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Fiction Suit: A User's Manual

 
  

Page: 1234(5)6789

 
 
Ierne
16:34 / 23.10.01
So where exactly do people get the idea that a 'god-form' is an assumed personality that the magician creates and wears come from? – Lothar Tuppan

You know...I thought a "god-form" was an assumed personality that DIVINITY wears in order to communicate with different folks who believe in different ways. The essence is whatever it is, but will express itself differently depending on the frame of mind of whoever is trying to get in touch with it.

We don't create it, we just reinforce it. (Have I upped the ante in terms of confusion here? Hope not...)
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
17:00 / 23.10.01
Actually that makes sense to me and accommodates the above usage by Chaos Magic practitioners.

For example Kali, Yama, Ereshkigal could all be 'god forms' of the same universal pattern of 'death'.

Is that kind of what you were thinking?

[ 23-10-2001: Message edited by: Lothar Tuppan ]
 
 
Rex City-zen
18:20 / 23.10.01
The debilitating power of language.
We seem to be caught in a web of definitions on what is a godform/fictionsuit/avatar/secret identity.
Before we proceed further, why not establish 2 things:
1. The agreed word for what we are discussing will be "FICTIONSUIT"
2. Post your definition of what exactly it is - but describe fictionsuit solely.
This is taking shape,
so nice.
 
 
Pandal
03:13 / 24.10.01
Just as there is the id, so should there be the am. As in, "i am writing this, i am feeling this, i am making all of this up, i am everything i tell you i am." The fiction suit is the am, the am can call itself a godform if that's what it tells all that it is. The creature which casts the spell has the ability to cast the fiction on the rest of us. If the am is powerful enough, it may cross over into his/her normal life.

i know that i AM pandal, it's the way i am in life and i know it's the suit i chose. I could change it tomorrow if i choose, but unless it's believable, it's just a costume.
The godform could then be classified as a really nice suit. The Armani of fiction suits.

Now back to my cave, all this typing is making me thirsty, wheres my Tab?
 
 
Emilio Burns
04:34 / 24.10.01
Hello, I am Emilio Burns.
 
 
Logos
11:34 / 24.10.01
Word, Emilio.
________________

My tuppence on godforms:

I seem to recall someone saying that the word "godform" originally came from the Thelemic or Enochian tradition, and meant an actual body position the magician took in the course of a ritual, meant to imitate a particular (Egyptian) god or goddess.

In more recent usage, it seems to be related to the Tibetan idea of a tulpa ("thoughtform"), where you essentially are dealing with a comprehensible representation of an incomprehensible entity (e.g. Jehovah as an old man with a long white beard, sitting on a throne on a cloud).

On MPD:

Multiple Personality Disorder, which in more recent versions of the DSM is called "Dissociative Identity Disorder" probably differs from what we do because we do not tend to "dissociate" from the character we play. That is some, but not all people with this disorder find that their primary personality or "point of view" disappears when one of the other personalities is in the "driver's seat". Our fictionsuits (at least the board identities) are masks we consciously take up and put down.
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
12:39 / 24.10.01
quote:Originally posted by Rex City-zen:
The debilitating power of language.
We seem to be caught in a web of definitions on what is a godform/fictionsuit/avatar/secret identity.
Before we proceed further, why not establish 2 things:
1. The agreed word for what we are discussing will be "FICTIONSUIT"
2. Post your definition of what exactly it is - but describe fictionsuit solely.
This is taking shape,
so nice.


Sounds good. My last comment on why I felt the need to be the 'Definition Police' is that in a lot of threads (and especially this one) we use a lot of terminology. 'Fictionsuit', 'godform', etc. If we're trying to create a 'user's manual' then we better start agreeing on what the hell these things mean and what we're talking about here.

While I agree that language is inadequate to convey some ideas, emotions, concepts, etc. more often than not, the limitations come from inaccurate or inappropriate usage of words.

Like trying to use a phillips head screwdriver when you need a flat head. When it doesn't work, blaming the screwdriver as being inadequate for the job really isn't fair.

