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Attack of the Clones

 
  

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Matthew Fluxington
10:46 / 21.03.02
I find it weird that at the end of the 20th and beginning of the 21st centuries, people would still be bemoaning the mixing of genres, and decline of pure, uninfluenced genre work...
 
 
Eloi Tsabaoth
11:00 / 21.03.02
There is no pure sci-fi. It's always influenced or flavored by something else.
I am, however, willing to be proven wrong.

[ 21-03-2002: Message edited by: Village of the Bizunth ]
 
 
that
11:11 / 21.03.02
I think you're right. I think SF, by its very nature, is not a 'fixed' genre. It has fluid boundaries, and that is a positive thing, IMHO.
 
 
sleazenation
13:54 / 21.03.02
its that great SF vs magical realism debate- of high and low cultural equivelents.
 
 
Captain Zoom
17:28 / 21.03.02
I just found this.

Pissed off Yoda

Yee-freakin'-ha.

Zoom.
 
 
gridley
15:21 / 22.03.02
Gotta agree with Paleface and Runce. AI was the best sci-fi film in a long time. Even though I'm wary of Speilberg, I think his touches worked well with Kubrick's ideas.

After seeing that movie, I was so jazzed that I went out and read the three Brian Aldiss short stories the film was inspired by. Very different stuff, but good.
 
 
bio k9
08:01 / 23.03.02
quote:Originally posted by Cholister:
I was offended, to say the least, at Jack's musings about whether me and my ilk should be forcibly euthanized. An ickle bit of an over-reaction, methinks.

Meanwhile, your reaction was perfectly measured and completely appropriate in the face of Jack's obvious attempts to have "you and your ilk (myself included, btw)" sent to the slaughter. Take a deep breath.

And let it go.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
08:01 / 23.03.02
The bits at the start od Star Wars do look kinda like Spaghetti Westerns like 'A Few Dollars More', was this the kind of thing you wanted?

Philip K. Dick did a short essay on his definition of science fiction and what it wasn't, don't know if it's been put up anywhere, maybe at Philip K Dick dot com...

And a question that's been bugging me for years. Brian Blessed's character in 'Phantom', was he actually speaking in English (albeit the horrible 'down on the plantation massah' dialect Binks spoke in) or was he actually speaking a 'foreign' language, because I genuinely couldn't understand a word...
 
 
Margin Walker
01:20 / 08.04.02
For anyone so inclined, a rough (read: 60 grit) draft of the SWII script can be found here:

http://www.prequel-spoilers.com/script.txt
 
 
The Monkey
14:15 / 08.04.02
I've heard but cannot confirm that many film wonks see tremendous similarity between Kurosawa's samurai flick, "The Hidden Fortress," and the plot of the original Stars Trilogy, all the way down to the dynamics between the main characters. Which is funny, because Kurosawa's film style and plot generation was profoundly influenced by his love of Westerns, which all confabulates this "what-genre-is-it?" question. Then again, I don't think any film actually perfectly fits within a genre's criterion, to the exclusion of other elements.

Was anyone else completely creeped out by all of the ethnicized aliens in Episode One?

BTW Loz - The Sergio Leone flicks "Fistful of Dollars" and "A Few Dollars More" are based on the Kurosawa film "Yojimbo" - which is an absolutely awesone film if you haven't seen it. Clint Eastwood is consciously aping Toshiro Mifune's style in that film, which is funny, because "Yojimbo" itself self-consciously appropriates from the Western genre (there is even a duel at high noon in the town center, heh) and Mifune, in interview, claimed that he was doing an imitation of his own favorite US actor, John Wayne.
I always thought Jar-Jar Binks was a rather distasteful parody of a Caribbean black male. His speech style is a lot like creoles or patois from the region; his motion in animation resembles a strut in the most 1920s Harlem, Detroit-Red sense of a strut; the fins he has in place of hair boths resemble and move like braids or dreadlocks.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
14:25 / 08.04.02
Just out of interest.

If Lucas had shit in a bucket and called it Attack of the Clones, would there still be line ups to see it?
 
 
videodrome
14:58 / 08.04.02
Fistful isn't just based on Yojimbo - it's a pretty direct remake. And Kurosawa was definitely influenced by Westerns, and American pop culture in gnereal - Yojimbo is strongly based on Dashiel Hammet's book Red Harvest. His Western and Isolation/v/Expansion tendencies are what make him so interesting, and part of what made other Japanese directors dislike Kurosawa.

I'm one of the film wonks that see similarities between SW and The Hidden Fortress. You'd have to be blind to miss them. The R2D2 and Threepio characters are based directly on the two rouges in HF, to the point where shots featuring them are identical. There are other shot-for-shot lifts made by Lucas and that being the case, it's hard to argue that the warrior/princess setup wasn't lifted as well, even though it's a common character pair.

And I can get all long-winded talking about how SW is a western and not sci-fi, but I just can't see the point...
 
 
grant
15:13 / 08.04.02
Clint Eastwood has said in interviews that what attracted him to Fistful was that he was told it was a remake of a Kurosawa film, and Kurosawa interested him.

Monkeys:Was anyone else completely creeped out by all of the ethnicized aliens in Episode One?

Yes, although Jar Jar didn't bug me nearly as much as the Chinese ones. (At least with Jar Jar, there were other Gungans who weren't like he was. The Trade Envoys, or whatever - they were worse than Charlie Chan.)
 
 
Margin Walker
09:43 / 10.05.02
As the guy who wrote this review put it himself "I almost wish that I didn't know what was going to happen." But if you want to know anyways....

