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7 Soldiers: Shining Knight

 
  

Page: 123(4)5678

 
 
Aertho
20:15 / 30.06.05
WEIRD isssue.

Anyone else?
 
 
Mr Tricks
20:36 / 30.06.05
I liked it...

Did those dark dwarves discover atomic power... splitting the atom & what not. Wasn't that how Camelot 3000 end all those years ago?
 
 
Mario
21:08 / 30.06.05
No new Welsh to try to translate (I don't trust "Gloria's" translations.) But we have some new details to mess with.

1. Agent Halligan drew the sword. Therefore, she's "pure of heart".

2. Could whatever Galahad & co did (note that these three knights are believed to be the only that saw the grail) have CREATED the Sheeda?

3. Seven treasures. I wonder what the three others are. And might one be a cube?

4. Apparently, the Harrowing isn't always fatal...if the Queen has need of you. Or maybe she just likes Spiders
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
21:16 / 30.06.05
1. It's possible the survivor committed betrayal, which wouldn't be entirely unexpected.

2. Not that Gloria refers to the end of "your civilization." I'm actually surprised that Helligan didn't catch that.

3. Art's still muddy in places.

4. Re: Creating the Sheeda. I don't think the knights did that, as I'm pretty sure the flashback occurs after the events of SK1; it's marked as the Age of Mordredd the Dead during the next millenium, the dark aged one.

5. The Knights return from the undersea Ysse - Ys, perhaps? Connecting them to the Zatanna series.

6. Blah, items of power.
 
 
Aertho
23:21 / 30.06.05
I don't think he's real. I don't think any of this is.

Could this Arthurian Period be from an alternate ..."proto" or imaginal world?

Could the Sheeda have crossed from imaginal boundaries into the "real" DCU?
 
 
Triplets
23:46 / 30.06.05
You mean from historical myth [Arthurian Fables] to modern myth [DCU]? Possibly. The Harrowing from #0 looked incredibly like the Dreamtime from Warren Ellis' Planetary series (#15). In the story Ellis relates the Aborigines description of the Dreamtime and how it exists as a timeless imaginary world of heroes and monsters. Perhaps Morrington is riffing that.
 
 
Eskay Uno
01:45 / 01.07.05
Loved this issue, and the entire saga as a whole is coming along great.

Chad, I'd agree with your theory if it were Alan Moore or Neil Gaiman writing this series. This being GM, I think the Sheeda-realm is as real as any other realm in the DCU and not part of some kind of Dreamspace or Immateria.

Morrison has always been a little more sci-fi than fantasy and I find that the Sheeda are being played more as Aliens than fairy-tale creatures (what with constant references to their Technology and this issue's line of the Microscopic races pledging allegiance to Arthur).

I say the Sheeda realm is as above the DCU as the DCU is above our world/Qwrk (or whatever) as presented in JLA: CLASSIFIED. Beings from the higher realms prey on those from lower realms. Worlds within worlds within worlds, and there's imagination in all of them - but as a seperate realm? Hmmmm... I dunno.
 
 
A
02:18 / 01.07.05
The splitting-atoms-with-a-hammer bit reminded me of the movie Young Einstein, in which Yahoo Serious, as the title character, splits the "beer atom" with a hammer in his backyard toolshed, thereby making beer frothy.
 
 
Spyder Todd 2008
03:12 / 01.07.05
Man...
OK. Spyder's run down of thoughts on Shining Knight:

Issue 1, back in March or whatever: "Ok, this is cool, nice little story. But whatever. Camelot = good, LA = dull. Give me Zatanna and Klarion, damnit!"

Issue 2, in April: "That was pretty cool. LA was more interesting this time around. Still... ZATANNA!!!!"

Issue 3, as of Wednesday: "Oh my god, I am so hot for this book give me more more more!!!!!"

I just thought I'd share with everyone that I've learned to love this waaaay more than I expected.
 
 
I'm Rick Jones, bitch
03:24 / 01.07.05
I think with regards to to "creating the sheeda" and such, it's best to consider this a fairly simple, linear narative:

SK #1: The Sheeda slaughter the remains of Camelot, with the aid of the time-displaced Neb-u-Loh and some stolen Green Lantern Power Batterys (not really relevant, I just love that little detail). Justin becomes time-displaced and survives, but not before stealing two sacred treasures and making a nemesis out of Gloria Tennabre, Queen of the Sheeda. Lands at the end of the current cycle, before the Sheeda come to harvest our world.