Lets pick 'fictionsuit' and stick with it.

Additional question for the list of personal definitions on what a fictionsuit is:

How do you define fictionsuit for use on the board as opposed to in physical, non-internet related life.

Logos: Thanks for the additional info.


[ 24-10-2001: Message edited by: Lothar Tuppan ]
 
 
Kobol Strom
14:40 / 24.10.01
Maybe a FICTIONSUIT is like an egoplex.Whereby the ego is bombarded at the psychic central self sense areas by conflicting self-referential titles.By hearing and responding continually to a stimulus,much like Pavlovs experiments with dogs, we are conditioning ourselves to habituate certain relevent,relative mindsets.By donning the 'suit' you can ARMOUR the ego in,what can be described as a memetic shield, not so much as an ego shield,but a shield to the increased probablity of making 'personality breaches',i.e. statements that seem to be out of character.

Thus the new fictionsuit is hotwired into a radial spectrum of possible mind-sets,with the access to barbelith we 'tune in',as if our 'personalities' could become like radio stations.

The next stage,of course,assuming we are different people and not one big split personality,is that by assimilating each others perspective ,new voices and new characters take on an almost evolutionary imperative,where the real organism that is BARBELITH continues to grow.These posts being the only part of that growth process.

[ 24-10-2001: Message edited by: kobol strom ]
 
 
Rex City-zen
17:46 / 24.10.01
I woke up this morning with a question I wanted to ask the lot of you...

What if a total stranger imposed a whole new fictionsuit on you?

For example,a stranger approaches you and tells you you are the reincarnation of so and so. Tells you of your past lives in detail. That this was your "intended" fictionsuit as it were? (er... )

Catch ,my drift??
 
 
Emilio Burns
18:40 / 24.10.01
Caught off guard I'd be wary. But, I might play along to see where it leads. Curiosity killed the cat.
 
 
Rex City-zen
16:33 / 25.10.01
BTW Expressionless, I really enjoyed yor post on the PKD thread about Jesus being God's fictionsuit. I have shared that theory for quite a while as well.
Consider also: Christ was baptized by JOHN
When Christ transfigured in the garden he was joined by Moses and Elijah before his disciples- 2 additional fictionsuits for God?? The author and the prophet and THE WORD MADE FLESH.
In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God, and one dau the word was made flesh.( The book of John)
Again,look how the name John plays into the fictionsuit concept...especially in the opening lines of the book of John...
John six. Jack frost. John O'dreams. The list goes on....
...and a John is a whore's client...

Sure you have much more to add.
 
 
cusm
03:15 / 26.10.01
As discussed here, the fictionsuit differs from invocation. The effect is similar, the primary ego submerged and a secondary becomes dominant. However, in full invocation, there is a line of loss of control that allows the invoked to become more deeply manifest. That is why external ritual devices are used to control it. If you are only invoking while within this circle, you can allow yourself complete transformation because you have a tool for returning to your original self again when you are finished. An example of invocation without controls is evident in voodoo, and similar Ifa derived traditions. The loa/egun etc can ride the initiated at any old time they feel like it, and in many cases the riden black out completely during the experience. This is an extreme example of one direction this can go.

With a fictionsuit, the other direction is had. Rather than supressing the ego, it is wilfully put down, but remains active in the background. One can step out of a fiction suit at any time, because one has never lost sight of the original self. The identity in the suit is kept separate from the primary psyche by use of differing names, histories, preferences etc. All the tools necessary for control are internalized. It is invocation without ritual, but with the same safety restraints in place.

As for a user's manual for running a fictionsuit, look to RPGs. The very purpose of RPGs is to become a character, to don a suit. Only in this case, key elements of the suit are put down on paper, and the reality in which they exist is a shared one. This method of suiting is the safest of any I know of, as the lines between reality are clearely marked at all times, as are the times when the character can be manifest.