A review of the film with a bunch of spoilers from Ain't It Cool News

I can't believe I just admitted that I read Ain't It Cool News. Why don't I wear a t-shirt that reads "Will you be my friend?" with Spock ears & get it over with.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
13:26 / 10.05.02
i just want to know why obi wan has a full effect macguyver mullet???
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
13:30 / 10.05.02
(just got around to reading these last few posts and Potus asked "If Lucas had shit in a bucket and called it Attack of the Clones, would there still be line ups to see it?"

i dont recall who it was but aroung this time 2 years ago someone said, and i quote "It could be footage of a monkey taking a piss for 2 hours called star wars and i would see it"
 
 
Trijhaos
13:35 / 10.05.02
I will not read the spoilers....I will not read the spoilers...I want to be surprised when I go see it.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
13:45 / 10.05.02
I plan to ruin it for everyone by walking out of the theater saying loudly "Who would have thought that Anakin was Darth Vader???"
 
 
Trijhaos
13:49 / 10.05.02
I already know who's going to lose what limbs within the course of the movie, because last week when I was out I checked out the new action figures. Some of the figures have features, such as removable limbs that could be considered spoilers.

I really feel sorry for any kids who attempt to play with those things. They look like little statues, not action figures.
 
 
The Natural Way
14:38 / 10.05.02
Trij, the new action figures piss on the ones I played w/ as a kid.

I think yr undergoing a case of nostalgia "gone maaad".
 
 
Trijhaos
14:50 / 10.05.02
I just think these new figures are marketed more towards the adult collector's market, then children. Sure, they look better than the older stuff from the 70's and 80's, but they don't really have much play value. I mean, most of them are little more than statues. Take, Shaak Ti, for instance. She's got 3 points of articulation. Most action figures have 5; the neck, the arms, and the legs. Or take, Padme Amidalia, her quick-draw feature is, in a word, crap.
 
 
Sensual Cobra
17:52 / 13.05.02
I downloaded it from the 'net. Sweet, life-giving Internet. Probably shouldn't comment on the effects, going from a bootleg, but plot-wise I do find it hard to care about many of the characters, excluding Natalie Portman and Samuel L Jackson. There seemed to be some gaping holes in logic, but maybe they're part of the Star Wars mythos I didn't get, not being a HUGE fan.

A couple of interesting links,
re: Joseph Campbell and Lucas, why the writing/direction on Empire was so superior, and George Lucas's debt to sci-fi in general: here @ Salon.

And the reader replies, in which Michael Moorcock slams Kershner (Empire
director) and blames Spielberg and Lucas for "hijacking" adult sci-fi
and driving it into the ground of juvenile camp. And! The Hidden Fortress!
here
 
 
Sandfarmer
21:31 / 13.05.02
What I've seen of the film in commercials looks fun. Lasers, spaceships, monsters, robots. Good sci-fi nonsense. I've already bought my ticket. I'm really looking forward to it. I've avoided all the internet spoilers so hopefully it will have some fun twists like Empire.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
22:06 / 13.05.02
Ah, but there AREN'T any 'fun twists'. I've checked.
 
 
Trijhaos
22:39 / 13.05.02
There are plent of fun twists.

Anakin is Darth Vader. Who'da thunk it?
 
 
Hieronymus
22:55 / 13.05.02
Saw all but the last 10 minutes of it thanks to a friend's pirated copy (yes, the stuff that Seinfeld episodes are made of). Same old stiff dialogue, kids, but the effects are incredibly slick. And the reports are true. Yoda is one bad-ass little Muppet.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
23:37 / 13.05.02
SPOILER!











SPOILER!


















SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!







Palpatine is Darth Sidious is The Emperor! Shhhhhhhhhh!
 
 
gentleman loser
00:14 / 14.05.02
If Lucas had shit in a bucket and called it Attack of the Clones, would there still be line ups to see it?

Yes. Yes they would, because:

A. Crap sells based on name.

B. Talentless directors (and idiot actors and moronic pop singers) have replaced God in the west.

As for the first post of this thread, Harry Knowles is an annoying, rabid fanboy who shouldn't be taken seriously in the least as far as his supposed "journalistic integrity" is concerned. Effects alone can't make a good sci-fi flick. Considering how crap The Phantom Menace was, I probably won't see Attack of the Clones until 2004 or so.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
12:22 / 14.05.02
B. Talentless directors (and idiot actors and moronic pop singers) have replaced God in the west.

Puh-lease! Korea and Japan are in the east, and pop culture there isn't much different.
 
 
gridley
16:27 / 14.05.02
yeah, if anything people in the East worship worthless pop stars even more than us morons in the West.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
16:57 / 14.05.02
It's their kitsch spirit, think Hello Kitty
 
 
Ganesh
18:16 / 14.05.02
Ahhh, "talent" - that strangely-unquantifiable ambrosia whose absence is apparently unequivocal - making a rare sojourn from the Music forum...
 
 
The Natural Way
07:22 / 15.05.02
Well, I work just by Leicester Sq. and all the Star Wars shit got me right excited. Roll on Thursday: leave work at 1, have a joint, make my way to the Odeon w/ my pals....oh, yes....
 
 
The Natural Way
10:07 / 15.05.02
Only two of my pals have just dropped out, cause they're skint and can't miss a days work. I'm a bit sad about that. We were all going to be geeks together.... Aaah, well. Trying to find replacements as we speak....
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
14:39 / 15.05.02
Most gallingly I've seen a number of 'reviews' and people on telly saying "yes, it is rubbish but, let's face it, you are going to see it aren't you?"
 
  

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