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The West Wing

 
  

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Regrettable Juvenilia
12:59 / 29.12.04
Most what?

It depends how much of quantity X you want in your life really, where X = essentially mediocre but 'respected' American TV drama with high production values. The West Wing was never quite up to the same standard as Six Feet Under or The Sopranos, but for the first two or (at a push) three seasons, it managed to be more or less consistently engrossing more often than it was irritating. The downward trajectory began before Sorkin left (as I've said, I'll always consider the "CJ's new FBI boyfriend dies randomly and heroicly" to be the turning point, but once John Wells (the man responsible for the last god knows how many seasons of interminably bad ER) took over as showrunner, I pretty much lost all interest.
 
 
Smoothly
12:29 / 30.12.04
I feel pretty much like Flyboy on this. The first 3 series are great, but the first two are better than the third. Series four goes downhill but is still very watchable, and series 5 is strictly for the devoted. If I started watching at season 5, I'm pretty sure even I'd think it was rubbish. It's only made enjoyable by the performances of characters I feel invested in.
Which is where I agree with dogslikesparky. If you like the surviving cast then you still get some decent performances. And whether you should bother watching it really rather depends on what else you've got to watch.
But the episodes are nothing like as dense, and what would have been strands in earlier series would be teased out as the whole canvas. Even the actors seem embarrassed by the scripts. And there is far more of an emphasis on individual characters rather than the relationships between them - which was for me a large part of the appeal.

In fact, truth is, I don't think I ever got round to the last few eps of season five, and haven't even approached six. I mean to – and sparky’s kinda galvanised me - but, you know, I've got piles of other middle-of-the-road TV to watch.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
23:59 / 24.03.05
I've decided that this current season of West Wing might be (gasp! blasphemy!) the best season...

I'm completely fascinated with the frank discussion of issues this season. With the interpersonal issues this season, with crazy dynamics of all the different candidates and their teams.

What does everyone else think?
 
 
Aertho
02:24 / 25.03.05
I'm a WW junkie. And I think I'd vote Vinick. You?
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
16:19 / 25.03.05
yeah, simply because he's so anti-God.

Santos doesn't rub me anyway...Vinick is personable, completely honest, and seems to be on board with most of what I believe...

It's so crazy how WW is the complete opposite of america's current political climate. There's no way that Vinick would be the clear frontrunner for the Reps in reality. The conservative element has completely taken over.

I just don;t give a shit bout santos, really. I mostly like those eps for the Josh/Donna dynamics. That's fun shit!

What they should do is: Vinick president with (gasp!) santos as vice president, and Josh as Chief of Staff.

That would rule. And Toby would be trying to overthrow the government with the help of his hitman father.
 
 
X-Himy
10:11 / 16.06.05
There was a West Wing marathon on Bravo not long ago. I caught half an ep (season two) during finals week and suddenly I was watching eight episodes after that. I went back and downloaded them from the beginning. While Sorkin was writing it was great, a lot of it was liberal masturbation fantasy, which frankly was something I needed at the time (since then I had to cut myself off the news for a bit). But somewhere around season four I stopped in disgust and deleted the rest I had left on my computer. After Sorkin left it went downhill. I read summaries to see if I should continue, but the plots sounded so ridiculous I was glad I had stopped when I had. The president's daughter being kidnapped? Josh quitting? Leo as a vice-presidential candidate? What the fuck happened to the smart writing? The plots somewhat based in reality?

Is it any better now?
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
12:28 / 16.06.05
no no no no no

the last season was fantastic.

and honestly, i liked the previous season, too...it had a rocky start, but soon moved into more interesting territory.

the entire primary campaign plot is really good and different. it became more practical and less liberal fantasy (which i liked, as well, don't get me wrong).

Bravo is dangerous. West Wing Mondays - 6pm -2am of episodes...dangerOUS.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
19:54 / 26.07.05
Sorkin, Schlamme, and Lowe to return???! WHAT WHAT WHAT?!?!
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
17:22 / 26.09.05
anyone watch the premiere last night?

interesting intro! basically told us all the immediate post-White House fates of most of the staff, leaving Josh's open-ended.

I have to say I could barely understand what people were saying in half the episode, though...has the quality of speaking gone downhill or something?
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
18:18 / 26.09.05
I could make a reference to something recent that this seemed to crib blatantly off of, but clever people would figure out the spoiler. But I think Keith knows what I mean.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
19:56 / 26.09.05
Are you referring to the intro or the episode as a whole?
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
22:18 / 26.09.05
The intro. The rest of the episode I missed bits of, but didn't seem altogether too bad. Although I'm completely in the dark about the whole leak thing. It does undeniably feel like a completely different show from Seasons 1-4 at this point, tho. Everyone's scattered accross the ether, and did Donna show up at all?

Anyway. With Mary Louise Parker on Weeds, West Wing has pretty much served its purpose at this point.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
00:22 / 27.09.05
I sort of like that scattered across the board feel to it. The dynamic between Josh/Leo and the White House is interesting...just how those politics are working now.

Donna did show up, begging for a job as Josh's deputy. He pulled out a folder full of all the nasty thing she said about Santos, while working for the VP's campaign. But Josh did say something like "if you think I don't miss you..." - but in the end he wouldn't give her the job on account of the differing history.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
00:30 / 27.09.05
O. U. C. H. Kinda glad I missed that.
 
 
Aertho
00:35 / 27.09.05
Are we talking about the "How's Columbia?" Still wondering if it means what I think it means.
 