Indeed, I learned a lot about how to invoke from deep character role playing. Go figure, the Christian fundies were right. D&D does lead children to practicing witchcraft

[ 26-10-2001: Message edited by: cusm ]
 
 
Seth
07:03 / 26.10.01
Rex: I'm not even going to bother quoting your last post. It was like reading myself writing. I sat with Parliament of Fools on Tuesday evening and read those exact same scriptures as we talked over our understanding of the idea.

While I don't necessarily agree that Moses and Elijah were fictionsuits of God, they certainly do embody and represent the Law and the Prophets, both of which Jesus came to fulfill. This links back to the passage about the greatest commandment/s (…and all the Law and the Prophets hangs on these two, or words to that effect). I agree with the pre-incarnate appearances of Jesus (BTW, there's also a significant one on the road to Jericho in the book of Joshua).

I have a developing idea (not yet fully formed, and only at the playful stage), that reality is not only God's fiction but God's hypersigil, and that by entering His own creation through Jesus He was able to rewrite facets of His own nature, while retaining His nature, forever unchanging. This is not an impossibility: an infinite and timeless being could conceivably create a Universe for the purposes of understanding Himself better. As He realises that there are aspects of Himself that need to change, He interacts with linear time via Jesus, writing His desired characteristics into the suit. The personality trait bleed-thorugh effect takes place, but is shifted into non-linear time, thus making the changes wrought an eternal aspect of God (ie: in order for a changeless non-linear being to change, He must interact with linear time). In effect, God and Jesus swapped places.

This isn't as potentially blasphemous as it sounds. Firstly, Jews believe (from what little I know) in a God that wasn't perfect – secondly, there is plenty of scriptural precedent for God changing His mind (or giving an indication that He may change His mind if certain conditions are met). It explains apparent differences in tone and the nature of God between Old and New Testaments, while still holding that they are the same infinite, unchanging being.

The use of Jesus as a fictionsuit effectively solves another problem: the idea of humaity as God's plaything. Of course, this is already partially solved by a conception of God as author of reality (interestingly, God is described as both author and perfecter in the Bible) – the writers I know (myself included) go to great pains to feel what their characters feel, suffering as they suffer, laughing as they laugh. Of course, this only gives God an understanding of what humanity is, not what it is to be human. One of the things that has always struck me about Jesus is His bravery: the desire of God to stub His own toe, to feel hungry and tired and have a crush on the girl who lives down the road and support the family business, and shit and piss with the rest of us (imagine being the girl that Jesus had His eye on!). And of course, this model only really makes sense if Jesus is to be discarded by God, and treated with the same impartiality as He treats us all (in a way, then, Jesus could have been God's salvation, nailed to the cross with God's imperfections as well as ours).

There are further implications, but that's enough for now – this is the extent to which I've thought it through (ie: not much!). There are other considerations, ie: afterlife, God's intentions in creation, etc. I reiterate – this is theorising at play, without any real commitment to the idea… yet. Of course, none of it is of interest at all unless you have an interest in Judeo/Christian theology. If it's taking this thread too much on a tangent, please tell me and I'll start another.

Relating this back to the Invisibles is trickier, as I still haven't read the final twelve issues (I'm waiting to see which happens first; ephemerat pulling his finger out and lending them to me, or the release of the trade - which I've asked the Comics forum about several times and still not got an answer). However, it fits with my understanding of Grant's intentions concerning his relationship with King Mob outside the text, the magic mirror/UFO and Barbelith itself (the segment where the 'Lith rewires itself through Dane's liguistic centres to manifest as Christ, the idea of the placenta taking away impurities for the developing child). Please don't spoil the ending for me (although I think I can make an uneducated guess).

Oh, cusm: total agreement about roleplaying. In some ways, my experience becoming characters (sometimes several simultaneously) has been one of the most valuable I've had: not only in terms of understanding the world, but in understanding my friends and seeing issues from another perspective. Plus I get to throw grenades!
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
12:12 / 26.10.01
Cusm: Excellent post. I completely agree.
 
 
A. Machine
15:14 / 26.10.01
quote:Originally posted by Lothar Tuppan:


What have I missed? Is there a text that covers that concept and practice or is this interpretation a misreading of the existing concept and practice?


