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Serenity: The Firefly Movie (spoilers within)

 
  

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Evil Scientist
14:34 / 13.02.06
Dvd sales were what turned Firefly into Serenity. I'm confident/hopeful that they might stimulate more 'Verse based action at some point in the future.

But hell. Serenity was a nice place to end it.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
14:38 / 13.02.06
I skimmed the thread, but was wondering. Has anyone noticed that River on the DVD cover is made to be a bit blue?

Kind of "If you liked Joss Whedon's ass kicking female character in the last season of Angel you will like his ass kicking female character in this movie!"

Also as an aside, I read a review of Serenity recently which pointed out that all the characters were tested out in the terrible Whedon penned Aliens: Resurrection.

Here is is
 
 
All Acting Regiment
17:22 / 13.02.06
I thought his original ideas for that were good, but the studio fucked around with it...
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
18:36 / 13.02.06
I had heard that as well, although I have not seen a script of anything but what it ended up as.
 
 
PatrickMM
20:07 / 13.02.06
I saw Whedon speak once and he talked about how his script was written with Buffy-style dialogue, but because Jeunet didn't speak English, they had a lot of trouble making it work on screen. Then, when one of the producers saw Buffy, he was like "Oh, so that's how you say it." I haven't actually seen Alien: Resurection, so I can't say if this was the only studio interference, but it sounds like Jeunet wasn't sticking too closely to the script.

I'm torn on this issue because I'm a big fan of both Joss and Jeunet. I'll definitely have to see the film soon.
 
 
robertk
20:31 / 13.02.06
although the resemblance between betty's and serenity's crew is pretty obvious - am i the only one who thinks that the last 20 mins of the firefly movie were pretty much an exact copy of jeunets film too? i mean, especially the scene where the reavers where all over the place and everyone except for river is hiding in that pipe.

i don't remember it exactly, but i know that when watching it certain images (such as: doors open - river standing there amidst dozens of defeated enemies) reminded me very strongly of certain parts in resurrection. am i alone?
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
20:37 / 13.02.06
Thing about A:R that people forget is: the plot, as it stood, wasn't actually bad, up to a point. It looked lovely... most of the acting wasn't too shit, either. I can't even blame the final script, really.

It just all hung together like sweaty pants wrap't 'round silly bollocks. With that crappy Newborn thing as rubbish icing atop a cake of poo.

Were I Whedon, I'd have taken a second chance to use ideas I liked but which hadn't worked out first time round as well.
 
 
robertk
09:41 / 14.02.06
just watched "our mrs reynolds" and i know i'm probably two years late to say this but wow! this was definitely the best episode i've watched so far. it had everything - lots of humour, in-jokes, sex, and the usual convention broken at the end. great!
 
 
Feverfew
20:30 / 26.02.06
Serenity comes out on DVD here in Britain tomorrow, and I'm really looking forward to seeing it again.

One interesting (for a given value of interesting) thing, though - there seem to be two potential covers knocking around for the film. Adverts for the film in Virgin Megastores seem to show the Region 1 cover, but the adverts for Serenity at HMV show the same style cover as the promotional posters.

(All of which probably means that the Virgin advert went to press before the artwork was supplied, but, still, it's a tiny bit of intrigue to hang your hat on.)

(Also - the search results for Serenity on amazon.co.uk are relatively entertaining, being a mixture of Calming Scenery, Firefly items and what seems like hardcore pornography. If anyone can fathom why items like "Suite Seduction" or "XXX Special Edition - Super Stud get flagged when searching for "Serenity", well... There's the prosaic answer, and then there's probably the fact that there's a "Adult Movie Actress" out there whose screen name is Serenity . I'm not checking to find out.)
 
 
e-n
21:38 / 26.02.06
Well feverflew, apparently DVD street dates mean nothing in Ireland as I got the DVD in HMV yesterday, which was nice.

Pretty hungover today so I just watched all the extras and then to take a quick break from sound of Joss Whedons voice I switch on T4 on channel four, and who is being interviewed but...Joss Whedon!

The commentary's ok but like I've heard in some reviews it would have been nice to Nathan Fillion on there, but maybe that would have been too much of a love fest as the feature extras really make it look like they had a blast working together.

We all need to buy this so we can get more adventures in the 'verse.
Ten copies each oughta do it.

And the dvd is all anyone is getting from me as a gift from now on
 
 
Lugue
13:23 / 20.04.06
Hmm. Nothing much to add, really; I quite enjoyed it and it held up nicely when rewatching lately, though I do have a couple of nitpickerish issues with the thing...