JLA #1-3: The Seven Soldiers of the JLA defeat a sortie by the Neb u Loh and the Sheeda Spineriders. Sheeda established as having mind control.

Z #1-#2: Set prior to Z's anointment as a Soldier, since it features Gimmix. She's lost her powers, has dreams of the Sheeda. Meets Misty, who is of possible relation to Klarion's tribe. Misty has a die, it isn't the fabled "God Machine" Die that will turn up later. Some time passes between issues one and two, in the same manner as shining knight. I imagine there's going to be a similar shift between two and three - we know zatana is going to be fighting the sheeda next with the undying don.

SSS #0: A group of seven is assembled to save the world. They don't know the true reasons why they've been brought together, and they fail, because one of them doesn't show up (my money is on The Toy). They're dragged into a strange place far from home and cut down. Possible survivors are I, Spyder and The Whip. At the very least, Spyder is turned, most likely trough a spine-rider.

MG #1: Not much of relevance to the main arc, introduces the new Guardian.

K #1: Another Sheeda signting, Klarion escapes and is drawn into the backwash of the Guardian's first scoop.

MG #2: The god Klarion's tribe worships turns out to have been a huge beast, restrained with chains beneath new york city. Incidental tie-in to Klarion, they pass each other like ships in the night.

K #2: Klarion possesses the god machine die, displays Sheeda traits and immunity to radiation. The idea of the absent god-monster is reinforced. Klarion makes it to NYC.

Which brings us to SK #3.

It all fits together neatly and sometimes disingeniously.

I loved this issue. Justin's arc is almost at an end, and I get the feeling that he may be comming to an end too. Then again, he may "gather champions" for SSS #1. I get the feeling he'll unite the seven.
 
 
Mario
10:56 / 01.07.05
My reason for wondering if Galahad created the Sheeda was that "echoing through time" comment. I'm wondering if the echoes went backwards in time too, splitting the Sheeda into good and bad.

After all, in a fictional world, are the building blocks of creation atoms...or imagination?

(OK, so it's a bit Dark Crystal...)
 
 
Aertho
13:59 / 01.07.05
Stone K. -

I think you nailed down what was bubbling around in my head.

I'm thinking like matryoshka universes - Russian nesting doll realities. The DCU surrounds baby universe Qwewq, and we know from Classified that Qwewq is grittier, less strong, less symbolic, less imaginal than the universe it lives in. Perhaps Justin is from a universe that envelops the DCU - where everything is MORE symbolic, MORE strong, MORE clear and defined... We see that the Sheeda Queen is an amalgam of the Wicked Witch, vampires, evil stepmothers, et all... and that she fights a Proto-Arthur and an Atlantean like Camelot worldwide civilization.


Maybe Justin didn't so much as fall "forward in time" as fall into a universe less complex and less aged than his own.
 
 
Eskay Uno
14:18 / 01.07.05
Yes! That clicks. I like the idea that things and people from the Sheeda-Realm are hyper-symbolic and hyper-real. It makes me appreciate the Guilt monster (or Mood 7 Mind Destroyer) from SS:SK#2 alot more.

And the question all true fanboys need to know: How does this "Russian nesting doll realities" view of the DCU relate to hyper-time?
 
 
Aertho
15:01 / 01.07.05
Separate ideas, Russian and Hypertime...

Buuuut, the theory would suggest that:

Qwewq has less Hypertime than DCU, and that DCU has less Hypertime than Justin's world, and perhaps... Justin's world has less Hypertime than the Sheeda-side universe that envelops it.
 
 
Billuccho!
20:49 / 01.07.05
Ahh, wasn't paying attention at the beginning there: rather than atoms, I wondered how it related to the foundation stone(s). Keep in mind I missed Klarion #2, damn that comic shop, so I'm not sure if I missed a key bit of something.

Bors = Niels Bohr? Okay, maybe it doesn't make sense, and I'm arsing around 'cause they sound alike, but let's think: While Bohr didn't split the atom, he developed the idea of circular electron orbits... Which parallels nicely with your "Russian doll" theory of the 7S multiverse. I like it. Justin is a poor lost electron that's popped into a different orbit because of some kind of chemical reaction.

Of course, the splitting of atoms in a land of fantasy could be showing how science kills magic, or how imagination is dying. Something like that.

Either way, it's interesting. I'm greatly enjoying Shining Knight, especially, and it's providing a lot more stuff worth reading into than the other series.

As for Helen Helligan: Okay, I don't know anything about name origins, so maybe that ties in somewhere, but if the Russian Doll theory isn't true, there's a good chance she's a descendant of Justin; they look a bit similar, and she *can* draw the sword. Perhaps he gets back to his proper time and rebuilds the fallen kingdom, thereby nullifying the darkness and destruction of his own civilization. Or something.

