in comics!" and explain to us the 'secret history of teh sheeda!!1!'. At least, that's if DC's finally sorted out those lying solicitations...

22:22 / 16.03.06

Yeah, well we have yet to se the ENDING of said issue.

I didn't feel reeeeally bad for Sally until "I have t-t-tried to get a job, i really have, but no one thuh-thinks i'm... old... old enough..."

Talk about powerless. Man.

Still glad Alix dropped an engine on her.

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

23:11 / 16.03.06

I think the narrative's a bit flawed - it's easy to forget that she's been remade into a bad girl - a bit of chemical rape - by Hyde's "evil serum." While I don't think this entirely excuses Sally's actions, she's still be rendered cruel. The story glosses over that a bit too much - it's used as an excuse for getting her into the hardcore superporn but it's presumably still a factor in her current behaviour.

23:17 / 16.03.06

Hmm... another "evil" drug reference from supposedly straight-edge GM. I guess one could use the idea that taking a potion could render one newly "evil", but i think it's more like key 23. ssay you're evil once you take the potion, and you become so, because you believe it. Not in the text, per say, but that's just what I got from it.

You're ultimately responsible for your own behavior.

Sorry Sally. Don't take it out on us.

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

23:27 / 16.03.06

Or, alternatively, she finally has a concrete "reason" to go apeshit and take vengeance for all the problems in her life. She's drunken the potion, and it doesn't matter if she's still on the potion or not, she can just say she's evil and it's all okay. Alix will always come off looking better, but these are both wronged women -- it's just Alix actually deals with the issue rather than using it as an excuse.

Sidenote: Sally is locked up in a wardrobe, and then disappears out the back. Superland as Narnia.

23:59 / 16.03.06

Ha! I went straight to Captain 7 from Nowhere Street.

Who wants to bet there were seven Wind Kings?

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

00:16 / 17.03.06

Or, you know, eight.

Perhaps Sally's connection is Sheeda debasement, marked for service of greater ill.

Maybe, seeing as she can't age or possibly die of old age, Sally Sonic is Gloriana.

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

00:23 / 17.03.06

(especially given the similarity between the whistle and another Sheeda weapon, the magic horn used for making floaty runes & summoning starry Nebula Men).

01:41 / 17.03.06

Some possible definitions for Vitaman:

VitaMan Natural Grooming for Men

VitaMan stands apart from other men's products due to our commitment to offering the highest quality and most effective ingredients available.

Our shaving, skincare and haircare ranges are formulated utilising unique Australian Native Plant, Herb and Fruit Extracts, which have been used by Indigenous Australians for over 30,000 years, and which have been scientifically proven in their effectiveness in treating a wide range of male skin conditions such as dry, dehydrated skin, ageing, sun-damaged skin, shave rash, problem skin, dull brittle, thinning hair and itchy flaky scalp conditions.

Developed by co-owners Glenn Kiddell (Naturopath/Herbalist) and Clare Matthews (Beauty Therapist & International Skincare Lecturer) along with Vic Cherikoff (Australia's leading Scientific Researcher & Author on Australian Native Medicine and Bush Food).

King Vitaman
Quaker Oats King Vitaman New King Vitaman
1970 2000
These Jay Ward Studio characters included King Vitaman, and his knights: Sir Laffitup, and Sir Cravenleigh, plus foes Blue Baron and Not-So-Bright Knight.

Originally, King Vitaman was a straight man to his supporting characters. When he mentioned his name, the others didn't know whether he meant himself or the cereal. For example, he would command someone to pour milk on King Vitaman and they'd spill it on him to which he'd yell "Not me! The cereal!" (Not pictured is the second version in which King Vitaman was a sillier character who thwtated his villians by himself).

The cereal itself was very much like Cap'n Crunch in that it tore up the roof of your mouth.

The animated characters lasted only one year (1970) before they were replaced by a human king (George Mann) with a crown of spoons and a red and white checkered tablecloth robe. King Vitaman Cereal was touted as "the 100% vitamin and iron cereal" with "sugary sweet tasty little crowns...kids love'em!"

In 2000, Quaker Oats replaced the human king with a new animated king.

Vita-Ray

The ray used with Erskine's formula in order to make Captain America. It was also used for a British Superhero known as the Destroyer in order to give him super strength.

12:20 / 17.03.06

Beastmaster suggests that the evil serum is Morrison's way of making fun of the Xorneto Retcon and all those stupid ways that good guys go bad through a blameless plot device. Sally was being broken and corrupted due to events in her own life, but they'll be able to "fix" her by saying it was just the evil serum making her act that way. Fanboys rejoice at the discovery of a loophole! Sally Sonic may yet return to being a True Hero™.

12:22 / 17.03.06

Should someone tell Paty Cockrum?

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

18:37 / 17.03.06

Yugh. I can honestly say I don't want Sally to be transposed into a True Hero Again. She's an effective foil for Alix, having an invulnerability power that dissolves bullets (and what's Alix) and a similar inability to age properly. She also represents the stunted adolescence that Alix rails against. Alix got to grow up -before- she became immortal.

Alix is eternally 'no longer part of the target demographic' (thinking back to what Jack Fear said over in that crossovers thread) but is also eternally at the emotional and physical maturity to actually accomplish real change if she wants. She's old enough to be taken seriously.