I suppose interest has already entirely waned as to a mostly unfamiliarized viewer's response to some of the stuff (I went in only having watched The Train Job) but for what it's worth - at the time, I had a good enough idea of who they were, but no actual connection. So really, Book's death seemed utterly ignorable. Wash's, on the other hand, worked spetacularly - not just because of having more screen-time or the surprise element itself, but the sequence of events itself... chaos - apparent calm - shock-death - even greater chaos and the feeling that things *are* rather fucked... it made his death work wonderfully both in and of itself and as set-up for what would follow. Still great when rewatching and, now that I'd watched a few more episodes, really freaking unsettling emotionally as well, leaving me with a really weird feeling during the initial Reavers confrontation.

(Strangely, still didn't give a shit about Book's death, beyond enjoying the dialogue with Mal.)

Oh, one thing: as far as taking the Alliance-Reavers situation as USA-Terrorists... well, I don't quite find it as problematic as others seem to, for the simple fact that the other faction of the victimized has been taken to such an extreme as well: there are millions who just let themselves die, and that's just about, in a way, over-the-top enough to make it seem somehow balanced to have those who didn't die be extremely fucking murderous. I know it probably comes down to a bizarre leap of logic, but I don't know, it ends up working for me. And I don't even feel inclined to read it that way at all - call me willingly blind, but the whole "meddling" issue strikes me as much broader than this particular situation.

Though, as to the dead and the Reavers, a causal link would have been nice - exploring how men and women with growingly agressive tendencies would react to the sight of everyone around, particularly loved ones, simply stop and die, contributing to their psychosis, might have been interesting.

(Y'know, something along the lines of it making sense, in a mind twisted by chemicals into a state where violence gradually comes more and more naturally, to seek the most extreme ways of guaranteeing constant (painful) emotion and causing the death of others, as ways of ensuring and affirming their own identity and existence. No?).

Couple of issues as to the River VS Reavers big battle scene, though:

1) So, Jayne got shot at, huh. And then Kaylee. Oh, and Simon. So why the fuck aren't the Reavers shooting everything they've got at River when she strikes, instead of taking her on unarmed? Did I miss something?

2) Kaylee specifically mentioned being able to reprogram the doors so that when closed, it wouldn't be possible to reopen them from the outside. So, maybe I'm missing something, but how exactly does River do just that after the Reavers-slash'orama?

Another thing:

Hum. Is anyone really that interested in it coming back in any shape at all? I mean...

1) River ends up finally spitting out what seems to be what's troubling her the most (well, beyond the surely traumatic treatment she's received), with rather positive results (despite some mild cases of. Hum. Death and destruction. Hum. Still...).

2) Kaylee want Simon. Kaylee sex Simon. Happy day!

3) Simon's darling's sexed, Simon's sister's healthier. Doing rather well as well, the fellow.

4) Mal actually finding a purpose and fulfilling it. Oh, and getting back to a closer relationship with Inara, in that they don't seem so prone to snark at each other, which is a start.

5) Jayne... well... Jayne was Jayne some more.

What I'm trying to get at is... is there really much more hanging, still left to say about these characters? The only one who clearly has a character arc waiting to happen is Zoe, who after her husband's death enters professional-mode for the rest of the flick and is now dealing exclusively with the man she follows, and no longer the man she loves. Would be nice to follow-up on her.

Otherwise, what else? Simon and Kaylee actually seems to me to be a bit of an uninteresting pairing now that it's actually... a pairing. Inara and Mal reverting to distance would be lazy. As would be having River as babbling damaged child once more.

So really, an honest question for those interested: do you spot material that merits exploring, to the point of justifying a new film/television/comicbook endeavour (at least as so far as character development goes)? Since I'll admit that I might just not be seeing the bigger picture.

And well, beyond character development, I do think plotwise, it'd be manageable, particularly if focused on the raising tension between the Alliance and the non-core planets, to the point of war, and the Serenity crew's role in that. No?

(Sorry for not being the sharpest with making thoughts and words meet, and I hope that at least some still have any interest in this. Heh.)
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
13:43 / 20.04.06
Well. as far as I know--and it sometimes amazes me the ridiculous info one friend of mine has about the Whdeonverse--Firefly/Serenity has been put to rest for good. There was some talk of a series on SciFi involving the crew, but there was some misunderstanding about who from the original cast was going to sign on, and what it was actually going to be about. (It wasn't going to be Firefly Redux, or so I heard.) Even Joss conceded defeat after the underwhelming public response to the film's release. I know that the cast are fairly heartbroken; after all, no matter what, we all wanted more. Nonetheless, I'm still introducing new folks to this world all the time. You just gotta keep flying.
 