Y'know, I had to go back and look. It is a very prevelant line of thinking among chaos types, and your question made me realize I had no idea where I, or they, got it from. As best I can tell, it seems implied in the Invocation chapter of Carroll's 'Liber Null' and possibly made easy to infer from some of his other comments in other books.
 
 
Rex City-zen
19:34 / 26.10.01
Consider this as well expressionless:

Elijah was better known as Elias. ( el = God i believe, but don't quote me...hmmm...I as God?) If we revert back to the egyptian version it would be AL.
Thus: Alias
Moses of course was the creator in a sense... in that he transcribed the creation of the earth and the subsequent events.
" If they ask 'who has sent you?' tell them ' I AM has sent me unto you..." or something like that. (The burning talking bush...)
I know there is ,ore to the tales than what is on the surface. Moses, from the water. John the baptist brought forth Jesus Christ from the water. ( Sometimes I believe Jesus and John were the same person, but more on that later.)
Here's one: Could the tree of knowledge of good and evil just been a book??
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
20:25 / 26.10.01
Except that the word Alias comes from the latin 'Alius'. Not hebrew or egyptian.
 
 
Rex City-zen
18:11 / 27.10.01
What does Alius mean,Lothar?
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
14:08 / 28.10.01
According to my Webster's New World Dictionary 'Alias' comes from the latin 'Alius' which means 'another' or 'other'.

I don't have access to any latin dictionaries to verify though.

My point being that linguistically there's no connection between Elijah/Elias and Alias.
 
 
Seth
13:26 / 29.10.01
It does seem to be reaching a bit. I’m all for wordplay, and I’m all for observing patterns in the good book, but I can’t stretch to Moses and Elijah as fiction suits for God – I just don’t think the text supports it. I also think there’s a danger of taking language a bit too far (I can’t believe I just said that) and winding up on the five-percenter side. I readily agree that they were involved in important phases of the revealing of the nature of God, but I’m not convinced it goes any deeper (note: one significant reason Moses appears at the Transfiguration is God’s promise that he will set foot in the promised land. It seemed that God had gone back on his word, what with Moses dying in the OT. Those are the kind of details in the Bible I really like. )

Having said that, the passage I suggested in Joshua does feature an aspect of God (I reckon an aspect of pre-incarnate Jesus – a fiction suit for a fiction suit?) in the form of the Commander of the Armies of the Lord. God may also have an angelic fictionsuit (the Angel of the Lord doesn’t necessarily refer to Gabriel – although I’ll have to spend more time looking up references). Then consider the sheer number of names for the Trinity: it’s an exercise in uncertainty theory, wrapping the invisible object (in this case the Godhead) with language to at least try and describe Him.

The Bible frequently raises the issue of naming and identity (the amount of times God names and re-names people and places is too many to list in a single post) – the idea that by renaming someone it causes a significant change in their personality (Abram – Abraham, Sarai – Sarah, Simon – Peter, Saul – Paul, Jacob – Israel. The latter also being an example of the Angel of the Lord, from what I remember from theology lessons. Jacob doesn’t wrestle an angel, he wrestles God). It’s pretty reasonable to apply this central Biblical theme to God Himself.

There’s some good stuff on the names of God here. These are some of the linguistic origins of the names that appear in the Bible, but it doesn’t scratch the surface of the poetic and symbolic names used in the Psalms etc. It’s so hard to find decent Christian stuff on the net that isn’t cringeworthy or preachy.

Rex: I’m only exploring this on-site because you’re interested, and because it’s furthering the discussion (for now). I’d be very interested in hearing about some possibilities from sources outside of Christianity. For example, the relationship of the Hindu pantheon to Brahman. That seems to be less a case of fictionsuits and more a case of extreme fragmentation (although that doesn’t begin to do justice to the philosophical nature of Hinduism). I’m also interested in people’s perception of Brahman from a chaos magic perspective, as I’ve only heard tell of people who have interacted with the bits and not the whole (problem being that the bits are the whole in this case. Why can’t us spiritual types ever make understanding easy?).
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
13:35 / 29.10.01
What exactly do you mean by 'Brahman'? Are you talking about the social class or a practice of some sort?

