BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


"Stupid" magick, religion and spirituality questions

 
  

Page: 123(4)56789... 83

 
 
illmatic
10:03 / 14.11.05
what could this indicate? Does it have something to do with some conception of an astral body being the opposite of corporeal one, thus the opposite chakra rotation? Or is there something completely out of wack with my subtle body?

Going to have a go at this one. Personally, with any sort of "subtle body" work, it's my opinion that you're dealing with something that basically isn't real - I don't want to get into a big argument about this, but it's certainly not as real as your physical body, is it? Or - it's certainly hugely influenced by your subjectivity, isn't it? It looks to me like you're already starting to worry about the reality/implications of your dream (ie, asking "is it out of wack"), but without connecting this to lived, physical experience. Looking at other peoples maps online isn't going to provide clarity, IMO, because you will always be able to find something simiar to what you're looking for, and just because someone else has had a weird experience doesn't mean yours is exactly the same. Experience is plastic and our minds can play a huge role in creation/interpolation of these models - thus the huge variety of subtle body maps out there. Someone commented to me recently that these "maps" themselves are kind of seductive because we get hung up/attached to them, in all their colourful glory, and this in itself might retard our progress and/or blind us to what is really happening in our bodies - the experience and movement of that which is natural. What I'd actually concentrate on is linking any of these conceptions that you have to the actual experience of your body - breathing, movement, sensation. That's the real magic as far as I'm concerned.

I'm quite interested in taoist conceptions of the subtle body myself, which despite their insane complexity seem to all imply that the forms are ultimately masks for something undefinable. That's a useful way to look at it, I think.
 
 
Unconditional Love
15:49 / 14.11.05
The subtle body to me seems about your own psychological relationship to your body, it becomes psychosomatic, it might be helpful to create your own subtle body map, investigate each area under meditation and note impressions physical sensations and literally create a digram of yourself based on the visions and impressions you recieve.

For example you might find your shoulders tense, what colour is that, what texture, what smell and taste, what memories, taking a leaf from the taoists you might liken it too terrain, mountain peaks with streams somewhere the water is pooling. The important thing is too consider both the mental impressions and visions and the physical body together, noting the relationship between them and how you relate too your body, also note that the impressions arent static they change with your postures and activities, the food we eat, how often we exercise. build a subtle body grounded in physicality, your own physicality and impressions.

a similar notion exsists in taoism of creating an embryo of an immortal self, its something that has to be formed, worked at, you put the work in to give it shape and form.
It can be built from inside out or outside in, but in my own experience it is better to build both at the same time and foster a healthy relationship between mind and body, taking the time to realise and contemplate that they may well be the same.

Basically what illmatic said.
 
 
Gendudehashadenough
22:06 / 14.11.05
All the responses to my post have been of supreme use, and yes IllOff, I am just starting to have what I can only call "sensations" of something inside that is not used to being analyticaly interpreted sensation. I wouldn't say, though that I necessarily ascribe to one map, or system of interpreting these centers, but rather, come to it by a more experiential/common sense approach, which mainly consists of disbelieving ANY system that I have come across, no matter how on point it seems to be (I do like all the porty colors though). It just seems obvious to me, through my experiences of exericise and getting to know my body's anatomy that there should be some significance associated with various parts of the body, and the "organs" that represent them.

The subjectivity of such "subtle body" experiences is of primary importance, especially when they happen in a dream, any like a side of irony with the body? Ahem. The only thing I'm sure of is that these experiences are becoming increasingly intense, pushy, and unwilling to be pushed back into the overgrown recesses of mind, and so are contributing to the psychosomatic response my reality is having. I've always felt physical tension in muscles, tendons, joints. Only now it's not just the body making those complains C/O life.

Yea, I'm a hung up on this idea of the Way, I'll admit. Many things I read a good few years ago are starting to reveal new implications, the basis of which I'd thought was lost, but this one has been brewing a while. I need to challenge the body a little more and the mind a little less.

Again, really helpful stuff coming out of BarBelith the last many months.