 
Lugue
14:28 / 20.04.06
Nonetheless, I'm still introducing new folks to this world all the time. You just gotta keep flying.

Haha, true enough.

Hmm. I had tried to check around but I still got the impression that good DVD sales might lead to a direct-to-DVD production, or a TV renewal if another channel would have it. So, thanks for essentially confirming that it really is... dead. Bah! (Well, no, an honest thank-you, actually, since I hadn't picked up on that, and it is indeed of interest to me, obviously enough).

Still, if anyone still wants to pick-up on whether there's much potential for follow-ups, feel free though it could be somewhat... fan-wankish, I'll admit. And apologies if, taking in this info, the whole sequel-stuff in my post(s) seems redundant.
 
 
Sniv
14:32 / 20.04.06
What else was left for Firefly? How about what the hell was the deal with Shepherd Book? All the way through the series there are hints about this and that, his past, his connections to the alliance, the fact that he's a total badass if he wants to be... and then Joss goes and kills him off in the film, knowing full well that there's still reams of story to be told (in fact, he even mentions it on the rather excellent DVD commentary, that Book could tell Mal his secrets on his deathbed, but decides not to. Bastard!!).

I think a comics miniseries about the good shepherd would be great. I mean, it's not all that necessary for the show, but his life story should make for interesting reading/watching.

As for no more Firefly, it took me a while to come to terms with it (like with Buffy and Angel, it's still a little sore), but I understand that the Whedon-verse shows were an zietgeist-humping, and that time has passed now. We need new stuff to freak out about, not re-hashing the past, no matter how good it was.

Still miss it though.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
14:38 / 20.04.06
It has been confirmed that after Whedon finishes Wonder Woman, he has promised us a Buffyverse movie.

I don't really know how I feel about that. Half-excited, half-"seriously, is this really necessary?", I suppose.

For those of us who attend cons regularly, we still have the pleasure of seeing cast members from Firefly?serenity come in and make the rounds.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:42 / 20.04.06
um, where was this confirmed?
 
 
gridley
19:01 / 20.04.06
The only Buffy-verse tv/film project I've heard about is the made-for-tv Spike movie, which Joss said he wouldn't really be involved in (passing the reins to Minear, I think). And I think that went into deep limbo after the less than spectacular box office of Serenity.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
20:28 / 20.04.06
For me, it was confirmed via reliable sources on Ain't It Cool News.

Mind you, there's misconceptions all the time...
 
 
All Acting Regiment
23:02 / 20.04.06
I've actually just watched this about two hours ago, thought it was very good. The fact that both times they go into a trap (Inara/Mr Universe) they know what's in store was good. It made them seem professional.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
23:37 / 20.04.06
David Krumholtz is pretty fantastic, isn't he? He's on my list of actors that are vastly underrated.
 
 
Tom Coates
05:47 / 21.04.06
He's cute too.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
12:02 / 21.04.06
Oh, very. If I didn't think Numb3rs was a crap show, I'd probably watch it just for him.
 
 
Feverfew
18:36 / 21.04.06
I loved Firefly, and Serenity is one of the few things in this world that can actually stop me talking for a good amount of time (a rare occurrence, sometimes).

But, as Quennyboy says, the problem following Serenity is, very simply, one of "Where do we go, from here?"

At the end of the film, mostly all of the underlying threads have been tied or cauterised; (Obvious Spoilers)
Big things;

- The bulk of the Reavers are assumed to be wiped out in the battle, leaving only token survivors who flee or didn't get involved in the climactic battle, so the Big Bad Menace From Beyond is no longer Big, or, well, Bad.

- The Alliance's power is destabilised, however temporarily, by Mal's broadcasting of the Footage, and it's credibility is damaged pretty much beyond repair.

Little things;

- All the contacts that Mal et al had used are dead following the Operative's Scorched Earth policy ("Leave no ground to go to", I believe, was the phrase), leaving a vacuum of opportunities for jobs, mischief, or mayhem - although I don't recall seeing Badger's name pop up in the sequence, so he could be hiding somewhere. Also, the lack of a Monolithic Uncaring Governmental power, however temporarily long it lasts, means that the line of illegality is now very, very blurred, and Serenity the ship could earn just as profitable a living being a simple cargo / passenger ship when there's less illegal profit to be made.

