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White boy. Can't dance. Please help.

 
  

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iamus
10:27 / 25.02.05
It's what every girl wants and don't let them tell you otherwise.

Oh, they never do. Day in day out it's Tom Cruise this and Tom Cruise that. Not even Bradd Pitt in a sexy battle-skirt gets a look in.
 
 
Olulabelle
10:37 / 25.02.05
This is amply demonstrated by the fact that you are still using the phrase “politically correct” in a particular sense above, and again insisting that, as the old thread title has it, clever people can’t be racist (all that endless discussion of how racism is not a binary either/or state but exists as multiple strands of thought that can affect any of us, just fell on stony ground, huh?)

No it didn't Flyboy. I just think you are wrong about Adam in this case. I'm sorry to disagree with you, but I really do and I don't think I'm using the word politically correct wrongly. I know it means you can still be Racist even if you use the term, or never use any Racist words but I don't think anyone here was being Racist, not Adam and certainly not me.

– for example, the recent decision that you would be a good person to decide who gets to sign up to the board, strikes me of being worthy of discussion, so perhaps I should contribute there.

That is horrible Flyboy. I don't decide, I just collate the emails and then see if the email addresses and links are valid. Then I send them to Haus. I'm sorry you are unhappy with that. Do you want to take over?
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
10:51 / 25.02.05
Tsk. My dear old dead grandfather once told me "Do not bark up that tree, that tree will fall on you". Wise words.

I don't really have a problem with you collating emails from people who want to join Barbelith, it may as well be you as anyone else who's still around regularly, I suppose.

But do me a favour and stop putting a capital 'R' on racist! That's not how it works. It's like the common cold. See?
 
 
Haus of Mystery
10:59 / 25.02.05
You know the old guy in 'Strictly Ballroom'? Now there was a man who could dance.

This thread is about dancing, right?
 
 
iamus
11:05 / 25.02.05
But do me a favour and stop putting a capital 'R' on racist! That's not how it works. It's like the common cold. See?

Grow up. Please.
The misuse of capital letters is the least important thing in that post to be engaged with. I can't see anything to be gained by being pedantic about grammer other than trying to put olulabelle down and make yourself look smart. As it stands, it's a very cheap shot. You say you don't perhaps choose how to spend your barbelith time very wisely. I'll take that as case in point.

Feel free to correct me as to just why it's vitally important, of course.


Just to be on topic.....

Swing!!!
 
 
Olulabelle
11:06 / 25.02.05
OK, Flyboy I didn't know about the capital 'R'. It's a grammar error, not a nod towards my character.

Jesus.

You may not give a shit about what people say Flyboy, but I really do so I feel really upset and hurt by this. I don't think I was mean and personal about you in what I wrote - I do feel you only turn up in threads for a row and this time it's me you've drawn into one. That's my bad and my stupidity because I'm not the sort of person that deals with things like this very well. I'm too emotional and it makes me feel awful inside.

I don't understand the personal attack about the potential member emails and I don't understand why you seem to be suggesting that I'm not suitable but won't say why. I don't understand why, when I stuck up for someone in a thread about dancing because I really didn't think they were being racist(see I do listen), I am suddenly the object of your derision and most of all I don't understand why you keep implying that I'm this really racist person when I really, really don't think I am.

Clearly I shouldn't have said anything to you and now I can see why most people avoid it. Obviously you thrive on this sort of confrontation, but I certainly don't in fact it reduces me to tears.

Sorry. Find someone else to flick peas at.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
11:38 / 25.02.05
My point wasn’t about grammar. We capitalise belief systems and specific political ideologies, big ideas that have their own doctrines and which people can sign up for unequivocally – Christianity, Communism, Islam, Nazism. To see racism as ‘Racism’ is to mistake it for a specific political ideology. Now, that kind of Racism exists, but it’s much less widespread or, in my opinion, dangerous, than the normal everyday racisms that infect each and every one of us. Stop thinking that I was “calling” Count Adam a “Racist”, and try thinking about it from a different angle. Amazingly, some people have conversations about these kind of ideas every day, even elsewhere on the internet, without getting defensive or personal. I thought you wanted to take it to a personal level, and responded in kind – if I misunderstood what kind of interaction you wanted to have, then I apologise.

Wipe away that tear, Olulabelle – in terms of the struggle for what Barbelith’s dominant values should be, I think it’s clear by now that I’ve lost.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
11:39 / 25.02.05
I think there are very interesting discussions to be had on political correctness. Using the term "politically correct" - even in a sense that you feel is benign - is buying into an amorphous set of assumptions and ideas that may not be useful.

Threads referenced in this thread so far, which might be due a revival, he says with fear and trepidation:

Why clever people can't be racist

Un-PC terminology, and the use of un-PC instead of "racist" - fascinating discussion centring primarily on the linguistic treatment of the First Nations.
 
 
Ariadne
11:58 / 25.02.05
I think that your attack on olulabelle was nasty, Flyboy.

I really think most people here are aware of what you're saying about racism, of the dangers of not seeing how it gets everywhere. But we really can't have every fourth thread derailed by accusations of bias, racism, sexism or whatever else. It's wearisome and counterproductive.
I understand your view that it's important to point these things out but I think you need to pick your battles or you risk becoming a joke suit. "Oh, here he comes again".
 
 
Tryphena Absent
12:04 / 25.02.05
*groan* oh not that old phrase again.

I'm sorry, I've got to wade in and take this right back to the basics, something that I think has been ignored in hiatus' posts. Not by hiatus.

What isn't racist about White boy. Can't dance. Please help. Sure it's meant to be funny but it's specifically emphasising the fact that a white boy can't dance... because that's relevant to the fact that someone can't dance?

