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Underground > Policy & Help >

The place for new members to ask basic questions about Barbelith

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07:46 / 19.07.06

Okay, rightly or wrongly it's apparent to me that some people feel intimidated about posting on here. (%These people, clearly, do not include me. I have not felt nervous about posting here as recently as yesterday. Thus I can only take your word for it.%) Maybe it would help to have a new posters-only thread? Or a snark-virtually-free Barbelith 101 for newish posters or long-time lurkers to ask questions and have people be supportive at them instead of having to fear Snarkupagus Attack?

09:53 / 19.07.06

I'm not sure what it would achieve, really. If there's one thing newer members don't seem shy about expressing, it's their feelings of nervousness when posting as it is.

I don't mean to sound too Major Brad about this, but as a newer member (and after nearly three 'Big Brothers,' I'd still put myself in that category,) it seems as if you've got two choices; either you ask yourself, honestly, before hitting post reply, if you've said anything that a reasonable human being might consider to be bollox, and adjust the thing accordingly, or you go ahead and be damned, and take the consequences with a modicum of good humour.

I just don't see what's so difficult about that.

Tom Paine's Bones

10:45 / 19.07.06

I think there's possibly a case for a Barbelith 101 thread, although I don't see myself using it much due to being a long time lurker. But if it was a combination of any questions and useful threads on issues that come up repeatedly (Feminism 101, Introductions, Political Correctness, Id Entity doesn't care if you were joking) I think it could be a useful resource for newer posters.

But the idea of a thread solely for new posters, no matter how well meaning, leaves me totally cold. I think the new poster/old poster divide is often overstated anyway. But I think that a thread where new posters sit round talking with each other about how new they are would only reinforce that impression.

On the subject of people being nervous/intimidated about posting on Barbelith, I think it needs to be recognised that isn't necessarily a negative point for everybody. I know I'm often nervous about posting on Barbelith. But that's one of the reasons I'm here. I want to be challenged and I don't want to be able to get away with some of the lazy discussion tactics I'm used to using on other boards. I'm sure that not everybody who feels nervous sees it in a similar way to me, but I strongly suspect some do.

10:52 / 19.07.06

On the other hand, hell why not? If some people will be encouraged by a training wheels thread why not start one? At worst it drops off the radar due to lack of use, at best it eases posters into Barbelith's idiosyncracies gently. A place where people can get all their emoticons and post signing out of the way sounds great, as long as it's not slack on '-ism' posting.

13:16 / 19.07.06

I’d like to think that the whole of the Policy is generally a low-snark zone. And the Policy Miscellany thread was designed to accommodate the kinds of questions new people might have.
I suppose there are very fighty threads in P&H, but I kinda think that snark is a two-way street. I’d hope that any question asked thoughtfully and sincerely in the Policy would be answered in the same vein.
I’d also second Jeremiah’s points that (a) the terms newbie and old-timer are probably not very helpful, and (b) that a certain reticence about hitting the Post Reply button is probably a good thing.

But maybe I misunderstand the need for a Barbelith 101 thread. Are we talking about a 'newbie' only thread like the women only thread where the (undefined) new posters can talk about Barbelith amongst themselves? A Q&A thread? A 'sandbox' area?

Ultimately, I’d suggest that anyone who wants one should start one, outlining what they want to happen in it.

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17:26 / 19.07.06

I was thinking kind of social-support-groupy, for newish posters to practice hitting "Post Reply" without whatever the danger is that they're fearing will happen when they post on the Lith-At-Large. But, yeah, maybe it wouldn't be helpful. I dunno.

Tryphena Absent

17:59 / 19.07.06

I think it would be helpful to have a no snark thread where new people could ask any question about Barbelith. A little safe space in case they weren't getting something. P&H is very dry and it can be argumentative, a softly-softly thread is not a bad idea because this is an assertive place and why should people have to go through the wringer? Well, they shouldn't.

Tryphena Absent

18:01 / 19.07.06

... if people felt like they were being treated very strongly for something small they could maybe retreat to that thread and say "I don't understand why this is happening" and someone could just be totally straight-forward with them.

19:07 / 19.07.06

A 'stupid Barbelith questions' thread sounds like an excellent idea.

20:55 / 19.07.06

Awrightee. Let's give it a go. For starters:

- please explain 101 etc
- Is there etiquette to exclamation marks/numbers doo-da?

20:58 / 19.07.06

Can you expand a bit? I don't understand the question.

ONLY NICE THINGS

21:01 / 19.07.06

"101" is a term from American college education - the 101 class is the first class you take in a subject. So, "(subject) 101" means "a thread for entry-level questions about (subject)".

Not sure about your second question. If you mean "why do people keep writing 11!!23!!?" - it's a joke about overexcited posting. Otherwise, as Falconer says, could you elucidate?

21:04 / 19.07.06

If you mean "why do people keep writing 11!!23!!?" - it's a joke about overexcited posting.