- River is no longer 'mad', according to her, and the secret that made her so has been found and unearthed, meaning her quest is over, for now.

- Simon and Kaylee no longer, of course, have the unrequited romantic tension, instead giving in to their Animal Passions.

So... If you don't want to read pure, unadulterated fan-wanking, wander off for, say, five-hundred words or so.

If anything were to happen, say a new tv series or a comic, I think I could come up with a fairly workable structure for the first six issues / episodes.

The first two would be concerned with the mystery of Shepherd Book; the Ident card previously seen would have been mailed to the crew of Serenity in the event of his death, which leads to a mystery about his previous life; was he a mercenary? A criminal? A perfectly ordinary man with a guilt complex? Possibly exposition for exposition's sake, but it's the unsolved mystery of the series.

The third episode could be the Trial of Malcolm Reynolds, as the organisation emerging from the ruins of the Alliance finds him and puts him before a court as responsible for all the problems and trauma caused in the fall of the Alliance. However, Mal escapes. Which, really, re-introduces a reason for him to be running, which is all he ever needed previously.


The fourth would relate to the taskforce who are tracking down the remnants of the Reavers, and their encounter with Serenity's crew, now masquerading as something completely different to avoid any attention.

The fifth could deal with Inara completely separately from the rest of crew, explaining how she had wended her separate way following the events of Serenity and how now, with the aforementioned masquerade ongoing, she is drawn back into her old world.

The sixth could work with the establishment of the new order and the resurgence of the Independents; a second civil war, but possibly more even now, with defectors from the old Alliance moving over and the new Republic forming.

Anything further would work fairly well, in my humblest opinion, with the backdrop of a much smaller, darker, civil war. There's always other escapees / products of the "Academy" that River went to if needed. There could also be more exposition of the Sino- half of the previous Alliance, something sorely missed previously.

See? I warned you about fanwank. I liked Firefly and I loved Serenity, and I think even with a few of the issues resolved by the film that it could continue - I'd want it to, if only for a little while - so it's just a shame that it won't...
 
 
All Acting Regiment
20:39 / 21.04.06
I think River can continue to grow (flow?) into a sort of super being- her ESP's been unlocked and now she needs to spread the word- until everyone is a 5d star creature or whatever. Might work.
 
 
Lugue
22:50 / 29.04.06
How about what the hell was the deal with Shepherd Book?

But does this really matter at all? I mean, for Mal and River in particular, their pasts are sources of tension in their present - Mal's grey morality and inner conflict (as originally intended, and as depicted in the movie) and River's... fuckedupness (to put it oh-so-smoothly) come directly from, respectively, his war experience and the manipulation she was a victim of.

Book, on the other hand, seems to have, after whatever happened to him in the past, found balance. I admit that this might come entirely from not having seen enough of him in the series, but what I did see didn't suggest there was anything left to tie up, so his past seems more... well, fan-directed material, potentially, than a story in and of itself (unless it was approached entirely as an individual project, which, hmm, well, doesn't seem likely).

I think the thing with the most potential is indeed what would happen to the Alliance from the movie's ending point onwards... A potential civil war seems of interest; we've seen, in fiction, the aftermath and the development of such conflicts, but is it just me, or are the actual seeds of such a thing usually left exclusively as background info?

Which is why, in a dream world, Firefly'd get picked up as a series again (heck, even a comics one), with the chance to flesh out the political evolution occuring while having the characters react to it all (which could turn out to be good material since, and correct me if I'm wrong, most of the crew don't have such a confrontational personal history with the Alliance as Mal and Zoe - beyond commiting some crimes, which might be taken as much more a matter of self-preservation than resulting from specific political stances).

So. Yes. That... that'd be nice. But it won't come.

Damn. May the fan-wank be forgiven.

It has been confirmed that after Whedon finishes Wonder Woman, he has promised us a Buffyverse movie.

Gah! Hope not. Really can't see what could be done with any of the characters when the whole point of the show's finale was that, y'know, things were gonna be alright now. Especially bloody Spike. He's alright, generally, and I did enjoy him in seasons 4 and 5, but 6 and 7 suck all interest out of him from me, and I can't see how a project specifically about him would stray far from A Much Paler Blade Movie.

Unless, of course, it's a leap back or (much) forward in time, to explore another Slayer's story. That could rock.