For avatars though, Vishnu is the god.
 
 
Seth
14:18 / 29.10.01
Apparently Brahman is the name of the Hindu trinity, involving Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesa, a being in and of itself. It’s also a hell of a lot more (I read some stuff on this a while back, I’ll see if I can trace some more later). For now, here’s a good place to start.
 
 
cusm
14:50 / 29.10.01
Consider this: What is the difference between a fiction-suit and an invocation? Perhaps when you invoke, the entity invoked is wearing you as a fiction-suit, only one of flesh. It is all a matter of perspective.

Thus, prophets and those who have taken on aspects of the Divine to a high degree like Moses and Jesus live in a consistent state of invocation. Perhaps that is the link, fiction suits are only an extended invocation.

Did God wear a suit of Jesus, or did Jesus wear a suit of God? I think both are true at once, as each side will see it from their own perspective, though the effects are identical.

If I wear a fiction suit of God, will I become a prophet or a saint? If I wear a fiction suit for so long that it becomes my primary ego and I forget my old self, is it really me or have I succeded in the entire point of personal magick in the first place, self transformation? Does it matter?
If I hit you in the face with a bananna cream pie that was sekretly made with artifical non fat powdered milk, will the audience still laugh at the gag?

My addition to the laws of Magick: Fake it till its real.
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
15:41 / 29.10.01
I'm more familiar with the term 'Tri-Murti' (triple form) for the trinity of Brahma, Shiva, and Vishnu.

There are many different sects that westerners consider 'Hinduism' and the website you linked to deals with only one sect yet labels itself the 'Hindu Website'.

Since this is getting way off topic, I'll start a new thread on Hinduism and the problem with web sources with agendas.
 
 
Rex City-zen
17:53 / 29.10.01
Thank you cusm.
 
 
Seth
06:53 / 30.10.01
That makes sense cusm. In fact I like it a lot. Sorry for doubting you Rex – I missed your point in that I felt you were singling out Moses and Elijah for special attention.

Lothar: didn’t realise the site only dealt with one sect. As I’ve also heard of Brahma, Shiva, and Vishnu being described under the Brahman banner, I think it would be cool to start another thread. I’ve probably got tons of questions. As for websites with agendas, see my above comments on Christian sites. Dire state of affairs!

Still, the question stands – I’m very interested to hear of examples of what we’ve established as fictionsuits coming from other traditions/practices/religions. Any ideas?
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
12:58 / 30.10.01
Well, if this thread is any indication, the term is so all encompasing that pretty much anything vaguely related to merging with an 'external' being can be considered a fictionsuit.

The avatar of a god is a fictionsuit.
Invocations and embodiments are fictionsuits.
Being a prophet of a divinity could be considered a fictionsuit.
What we used to call 'handles' are fictionsuits on the board.
'Avatars' in online communities are probably considered fictionsuits by some here.
Magician selves for use in ritual are fictionsuits.

and of course the way that Morrison originally used it in the Invisibles to represent the illusion of our psyche and PHYSICAL lives as his way of recapping and adding a new twist to the concepts of reincarnation and Maya.

As well as his other possible intentions of the term such as entering a fictional world through your characters so you can interact with them by 'descending' like a god becoming an avatar.

Maybe I'm trapped by my love of clear, precise definitions but doesn't it seem that since the general usage is just a tad bit too vague, and that everyone is hell bent to use their own personal definitions instead of coming to a consensus, that adding additional examples will just muddy the waters beyond hope of understanding?

Has GM's term grown into a monster rampaging through town? Should we stop it before it gets to the children?

Is the goal of this thread really to create a Users Manual (in which case it should be clear enough to actually be used by someone unfamiliar with the various practices) or is it just to have a conversation about our individual beliefs regarding the infamous 'fictionsuit'?

