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Superman Returns - Post -release thread

 
  

Page: 1234(5)

 
 
Spatula Clarke
15:58 / 26.07.06
it doesn't work to keep the goodies and the baddy apart until a short while before the end of the movie because the audience will spend their time impatiently waiting for the fight.

The Matrix.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
16:59 / 26.07.06
Matrix Revolutions really.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
17:01 / 26.07.06
For the benefit of Flyboy, who likes so much that is shit.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
17:23 / 26.07.06
Oh, and I'm getting a bit tired of the implication made in this and other threads that I hate everything. I wouldn't actually go to the cinema and pay to see a film if I thought it was going to be poo. I go to the cinema and see a film because I think it's going to be great and am sometimes disappointed. Same as everyone else.
 
 
The Falcon
17:24 / 26.07.06
Sometimes?
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
18:39 / 26.07.06
Yes.
 
 
Spaniel
18:50 / 26.07.06
I'm getting a bit tired of the implication made in this and other threads that I hate everything.

To be fair, Flowers, I think you have that rep for a reason, not because you never enjoy things, or are incapable of enjoying things, but because I (and I suspect many others) can't think of a single instance where you've gone on record as loving something, or gushed, or expressed delight. That's not to say that you haven't, however, just that examples are likely few and far between.

Oh, and you do complain, alot.

I've come to find it endearing.
 
 
Triplets
19:10 / 26.07.06
Not everyone does, though. But, yes, as Boboss says I can't think of one thing you've superloved but I can think of a load you've superhated.

In fact, when this thread got bumped to the top a few weeks ago that first post pretty much summed it up.
 
 
Triplets
19:12 / 26.07.06
Actually, your second post is even %better%.
 
 
Dead Megatron
19:34 / 26.07.06
And I don't think you're in any position to stop Lois smoking since you had unprotected supersex with her and then left her to bring up the baby

In Supes defense, when they had unprotected supersex five years ago it was 1980 and pretty no one cared much about that back then.

It's the relativistic effect of near-light-speed space travel.
 
 
adamswish
13:05 / 27.07.06
saw this last night and must admit just how shocked I was at how excited the theme music and opening credit homage made me. I was a kid again which surprised the hell out of my girlfriend who was sat next to me.

MY housemate saw it before me and noted his surprise at the age of Bosworth and Routh and that (to him) they seemed too young for the roles. Especially as this film is "supposed" to be five years on from Superman II. And I have to agree but can forgive for the fact that as Clark Routh was the spitting image of Chris Reeves. Not so much as Superman, but once behind the glasses it was amazing.

The one niggle I had through the film is that the plot is very much the same one as the original Superman. Only this time Luthor has decided to create new land rather than destroy California for new beach front property. The sequence of the maps sliding was very much like the old subway base and the glass map of Hackman's Luthor. (which I know others have pointed out too).

But that's the thing isn't it. The Lex Luthor of the films are a bit crap when compaired to the comic book versions (mad scientist/evil businessman). Yes he's an extremely intelligent criminal, but that's it. therefore no, real match to the man of steel.

But it was good that they have the shuttle rescue, which I believe was his first rescue in the post-crisis stories (correct me if I'm wrong) and the car hold photograph was perfect too.

And how can you hate a film with the baseball/disappointed dog gag.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:46 / 27.07.06
>> saw this last night and must admit just how shocked I was at how excited the theme music and opening credit homage made me. I was a kid again...

Yeah, the 2 things everyone seems to have loved across the board about this movie are the opening credits and the plane rescue sequence. I kind of just want to watch bits of the film again and again, as opposed to watching the entire movie again.

Singer has said that for the sequel he wants to do some 'crazy sci-fi' stuff with 'an alien' threat/villain.
 
 
The Falcon
17:19 / 27.07.06
*rubs hands*

Good, good. If he tribs 2 - which is the other possibility, I'd think that pretty lazy, mind.
 
 
Professor Silly
20:29 / 27.07.06
My theory on "why Luther surrounds himself with idiots" is similiar to those stated earlier, but slightly different.

I think Luthor surrounds himself with idiots because he feels it's only fair. It's like giving oneself a handicap in golf when playing a lesser opponent. Luther feels it would be cheating to use his brilliant intellect against the world without some kind of handicap. When he wins (and he does believe he will) he can know that he did it in spite of all the adversity--most of which (outside of Supes) he put in play himself. One scene, from the original, that comes to mind takes place in a car--Hackman/Luther asks Otis if he reprogrammed the missiles correctly (which he didn't) and then reveils that he anticipated Otis' blunder and has a contigency plan already in motion. This allows Luthor a subconcious pat on the back ("DAMN I am smart!" thinks Lex).

...of course, having failed now twice, I would think that next time he won't make the same mistake....
 
