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Lost for Words

 
  

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Saveloy
15:39 / 20.04.04
Thinking about it, 'striation' almost describes the sound the ice-cream makes when you pull it apart (imagine it close up, very slow). It does in my head, anyway.

Todd> your one is bugging the hell out of me - there ought be an audio eqivalent of 'picture', as in 'picture a gun...'
 
 
h1ppychick
16:47 / 20.04.04
I was thinking, maybe 'recall' would work as it invokes both the memory part and the sound part in the -call' element? I'm sure there must be something better, though.
 
 
Ex
17:10 / 20.04.04
Off the top of my oddly pointed and greygreen head, a species is a subsection of a genus and is defined by the capacity of males and females in it to produce fertile young together.
eg horses and donkeys can produce mules, but are of a different species.
But all the dogs can produce little dogs which produce more little doglets, theoretically.
(Which is why racist scientists, determined to ascertain that Africans weren't in fact the same species as Europeans, tried to prove for ages that mixed race people were infertile. The tossjobs.)

I am exempted from the discussion as to whether women are a different species. I'm from Innsmouth.

There's always a male and female of the species. That's how it works. And the female of the species is always more deadly than the male.
Unless there's more than two sexes, like with bees and shit.
 
 
Cloned Christ on a HoverDonkey
17:20 / 20.04.04
Jub - taken literally, calling women a species is technically incorrect, but I think in this sense it's meant metaphorically. As in 'women are so different to men they can be considered a different species'.

I suppose the context is important; in a technical work women wouldn't be referred to as a species, but I'm sure it's perfectly acceptable in colloquial speech.

P.S.

The word 'species' doesn't just have the strict biological definition, either; it can also be used to mean 'a specific kind of something', as in a 'a species of humour' or 'a species of molecule', so in this respect its usage is again perfectly acceptable.
 
 
Ethan Hawke
17:28 / 20.04.04
recall is close, and would work in certain situations but wouldn't do if you were told to imagine hearing something you've never heard before, which was what I was trying to convey when the lack of a word stumped me.
 
 
Ethan Hawke
18:30 / 20.04.04
Weird! I just read through this thread, and Praying Mantis has already asked what is essentially my question. and no one could answer her, really.

We're doomed! Doomed to live in a hell for which we have no word.
 
 
Ganesh
18:35 / 20.04.04
Wasn't the answer to Mantis's question 'olfactory'?
 
 
Ethan Hawke
19:50 / 20.04.04
oh wait, i thought she meant aural. now I'm all confused. let me be, damn you!
 
 
waxy dan
08:29 / 22.04.04
The immense sense of frustration born from saying the same thing to students over and over again, even printing them all out little summary sheets with bits highlighted and projecting it onto a screen that you point at a lot, and still have them asking when things are due in.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
11:37 / 22.04.04
Existential futility?

Instead of imagine or envision: "conjure"?
 
 
Saveloy
14:14 / 14.06.04
Is there a word or phrase to describe the comedy that is derived from someone trying to preserve their dignity in an undignified situation (eg being pelted with shit)? Examples: there's a lot of it - in subtle form - in The Diary of a Nobody; see also slapstick (Oliver Hardy especially)
 
 
Saveloy
12:37 / 17.06.04
Is there a word that the same job as the word 'sin', but without religious connotations? I'm thinking mostly of sin as noun, so I'm after a word that means 'a naughty act'. 'Crime' comes close, but doesn't quite qualify, as it relates only to acts which break the written law. I'm after something that would cover all acts of naughtiness.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:40 / 17.06.04
peccadillo?
 
 
Ex
12:50 / 17.06.04
Misdemeanour? Wrongdoing?
 
 
sleazenation
13:07 / 17.06.04
transgretions ?
 
 
grant
13:14 / 17.06.04
Vice?
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
08:44 / 18.06.04
Iniquity or perversion?
 
 
Saveloy
09:29 / 18.06.04
Thanks, you lot. I reckon misdemeanour, wrongdoing, transgression and possibly iniquity are what I'm after (" then you came to the right place, ho ho!")

To explain further: I had less than half an idea recently that there might be a discussion to be had about the fact that by dropping the word sin from our vocabulary, we had lost a useful tool. There's a bit in Flann O'Brien's novel The Third Policeman where a ghost explains how he came to the conculsion that 'no' is a better answer to all questions than 'yes' (I won't go into the whole thing cos it would take all day and it's by-the-by here). The relevant bit:

"I took all my sins out and put them on the table, so to speak. I need not tell you it was a big table. I gave them all a strict examination, weighed them and viewed them from all angles of the compass. I asked myself how I came to commit them, where I was and whom I was with when I came to do them."

I really like that idea of turning actions into 'physical' objects, and feel it might be useful to be able to talk of them in this way. Turns them into things which might be dealt with more easily than actions-with-adverbs-attached, if you get me.

So anyway, I didn't want to start such a discussion and have someone pipe up "You fool! We do not have the word sin, but we do have [insert obvious replacement here]'" etc.

Misdemeanour and - now I think of it - offence seem reasonable replacements, but - I dunno - there's summat about them that doesn't quite hit the spot the way sin does. Anyone have any futher thoughts on the matter?
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
09:42 / 18.06.04
From here I would be inclined to take veniality to meet your needs.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:52 / 18.06.04
Veniality is a very Christian term, though, referring as it does specifically to sins for which veniam petere (the seeking of pardon) is possible... that is, slight or pardonable ones. The "slight" is the problem with peccadillo. I'm warming towards transgression, as it can be social, legal or spiritual....likewise offence.
 
 
grant
13:30 / 18.06.04
"Sin" to me is always associated with absence. It means "without" in Spanish (sin carne, por favor -- without meat, please), but theologians also define sin as that which removes us from godliness -- a division between human existence and divine.

