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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

The Prestige

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18:13 / 07.01.07

because it was Angier's plan to incriminate his rival. plus he seemed obviously disturbed for the whole experience of having himselkf killed every night ['was I going to be one in the tankor the balcony?'].

but he never realized his mentor was right, and there was a twin brother all along involved in Alfred's trick. Batman wins.

[there's a line of thought that says the twin was not a natural brother, but produced by Tesla's machine - as Bat-Bale sent X-Hackman to Tesla-Bowie in the first place; maybe he was much more pityful than his mutant rival, who killed all the copies to get his trick going]

and: I saw it as the machine producing not quite a clone, but a time-displaced version of the user. split-second time travel where both share same memories as they've been placed very few [nano]seconds apart.

Regrettable Juvenilia

21:46 / 07.01.07

Thorn, clearly the Angier who appears on the balcony does not 'appear' (there's a word for this, isn't there, to appear out of thin air?) in full view of the crowd - he has to step out onto the balcony. Otherwise it would give away the fact that this is not just stage magician magic but something more, which Angier is advised to conceal. He must appear each time behind a screen - and on the last night, he simply slips away rather than stepping out.

22:30 / 07.01.07

Materialise, I suppose. And there’s also “apparate”, though on closer inspection only according to J.K. Rowling.

While everyone’s theories on what the machine actually did and to who are fascinating, there’s not much evidence for most of them in the actual film is there?

Regrettable Juvenilia

23:38 / 07.01.07

How embarrassing that I was thinking of "apparate".

There's not much evidence by the end of the film for any theories other than the explanations which we are explicitly given, no.

01:49 / 08.01.07

so sorry to bother everybody with mine.

Whisky Priestess

10:30 / 08.01.07

"Apparate" = "to manifest as an apparation" rather than to appear/materialise in the flesh, presumably?

That's quite a useful distinction, and therefore word. Nice one Rowling.

D Terminator XXXIII

08:00 / 11.01.07

The reason why Angier doesn't appear at the event that eventually frames Borden for murder is because Borden is clearly heard shouting from beneath the stage throughout the audience room, and one would expect Angier to also have heard him.

Now. I think it's more implicit but Borden/Fallon, the twins, are as I see it set up to be as morally ambigous as everyone else and can arguably be the most morally ambigous characters within the film. Their wife, as perceptive as she was, clearly knows something is wrong and has figured out the differences, subtle or otherwise, between the twins and the segments before her suicide are as I remember them set up so that she can get one of them to admit that she's right in her belief -- i.e. it's not just the extramarital affair that finally cracks her -- but seeing as she couldn't receive the answer that she was looking for, she takes her own life. It may be implicit because I deffo have to see it again to confirm my reasoning but I thought that Borden and Fallon knew that she was suffering and was desperately trying to connect to the truth but they both couldn't reveal it because of their lifelong commitment to their craft...

18:59 / 01.02.07

Reading through this thread it seems to me that the notion that the machine didn't work is based on two things a) not watching the film closely, and b) not wanting it to be the case.

I didn't want it to be the case either. Unfortunately it was, and, like Nighthawk said, it is somehow disatisfying. Yeah sure, it makes sense in terms of the Angiers character, but it felt like a huge stretch in terms of the fictional world. Surely there were better, more grounded ways of illustrating the culmination of Angiers' obsession.

D Terminator XXXIII

19:23 / 01.02.07

I liked how the magicians' rivalry were justaposed with the inventors', Tesla/Edison. Magic/illusion and science. The machine enhances the story and message: whereas scientific discoveries have again and again changed the world in profound ways, people can't help but be more fascinated by illusions and magic tricks, and that the invention which would've profoundly changed the course of human history is hidden for the sake of a illusion is a case in point.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

13:47 / 14.03.07

So, I finally saw the movie for the second time.

I just wanted to say that on a second viewing I picked up a TON of stuff that I missed the first time around. The "Today you don't mean it" theme with the Bordens was pretty cool once I realized what it was all about. The opening bit of Borden's diary uses the phrase "We were just two young men, we never set out to hurt anyone" which could have been referring to he and Angier, but also to him and him. All the references to fighting with himself, and half of him feeling one way. U felt a bit like a dolt for not noticing all the queues the first time through.

Held up to a second viewing quite well, I recommend it.

18:53 / 14.03.07

On second viewing, did you get the impression that the Borden/Fallon reveal was meant to be a secret, or that the audience was supposed to have figured it out in advance?