Maybe I'm just nuts. Still... good reading. And, heh, Justin only shows up on seven or so pages, and I didn't even notice!
 
 
Aertho
01:00 / 04.07.05
Sword of Aurakles?

Mention of a Pegazeus earlier leads me to believe that they are referencing a funny form of 'Heracles". God of Strength and all, auras being what they are... only pure of heart? How does all this work?
 
 
Mario
01:23 / 04.07.05
There was an old DC character named Halo (part of the original Outsiders) who was empowered by a race of ancient energy beings called the Aurakles....
 
 
Jack Fear
01:43 / 04.07.05
= Oracles
 
 
Aertho
02:04 / 04.07.05
oh.

and

d'oh.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:01 / 04.07.05
Sir Bors is from the source texts, so I don't think a Bors/Bohr gloss is necessary.

"Herakles" means "Glory of Hera", by the way - the intention of the name was to avert the wrath of Hera, largely without success. "Aurakles" would then be "Glory of gold", which seems reasonably fitting for the Shining Knight... Or, assuming a more artificial reading, "Golden Key"? Have we got one of those in this series? Jack's probably right.
 
 
Warewullf
09:47 / 04.07.05
Great issue that improves upon re-reads. Some impressions:

- Love the opening!

- Galahad is "accursed" because he convinced the Dwarrows (Dwarves) to forge a sword (Excalibur) capable of harming Mordredd, leading to some unknown consequences.

- When Justin hands himself in, there is a sign on the desk but we can't read the writing - lazy art or representative of Justin's inability to read English?

- Only realised on re-reading that Gloria tries to unsheath the sword but fails ("There are people who believe *nnn* that the...")

- Agent Helligan is wearing a symbol around her neck. Anyone recognise it?

- The weather was so warm, Helligan called it "like a sauna" but Gloria still felt cold. Even heat is stonger on Sheeda-Side (adding to the everything-is-more-intense theory.)

- It's 7.05pm when they start to interview Justin, Gloria reveals her true face at exactly midnight.

- Mortal, modern weapons can harm the Sheeda (Justin shoots Gloria and it hurts)

- They get away in Spyder's helicopter

- The cauldron is from Arthurian myth - it raises the dead.

From this site:
In the poems 'The Spoils of Annwn' accredited to the Welsh bard 'Taliesin' (See Taliesin) of the sixth-century is a description of a sacred vessel that is sought in the Annwn, the Underworld, by a group of learned mystics, believed to be a vessel akin to the symbolism of the Grail.

'The three properties of the cauldron -
inexhaustibility, inspiration and regeneration...fertility.'

The mystics were believed to have entered Annwn to find the 'Cauldron of Pwyll' reputed by Taliesin to be a vessel that -

'by the breath of nine damsels it is gently warmed.'.
The Cauldron possessed many magical powers including speech, its appearance being noted as -

'with a ridge round its edge of pearls,'.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
11:18 / 04.07.05
The cauldron is from quite a lot more than Arthurian myth - it occurs in various forms in Irish and Welsh myth; in the story of the war between Wales and Ireland the King of Ireland has a cauldron that returns his warriors to life, which is eventually broken by Evnisien (strife), the Welsh noble who started the battle in the first place.

The analysis of the Preiddu Annwn offered there is eccentric. The full text of the poem can be found here - it's pretty clear that Morrison has drawn from it heavily here, so I'd say the source text bears reading.
 
 
I'm Rick Jones, bitch
12:17 / 04.07.05
Heh. I wonder if the die is in fact the stone of destiny - I'm thinking of the four treasures used in Slaine: The Horned God.


Sword, Cauldron, Stone - who could rock a spear? Bulleteer?
 
 
Mario
12:32 / 04.07.05
The symbol around her neck looks like a Chinese pictogram (or Japanse kanji), as does the one on Justin's shirt. But I can't read either.
 
 
Aertho
12:56 / 04.07.05
I'm thinking the Chinese pictoglyhs are just Bianchi's motif. The Stratos air elemental guy is done all up in Samurai gear, and the Chinese stuff is everywhere, directionless, and without a point of origin. That leads me to believe the artist is flavoring with his own spices.
 
 
Aertho
13:01 / 04.07.05
I thought we were being lead to belive that the Cauldron is the Grail. Leaving Fire - either a spear or a staff or even a tree, and Earth - possibly the die.

And then three more.

