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Questions and Answers - Part 3

 
  

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Feverfew
20:07 / 28.02.07
Cattles was the first one that mentally occurred to me, swiftly followed by the same conclusion.

Ideas to ponder, anyway, certainly!
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:07 / 28.02.07
I assumed it was because she was a schoolgirl and he was a cop, but... who knows.

Actually the subtitling isn't flawless: one interesting error ~ it seems to me ~ in this episode, where Matt declares "we're not exactly dealing with a patient man", and the French translates "we're not exactly dealing with a patient, man!"
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:09 / 28.02.07
Bonus: "save the cheerleader" becomes "sauver la pom-pom girl."
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:21 / 28.02.07
Oh shit. Am I doing spoilers here. Sorry. Please delete anything inappropriate.
 
 
Olulabelle
20:34 / 28.02.07
To XK: Yes well I was going to say I didn't think you should sit on your catses. Or doggles. Don't sit on anyone is my advice. Unless it's well, you know...
 
 
Olulabelle
20:38 / 28.02.07
To Miss W: I shouldn't worry. To anyone uninitiated it sounds like drivel. It is only us Heroes geeks what is getting it.

Loving "Sauver le pom pom girl". Why is it not "Sauver le pom pom femme"?
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:50 / 28.02.07
I think a sixteen year-old would be a jeune fille anyway (the last time I seriously did French, we studied Moliere ~ yes, that long ago (1668)) but I assume it's one of those phrases adopted from American into French and sort of warped from the original along the way, like "salaryman" in Japanese.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:56 / 28.02.07
An interesting para from French wiki!

Une Pom pom girl (faux anglicisme) ou cheerleader (en Amérique du Nord, Québec inclus) est une jeune fille assurant un spectacle à base de chant, danse, saut et autres pyramides humaines dans le milieu sportif aux États-Unis. Au Québec, la recommandation officielle de l'OQLF est meneuse de claque, et c'est ce terme qu'on entend ordinairement dans les médias, et de plus en plus souvent dans la langue courante.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
20:57 / 28.02.07
There IS no feline form of "doggles". That's why doggleses are so ace.

(Though at a push I'd say "kitties", but I'd deny saying it afterwards).
 
 
doozy floop
21:01 / 28.02.07
I doubt I'm the most francophonic (?) on the board, but that tu/vous combo sounds about right - adults particularly in positions of responsibility or seniority will usually use tu to children, while vous is still a safe bet between adults who don't know each other. Although if Ted wants to kill Bennet's wife, it sounds like they might know each other. Or at least Ted probably knows Bennet's wife, I suppose. Or maybe not. I don't know who these people are. Although I have a feeling that it's not as weird as it might seem for him to use vous while menacing a stranger. Not sure why: perhaps because it's still habitual to use vous with strangers...

A reciprocal 'tu' was becoming much more common between youngsters and adults back in the day when I were a nipper in the French-speaking world, but if in a new situation this Matt chap is trying to assert authoritative-ness then the tu would clarify that. Vous would be reserved for someone of adult age, 18ish, or someone younger in order to demonstrate greater respect or comparability of position.

Kinda.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
21:11 / 28.02.07
Thanks Doozy. I've been googling and found some interesting French/English discussion fora about the connotations of vous/tu in contemporary society ~ it didn't strike me for instance that to vousvoie someone you usually address informally could (as someone on the forum suggests) calm them down and keep things cool rather than risking heated argument, or could insult them with a bit of icy distance; or that you could use endearments like "mon chou" but still address someone as vous.

I guess because Claire is in her father's house, so a dependent, and Matt is a cop, for him to tutoie her would be natural, but I was wondering at what age that would change, and when an adult of 35 would be more formal and polite to a young person ~ as you can't usually tell a sixteen year-old is sixteen as opposed to nineteen.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
21:13 / 28.02.07
If you were, say, picking a fight with a stranger in a bar, though, or telling them to get the fuck away from your friend, wouldn't you use "tu"?
 
 
Olulabelle
21:43 / 28.02.07
I'd probably be more likely to use a big stick.
 
 
sleazenation
21:48 / 28.02.07
I think you'd probably say something along the lines of "touche pas mon ami"
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
21:51 / 28.02.07
Vousvoyering and tutoyering is tricky for non-Francophones -- it's rather instinctive, and I've always found it hard to get the hang of. "Vous" is the more formal form of address, and is more polite for strangers and your elders, but once you get to a certain degree of familiarity, "vous" can start to seem overly formal and even slightly mocking; like when you were a kid and people would call you "chief."

I vousvoyer and tutoyer almost interchangably. When in doubt, ask: after over a year in the same office, I finally broke down and asked my employer which she preferred, and she asked me to finally switch to "tu," as we got along very well. But she would have been well within her rights to ask me to keep vousvoyering, which would mean she wanted to maintain a professional/seniority difference.

Back to the actual subtitles: it would be brash and shocking for a kid to refer to an adult they're not on extraordinarily familiar terms with as "tu," like suddenly referring to your friend's parents by their first names when you're about eight years old and haven't been asked to. Similarly, an adult vousvoyering a kid would indicate he's either in a position of forced familiarity, like a waiter or a host, he's mocking/patronizing the kid, or the kid is royalty or something.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
21:52 / 28.02.07
And bar fights are definitely "tu/toi" territory. If you're even using pronouns at that point.
 