 
Aertho
13:57 / 31.10.05
I was right about Toby. Killer kiss-off by Bartlett. O.U.C.H. Heh.

Donna is BACK, and full of teeth. YEAH.

So does that mean she's gonna be the new CJ? Provided Janeane(Lou) is the new Toby, and Josh is the new Leo. Still need to fill out the Deputy positions, and looks like he's gonna pick that tall, awkward looking prettyboy for some job or another. Will might stick around for a little while, but the flashback precludes his future as a diplomat.

Strange that WW is getting the abortion issue straightened out. A true Republican would fight for choice, and a true Democrat would fight for life. And in reality, the parties have it switched. Looking forward to the Nov 6 debate. LIVE.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
14:23 / 31.10.05
curious, what do you think "how's columbia?" mean?

i'm sort of getting bored with West Wing finally...the start of this season has been moving very slowly to me. which is odd, cause they are still running around and talking fast the whole time. the election just seems to be taking too long in TV land.

the big question, though, is: is this the last season? will we ever actually see a new administration in the White House?

i was disappointed that Josh didn't comment about Toby at all. last night reminded me why i like Will, though.

i enjoyed the Creationism/Evolution episode, though.

live debate should be an interesting experiment...does this mean we won't be checking in with any of the characters or will their behind the scenes stuff be live as well?
 
 
Aertho
15:01 / 31.10.05
How's Columbia?

I thought Toby was exiled, or sent there. Toby's had experience in foreign relations, China, Eastern Europe —so it makes sense that he may be doing dipmlomatic work there. That, or Bartlett pardons him and immediately sentences him to ambassadorship in Central America to work on CAFTA or something.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
16:19 / 31.10.05
that makes sense.

at first i thought it meant he was teaching at Columbia.

but his comment "it's not a bad place to spend some time" works better as the country and not the university.
 
 
gridley
17:24 / 31.10.05
Or how about Columbia Minimum Security Prison?
 
 
Aertho
17:44 / 31.10.05
gridley wins
 
 
Aertho
17:39 / 07.11.05
Anyone catch the LIVE episode last night?
 
 
MrKismet
17:53 / 07.11.05
I thought the live debate episode was a mess. Both actors fumbled several times, though Alda came off better as an actor. Smits was too obviously reciting memorized dialogue.
 
 
Jack Fear
17:57 / 07.11.05
Smits was too obviously reciting memorized dialogue.

So he, of the two, actually sounded like a real presidential candidate, then?
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
18:08 / 07.11.05
it was a bit of a mess, i agree.

it was a bold gimmick, i'll give them that, and they truly did discuss issues instead of doing drive-bys on issues in the name of drama.

but there were too many moments of incredibly stiff acting from Smits. Alda came off better as an actor, but he was quite snide and offputting. He actually reminded me of how Bush acted in his debates. Not professional at all.

It was interesting, but the Sorkin debate episode with Bartlett and Ritchie was the ultimate in fake debates.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
19:28 / 07.11.05
I thought the same thing about Smits but, I figured that was intentional. I mean, it's not like either of these guys are scrub actors. One of the things Vinick has been grilling him on is his lack of comparitive experience. This was a pretty vivid example of that. And yes indeedy, the Bartlet debate was truly the ultimate.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
03:06 / 08.11.05
huh.

i'd only seen it once before, but Bravo was repeating last season's "Drought Conditions," the one where Toby and Josh fight. It was really sad seeing those two go at it (sort of like Obi-Wan and Anakin).

but what struck me was the just the sheer style of the episode. it actually felt like a really good Sorkin episode, although not quite as funny. but everything about it was well done, and the ending sequence played beautifully played out to Brubeck's "Take Five." even the lighting and cinematography of it was very Sorkin-era.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
00:25 / 17.12.05
This is sad. John Spencer, easily one of the best actors on the show, died today. What an extreme loss to acting.
RIP Leo
 
 
Ganesh
00:43 / 17.12.05
I'm crying on the inside.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
01:22 / 17.12.05
Good one.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
05:24 / 17.12.05
Damn shame Hope he wasn't alone in a wood after a big bust up with his best friend, this time. Seemed like a good bloke and was certainly a good actor.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
05:53 / 23.01.06
West Wing will finish at the end of series 7.

In related news, West Wing clone Commander in Chief seems unlikely to make it past the end of series one.
 
 
doglikesparky
15:07 / 23.01.06
I think that's right, really. As much as I love WW and could happily watch it for another 7 years, it seems fitting to end it now.
Bartlett will be going whatever happens and although the show is called (and therefore strictly speaking, is about) The West Wing, it's really been about the Bartlett administration and the people involved directly with it rather than just the government in general.

I'm also not surprised about Commander in Chief either. It tried to be it's own thing and it came at the idea from a relatively fresh approach but ultimately, it just wasn't very good.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
17:41 / 03.04.06
*giggle*

SPOILER WARNING
















ARE YOU READY??????









SPOILERS FOR LAST SUNDAY, "ELECTION DAY"




LAST CHANCE








josh and donna finally did it. twice.
*giggle*
 
 
Aertho
17:46 / 03.04.06
Other than that, Josh had another breakdown, and they finally deal with John Spencer's death. I'm hoping Leo gets a decent send-off. Because as interesting as this shouting breakdowns are, gawd. I'm so bored.

Any ideas who they'll nominate for new VP? If they do that stupid thing where they end the show with both Alda and Smits as a Vinick/Santos ticket... Weird, wrong, and schmaltzy.
 
  

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