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Rape accusation against Duke lacrosse team

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20:50 / 05.04.06

Rape accusation against Duke lacrosse team.

"The members of the team completely support each other and they know the thing with which they are charged could not possibly have happened," said one individual close to the team who asked not to be identified. "The players are shocked and stunned that this has gotten to such a point. The team was so looking forward to this season. They have had it suspended when they didn't commit a crime. Their only crime was bad judgment; of everything else, they are innocent."

Duke's lacrosse coach resigns.

The rape allegations have roiled the campus and the city, raised racial tensions, and heightened the long-standing antagonism between the privileged students at the elite university and the poorer people of Durham.

The stripper is black and said her attackers were white. Investigators and witnesses have said the lacrosse players taunted her with racial slurs and insults.

Students and townspeople have marched on campus and off, angry over the school's handling of the allegations and the team members' refusal to cooperate with police. Investigators said the athletes are sticking together and keeping silent. No one has been charged.

A violent and hateful email sent by a player supposedly proves his innocence.

Earlier Wednesday, authorities unsealed documents stating that hours after the alleged rape, a player apparently sent an e-mail saying he wanted to invite more strippers to his dorm room, kill them and skin them. It was not clear whether the message was serious or a joke. ...
“While the language of the e-mail is vile, the e-mail itself is perfectly consistent with the boys’ unequivocal assertion that no sexual assault took place that evening,” said attorney Robert Ekstrand. The e-mail “demonstrates that its writer is completely unaware that any act or event remotely similar to what has been alleged ever occurred.”

Our Lady Has Left the Building

08:19 / 06.04.06

The team are the victims here, because they've been stopped from competing while this is investigated... oh please, my heart bleeds!

"Their only crime was bad judgment; of everything else, they are innocent."

I wonder what this unidentified source thinks is the 'bad judgement' the team displayed? Hiring dancers, threatening them with a broomstick, pushing them into the bathroom..?

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09:39 / 06.04.06

Some more good honest reporting...

It’s racism at Duke, all right. Racism against white students. Members of the Duke University Lacrosse team may have abused a black party girl, but, without any proof or trial, the Duke Lacrosse team was punished by the university, suspended from further games. So terrified was the administration of being charged with “racism.” The black female wins again. She is truly an ace on the field and in court.

Naturally, the name of the black girl has not been released – appropriate if she is a rape victim, inappropriate if she is engaging in scurrilous race-baiting. The reports say the woman is a divorced, 27-year-old “mother” of two, attending North Carolina Central University. She is not a person of note, and is said to do exotic dancing as a side job to pick up extra cash.

Any idea what conclusion this string of evidence is evidence toward? beyond that the author is racist and misogynist (and yes, I used that word deliberately this time)?

09:43 / 06.04.06

FFS. Not that I'd expect anything better from that particular publication. How influential is it, btw?

Spyder Todd 2008

16:03 / 06.04.06

Christ. How do people like that sleep a night? At least the university is (sort of) sending a message to the team. But I'm rather worried that these guys might get away with this. Juries get stupid in trials involving athletes, I've noticed. Which is horrible, really.

16:19 / 06.04.06

No charges have been laid, yet, right? As of articles printed today that I found, I didn't see any arrests or anything. Is that right?

16:23 / 06.04.06

Just clicked that second link in the second post - 'kin hell. What are these people on?

But, exotic dancing—and then to cry “abuse”? This may be pushing victimhood beyond reason.

So, she's a stripper - she deserved it. Kerrrist.

18:25 / 06.04.06

Smoking Gun has the email.

Page five.

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20:28 / 06.04.06

No charges have been laid, yet, right? As of articles printed today that I found, I didn't see any arrests or anything. Is that right?

You're right, matt, and we must bear in mind that the lacrosse players have not been proven guilty of assault. However, we must also keep in mind that the woman has not been proven guilty of slander.

Grant, thanks for the Smoking Gun link. That's really interesting, albeit disturbing.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

09:06 / 07.04.06

Also some nice thoughts on Yeagley's own message board.

Spyder Todd 2008

21:33 / 10.04.06

Well, this is interesting.

Of course, I might point out that if you were wearing a condom, you might not leave DNA behind. Thoughts?

00:29 / 11.04.06

Of course, I might point out that if you were wearing a condom, you might not leave DNA behind. Thoughts?

The article suggests that if a condom was used, other traces would be left, such as lubricant and latex...

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

13:06 / 11.04.06

I would assume they wouldn't take DNA samples if they didn't have anything to test against.

01:57 / 12.04.06

The lawyers for the accused have said that the DNA tests proved no match. See here.

The question is what happens now?

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

16:02 / 12.04.06

According to that article there wasnt any evidence that the woman had sex recently?

That seems odd, since doctors can check for bruising which is common in sexual assaults. If she had not had sex recently why did they test the team?

Despite my distrust of athletes of almost all variety, I can't help but feel a bit sorry for these guys if they didn't do anything wrong and their season got ruined. Of course, if it comes out that they either did assault her, or knew she was being assaulted at the party and did nothing, then they don't win any of my pity.