If this was a thread that was specifically about stereotypes on screen then it might be normal to have a thread title like that but instead someone has chosen to highlight the fact that white boys can't dance. White boys. Yeah? So even if no one was being racist (and I don't necessarily take it that way but I'm a middle class, english, white girl) it doesn't mean the thread title can't be seen in that way by anyone who reads this board at any time. And some people might be upset about that association and that's fair to express in any thread.

I also think that people are as liable to be nasty to Flyboy as he is to them and perhaps if people relaxed in their approach, he might in his. Communication is a two way street and Olulabelle, I know you're upset but you accused before he did in this case so sad as you might be you have to be responsible for your behaviour as you're asking hiatus to be responsible for his.

And Ariadne, you're right, we're locked in a cycle that's making these arguments irrelevant but Fly obviously isn't going to change so sadly it's up to the rest of us to drag the positive out and stamp on the negative.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
12:09 / 25.02.05
in terms of the struggle for what Barbelith’s dominant values should be, I think it’s clear by now that I’ve lost

?
 
 
Tryphena Absent
12:13 / 25.02.05
I've just modded my last post to make it more... erm, what I think and unboldified. When it's unboldified it might be replyable too. Ohmygod, this post proves I'm brain dead.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:18 / 25.02.05
If we read the thread, it seems that his gothness rather than his whiteness is what is holding Charrelz back on the dance front. But, is the Church not a goth club? In which case, what's the problem?

Elsewhere... the movie Stripes has a scene where the group of mismatched oddballs obligatory in screwball comedies in the early 1980s decide, as they do, to shape up and make their avuncular superior proud, or similar. As they seek to learn to march in rhythm, Ramis suggests that the "black guys help the white guys". This causes a degree of negative response from the aforementioned guys.
 
 
Aertho
12:30 / 25.02.05
But, is the Church not a goth club? In which case, what's the problem?

Maybe his girl isn't goth?
 
 
Haus of Mystery
12:36 / 25.02.05
Can you have mixed-goth relationships? It's certainly frowned on in my town...
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:39 / 25.02.05
Ah, but if his girl is not goth, then why does she want to go to a goth club goth club goth club? Possibly he was in his goth days a cybergoth, and she is a trad goth, and therefore wants to go to a trad goth club, in which case all he needs to do is stick the back of his hand to his forehead and sway a bit. It won't make a difference, ultimately, because his cybergoth status will lead to far more sneering than his dancing ever could. Eventually, his girl will have to choose between their relationship and the true, deep friendship she enjoys with Lord Gorgamoth Ravenblacque, who will mock and undermine his choice of boots constantly.
 
 
iamus
12:40 / 25.02.05
If we read the thread, it seems that his gothness rather than his whiteness is what is holding Charrelz back on the dance front.

Maybe he puts whiting powder on his face, in which case both would be inextricably linked.
 
 
iamus
12:43 / 25.02.05
Lord Gorgamoth Ravenblacque, who will mock and undermine his choice of boots constantly.

And that's clearly gothist.

(small g).
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:46 / 25.02.05
Tush. Some of my best friends are gothic.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
13:04 / 25.02.05
his cybergoth status will lead to far more sneering than his dancing ever could

A sad state of affairs, who doesn't enjoy the cybergoths.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:20 / 25.02.05
The trad goths.
 
 
Aertho
13:23 / 25.02.05
Detroit scene-hopper here. Is there somewhere I can learn more about the plumage and migratory patterns of the various goths? A wiki, maybe?
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
13:32 / 25.02.05
I think I understand and sympathise with both Oloulabelle and Fly's positions, so all that really remains is for me to discover which of them is the better dancer, then we can all go home.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
13:34 / 25.02.05
In fact, from now on all arguements on Barbelith must be settled by dance-offs.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:36 / 25.02.05
Prepare for total domination.
 
 
grant
13:37 / 25.02.05
As they seek to learn to march in rhythm, Ramis suggests that the "black guys help the white guys". This causes a degree of negative response from the aforementioned guys.

They do wind up doing a drill routine to Sly & the Family Stone (and "Doo Wah Diddy"), if I remember right.

I'm sure there's some racial (and other) politics going on in that*, but mostly it's just pretty funny. Boom-chugga-lugga-lugga.


*edit: the drill routine, I mean.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:42 / 25.02.05
Prepare for total abomination.
 
 
grant
13:42 / 25.02.05
OK, who gets to DJ?
 
 
Tryphena Absent
13:44 / 25.02.05
Rufus Wainwright, it doesn't matter that he's no DJ, everyone will forget their troubles when they see him drinking chocolate milk. Awwwww.
 
 
Aertho
13:48 / 25.02.05
I think I understand and sympathise with both Oloulabelle and Fly's positions, so all that really remains is for me to discover which of them is the better dancer, then we can all go home.

In fact, from now on all arguements on Barbelith must be settled by dance-offs.


% I told you it was a contest. %
 
 
Haus of Mystery
13:53 / 25.02.05
The Lady DJ from the Warriors must DJ! The one with the sexy voice!
 
 
grant
13:57 / 25.02.05
Nowhere to run to, nowhere to hide....

I think that was actually someone famous. Marilyn McKee? No, but someone like that. Maybe that's an urban legend.

Does that mean it's exclusively a disco-soul danceoff?

Or a Warriors DJ round, followed by a Rufus Wainwright round?
 
 
grant
14:01 / 25.02.05
Hmmmm.
 
 
Sax
14:07 / 25.02.05
Well, let's all thank God that at least Spidey can dance.
 
 
grant
14:11 / 25.02.05
It was Lynne Thigpen! Carmen San Diego!
 
  

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