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The Geeky X-Men Thread

 
  

Page: 123(4)56

 
 
Pants Payroll
12:50 / 16.05.03
When was the first time Magneto was seen without his helmet? Was it actually X-men #151 or was there an earlier dehelmetification? (flashbacks dont count)

(nor does the time he got turned into a baby...)
 
 
ciarconn
13:14 / 16.05.03
The latest way it was explained, The Beast is a devolver. The harsher the ambient is, the more he devolves, and the more he devolves, the stronger, faster, smarter and more resilient (sp?) he gets. Sometimes it just doesn't work that way. At the beggining of the X Factor series, he was getting stronger without devolving, and he was loosing his smarts. The Beast in the Mutant X universe went all the way to reptilian, but went almost to childlike intelligence.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
18:34 / 18.05.03
I highly recommend that any of you who have questions read through this insanely detailed FAQ.
 
 
Graeme McMillan
15:52 / 19.05.03
"When was the first time Magneto was seen without his helmet? Was it actually X-men #151 or was there an earlier dehelmetification?"

It originally happened during the Neal Adams run on the original X-Men, if I remember correctly...
 
 
houdini
18:49 / 19.05.03

I agree. A real X-gem if you can find it is the X-Men Visionaries: Neal Adams volume, in which Neal and Roy Thomas introduce Sauron, the Savage Land, Havok and Polaris, make the Sentinels scary (this was the first time the Sentinels had a learning program and could think adaptively), show Mags as something other than a post-Doom bucketheaded egomaniac and draw X-Men with more proportions more human than superhuman.

Basically, the way Marvel was publishing books at the time, the Adams/Thomas X-Men was DOA before its first issue hit the shelves. What with being already cancelled and all they went ahead and pulled out some pretty neat issues. Plus, one of their stories is entitled "Do Or Die, Baby". You cannot go wrong.

My favourite X-artists would be Adams, Alan Davis and J.R.Jr (1st run - not the ugly squareboxy 2nd one). Oh, and Jackson Guice's work on 'The New Mutants' in the period between Sienkewicz and Brett Blevins was also very good - gave the characters a real complexity and humanity, kind of a low budget Barry Windsor Smith thing.

I think Claremont clearly made the X-books "sexy". Characters were always being forced into bondage, dressing up as hookers for disguises, mentally dominated and placed in increasingly risque costumes, having all their clothing blasted away, running around in the nude, being regressed to infancy and re-aged as someone else's slave and generally getting their kink on. Poor Rogue got stripped of her powers and fondled quite a bit, and the whole thing had an ongoing restraint/bondage/frustration/slavery motif running through it.

Despite all that, I'm not sure that Claremont's stuff qualifies as mysoginistic. He probably did more of interest with female characters during that period of comics than any other writer I can think of. The work that was done with Storm in the 'Lifedeath' stories, or the treatment of Kitty in her losing her relationship with Colossus, Danielle Moonstar facing down Death and realizing aspects of the lifecycle - there was some really excellent work going on and it was mostly the girls who got to be the protagonists. New Mutants was particularly the focus of this, where Mirage and Magik and Wolfsbane were the central characters with the boys popping in and out from time to time. And during the Lifedeath period there were whole X-arcs just focussed on Storm and Rogue.

In writing about Lancelot du Lac, T.H. White (himself somewhat of a sadist) says "He was probably something of a sadist, which is why he went out of his way to be very kind." That's a paraphrase, BTW, but it seems to me to be obvious that White is writing of himself here. I sometimes wonder if he isn't defining a type as well. By my lights, Mr Claremont would probably fit the bill.

Met him once. My question (aged 15): Is Rogue going to be dead forever?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
19:14 / 19.05.03
It's very nice to see the general feeling on Barbelith gradually become more and more pro-Claremont. I've been going through all of my old Claremont X-comics lately (I just found a bunch that I thought were gone forever, actually) and it's really cool to read these things that I was obsessed with as a kid (and mostly haven't reread since then) and see all of this subtext that wasn't obvious to me at the time, being under 12 and all. I definitely remember feeling the sex vibe, I just didn't fully understand it. I vaguely remember hiding some of the issues so that my parents wouldn't see some of the naughty stuff, namely the Inferno issues with Madelyne wearing next to nothing.