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19:02 / 12.04.06

I'm still concerned about the horrifying misogyny (can I use that term this time?) and racism apparent in the email and the press coverage, and it might be worthwhile directing our attention to that.

08:03 / 13.04.06

Of course, I might point out that if you were wearing a condom, you might not leave DNA behind. Thoughts?

Shed pubic hair could supply DNA evidence.

Spyder Todd 2008

21:52 / 13.04.06

A point, yes. Here's another update.

15:03 / 14.04.06

The team are the victims here, because they've been stopped from competing while this is investigated... oh please, my heart bleeds!

if all it takes is an accusation to cancel a sports team's program, we're in big trouble.

Christ. How do people like that sleep a night? At least the university is (sort of) sending a message to the team. But I'm rather worried that these guys might get away with this. Juries get stupid in trials involving athletes, I've noticed. Which is horrible, really.

cancelling a season is a pretty strong message. the only other thing the university could do would be to revoke any scholarships. of course, we can assume that it wouldnt come to that unless guilt is actually proven. and as far as juries "getting stupid" in trials involving athletes, i'm wondering what you're referring to. these are amateur athletes, and not even ones who are playing in the hopes of making a pro career out of it.

Despite my distrust of athletes of almost all variety, I can't help but feel a bit sorry for these guys if they didn't do anything wrong and their season got ruined. Of course, if it comes out that they either did assault her, or knew she was being assaulted at the party and did nothing, then they don't win any of my pity.

well, gosh, thats big of you. you'd feel "a bit sorry" if they were punished for something they didnt do. the to and fro here is interesting. the need to state that someone proven guilty of assault doesnt get your pity (why would they?) along with the hesitant feelings of sympathy should they be proven innocent.

do some groups of people get something like an automatic judgement in the court of public opinion? here, it seems that the accuser gets the benefit of the doubt while the team doesnt. at a certain point in the legal system, people need to be treated fairly. it's a valid point that an accuser needs to be granted some latitude, but i cant help wondering, at this point, if searching her house or apartment would be viewed as wrong, while, despite all public evidence seeming to point towards the team's innocence, the players are having their rooms searched.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

15:34 / 14.04.06

They are not being punished by the legal system, they are being punished by the University. So yes, since the worst thing that could happen to them is that they missed a bunch of lacrosse games because someone claimed they got raped at their house, I feel "a bit sorry". They have not had to deal with any hardships as a result of the legal process so far (possible illegal search and seizures aside until monday when we get more info), the University could just as easily have cancelled games because of the underage drinking.

I felt the need to qualify about them being found guilty because I assumed that the question "Well how sorry would you feel for them if they turn out to be rapists?" would follow.

15:37 / 14.04.06

but i cant help wondering, at this point, if searching her house or apartment would be viewed as wrong, while, despite all public evidence seeming to point towards the team's innocence, the players are having their rooms searched.

Um...WTF?

15:45 / 14.04.06

They have not had to deal with any hardships as a result of the legal process so far (possible illegal search and seizures aside)

what other hardships would you like them to have to deal with?

are you prejudiced against sports teams? their interests are pursuits are just as valid as anyone elses.

should an accusation of assault against a minority interest group on a college campus result in the immediate cancellation of all those group's activities for the entire semester?

Less searchable M0rd4nt

15:57 / 14.04.06

Shadowsax, that's nonsensical.

what other hardships would you like them to have to deal with? is only a rational question if Elijah had suggested that they needed to be 'punished'.

are you prejudiced against sports teams? their interests are pursuits are just as valid as anyone elses.

I don't see anyone arguing otherwise.

should an accusation of assault against a minority interest group on a college campus result in the immediate cancellation of all those group's activities for the entire semester?

Yes, frankly. Or a member of a non-minority group. If a white women--or a white man for that matter--had made those allegations then cancelling the group's activities for as long as it takes the proper authorities to conduct their investigations would still be perfectly reasonable and send a valuable message.

I can't help wondering, Shadowsax, if you'd be taking this dismissive tone if a young man alleged assault by a female sports team. I doubt it.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

15:58 / 14.04.06

If the private governing bodies of the University decide that the action needs to be taken that is up to them. It would be within the private University's rights to cancel all on campus activities of a student organization, regardless of the minority status of their members.

I feel worse for the coach who lost his job over this then the team who lost their season.

And the illegal search and seizure comment above I edited right after posting, saying that we don't know if it wa illegal. If a judge beleives there was enough evidence to issue a warrant, then the searches are acceptable.

16:02 / 14.04.06

If a white women--or a white man for that matter--had made those allegations then cancelling the group's activities for as long as it takes the proper authorities to conduct their investigations is perfectly reasonable and sends a valuable message.

"as long as it takes ... to conduct their investigation" doesnt describe the cancellation of the entire season, and doesnt describe the coach's firing.

I can't help wondering, Shadowsax, if you'd be taking this dismissive tone if a young man alleged assault by a female sports team. I doubt it.

well, doubt on. you'd be wrong.

but i wonder how the story would change if the genders were actually reversed.

and i cant help wondering how you feel i'm being dismissive. exactly what do you think i'm dismissing?