[ 30-10-2001: Message edited by: Lothar Tuppan ]
 
 
Seth
14:32 / 30.10.01
A thread on a message board is never going to read like a manual. The way I interpreted the title was to try to be exhaustive on the subject and related matters, and see what people wanted to take away with them. I’m not sure I agree with the capability of language to be clear and precise in every instance: I think it’s also shifting, subtle and colourful, and I enjoy the diversity of interpretations that come out in a thread like this.

I’ve no doubt the thread could be turned into a manual, with a bit of pruning, translation and TLC. As it stands, I think ‘Let’s chat about identity’ would have been a better title. Maybe Rex could let us know what his intentions were. I have asked frequently whether I’m wandering off topic: I didn’t feel a yank on my choke-chain, so I kept going.

So, I’d like to ask Rex: in a couple of places in the thread, you’ve posted words to the effect that you’ve had ideas and want to see whether we’re running along the same lines. You’ve allowed the thread to push the definition into territory that may be too vague for some people. I’m intrigued as to what you wanted to achieve, as you’ve indicated that you’ve pleased with the direction the discussion was taking. Was it really to see just how far it would go?

(Don’t get me wrong: I think it’s been a strength of the thread that we’ve entered into quite free form discussion, and I like the fact that Rex has been pretty hands-off for the most part. But now I’d like to know what Rex thinks...)
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
15:10 / 30.10.01
quote:Originally posted by expressionless:
A thread on a message board is never going to read like a manual. The way I interpreted the title was to try to be exhaustive on the subject and related matters, and see what people wanted to take away with them. I’m not sure I agree with the capability of language to be clear and precise in every instance: I think it’s also shifting, subtle and colourful, and I enjoy the diversity of interpretations that come out in a thread like this.


Sometimes I'm too literal. When the first post talked about "The creation of an operator's manual for utilizing the fiction suit to it's full potential." I was taking it at face value where we would, in the course of the thread, come to a consensus of what we're talking about and how it can be used and potentially, taken further than before. Those conclusions could then be edited into an actual 'manual' maybe as an article for Tom.

I've been the straight man before. It wouldn't surprise me if this is again the case.

quote:
I’ve no doubt the thread could be turned into a manual, with a bit of pruning, translation and TLC. As it stands, I think ‘Let’s chat about identity’ would have been a better title. Maybe Rex could let us know what his intentions were.


If that is the goal of the thread then I'll stop being pissy and will continue to chat about identity.

quote: I have asked frequently whether I’m wandering off topic: I didn’t feel a yank on my choke-chain, so I kept going.

With the exception of certain 6500 year old ranting I think that all of the off topic stuff has been very illuminating and informative. I don't think you or anyone else has been inappropriate in exploring the boundaries of this subject. I especially liked the discussions on what god-forms are and the divine uses of 'masks' and/or avatars - I just didn't want to get into Hinduism specifically but that's only because this isn't a thread on Hinduism.

My only frustrations stem from when we're actually talking about 'fictionsuits' and we don't seem to be getting any closer to consensus over what we're talking about.

Like when Rex tried to steer things away from 'godforms' and back to 'fiction suits' and to keep things to that term, and to post a definition of what fiction suit is. The very next post went on about godforms anyway.

quote:
(Don’t get me wrong: I think it’s been a strength of the thread that we’ve entered into quite free form discussion, and I like the fact that Rex has been pretty hands-off for the most part. But now I’d like to know what Rex thinks...)


I agree. I think the freeform discussion has been cool and my only disagreement stems from my interpretation of the goal of the thread in the first place. If we are just having an informal discussion then chalk up my above frustrations to my 'Project Manager Fiction Suit' having too much control over me and my reactions.

I am the fiction suit cautionary tale.
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
15:41 / 30.10.01
quote:Originally posted by cusm:
Consider this: What is the difference between a fiction-suit and an invocation? Perhaps when you invoke, the entity invoked is wearing you as a fiction-suit, only one of flesh. It is all a matter of perspective.



Exactly. I think the Voudoun metaphor of the practitioner becoming a 'horse' for the Loa who 'rides' the human to be an apt one at indicating who's more in control at that particular time.