I think in many ways, Claremont's work on the X-Men is much more interesting to analyze and speculate about than Grant Morrison's stuff - maybe it's just me, but issues of sexuality, human relationships, and morality are far more interesting than metaphysical/magical mumbojumbo. It's also more interesting to me because so much of it was relegated to the subtext and visual detail and read by an enormous audience that was mostly children - it's sooooooo much more subversive than anything Morrison could ever hope to achieve with or without the X-Men.
 
 
cusm
17:48 / 26.05.03
So how did Storm regain her powers, anyway? Its been too long for met to remember, and the detail is bugging me. I always did like that arc.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
18:47 / 26.05.03
It's really as simple as this: Forge built a new machine that gave her powers back. She then 'died' with the rest of the X-Men fighting Adversary, and the X-Men moved to Australia.
 
 
arcboi
20:50 / 26.05.03
I got into Claremont-era X Men after a friend lent me some copies at the time. I promptly went out and picked up some of the trades. Those Art Adams illustrated issues are just wonderful comics.

Strangely enough, the same is true of GM's run (I just picked up the latest trade this week in fact).

I liked Claremont's soap opera approach to the title, but I also like Grant's "magical mumbo jumbo" (although is there really that much of that in there?). Frank Quietly's art is a big factor too though.
 
 
Optimistic
10:48 / 27.05.03
What was Mr Sinister up to the last time he turned up?

After the lastest issue of New X-Men I was trying to think of who might be pulling the strings. I mean, is he still alive or was he killed off?

I'm looking to you long term fans to tell me how likely it is to be him who produced the kick etc. etc.

Part of me wants you guys to tell me it'll never happen, but then I think it might be really cool to see how Grant handles the character.

Well, what do you think?
 
 
some guy
12:38 / 27.05.03
Forge didn't build a device that restored Storm's powers - they were always there. Tons of clues were dropped in the interim. The second gun in UXM 227 was just a placebo, I think.

I agree that Claremont's first run is overdue for a positive critical reception. Part of the problem though is that, like Morrison's current run, it was very much of its time and therefore often feels dated. It's also such a large tapestry that much of what Claremont achieved isn't visible in individual issues, but instead must be seen from a distance...
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
12:56 / 27.05.03
Laurence, I was just trying to simplify the answer as much as possible!
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
15:02 / 27.05.03
Super Geeky Question:

What, in your opinion, was the best X-Men line-up ever?

Personally, I'm going to have to say that it is a dead-heat tie between Grant's current group (Charles, Wolverine, Cyclops, Jean Grey, Emma Frost, Beast, and Xorn) and the Claremont/Romita Jr. roster (Storm, Wolverine, Rogue, Rachel Summers, Kitty Pryde, Colossus, Nightcrawler, and Magneto).
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
15:05 / 27.05.03
Also, the worst line-up is easily the current Chuck Austen X-Men, which makes little to no sense besides being the leftover characters that Claremont and Morrison have no time for: Archangel, Havok, Polaris, Juggernaut, Nightcrawler, Iceman, and Husk.

I always disliked the poorly thought-out group dynamics of the relatively short-lived Jim Lee blue team/gold team nonsense.
 
 
ciarconn
00:34 / 28.05.03
On Mr Sinister. (I think it was at the end of the Revolution/Claremont's run)He manipulated the high Evolutionary into using a satelite to deny the powers of all metahumans i earth, and later used that same satielite to stimulate and jumpsatrt mutations on all X-factor potentials. The X Men flew into the satelite and fought Mr S. creations without their powers, and won. The neo (an Uber-mutant subrace creatged by Claremont) started a vendetta on Sinister because many Neo died while Mr S. supressed the X Factor. Supossedly they killed all the clones (since there appears to be no original).

But later, on Unlimited, Mr Sinister returned and offered Nightcrawler to clone Colossus and, in a way, return him to life. So he's supossed to be alive and hiding.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
18:41 / 07.07.03
I was just flipping through my X-Men back issues and can't seem to find anything about Callisto's powers. What the fuck is she? Just a mutant hardass? Has this been covered already?
 
 
Mr Tricks
19:06 / 07.07.03
Callisto was presented as a sort of watered down Wolverine.