Yes, that's about the strength of it...(!)

21:48 / 19.07.06

to see why, hit a string of exclamations and lift the shift too early, like...

this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Less searchable M0rd4nt

22:37 / 19.07.06

And 23 is the focal number of Discordianism. Over time it's become associated with the exasperating phenomenon known on Barbelith as fnording.

00:44 / 20.07.06

I always assumed that the unofficial purpose of the Late Shift threads was to give the n00bs a place to show up and chat until they felt confident enough to get their feet wet in the other threads and fora. Maybe that's just how I used it though.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

00:53 / 20.07.06

Am I the only person who's finding the "101" thing annoying now? It's like when people say "three strikes and you're out", and know nothing about baseball (like me). OK, it's kind of a minor thing, but it makes me GRRRR.

paranoidwriter waves hello

02:30 / 20.07.06

Threadrot question: when was "fnording" added to the wiki? (I could have sworn I've read and re-read the wiki a number of times and hadn't seen this as part of Barba-lingo - I knew "fnord" through RAW, but "fnording"? Well, that's new to me [which aint a bad thing, of course].)

I also like the idea of a no-snide thread for new-members to gain confidence and better understand (for want of a better phrase) Barbetiquette. I'll hopefully explain why later, but I'm a lttle pissed and only supposed to be popping in to ask the above question.

06:54 / 20.07.06

So, I confused, is this thread supposed to be the thread in question, or are we talking about starting a new thread? I assume the latter, but TFT's post and the responses to it have rather muddied the water. The thread should be put in Convo, yes?

07:06 / 20.07.06

why convo?
stupid music questions go in music.
stupid policy questions should go in policy, yeah?

or is it a visibility thing?

ONLY NICE THINGS

07:55 / 20.07.06

This seems to be the default "stupid questions about interacting on Barbelith" thread - if we're running with it, we should probably change the title and abstract - or we can start a new thread, here or in Conversation, with the last couple of questions copied and pasted.

08:36 / 20.07.06

Yes, lets make this one the actual thread if id agrees.

09:22 / 20.07.06

I can imagine situations that would fit the remit that wouldn't quite fall under the policy heading. Also there's the question of traffic. Lots of newbies don't read the Policy (I may be wrong, but I think it's better to stay on the safe side), so to ensure maximum helpfulness, I think this should go in a more popular, more, dare I say, accessible forum.

10:16 / 20.07.06

We could always put it in the email Tom sends. You know, the one which also says, "Please do not start your own introduction thread." which everyone always pays attention to.

I wish we had sticky threads, or maybe just a little new poster section. We could say, "Go here first." in the email and in that space would be all the relevant 101 threads, this thread, the introductions thread. Everything together. And we could call it, "Come in here new posters and read everything. Read it properly, more than once and don't come out until you've finished. Or else."

Or something a bit shorter.

10:31 / 20.07.06

Have we ever had sticky threads, I can't remember?

10:41 / 20.07.06

I don't think we can technically do them.

10:47 / 20.07.06

Well, I'm sure that's the case these days, but something in the back of brane tells me that we once had 'em.

11:18 / 20.07.06

I don’t know. As someone who just learning how to point the cursor at Post I’m beginning to see the point of the not-so-huggly-Barbelith attitude. There are numerous examples of members pointing out that if you can’t muster the conviction to post, don’t post. This is pretty healthy. I’ve already made a couple of stupids and have been lucky to escape censure. I know what they are, though, and I’m sure I learned from them. I really had to think hard to come up with two poorly presented questions up above, probably because I have read the wiki (less than twice, clearly). As I’ve hinted to someone in private, I don’t see the point of some sort of Barbekindergarten. Perhaps a frisson of terror is half the fun. I would think that the best way to learn about etiquette is to read as much of the site as you can stomach and have a go. Oh, bit by bit. On tippy toes.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

11:32 / 20.07.06

Write about Moomins. My first thread was about Moomins and I've done all right.

09:25 / 21.07.06

I have a stupid question:

pwn3ed - I don't understand what it means. Please tell me and don't laugh.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

09:31 / 21.07.06

pw3ned (and variants) = owned = schooled, trounced, taken to the cleaners, defeated.

10:08 / 21.07.06

More on teh p3wn. Worth following the links to L33t, too.

12:30 / 21.07.06

I would think that the best way to learn about etiquette is to read as much of the site as you can stomach and have a go. Oh, bit by bit. On tippy toes.

Glory be TFT, if only everyone had the same idea.

15:48 / 21.07.06

See now? Sometimes Google is not your friend. I couldn't find the wikipedia link for paw3ned, and that's because it was listed under p3wn.

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16:06 / 21.07.06

I was going to ask is there some basic primer on pop-culture references for people who live in California hippiedom and never watch television or movies or listen to the radio, but then I realized that I'm posting to it right now. So I'll request a remedial British in-joke lesson at some point instead.

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