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Meanwhile, this is being ported over by request from the Moderation Requests Thread, since it is clearly no longer about Moderation Requests... (DM in italics in his own and my posts, me and others as necessary in bold)
Dead Megatron, popping into the discussion about whether to delete various posts in his Birthday thread (and incidentally whether to ban or otherwise censure Flyboy and Triplets, although one person claims they were joking and another claimed shortly afterwards that he had not in fact proposed their banning):
I just want to point out a few things:
I did not move for any post to be deleted
I did not move for any poster to be banned
I did not request anyone to apologise for anything
I made a "perhaps you should be banned" and a "dance, puppet" joke, but I did it in hope it would make the pesonnal attacks to stop (I'm sure someone will say that is not what I said or meant, though)
I have absoutely nothing to do - nor do I want to - with Haus argumentation in the past three pages or so of this thread on why Flyboy attitude towards me is uderstandable (I suppose that this was his point, if he had one at some point)
I would like, however, to move now for my birthday thread to be locked. Why? Because the party is over, and the ballroom needs be cleaned up*. Plus, it would be symbolic of my desire to bury the hatchet, as it is.
* I did intent to post a few pics of my party in it, but after yesterday, I really don't feel like sharing such a good moment of my life with Barbelith. After all, people may take offense.
I responded:
I have absoutely nothing to do - nor do I want to - with Haus argumentation in the past three pages or so of this thread on why Flyboy attitude towards me is uderstandable (I suppose that this was his point, if he had one at some point)
Helllo, Dead Megatron, and happy birthday.
I'd like to direct your attention to a couple of places, all in this thread. First up, the first post I made here, where I specifically said that I thought that Flyboy should lay off you.
Next up, I'd like to point you to the place where I say, specifically, that I believe that Flyboy and Triplets should apologise to you. Then to the place where I agree that it is reasonable to find their behaviour unsavoury and to protest it. Then to the place where I agree that they were out of order. Normally I would provide links, but I think it would be good for you to read this discussion as a whole to winkle those statements out, for reasons that may become clear later.
If you do read the relevant part of this thread, you'll find that most of the rest of my conversation on this thread is not actually about Flyboy at all. It is about the specific questions of when posts should be deleted in the Conversation, when people should be proposed for banning, and about the more general topic of how you and I interact. Specifically, it is about the fact that about two months ago you undertook not to post to threads which you had not read. I believed that this represented a significant step towards your profitable engagement with Barbelith, and I have pointed out here that I have been trying to be nice to you since then, to encourage this process. As such, I was therefore hurt that you repeatedly lumped me in with Flyboy, who did not apparently share my faith, and specifically that you decided to claim that your invitation was made, and I quote, in an:
"I hope they show up and we can leave our differences aside for a while and have a good time together for a change, and they can pick up the hatred tomorrow, if they really must" kind of way.
I did not feel that a daily dose of hatred in any way characterised my interactions with you - I had not actually posted to Barbelith for a week, and was only pulled back by this car crash and the sense of duty that had me reading the Policy, which incidentally means I missed your birthday thread anyway - and it saddened me that you had appeared not actually to have paid attention to what was actually happening on Barbelith before deciding to make this self-exculpatory and unfair statement.
As I said, I had taken your commitment to read threads before posting to them to be a sign of a commitment to being a more productive member of Barbelith. I was saddened that your comments about "hatred" suggested that you had not actually stuck to this entry-level commitment to try to contribute value to Barbelith. I am now further saddened that your mischaracterisation of what I have said in this thread seems to prove that you have decided not to stick to the promise you made - to read threads before posting to them - at all. Given that that undertaking was made in your family's name, and that didn't stop you breaking it, I don't know how you'd get the trust back, there.
Forget about Flyboy for a second, if you can; this is about you. I trusted your word, and you have now made me feel like a hopelessly idealistic fool for doing so. This saddens me.
Dead Megatron, IMHO rather missing the point:
What part of "nor do I want to" do you not get?
"put aside the hatred" is a figure of speech, you literally-obsessed person. Change to animosity, or lack of friendship, or incompatibility of personalties, or anything you like. I don't really care.
(And I'm not the one who called you "dung-covered village idiot", remember?)
I did read this thread very carefully, which is why I decided not to engage in the argument in anyway, if possible. (this single post being the exception)
And, if you say I should forget about Flyboy for a moment, maybe you should remember that this discussion was about him and his attacks on me, until you turned it into a nittypicky-fest on all my past mistakes as justification to why Flyboy had the right of being abusive towards me (a logic that I find morally questionable), most of which I have already apologised for, and none of which have anything to do with the case in point.
So, this is all I'm going to say about this subject. If you insist, be warned you will not get any further response. (which, I guess, means you win in your book. Yay!)
unbelievable...
I, quite unhappy:
OK. This not for Dead Megatron, but for the rest of the board.