I'm curious if Nolan says anything about it on the dvd. I haven't picked it up yet.

D Terminator XXXIII

18:56 / 14.03.07

Also, since it will be a while before I'll buy it, am I right in suspecting that after the first date, when Borden leaves, she's entering her flat to the other brother?

Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!

21:20 / 14.03.07

The "today you don't mean it" thing was one of the things I found most irksome about the film on first viewing. Symptomatic of other things about the film, it feels a bit clunky and unnatural purely because it's more involved in plot and eventual pay off than anything real between the actual characters. Things happening and being said because they just advance an eventual reveal - for all the talk of sleight of hand with regard to this movie, it felt like moments like this were just too plainly sighted and awkward.

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

22:04 / 14.03.07

On second viewing, did you get the impression that the Borden/Fallon reveal was meant to be a secret, or that the audience was supposed to have figured it out in advance?

Well, the people I was watching it with had not seen it yet, and they all remarked that Fallon looked like a chubby version of Bale. I think having him appear so suddenly and then never really speak was a bit of a giveaway, though I am not sure it was meant to be obvious. The "I'll share half my food with him" line made me chuckle though.
I have not checked out the bonus material on the disk yet, so I don't know if Nolan mentions it, I will take a look later today or tomorrow.

am I right in suspecting that after the first date, when Borden leaves, she's entering her flat to the other brother?
That is another scene that I didn't think about the first time watching it, but yeah, it seems to make sense that way.

I do agree somewhat Suedey, a lot of it does seem like unnatural dialog that only makes sense after the reveal. I think in general it worked out ok though. Having read the book a lot of the same type of thing is used throughout. Maybe it worked well in the novel so they wanted to keep it and it comes off a bit more clumsy in the film.

19:19 / 26.03.07

Having finally seen the film, I can say that it did do a lot of back-of-the-neck hair-raising, and it's my humblest opinion, having read the book a few months ago, that they made a good adaptation - I know that they excised several elements, and simplified the Borden/Angier relationship,

I really think, however, that in the context of making a film, that while its' not word-perfect to the source text that it is a good film.

There's nothing quite like being late to the party, huh?

(Also, it's the second film I've seen recently that had a Thom Yorke song over the credits for the requisite spookiness - after A Scanner Darkly. I'm intrigued.)

01:55 / 28.03.07

I just bought the film on DVD, and when I cracked open the seal to take a look inside, the disc had done it's own disappearing act. Unfortunately, a clone of the disc did not appear in my other room.

(No jokes. The case was empty. Just like my soul now.)

00:52 / 29.03.07

to the exchange cabin!

since some of you guys are watching it again, how does the "twin Bale brother being a machine-generated double" stand?

13:27 / 29.03.07

I don't even have to see it again to know that theory doesn't hold any water.

13:55 / 03.04.07

I just watched the other Prestige, The Illusionist. If you people thought the twists in The Prestige were obvious, you can't even begin to guess how awful The Illusionist is. It hits all the proper beats of a film like this, including Paul Giamatti's middle of the road character, who figures out the secret but is too moral to bring Ed Norton to justice. Blech. At least with The Prestige, everything adds up slowly and surely, making the twist, not so much a twist, but a fitting ending. The Illusionist is overlong without any interesting characters and a twist ending that recalls every other movie known to man. Boring.

14:43 / 03.04.07

Agreed. I was really disappointed, because with Ed Norton involved I had anticipated something better.

18:29 / 03.04.07

Ed Norton's only good when he's playing either a Nazi or a leper. And when you don't know he's playing a leper.

21:07 / 03.04.07

are you really going to tell me that "Death to Smoochy" wasn't genius?!

Yeah, Illusionist was brutal. I found it funny that two magician films (both striving for the same tone, mood, background and few other same goals - only one having succeeded), made me think this was a good year in films for Gob (from Arrested Development) -- someone was taking the craft seriously enough.

And Matt, the disappearing trick from your dvd might have been cruel, but I dare you not to laugh about it in a month.

I'm a bit sad the dvd won't come with Nolan's commentaries. I really wanted to know if the twin angle was supposed to be a mega twist, or what I suspect to be, just a intentionally telegraphed resolution that in the end the film just landed home.

The whole aspect of "the most simple answer is the truth" (being a double) against the entire sci-fi twist, and all the "you don't really want to know the truth, now do you?" makes this film a 2006 winner by a long shot along with Fountain and Children of Men...

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