Amulet? Book? Map? Shield? Mirror?
 
 
Billuccho!
15:08 / 04.07.05
Sir Bors is from the source texts, so I don't think a Bors/Bohr gloss is necessary.

Yes, I know; that doesn't mean someone couldn't take advantage of a coincidence.

Of course, it's still a stretch. I just thought it was a funny observation.
 
 
Mario
15:22 / 04.07.05
I haven't found any solid references to Seven Treasures. However, there IS a list of twelve treasures associated with Arthur.

Looking them over, and eliminating the ones that are duplicates of the Four, we have a few candidates:

The Chariot of Morgan the Wealthy: transported its owner wherever he wished to go quickly.

The Halter of Clyno Eiddyn which was attached to the owner's bedfoot by a staple: whatever horse one wished for would be found in the halter. (Such a dream-horse would be much desired by the horseloving Celts.)

The Coat of Padarn Red-Coat: it would only fit a nobleman, not a churl. (This resembles the Mantle of Faithful Wives which will cover the nakedness of a faithful woman but not an adulteress, in Arthurian legend.)

The Gwyddbwll board of Gwenddolau: the pieces were of silver, the board of gold and they played by themselves when it was set up. (This Chessboard appears in PEREDUR where Peredur plays and, when his side loses, he casts the whole board into a lake). In that story it is termed 'the Chessboard of the Empress' where it clearly indicates the Land of Sovereignty.

The Mantle of Arthur: whoever wore it was invisible. (This cloak is also that worn by Caswallawn when he enchants Britain; it is probably also that of Curoi mac Daire who is specifically termed 'the grey man in the mantle'.) All thirteen treasures reveal a preoccupation with worthiness of the person finding or using them: they will not work for the unworthy. This is a clear indication of their funtion in the king's relationship with Sovereignty: they cannot be found or wielded by any save the rightful king or champion of the king. - Merlin was supposed to have procured these from their owners and taken them to his abode of glass on Bardsey Island

I'd guess we'll see a cloak, a chariot, and maybe a chessboard. Other possibilities include a throne, a crown, a sceptre, or a ship.
 
 
Jack Fear
18:32 / 04.07.05
I reckon it'll be the Ark of the Covenant, the Sword of Omens, the Eye of Thundera, the One Ring, the Hand of Vecna, the Elixir of Forgettingfulness, the Maguffin of Plot Desperation, and a partridge in a pear tree.
 
 
Ganesh
18:50 / 04.07.05
I feel certain the Dance of Disrespect will feature at some point, too.
 
 
Mario
19:49 / 04.07.05
You forgot the Red Lamp of Negotiable Affection.
 
 
A fall of geckos
21:57 / 04.07.05
I thought it was interesting that there was so little direct action involving Justin in this issue - though there was a fair amount of information conveyed either in flashback or through Agent Halligan's conversation. I've been wondering if this is more then a handy way to tell the story. Possibly it's a way of introducing Halligan as a partner for Justin. Giving Justin a guide to his new world would ground this a little and would set up an interesting pairing for any future use of the character.

If not, I still think that the fact Halligan can draw the sword will lead to some kind of a pay off later.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
22:13 / 04.07.05
Ystin teaming up with Helligan in a future story - let's face it, one issue to go, not enough time - and I'm hoping this is Morrison's way of setting the universe up for either a sequel by him, or one by someone else. Helligan was an interesting character, although we're not sure what the result of Gloriana's bite will be - eventual death? Insanity? Possibly some kind of heightened understanding?

The Harrowing is set up here as the purpose of the Sheeda, rather than proof of their vicious evil; Gloriana presents it as a neccesity when civilizations reach the endpoint and need to be burnt away in favour of a new beginning. Which is possibly just window-dressing -- giving them a reason to exist, a quest, a Manifest Destiny or something. They get rid of mankind when it's had too much to drink and evolved past the point of "Optimal Human" into a bloated cancer of itself. I like that we never quite know what to make of the Sheeda, who are all Guile; is she simply providing a convenient reason for the "modern thinkers" like Helligan? History and Genocide as seen through the lens of "what is neccesary?"
 
 
Ganesh
22:19 / 04.07.05
Hasn't Helligan (as in "Hell and Hell again") already lost her mind (and developed green glowing eyes) as a result of Gloriana's kiss?

What was all the 'wedding in New York' stuff foreshadowing?
 
 
Billuccho!
22:26 / 04.07.05
Helligan looks to be the same shade as I, Spyder. Some form of vampirism? Is she a Sheeda zombie lackey now?
 
  

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