Peace
 
 
Earlier than I thought
14:36 / 24.11.05
Another foolboy question...
Over the last few months I've been increasingly drawn towards work with the lwa. I'm aware from other posts that this can be heavy stuff and I'm trying to research as much as I can. Thing is, they are quite active with me already. Strings of coincidences prevail and I was dreaming about a figure that I now identify as Legba (in his old-man-with-stick aspect) at a time when all I knew on the subject was watching 'Live and Let Die'.

After a few weird and dangerous incidents around crossroads, I improvised a kind of natural/urbanspace altar and made a few discreet offerings to Legba, at which point I got results like never before. I've since tried a few gently respectful low-key offerings at home which seem to generate a very intense sense of - well, presence, I suppose I'd describe it as.

So - I guess I'm asking for advice, suggestions and warnings here. This feels very, very right and positive for me, but has anyone got any other perspectives that I should consider? Or did I just make myself look really dumb?
 
 
Morgana
14:48 / 20.12.05
Right, I've got a stupid question today...

*blushes*

Did anyone ever reverse a separation-spell or has an idea how to do that? I've banished some people from my life a couple of years ago with a little ritual that worked really well - and now I'd like to have one of them back, as I 've overreacted a bit concerning her. At the moment there doesn't seem to be any chance of getting close again, even if we do meet and even though I'm quite sure, she would like to be friends again, too. So I somehow have to break that bloody spell, but how...?

Great, I feel like a fluffbunny now - slay me!
 
 
gale
15:55 / 20.12.05
I once banished someone from my life, and after a year or so I realized that I missed her terribly. I ended up writing her a letter that said, in effect, I MISS YOU. Not too soon after, she called. She is a wonderful friend and I made a mistake.

I think you can unbanish your friend using nonmagical means. It's alot simpler!
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
23:31 / 20.12.05
If it was me, I'd write this person a letter and post it. If hir addy was unknown, I'd concoct an address based on the qualities and states of being that I missed. Find a post-box somewhere portentious, like a crossroads or a site of some historic interest; if preferred, post the letter inside a dead tree, a crack in a rock, a wishing-well, ect.

(Disclaimer: bear in mind I've never done anything quite like this--messages I've sent on in this manner have been for people who I haven't met yet/are dead/are nonexistant/are fictional.)
 
 
Morgana
09:28 / 21.12.05
Thanks very much - I think to write a letter and not actually send it to her is a good idea, as the problem is I have to somehow reconfigure myself to allow her to be part of my life again. That's why I can't simply write a letter and send it to her. I just wouldn't do it... Perhaps I should send it to myself *g*
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
17:04 / 27.12.05
I need a working to combat depression.

After sitting down and reflecting seriously on the matter I have decided that the only thing stopping me from sorting my life out is my mental health ishoos. Once I get that sorted, things like books, jobs, music, not-being-quite-so-fat ect will follow. I've been trying to get over it with a big Effort of Will but have been forced to conclude that Efforts of Will are frankly overrated.

I'm putting together a mojo hand (or I will be, once I get a shagging angelica root), I've been taking St. John's Wort for about 3 weeks now, and I'm doing one or two other things to help.

The trouble is that the bit of me that the Black Dog most enjoys gnawing on is my motivation. I don't spend all day crying, listening to Silverchair and cutting up, I just get a bit grim and mopey and disinclined to do very much except stare out of windows. This means that a working involving things to be done every day tend to be a bit self-defeating. In the short term they're okay--say, daily something or the other for a week or three--but after that the rot tends to set in. Bear in mind that I do maintain a daily practice already, so anything else is going to be on top of that. What I need is an initial quick-fix to get things started--then maybe I'll be in a position to add a long term element.

I'm actually feeling rather braced right now because for years I've been attacking things that were essentially peripheral issues, like jobs and so forth, while avoiding the real problem. Even a minor improvment in motivation levels would make a real difference to my quality of life.

Any suggestions appreciated.
 
 
Mistoffelees
17:46 / 27.12.05
Mordant, that reads as if I´ve written it. I got the exact same problem.

So I´d be very interested in any suggestions, too!
 
 
LykeX
18:09 / 27.12.05
I have similar issues myself. I've decided on the ancient ritual of talking to a shrink.
I feel that in my situation (as opposed to yours, which I know nothing about) doing spells and potions would be taking a huge detour and possibly work as a hindrance to actually getting anything done.