Super sences (though not as super as wolverine)

Strength,Agility & toughness (though not as strong or tough as wolverine)

there was even a monore healing ability implied (though nothing like Wolvie of course)

So yeah... mutant hardass would prettymuch sum her up.
 
 
grant
19:39 / 07.07.03
Also, the worst line-up is easily the current Chuck Austen X-Men, which makes little to no sense besides being the leftover characters that Claremont and Morrison have no time for: Archangel, Havok, Polaris, Juggernaut, Nightcrawler, Iceman, and Husk.



I haven't read any of Austen's stuff (nor am I likely to), but it seems like you could have a lot of fun with Nightcrawler and Archangel on the same team - especially visually. And Iceman has always seemed like a fun guy to write.

And then you've got Havok and Juggernaut - they're both the less-famous brothers, right?
That'd also be fun.

Request - a nutshell history of Juggernaut would be nice.

Polaris I'm not that familiar with - former Alpha Flight member?

And Husk I don't know at all.

Request - a nutshell history of them two would be nice too.
 
 
Panic
20:48 / 07.07.03
I know that Husk is Cannonball's sister. Which just adds to the apparent X-ridiculousness of all mutants being related to one another. She was introduced I believe in the GENERATION X series.

Polaris was supposedly Magneto's daughter. Then she wasn't. Now I think she is again. You see now why a lot of people quit reading X-books after a while. She wasn't in Alpha Flight as I recall, but she was in X-Factor.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
20:59 / 07.07.03
I think there's already a nutshell on the Juggernaut in this thread, but basically he's Professor X's half brother, demented by the favor shown to Charles when they were boys. He isn't a mutant, last I knew, but was empowered by a gem he found in a South American ruin that makes him strong as hell, impervious to harm, and immune to Charles' psy-powers. He teamed up intermittently with Banshee's cousin Black Tom, sort of an evil pirate, to Get Revenge. I didn't know he was A) now a goodguy or B) now a mutant.

Polaris was Havok's girlfriend, who either was or was not actually Magneto's daughter. She was introduced, I think, during Claremont's first New X-Men mission to Krakaoa, the mutant island. I dunno her current status, either, but she was the victim of constant mindfrugging from Magneto and the Marauder Malice.

Husk I have no idea about. After my time.

My favorite X-Men line ups were the variations during the Saga of Storm's Mohawk, which was roughly Morlocks-kidnap-Angel through Mutant-Massacre. I really liked Cyclops running around fighting giant squids on his honeymoon, and I liked the increased focus on Nightcrawler, who wins Most Underestimated X-Man hands down.
 
 
Mr Tricks
21:45 / 07.07.03
I think Polaris first appeared as the girlfriend of ICEMAN durring the Neal Adams era of X-men...

For a time she also was & wasn't the sister to Zelandine a Savage Land Priestess who was a foe of KAZAR that the X-men adopted (hell why NOT).
But yeah, she's been Goo-Bad-good-Bad again... So many times it's hard to keep track. Probably the MOST mind controled mutant in X-history which is ironic considering how Magnetism seems to keep Magneto protected from Psychic attack.

Husk has alwasy been absurd. Appariently her powers allow her to peal off her skin (and cloths) and reveal a new version of herself with the power to solve the plot... plus her outfit again. So if the plot demands a diamond drill she can peel off her skin(and cloth) and whaLA... there she is in diamond form still waring her outfit.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
22:46 / 07.07.03
Ah, that's nowhere near as lame and contrived as Lifeguard from X-Treme X-Men, whose power is to be given the ability to do anything in order to save someone else's life.

Her secondary mutation is to eliminate every trace of drama from every story that she appears in.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
23:25 / 07.07.03
Maybe these wack mutants can be retconned by saying that Proteus is still alive, but is unconscious and hallucinating that he's various X-Men and X-villains. They never did bring Proteus back, did they?

I think it makes passable sense for all these mutants to be related--they share x-genes or whatever.
 
 
Mr Tricks
23:37 / 07.07.03
There actually WAS an attempt to bring Proteus back in a multi-comic annual cross-over "event" called The King of Pain...

believe me... the less you know about it, the better you'll feel.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
23:43 / 07.07.03
Was Sting involved?
 
 
The Falcon
01:30 / 08.07.03
No. But the New Warriors were.

I've got it in French. I don't know French.
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
01:59 / 08.07.03
The New Warriors were so cool.
 
 
weepy_minotaur
02:17 / 08.07.03
Favorite Team:Current, although I've always had a soft spot(and always will) for the originals.
Favorite artist:Quitely only because I don't know if Sienkehowever-the-hell-you-spell-it counts.
Flux, thank you. I didn't think anyone else on the planet knew as much about X-History as me.To my delight you,Sir, have proven me wrong.