16:07 / 14.04.06

I thought "minority interest group" was a clever clever way of being dismissive of the humanity of the victim.

16:16 / 14.04.06

I thought "minority interest group" was a clever clever way of being dismissive of the humanity of the victim.

the analogy has nothing to do with the victim. i'm only trying to compare the lacrosse team with a different organization. i'm not sure how you drew the conclusion that it had anything to do with the victim.

16:28 / 14.04.06

and i cant help wondering how you feel i'm being dismissive

I think you're being dismissive of the need to take all allegations of rape extraordinarly seriously, even if they are later proven to be untrue.

their interests are pursuits are just as valid as anyone elses.

Did you read the commentary? There's a particularly nasty piece linked to above which is saying basically "the black female has got the whip hand - watch as she plays her master card ONCE AGAIN!". What's your view on this piece?

16:31 / 14.04.06

"While the language of the e-mail is vile, the e-mail itself is perfectly consistent with the boys’ unequivocal assertion that no sexual assault took place that evening,” said attorney Robert Ekstrand. The e-mail “demonstrates that its writer is completely unaware that any act or event remotely similar to what has been alleged ever occurred.”

Having read the email, I'm not sure where he's getting this. If anyone can explain... the only thing the email "demonstrates" to me is a level of misogyny that could come from the mind of someone who has or would commit a sexual assault...I'm not saying it proves anything, just that it's not incompatible with sexual violence AT ALL. In what universe could that email be called a joke?

Even if the men are innocent (and as id(entity) said that may not be the central issue as far as the rest of us are concerned) I can't seem to muster any pity for them. Sorry if it makes me a bad person if I don't feel sorry for someone who jokes about skinning women for sexual gratification when his favorite pasttime is taken away. I'm not an athlete, but it's my understanding that teams have been suspended for far less... players can be benched just for not wearing a collared shirt on game day. Athletes represent their schools, and it's completely reasonable for the school to cancel their season over such behavior.

16:32 / 14.04.06

...and I'm sure you're going to ask why I drew that conclusion so I may as well spell it out in advance - because you're comparing two very different "injustices" (one a heinous assault, the other a loss of privelges to play sports) on what feels to me like a like-for-like basis.

16:35 / 14.04.06

I think you're being dismissive of the need to take all allegations of rape extraordinarly seriously, even if they are later proven to be untrue.

and what i said was: "it's a valid point that an accuser needs to be granted some latitude". of course the allegations need to be taken extraordinarily seriously. but so do the rights of all involved.

i'm not claiming that the players have some intrinisic right to play lacrosse, but they do have a right to the same access of activities as any other student, and the extraordinary attention necessarily paid to the investigation does not require extraordinary measures against the players prior to the justice system not only having a say, but even presenting its evidence.

There's a particularly nasty piece linked to above which is saying basically "the black female has got the whip hand - watch as she plays her master card ONCE AGAIN!". What's your view on this piece?

it's vile. i think even if she is found to be lying and also an immoral attention whore, her behavior shouldnt be determined to represent either women or blacks.

16:44 / 14.04.06

Even if the men are innocent (and as id(entity) said that may not be the central issue as far as the rest of us are concerned) I can't seem to muster any pity for them. Sorry if it makes me a bad person if I don't feel sorry for someone who jokes about skinning women for sexual gratification when his favorite pasttime is taken away. I'm not an athlete, but it's my understanding that teams have been suspended for far less... players can be benched just for not wearing a collared shirt on game day. Athletes represent their schools, and it's completely reasonable for the school to cancel their season over such behavior.

try to distinguish between "him" and "them". i can understand not having pity for the author of the email, but the lacrosse team has more than one player on it.

also, this isnt a suspension. this is the season being cancelled. two very different things.

also, "favorite pastime" is dismissive, no? would you approve of a university closing its student art gallery because a group of artists were accused of improper behavior at a strip club?

you're comparing two very different "injustices" (one a heinous assault, the other a loss of privelges to play sports) on what feels to me like a like-for-like basis.

no i'm not. i'm not saying that what a possible victim suffered is comparable to a team losing its season. i'm not saying that at all. where did you get that?

16:47 / 14.04.06

"should an accusation of assault against a minority interest group on a college campus result in the immediate cancellation of all those group's activities for the entire semester?"

could just as easily have been posted as

"should an accusation of assault on a college campus result in the immediate cancellation of all those group's activities for the entire semester?"

Do you see? The latter makes your point. The former makes a SPECIAL POINT of the victim's race and something about an "interest group" thus becoming, at least partially, about the victim.

16:54 / 14.04.06

Do you see? The latter makes your point. The former makes a SPECIAL POINT of the victim's race and something about an "interest group" thus becoming, at least partially, about the victim.

i see what you mean; my intention was not to connect the group with the victim but to invent a group that might be more sympathetically identified with. i can see how that was misunderstood.

16:54 / 14.04.06

Oh, wait. Is the lacrosse team the "minority interest group"? If so, my bad.

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