My point is simply that it's what works that counts.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
18:15 / 27.12.05
Absolutely; and if I hadn't exhausted all conventional means of tackling my problem, I'd be a bit of a fool to be reaching for the spellbook. But I've reached the limits of what analysis can do, I can't take conventional meds because I'm an epo and they give me fits, and so on and so forth.
 
 
Anthony
18:57 / 27.12.05
i'm having a similar problem recently. sometimes i think we can build up a great amount of unprocessed emotions that need to be faced & purged.

i was going to ask if anyone ever experienced a sheer inexplicable feeling of raw terror accompanied with complete mental & emotional disarray. and if anyone had ideas what this was.
 
 
Anthony
19:01 / 27.12.05
i've been on antidepressants but i found they made me feel very physically ill after a time, so i kicked them, which was one of the most hellish experiences i've ever been through, and i still have the same crap to face as i did when i was on them, and it never really went away, it was always there eating me up under the surface. so now i'm facing it square on and hoping it doesn't destroy me.

i would recommend particularly, lustral for a quick boost provided it doesn't interfere with previously existing conditions. it got me out of the mire for a while, and i definitely needed that back then.
 
 
Anthony
19:03 / 27.12.05
i'm looking at all of the things that i do which could be construed as being self-destructive, and trying to eliminate them from my life.
 
 
Anthony
19:12 / 27.12.05
i think you should get a job & see how your psychology transforms in the process of doing it. i had a good job a while back which unfortunately, for reasons i won't go into, i felt like i had to leave, and doing it gave me a lot of self-esteem and a huge boost in all aspects. doing nothing, the rut i'm in now, i think the inertia just gets to one after a while & drags one down.

give the birthday party & jandek CDs a break for a while too resist the temptation.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:22 / 27.12.05
Well, I also think I should get a job. I have spent 2 years trying to convince other people that I should have a job, with no success. I realise that you're not familiar with my situation and could not be expected to know this, so please don't take this personally; but I'd like to mention as a general point that I cannot begin to describe the burning frustration I experience when people tell me how much happier I'd be if I just got a job. I'm TRYING to get a job. ANY job. It's not WORKING. I'm not a fussy person--previous jobs I've happily undertaken have included sweeping streets and cleaning toilets in a men's bail hostel.

I should probably also have mentioned that this is a long-term problem which I've been dealing with since my early teens. I've had many jobs in that time, and whilst a good job has a definate positive impact, it's not the answer. At best I end up treading water, able to keep afloat but not able to make any progress with the things that matter to me.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
20:23 / 27.12.05
Try and detatch. You know when you're reading a book and you're thinking of a character: "Why doesn't she just do X? It's so obviously the answer!"? Try and do that to yourself.
 
 
grant
21:03 / 27.12.05
Thought about getting into the GTD thing? Utterly non-magickal, except it revolves around basic techniques for mindfulness and doing simple things that result in big changes. I'm not much for it myself (too lazy and sloppy), but I have friends who prosyletize.
 
 
agent darkbootie
21:56 / 27.12.05
The trouble is that the bit of me that the Black Dog most enjoys gnawing on is my motivation. I don't spend all day crying, listening to Silverchair and cutting up, I just get a bit grim and mopey and disinclined to do very much except stare out of windows.
Oh lordy I can relate to that.

My battle with depression has been pysiological, chemical, and behavioral. Therapy helped get to the root of what was rotting in me, but eventually I also had to break down and take some anti-depressants. (And finding the right one was a little adventure, too.) It sucks. It really does. But I can get better.

But as far as finding your motivation... It might help to understand that you're never going to WANT to do what you're supposed to do, so maybe you can find other incentives. Or learn to push through the misery with that knowledge.

I finished a massive writing project because I had a bet with a friend that I had to do two pages each day or I owed him $100 for every day I missed. Didn't miss a single day. I learned a kung-fu routine once because my instructor said, "I want you to do this every day, twice a day, or I'm going to be PISSED." Yep... Didn't miss a single day.