And Wolverines always had bone claws. I think they suck too, but them's the facts. How often does Logan have to shave/cut his hair? Does the healing factor affect such things? If so, imagine this toenails....ewwwww....



I realize this is a bit off topic, but I thought I'd run the idea by my fellow geeks and see how it pans out.
I have a theory that Apocolypse is responsible for everything that happens in the Marvel Universe. Not just the X-Stuff, but everything.
Thoughts? Am I a moron? Do I think about comics too much? Let me know what you think.
 
 
waxy dan
07:46 / 08.07.03
Probably the MOST mind controled mutant in X-history which is ironic considering how Magnetism seems to keep Magneto protected from Psychic attack.
Isn't it his helmet that somehow uses dark and malevolent science to shield him from psychics? Thus the big near-suicidal attack by Wolverine (when he lost his adamantium) to remove Magnus's helmet so Xavier could attack him?

Q: Who's Proteus?
 
 
Dan Fish - @Fish1k
08:45 / 08.07.03
Husk may have appeared in an early Rom: Space Knight annual, guest starring the New Mutants. Her first 'proper' appearance was in the X-Force/New Warriors 'Childs Play' crossover, shortly before the Phalanx/Generation X launch
 
 
Persephone
11:18 / 08.07.03
Q: Who's Proteus?

Proteus is Moira McTaggert's son. He doesn't have his own body. He occupies other people's bodies until their life force is used up & then he discards them all mummified. Proteus can also alter reality. Moira kept him in a special cell on Muir Island, but he got out. This was right after the South Pole thing & right before Jean turns Dark Phoenix.
 
 
penitentvandal
11:23 / 08.07.03
Yeah, you could have visual fun with Nightcrawler and Archangel on the same team, couldn't you? Or at least you could if the Austen hadn't turned Archangel pink again, and given him back the feathery wings, and turned him into a Christ-like figure who heals mutants by the power of his blood. Seriously.

There is one good issue of Austen's run, and that's the last issue of that stupid werewolf story. And the reason it's good is just because it's ridiculously over-the-top and camp, in an unintentional way. But since then, it's just been a long downhill slide into super-Dynasty. I stopped reading after Polaris intro'd her new 'Magneto-style' costume when havok revealed he didn't want to marry her after all and instead wanted to marry Annie the Whining Human Nurse, who Iceman is shagging for no apparent reason except that Iceman always fancies Havok's girlfriends, which is interesting because Northstar, the Only Gay Mutant in the World, fancies Iceman, you see, and...

Oh sod it. I don't understand it either.
 
 
SavageFistsOfFengshui
11:50 / 08.07.03
Polaris was introduced by former Doom Patrol writer Arnold Drake in X-Men #49. That issue's cover was by the great Jim Steranko, who also drew the next two issues and redesigned the X-Men logo.

http://216.87.86.135/istore/images/fullsize/97792366288.49.GIF
http://216.87.86.135/istore/images/fullsize/97792366288.50.GIF
http://216.87.86.135/istore/images/fullsize/97792366288.51.GIF
 
 
fluid_state
13:12 / 08.07.03
Those covers are golden. Ive spent the last half hour checking out the other numbers in the series. (58 seems to be the first introduction of Havok, and has a damn snazzy cover).

Fave X-men line would be... yeah, Storm's Mohawk Team sums it up pretty perfectly. right until 227 (and a bit after). Always the same team members, perpetually changing dynamic.

And about Juggernaut, it wouldn't be surprising if he was "really" a mutant all along. There's a pattern of once-magically-bestowed characters suddenly becoming mutants by virtue of joining an X-title. Y'know, "he/she was really mutant all along; When he/she was immersed in Merlin's Scintillating Pixie-Dust of Power, his/her natural abilities were unlocked for the good/ungood of mankind". Science:1, Magick: ridiculous.
 
 
Shrug
19:44 / 08.07.03
Husk- In her first appearances seemed to be a standard omnimorph? (transformed into a bird or ladybug or something) however this has now all but been forgotten. Lately she just peels of her skin revealing a diamond/rubber/steel form? Although in AOA she transformed into a corrosive acid. (which was a lot more interesting than her current Uncanny morphs)
 
  

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