(Now, to pretend I have a life of my own...)
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
14:14 / 30.04.06
I agree with you about a Buffy movie. I think it's a bit late in the game to film one. I liked how the series ended, and I am content to remember the characters fondly. I really have no wish to see what they're up to now. Okay, well, that's not entirely true, but I want to be kept up to date in the way that perhaps you get an email every now and then. "Willow and Kennedy are still in South America; Dawn's finished school; weather's lovely, wish you were here; ta."
 
 
Tamayyurt
15:32 / 30.04.06
I'd be very happy with a Spike & Angel movie... that's a great Comedy/Action team right there.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
18:14 / 30.04.06
Because let's face it: what else are David Boreanaz and James Marsters going to do?
 
 
gridley
13:53 / 01.05.06
was he a mercenary? A criminal? A perfectly ordinary man with a guilt complex?

I think he was an operative, like Chiwetel Ejiofor's character. Definitely a government agent of some type.

what else are David Boreanaz and James Marsters going to do?

"Bones" and "Smallville" respectively.

I also saw an indie comedy with Boreanaz called "These Girls" that wasn't half bad.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
13:57 / 01.05.06
Oh, I know that's what they're doing, but that doesn't mean either of those shows are any good.

Bones? Sorry, I'm not buying Boreanaz as a smirky FBI agent. I know it's the fangirl in me, but that mofo will always be Angel.

And Marsters? I stopped watching Smallville a long time ago. As much I love him, it's no incentive for me to want to tune in.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
19:15 / 10.07.06
just watched 'Serenity' and really enjoyed it. After keeping the Reavers so far off-screen during the series I was dubious that they could be brought on-screen and still seem as nasty as their reputation was (it's the common failing of sci-fi fiction, have an incredibly vicious and nasty character described that, when he turns up, isn't as nasty as all that because of the limits to what you can actually do on-screen) but it did work.

Was the fight choreographer the same one that did the last few years of Buffy, because while not as bad, some of the Mal/Agent fistfights did start to degenerate into 'Mal punches Agent, Agent punches Mal, Mal punches Agent' several times.

But otherwise, good. And I'm glad that, just because the future of the show was uncertain, Joss didn't try to suggest that civilisation had fallen due to broadcasting that tape.

I'd watched and enjoyed Firefly but, after watching Serenity I think I'll go and buy both. Even if we never get anything Firefly related again (and the Sci-Fi channel should be given a wide berth, look what they did to B5) it's something I wouldn't mind in my collection.
 
 
Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!
19:43 / 30.06.07
Well, I figure at this price it's worth a link, just to be nice. Cheaper than a magazine!
 
 
Feverfew
18:20 / 19.12.07
Just flagging up for flagging up's sake, but there's a new book - Serenity Found - out, in the mould of Finding Serenity,. Brief excerpt here of the Nathan Fillion interview;

But what was it like? It was so long ago it pieces together like childhood memories, complete with those moments of clarity that suddenly strike you with, “Oh, yeah! I remember that!” and a lot more moments of, “Really? We did that? Was I drunk?”

- and a bit more info here.

Granted, it's a bit late for a Christmas present, but still...
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
05:20 / 23.12.07
Truthfully, you know what I lurv (and not a misspell) about Nathan and the rest of the cast?

They know they had gold. All the time.

There was a lot we lost five years ago.
 
 
Feverfew
06:52 / 23.12.07
Well, look on the bright side; at least Better Days seems to finally have a release date after a lot of faffing around, at least according to Dark Horse;



Serenity: Better Days #1 (of 3)

Writer: Joss Whedon, Brett Matthews
Artist: Will Conrad
Cover Artist: Adam Hughes
Colorist: Michelle Madsen
Genre: Science-Fiction, Action/Adventure

Joss Whedon returns to the world of his blockbuster film Serenity with the three-issue comics series Better Days.

Better Days revisits everyone's favorite space cowboys in this thrilling, action-packed adventure, with Mal and his crew on a heist that promises a big payoff--what's surprising is that this heist just might make good on that promise.

Whedon reunites with Brett Matthews and Will Conrad, his collaborators on the best-selling 2005 series Those Left Behind. Adam Hughes joins the team for covers.

* Prequel series to the blockbuster film Serenity by Joss Whedon.

* Front covers by critically acclaimed Adam Hughes.

* Serenity: Those Left Behind has sold over 85, 000 copies!

Joss Whedon and Brett Matthews return to Serenity!

Publication Date: Mar 12, 2008
 
  

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