What I'm saying is if you're not motivated by the carrot, see if you can find a stick. You will feel good when you've reached your goal.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
06:56 / 28.12.05
I've actually got pretty good at doing things I don't want to do. I didn't really want to spend all day filing, or working noisy, dirty machinery, or hosing dogshit off paths, but I did all those things and more because they needed to be done. I'm an adult and I don't expect everything to be fun or pleasant, or even inoffensively dull.

I'm not really talking about that level of non-motivation. I'm talking about being so inert I can't even do the fun stuff.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
07:28 / 28.12.05
Here's the Wikipedia entry on clinical depression, which might be helpful. Bear in mind that I am talking about a clinical diagnosis confirmed by various mental-health professionals over a period of some years, not an attack of the mopes brought on by too much Coil.
 
 
Seth
08:54 / 28.12.05
What does your depression say when you talk to it?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
09:17 / 28.12.05
"You can affect nothing; all effort is waste."
 
 
Seth
09:45 / 28.12.05
For how long has your depression believed that?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
09:50 / 28.12.05
For as long as it's been around. Why?
 
 
Seth
09:56 / 28.12.05
I'm curious in exploring what it has to say for itself.

Do you know its name?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
09:57 / 28.12.05
Nope, it's just a big nameless blob.
 
 
Seth
10:00 / 28.12.05
Do you mean, "Nope, I don't know its name" or, "Nope, it doesn't have one?" Have you asked it?

A big blob. What else does it look like?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
10:09 / 28.12.05
I don't think it has a name. As for other than a blob: I don't know, a vortex or a big black hurricane or something.
 
 
Seth
10:16 / 28.12.05
Are you just making this up, Mordant Carnival? You think? I don't know? Or something?

Either it's there and you can find out these answers for yourself from observing it and talking to it or you're just humouring me. A minute ago it could speak. Can it no longer speak for itself?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
10:19 / 28.12.05
To clarify: It can speak, but it only has that one line. If it has a name, it's not telling me. It's fairly amorphous, like a vast dark cloud, full of destructive movement but no features or direction.
 
 
Seth
10:29 / 28.12.05
How do you know the movement is destructive? What is it about it that tells you that?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
10:43 / 28.12.05
It's always been a destructive force in my life. Also, it looks destructive, the way a hurricane looks destructive. If I peer into it long enough I see fragments of all the things it's smashed up over the years.
 
 
Unconditional Love
13:00 / 28.12.05
Where is the feeling of depression located in your body, what parts of you house the feeling?

For me personally its my stomach and abdomen area, i find the more it gathers and doesnt get some expression or acknowledgement the worse it gets, in fact the more i talk about it, quite literally the weight i am carrying seems to lift. Mine feels like emptiness yet an all consuming emptiness, full of emptiness, yet it carries sorrow and rage.

I have been talking to a victim support counseller today about childhood traumas, and i literally feel lighter, i described incidents from my childhood, i can still only approach them in the third person, but i can tell the weight is lifted as soon as i relate my experience, its the isolation that keeps me heavy in my stomach, the lack of expression.

Relating to people who have similar problems to you can help, to see and try other peoples coping strategys, my next step is to find a support group.

Is there someway you could perhaps find a way to lift the weight of the problem through support groups to do with epilepsey and depression.

I found exercise helpful to a point as well, starting with something light like chi gung or a less dynamic form of yoga(sukha) and gradually building up to something more challenging, i tried it the other way around first and encountered repressed emotions i couldnt control, so gentle exercise to begin with would be my advice on retrospect. At first i was really resistant to the idea, i had been a cane head for a longtime, but after a month or 2 of my body moaning at me i began to love it, then id exercise everyday, couldnt get enough of it. I am going to start three new exercises this new year, which also means i socialise more and break my isolation. Its good to get new influences in my life.

Another area i have found important is a well balanced diet, it really does improve my mood when i eat the right foods, its worth looking at nutritional info and designing a diet for yourself which is both practical and has some elements of pleasure.

How about all of the above and a devotional working to freya until the spring equinox, gathering as much of her love to yourself as possible and including her in the above elements, harvesting her love into your body and food and movement. (i think i have the right lady but correct me if i am wrong)
 
  

Page: 123(4)56789... 83

 
  
Add Your Reply