"Transgression" and "iniquity" are words that I learned as part of the Catholic Mass, so they're forever associated with me dribbling water over Father Collins' fingers before he touched the host for the transubstantiation. ("forgive me my transgressions and wash away my iniquity").

The word "sin" can also have a different sense in the singular than in the plural -- like, suddenly you're talking about a category or state of being rather than a specific case. (Living in sin rather than living with my sins). Which is sort of a tall order for a word. That might be why the Flann O'Brien bit is so appealing -- it concretizes the behaviors or instances and separates them from the state of being.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
13:54 / 18.06.04
Stab in the dark but how does violation fit with you. It really has no deep theological or legal attachments.
 
 
Ethan Hawke
17:29 / 18.06.04
Infractions?
 
 
Jack Vincennes
08:49 / 22.06.04
Is there a word or phrase to describe the comedy that is derived from someone trying to preserve their dignity in an undignified situation (eg being pelted with shit)?

Is bathetic anywhere close to what you're looking for?

Does anyone know of a word for intellectual context, which encompasses the contempories of (in this case) the author, but also the philosophical or literary movements which were happening around them and in which they were involved with or reacting to to some extent? 'Context' is almost right, but it's specifically context in terms of time rather than place that I'm looking for...
 
 
Smoothly
10:11 / 22.06.04
Climate?
Milieu?
 
 
grant
14:17 / 22.06.04
Zeitgeist!
 
 
Saveloy
09:35 / 23.06.04
Thanks for the further suggestions, chaps. I reckon I'm mostly with Tan/Haus, transgression and offence are my faves. That said, transgression, like misdemeanour, has a whiff of 'minor' and 'regrettable but not very serious' about it. I associate it with naughty vicars and mealy mouthed civil servants.

Infraction sounds too much like legal jargon, and might refer to some blameless cock-up. It would be awkward to use in place of sin, too: "I took all my infractions out and put them on the table" doesn't sound quite right to me. The same applies to violation - someone taking all their violations out might be referring to physical acts commited against themself by others.

Vincennes>
Thanks, I think bathos might be right, but I'm not sure of its precise meaning. I'll have a look for some examples.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:38 / 23.06.04
Bathos is the sudden transition from the sublime to the ridiculous... not, I think, quite right...
 
 
Jack Vincennes
10:46 / 23.06.04
Thanks, Suavemente and grant -milieu is what I'm using just now, but may well change to zeitgeist if I think I can get away with it!
 
 
Cat Chant
16:00 / 06.07.04
What's the opposite of isomorphic? And does isomorphic just mean, like, "exactly the same shape and size"? (If not, what does mean that?) Like if you had two triangles that were isomorphic, they would have the same side lengths & internal angles? Is the opposite just "non-isomorphic" or is there a cool word like heteromorphic?
 
 
grant
16:48 / 06.07.04
Uh, isn't it "polymorphous" or "polymorphic"?

I'm genuinely not sure, but that seems about right.

To elaborate, I've only encountered the term "isomorph" in biological surveys, where the researcher is talking about creatures that look the same (or have the same dental configuration or genitalia shape or whatever -- I'm not making that up, genitalia is one of the main identifiers for speciation in butterflies). Anyway, this is just too good an excuse to post up this link to a shrew morphometric study done by an online friend of mine. I love the language, although I don't entirely understand it. I don't know if he uses isomorphism as a term, actually, but there's a cute picture of shrew up there. And of shrew skulls.


According to this geometric definition, it applies to graphs that have the same shape, and that "homeomorphic" is a synonym, so maybe "heteromorphic" would work. (Although "homomorphic" means something different.)

And BrainyDictionary.com says "isomorph" can describe identical crystalline structures (chemistry) OR (biology) animals that look the same, but are "phylogenetically different" -- in other words, that resemble each other but aren't exactly the same.
 
 
John Paul Vann
17:54 / 06.07.04
I've got one that has troubled me for about 4 years now: I'm sure there is a word for the point at which a tidal river (in this case the Thames) stops coming in but just before it starts going out.

More specifically the word pertains to actually what the river looks/feels like at this point (if you have ever seen it is quite extraordinary, all swirly, confused & un-even, like it's a bit embarrassed for having come in at all and is just hoping no-one noticed so it can just go out again quietly once it has regained its composure)

So this word is one of those lovely soundy feely words that ibis goes xtreme was trying to define earlier. It's very olde Englishy like 'Gloaming' or 'Waxen'

I may of course have just dreamt it.
 
 
Jack Fear
19:10 / 06.07.04
Estuary?
 
 
grant
02:58 / 07.07.04
If you're talking about the line where the one kind of water meets the other, you might be looking for "liminal." There are other terms to describe that meeting place.

I actually grew up on an estuary, sort of. Well, an "estarine ecosystem". There wasn't really a swirly border region, just a (somewhat) violently tidal inlet a couple miles down the waterway.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
07:03 / 07.07.04
Heteromorphic means deviating from the usual form, such as the Y chromosome to the X chromosome, which rather undecorously leads me into my next bit.

Away from the common usage in sexuality terms, the prefix hetero means or implies deviation from a norm or standard. For instance, the more formal word for unorthodox is heterodox. I'm sure I don't need to go into an explanation of exactly how the words heterosexual and homosexual were derived. One does wonder if the originators were aware of the irony they were creating.
 
  

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