Not all invocations are that intense but it does help as a reminder that these beings have their own wills and that it's not just about who we humans are choosing to 'wear' and what the potential differences between invocation and 'fiction suits' are.

[ 30-10-2001: Message edited by: Lothar Tuppan ]
 
 
Rex City-zen
20:56 / 30.10.01
Yikes!!

Time to reach for a loaded wand?

[QUOTE]Just an idea---want to see how far it goes.
Excercise:The creation of an operator's manual for utilizing the fiction suit to it's full potential.

Fictionsuit is a term that has been thrown around quite a bit in Barbelith and it's previous incarnations since being introduced in the invisibles.The series was vague at points and alluded to many things without being concise on any one (buzzword) "meme" that Morrison would introduce.
Since the end of the series, I have had several interpretations of what exactly that term does mean.One idea would lead to another and of course, information would manifest that would back my hypothesis up, data wise.From Rex Mundi to the Black grail to the whore of babylon and people named John, this topic has weighed heavy on my psyche.
The intention of this thread was and still is the same as POST 0 when started.I do wish to create a user manual for the fictionsuit but at the same time I am trying to flesh out the idea that it is more than an online identity.The only history those have are various posts on various sites.The manual will be created , with help from all of you, I hope, by way of cutting and pasting the valuable information found within this thread to another fresh one and hopefully a webzine article.
The reasons why I have not started this are:
1. The thread keeps expanding with incredible ideas that I really don't want to start another thread till this one has run it's course- when I review, this topic is still alive with no signs of threadrot yet.
2. um- I've been really busy.Sorry.

True. I have alluded to grand ideas on this topic without really sharing them, for that I apologize. Sometimes, I need to know what I'm dealing with before I rant...

So, I hope this clears up a bit.Any other questions please feel free to ask at anytime. I truly have enjoyed working with all of you on this so far and I hope it continues into what we all hope it will be.
REX
 
 
MK Ultra
19:23 / 31.10.01
Ook?
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
13:09 / 01.11.01
<Lothar begins post still wearing his project manager fictionsuit>

Thanks for the clarification Rex. My suggestion as to how you can still allow for complete freeform discussion and brainstorming while moving forward to our milestones on time and under budget is that we have two threads.

Keep this thread for everything from fictionsuit identity stuff to whatever tangential subjects people feel inclined to explore.

In addition to this thread, when you're ready, start another thread recapping what your end goal is, what we need to come to a consensus on, and then how we need to proceed from that point in order to really get the raw data that will become the Fiction Suit users manual. If you're feeling overwhelmed by any of this feel free to delegate. If we are interested in participating then we should also be willing to help you with some of the load.

And make sure that we have a Tech expert in all the meetings to nod at appropriate times when talking to clients.

<Lothar sheds Project Manager fictionsuit. Washes mouth out with mouthwash. Repeats affirmations of "I am not a corporate lackey. I am not a corporate lackey." and dons t-shirt and jeans.>

When reading the 'Void' thread that just began, I was remembering experiences with the Chod ritual where at the end all ego (including false egos and constructed egos) were completely stripped away and all that was left was a faint remnant of what was before. (More specifics to appear in Void thread sometime after Dia de Los Muertos.)

Other than fictionsuits, what types of extreme, and not so extreme, ego modification have people done and with what results?
 
 
Mordant Carnival
18:21 / 01.11.01
quote:Originally posted by The Librarian:
Ook?


Ook. Ook ook, ook ook ook ook; ook ook ook. Ook, ook ook, ook. Ook- ook ook.

OK?
 
 
Darkside of the Moo
19:19 / 01.11.01
Other than fictionsuits, what types of extreme, and not so extreme, ego modification have people done and with what results? - Lothar Toppan

As we speak, I am reading the Patty Hearst story...
in answer to your question:"TANIA"

As well I am deeply into prometheus rising by RAW. The book is really shedding some light for me as far as Fictionsuits go. Check it out if no one has yet.
 
  

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