 
Spaniel
20:55 / 27.07.06
You do of course understand that the primary reason is cinematic and genre convention?
 
 
Professor Silly
00:12 / 28.07.06
(yeah)
 
 
iamus
02:46 / 28.07.06
I pure loved this movie.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:36 / 28.07.06
>> If he tribs 2 - which is the other possibility, I'd think that pretty lazy, mind.

Yeah, he's hinted at Zod, and reportedly wanted to get Jude Law to play Zod in Superman Returns; when Law wasn't available schedule-wise, he went with a different plotline, apparently... but I don't want to see a clean Donner's I-Singer's I and Donner/Lester II-Singer 2 line-up. Zod could be a part of it, but I want some Braniac or Metallo action. He seems to hint as much by saying 'sci-fi' for the sequel.
 
 
Spaniel
22:30 / 28.07.06
Really? I'd say Zod and friends, being from space and kind of superpowered, are pretty sci-fi.
 
 
The Falcon
23:33 / 28.07.06
I'd hope not, though. In any case, after all they're only as alien and sci-fi as Superman is, so I'm definitely hoping he's not driving at that*; of course, it could potentially be really good, but it's been done before y'know, so I'd rather have Bizarro-world. Or BRAINIAC(!!), obvs.

*If indeed this is not just some utterly spurious reportage, which is quite likely.
 
 
Spaniel
06:15 / 29.07.06
I think Zod, having been a proper Kryptonian citizen, could be played as significantly more alien than Superman. Also it's a matter of emphasis. Normally the sci-fi aspects of Supes (the character) are kept in the background, with Zod in the game you could play them front and centre.

'Snot that I desperately wan to see Zod in the next film - although I wouldn't really mind - just that I think he fits with Singer's tease.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
08:33 / 29.07.06
Yeah, then you could call the film Zod Returns.

I do like Zod, but I'm a little dubious about the extent to which (if Zod does reappear in the sequel) Singer's Superman is going to be all about people coming back again, referencing their previous incarnation in Donner's movies and reprising a role from "five years ago".
 
 
Triplets
11:38 / 29.07.06
Stop bumming Zod, Boboss. Have a hunger break.

That said I agree that Zod, played as Superman's dark parallel, in the same way that Brock is being run as Dark Parker in Spider-man 3, could be fun analysis of "what if Superman grew up on Krypton". Well, he'd be an arsehole!

You could riff off of Dan Jolley's / Tony Harris' Zod in JSA: Unholy Three in which Zod (Zod Jnr really) gets Phantom Zoned as a lad and ends up being rescued by Earth scientists in the 30s. Still nasty as.

Bizarro Invasion gets my vote. Would fulfill the early rumour of Supes fighting 300 Kryptonians now we've got safe distance from those fuckawful Matrix sequels.
 
 
Brigade du jour
08:39 / 31.07.06
Just some thoughts after two viewings ...

Bit of a flawed masterpiece this, I reckon. Very much a homage to the '78 film, almost to the extent of being completely in thrall to it, but I can't help feeling that there are things it does better.

For one thing, I ended up preferring Brandon Routh's performance to Christopher Reeve's. I never thought that could happen! His Clark Kent seems less comically clumsy and grating, more likeably geeky (somewhere between Reeve’s klutz and Dean Cain’s smoothie, I guess).

His Superman seems less laid-back and at ease with himself and more like, as Mister Six said above, a 'simple country boy … with the power of a god'. Oh sure, he's fine zipping around catching people who've just fallen out of a thirtieth-floor window, but as soon as Lois Lane starts asking those difficult little questions like "where the fuck have you been all this time, ya big galoot?", he seems … a bit lost. Left out, like the fat schoolkid when the team captains pick sides. Lois has basically just told him nobody needs him any more (and isn’t that Superman’s overriding psychological drive, to be needed? What other use are super-powers if you’ve not been brought up to be venal and selfish?) and he flies off – the camera cuts from a full-body shot (yay, Superman’s flying, ain’t he great?) to a slow-zoom close-up of the heartbreaking expression of loneliness etched across his face (jesus, poor guy). I don’t know, just seems like a really effective way to approach a character that is, let’s face it, pretty hard to empathise with if he’s flippin’ invulnerable. Yeah, the Donner movie hinted at that somewhat when Superman flies up into the sky screaming at the injustice of Lois’ death, but this version has the nuts to actually build the whole movie around it.

I hate to say it, but I think Kevin Spacey phoned his performance in a bit. He was terribly watchable - funny and sinister and a wee bit creepy all at once, but … ah, he can do that shit in his sleep. I certainly don’t agree that he carried the movie as some have said on this ‘ere thread.