 
Closed for Business Time
21:56 / 28.02.07
3 questions this time.

What's the longest Barbelith thread of all time?
What was the first thread - the Ur-Thread?
What and when was the "great meltdown/schism/mass defection"? I keep reading references to this in the Elders' posts, about this primeval catastrophe when much went awry and, yes... you catch my drift, no?
 
 
Quantum
23:25 / 28.02.07
losontem, good questions! I wanna know! Olulabelle, that's great for your application- I was wrong with the minimal answer, you went the extra mile which is what impresses an employer. I would hire you.

There IS no feline form of "doggles"

That's why cats are so cool. You don't need a diminutive form for felines, you have to hope they think you're cute.

Dogs are like a frontal lobotomy. They make people go 'Boogleboogle oozadoggle' and get down on all fours (I've done it so I know). To quote some graffiti I saw today I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
 
 
ORA ORA ORA ORAAAA!!
23:54 / 28.02.07
it's probably not the oldest thread, but it is topic one: Obnoxious Relatives/Advice? Which is an interesting start to the board.
 
 
Quantum
23:56 / 28.02.07
'So Barbelith, tell me about your childhood...'
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
23:57 / 28.02.07
What does it mean to "nerf" a character class in WoW?
 
 
ORA ORA ORA ORAAAA!!
00:05 / 01.03.07
Nerfing is taking features away from classes, or making them work differently. usually it's for game balance, to make the class less ridiculously overpowered compared to other classes/races at the same level. However, if you are already invested in one of these classes, it's pretty upsetting (Judging from the way my friends react to these things, anyway).

I imagine it's from nerf weaponry.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
00:38 / 01.03.07
Thanks.

Next question: What the fuck?
 
 
Triplets
00:46 / 01.03.07
ASL?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
00:52 / 01.03.07
What wigs me out is that her profile says she's 14. Why am I of sufficient interest to a tiny schoogirl that she's copied my name?
 
 
Saint Keggers
00:57 / 01.03.07
Yeah, that's exactly what happened. We believe you.
 
 
Quantum
01:14 / 01.03.07
Change it to Mordant Carnival- Crouched under the counter. How did you find your snowclone anyway?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
01:23 / 01.03.07
I was trying to find an old post somewhere and Google turned that up.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
01:27 / 01.03.07
I will have to SUE. For TEN MILLION INTERNET DOLLARS!
 
 
Quantum
01:31 / 01.03.07
Sweeeeeet....
 
 
grant
03:31 / 01.03.07
What's the longest Barbelith thread of all time?

I think it'd be this one -- which is actually part 3 of a much larger thread.


What was the first thread - the Ur-Thread?


Well, that was how the whole board came to be....


What and when was the "great meltdown/schism/mass defection"?


There was no schism or defection. The board software has melted down a couple times, though.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
06:47 / 01.03.07
Thanks Matt, that's very interesting stuff. I found it fascinating, reading French threads (mostly in English) that French people had real pantwetting anxieties about whether to tutoie a business associate they'd been corresponding with for a long time, or their mother-in-law. I've had some similar awkwardness in the UK when I was unsure whether to use someone's first name (in the US, I would address strangers as "Sir/Ma'am", which is an honorific rarely used outside shops, hairdressers, customs desks and police stations in the UK) but having two forms of address does seem to complicate things a lot even for native speakers. It also gives a range of subtle overtones, true.

What about if you were in your twenties and met someone in a bar, then went home and slept with them? Would you start using "vous" and switch at some point?

Not that I'm trying to bone up on this before I go to France, pick a fight and have a one night stand.
 
 
Saveloy
08:31 / 01.03.07
Does anyone here have experience of dealing with blatant acts of discrimination against would-be employees after the event? Or know what can be done about it?

Check this:

The Straw that Broke the Camel's Back

In summary: a job is advertised, a disabled woman goes for an interview, the interviewers make it plain (to their colleagues) that there is no way she would get the job because she is disabled, LAUGH about it, and are complicit in ridiculing her behind her back with half the office. The woman sees none of this, of course, but it is witnessed by at least one person in the office who feels disgust at the treatment the woman has received.

What advice would you give that person? Is there anything that either he or the interviewee herself could or should do about it?

If you read the whole thread you'll see that advice has already been offered but I don't *think* there's anything beyond "leave" or "stay and fit them up with hidden cameras".
 
 
Mon Oncle Ignatius
09:01 / 01.03.07
As an aside To quote some graffiti I saw today I'd rather have a (full) bottle in front of me than a frontal (full) lobotomy is often attributed to Tom Waits, which he is frequently quoted as saying on a TV programme once, most likely quoting WC Fields, though that has yet to be proved and he has apparently said he got it from a bathroom wall. Does anyone have any references to show where it does come from? Googling hasn't shown me anything conclusive about WC Fields being the origin of the quote, though it sounds like the sort of thing he would say, though Dr. Randy Hanzlik has been creditied with coining the phrase for a song - having cribbed it off a bathroom wall...
 
 
Olulabelle
10:07 / 01.03.07
Saveloy, your questions sound like an essay question in an English exam.

Can you post to the thread and suggest that the person involved make a copy of their email? Can you suggest that they approach someone outside of the company about it, perhaps a disability charity who could move forward with the knowledge.
 
  

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