If Dead Megatron did read this carefully, then he is lying about what it says and what I have said. If he did not read it carefully, then he lied to me two months ago, and is now lying again. Either way, he is either unwilling or unable to interact with Barbelith as a place where people's words are given the consideration of reading and response.
Either way, I'm afraid that he is heading towards troll territory, and pretty fast. I want to resolve this, but I am clearly not going to be able to do it with him. I would like to invite senior members in good standing to offer suggestions. Possibly by PM, or in another thread.
Flowers:
How about backing off him for a bit? For a number of reasons DM has been rather at the centre of discussions over the weekend and perhaps now's the time to take a breather. Let's try and go for a week before we start talking about the next person we throw off the island shall we?
Olulabelle:
Haus, is doing it by PM a good idea, really? If you think DM is moving towards troll territory and you would like to discuss that, surely it would be best to do that openly?
Flyboy:
I take it this [the suggestion to "back off"] is addressed to Dead Megatron, regarding his claims that Haus has said precisely the opposite of what we can all see he said?
Myself:
I have absolutely no faith in DM's ability to back off me, Flowers, which is a problem. However, if he apologises for misrepresenting my efforts to treat him like a worthwhile member of Barbelith for the last two months, then we can maybe negotiate a truce, which he can have fun breaking later.
Ganesh, on my fear that DM was heading towards troll territory, and pretty fast.:
I, for one, don't agree. Could we all perhaps agree to take at least 24 hours out before coming back to this? I'd like to contribute constructively, Haus, but am feeling the looming-sabbatical tiredness you've previously mentioned, and would hugely appreciate a gap in the proceedings.
Myself:
Ganesh: Surely. I'd like to finish up, however, by returning to that ol' Transformers thread. Both Dead Megatron and Flyboy has cited it as a case of the one goading t'other. E. Randy Dupre, Cameron Stewart and others also at variouspoints lose their patience. And yet, I appear to be in there, bantering, chatting, not insulting and generally treating Dead Megatron like a worthwhile member of Barbelith. Or how about here, where I again seem actually to be cutting him a surprising amount of slack, given his largely "look at me!" posts. I actually thought we were making progress there - he was actually referencing things that were happening by here. Of course, if I'd known that he was ignoring all that in order to strenghthen his bulkwarks against this hatred I apparently feel for him - or animosity, or lack of friendship, or incompatibility of personalties, it really doesn't matter which - I probably wouldn't have bothered. It does at least explain what at the time seemed this frankly bizarre second bite at the "having a go at me" cherry, here - I hadn't noticed that we were mortal enemies.
Now I really am depressed.
That covers the key points I think. Ganesh asked for a 24-hour pause to celebrate our birthdays, and a day later I posted:
24 hours later, and a year older, I'm not sure whether and where t do this, but I guess I wanted to flag that I still feel v. let down, especially after this in the mercifully-locked "Dead Megatron: His Crimes" thread.
I believe Haus already have linked recently on the Moderation Request thread every single mistake I've made
This is a) darkly hilarious and b) a sign of the same disturbing tendency. Once DM has decided, based on sketchy, sketchy readings, that he has an enemy, it seems the nibbling will never stop. I'd like it to, quite soon. Best estimates?
I note that DM has edited that post retroactively, which is nice, if unacknowledged. There was a request to move the discussion. I proposed that the bullying thread might be a good enough place to put it, as DM's behaviour could be seen as bullying (with the various provisos at the beginning of this thread). DM inquired as to how it could be seen as bullying.
Well, here's how I see it. DM keeps on telling lies about what I have said. It may be that he is not reading what I write, in which case he has gone back on his vow on his family's name to do so. It may be that he is incapable of understanding it - which is fair: there are some long words and run-on sentences. However, I don't see that this should be made to be my fault or indeed my problem. In the meantime, by constantly attempting to traduce my good name, in the face of what I am surprised to report is still pretty mild-mannered correction, I find myself forced to conclude that DM is attacking me on a personal level - specifically, seeking to misrepresent my thinking and writing in a way that will make others think less of me. This may be malicious, it may be lazy or it may be due to incomprehension, but he appears unwilling or unable to listen to what I am saying, which would be fine if he did not keep editorialising and attempting to tell Barbelith what I am saying. As it is, I'm saddened that trying to treat him like a worthwhile member of Barbelith has been thrown back in my face like this, and I believe that his actions towards me are not acceptable behaviour. In the combination of aggression, rudeness and misrepresentation of the facts, I see the germ of a bullying posture. I would like this to stop, either by DM reading and being clear in his understanding of my posts (asking me if he gets confused, politely and once), or DM being (and this is a mind-bending concept, but it might just work) quiet until he is confident, perhaps with the help of PM exchanges with a patient and impartial judge with decent language skills, that he understands what is going on and has something positive and useful to add to it.
This has nothing to do with Flyboy or Triplets, let me make clear, before any water is muddied. It is about Dead Megatron's behaviour towards me. |
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