03:58 / 18.03.06

My first guess for "Earth's first superhero" was the Crimson Avenger. Pro's: Crimson Avenger appeared in comics before Superman, he was a gun wielder, the red in the Bulleteer's costume, and Crimson Avenger was one of the original Seven Soldiers alongside Vigilante. Cons: Too obvious for Morrison?

Wikipedia says Morrison referenced the Crimson Avenger in the Justice League. Does anyone know which issue(s) this was in?

10:00 / 18.03.06

Crimson Avenger's cape was part of the initiation ritual for Aztek joining the JLA in Aztek #10.

10:03 / 18.03.06

Cass's link for I am NOT the Beastmaster went to page one of this thread.

12:09 / 18.03.06

That's actually an interesting theory (about the Crimson). Although it makes the "direct descendant" part a little less special.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

12:23 / 18.03.06

Hurrah for Grant Morrison! Examining the concepts of sex and sexuality in contemporary comics through a catfight between two gorgeous women, one of whom has big breasts.

13:16 / 18.03.06

I vote yes on Crimson Avenger as Alix's grandpappy. We never did learn her maiden name. Travis?

20:39 / 19.03.06

Somebody named Adrian over on Comics Should be Good suggested that Alix get a job with a reboot of Morrison's Doom Patrol.

That makes so much sense it's sick.

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

15:05 / 20.03.06

Mordant: Hurrah for Grant Morrison! Examining the concepts of sex and sexuality in contemporary comics through a catfight between two gorgeous women, one of whom has big breasts.

There are many different ways of subverting cliche or genre convention for effect. Traditional depiction of comic book heroines is being subverted here, riffing off the existing tropes -- this is one way of accomplishing this. If you want to see see a different form of subversion (possibly with woman of different body type, smaller breasts, et cetera), could you discuss this more? And if your issue is more with the choice of Yanick Paquette as artist -- he only seems to draw one female body type -- I'd refer you to earlier pages of this thread, where that was discussed, and how stereotypical female depication can be used for subversive effect. I'm not exactly happy about Paquette's style - partly because he does favour two, maybe three body types across the board and many of his women end up looking too similar (in that, Alix is at least allowed some diversity), but the choice of two "gorgeous women" having a super-catfight can be used effectively to point out the problems with the genre that generates such catfights (look at Alix's continuing desire to stop the fight and find out what Sally's problem is, rather than continuing the melee).

Bulleteer is about cottage superheroics and the super-powered pornographic industry, there has to be a certain "porn star" quality to the female characters to further this aim - it's comparing/contrasting, to some extent, the wish fulfillment that drives both super-comics and porno. Sally Smart is a child with a particular view of the "ideal woman" she'd like to grow up into, probably because of media portrayals around her, and is given a magical whistle that lets her change into that ideal woman -- and then traps her between her two selves, with no room to grow and move. She is caught being a "gorgeous woman" and a "bad girl," and will never grow or change beyond that.

I'm not saying that the work is a perfect examination, but there can be no perfect examination. Want to discuss your take further?

15:49 / 20.03.06

Yeah, for all that it was an object example of 'having your cake and eating it' I hardly think the story would have worked if - you know - the characters didn't look somewhat like the vaguely dysmorphic, balloons-up-jumpers figures superhero fans will be long since accustomed to. Michael Turner could've drawn it, but that'd've been nauseating. Paquette at least has chops.

Anyway, I'm thinking Alix is definitely a descendant of (first superhero) Lancelot; Lugh of the Long Hand, spears and all that. Also, he's chronologically the first victim of a Sheeda agent (Neh-Buh-Loh) seen in the narrative. She'll be the one to finish it, closing out a 10,000 yr debt, and then there'll be some sweet-ass (lit.?) symmetry. I'd hang my hat on that, pretty certain.

15:51 / 20.03.06

Two things, Papers: 1) 'snot Mordant there, 's flowers, and he's occ. prone to have a c*rp. 2) I'd actually argue 'Bad Girls' pretty much is a perfect examination.

15:54 / 20.03.06

Of comics bad girls that is. Of the titular subject.

I'm going for the finderwolf consecutive posts record here.

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

16:06 / 20.03.06

*slaps forehead* Dowh. Flowers. Right. For some reason, in between reading and posting, my brain hiccuped.

I suppose by "perfect examination," I mean one that everyone can agree with.

16:25 / 20.03.06

When does a hero become a superhero?

Because Lancelot is a mythic hero, and I'm thinking superheroes are products of the 20th Century. Any criteria that delineates between plain heroes and supers?

16:37 / 20.03.06

I was going to be a smartass and say superpowers, but yeah - Batman, and indeed each of the seven soldiers don't really have. There was some big play given to 'icons', as in physical insignia in 1,000,000 but that too seems pretty notably absent here.

Extranormal abilities used for (the greater) good, saving teh world, etc.? A costume?

Hallo, Paper Spaceboy

16:40 / 20.03.06

Multiplicity of identity? No, I suppose "Long-Armed" and other honorifics would probably apply.

16:41 / 20.03.06

A special weapon or accoutrement, like a lance, shield, magic rings, hawks, hat or cat?

16:47 / 20.03.06

Vigilante behaviour?

IE: NXM"s Scott Summers is a superHERO, whereas NXM's Emma Frost was merely superHUMAN. There's an obvious element of intention.

Dunc may be on to something with suggested a specialized weapon or extrahuman addition to one's cultural identity. Superman ain't Superman without a red cape? Does that hold true?

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