Pleasantly surprised by Kate Bosworth’s Lois (at least partly because she tends to bear the brunt of most of the negative reviews I’ve read, probably) – okay, she might be a shade too young for the part, but I thought she played older pretty well. I bought that she might be about thirty, albeit a baby-faced thirty. More to the point, though, she nailed petulant Lois and persistent Lois even if it was at the expense of a sweeter, slightly more girlish Lois. Maybe the film-makers were scared of characterising her as a tough, grizzled reporter one minute and a soppy get slinging goo-goo eyes at a dude in blue tights advising her on the dangers of smoking the next. Can’t say I blame them, really. Still though, watching it for the second time last night I spotted a missed opportunity here and there where her softer side could have been subtly hinted at.

* * * SPOILERS * * *













Overall, the movie is a bit of a mess in terms of an overarching plot structure. But, Singer is, I think, a deft enough director to paper over the cracks so that you almost don’t notice. The stylish little touches are intact (sonic booms, dust falling off trees, hypodermic needles failing to penetrate Kryptonian skin etc.), the finer details serving the director’s struggle for authenticity, for believable characters in an ‘unbelievable’ world. The cracks do show, of course - the bit near the (rather long-winded) end where Lex and Kitty are on the desert island seemed particularly awkwardly timed, as if the writers couldn’t decide where to put it but had to cram it in so people wouldn’t wonder where Lex and Kitty were. Ultimately though, it couldn’t help but break up the emotional tension of Superman’s near-demise.

Incidentally, the person I saw it with actually suggested it might have been better to actually have him die saving the world, but … hmm, I’m not sure. I absolutely loved that Superman nearly died saving the world (or in the first instance, North America) but to have actually had him die? Well it wasn’t really going to happen, obviously, but … for a while there they had me believing that it might have. I guess that says it all for me, really – if any movie is going to make me believe not so much that a man can fly but that a god can give two shits about us lesser beings, it’s Superman Returns.
















* * * END SPOILERS * * *
 
 
_Boboss
11:08 / 31.07.06
Stop bumming Zod, Boboss.

just worth repeating, i feel.

Stop bumming Zod, Boboss.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
12:20 / 31.07.06
man, I used tae pure fancy Zod's gal pal by the way.
aw thae wee slits in her costume n that.
 
 
Spaniel
17:36 / 31.07.06
Zod and I like to pash.
 
 
FinderWolf
20:20 / 31.07.06
Oh, Zod would definitely be quite sci-fi, not to mention alien. My preference for Braniac's sci-fi/alien-ness was influencing my interpretation. One of the SR writers was seen at San Diego ComicCon wearing a "KNEEL BEFORE ZOD" shirt on a panel, prompting much speculation. I agree with those who don't want Singer to just retread the Donner films...maybe a Zod/Braniac team-up? I really want to see Metallo on screen for some reason, but then again, his character and shtick are pretty limited.
 
 
The Falcon
21:16 / 31.07.06
LUTHOR/BRAINIAC TEAM.
 
 
Henningjohnathan
21:45 / 22.08.06
it doesn't work to keep the goodies and the baddy apart until a short while before the end of the movie because the audience will spend their time impatiently waiting for the fight.

It doesn't often work in this sort of movie, you're right.

For me, I found Superman to be incredibly dull and dense. Occassionally, Lois would say something about the mysterious blackout and you'd see Clark give a look that's supposed to say "Oh yeah, I should look into that." (Perry did give him the dang story, after all). Then in the next scene, he's back to moping about Lois not loving him anymore.

So, for me it was more the fact that Superman seemed completely out of the loop as far as the bad guy's schemes go. The fact that Superman's so powerful in the film makes it difficult to put convincing obstacles in his way throughout the movie, but really I think a more pulp hero version of the character where he's actively engaged in the conflict with the enemy from early on would have resulted in a better reception in general.
 
 
My Mom Thinks I'm Cool
19:28 / 31.08.06
Was very unexpectedly happy with this movie. Had only one complaint (and my coworker, with whom I have never before agreed about anything, agreed): superman rescues plane, announces to world that he is back, lois lane faints. LOIS LANE FAINTS?? FUCK YOU LOIS LANE FAINTS! Lois Lane has never fainted in her life. In a contest of wills she eats superman for breakfast. Look, I realize it was a crazy moment, *I* no doubt would have fainted, but I'm not goddamn lois lane.

other than that...there were plot bits that were silly, but I was happy. made me want to go out and pick up a car.
 
 
Dead Megatron
20:23 / 31.08.06
The fainting, I suppose, was a "homage" to the first helicopter rescue, in Superman I, when Lois sees Supes for the first time and she did faint then.

But I agree, it was out of character for such a strong female character. The first faint was understandable, since she was seeing a man flying and lifhting falling choppers with a single hand while saving her with the other!!!!

But the second fainting, when she was supposed to be accostumed with that flying-super-strong-thing (she had sex with him in the Fortress of Solitute, for Jor-el's sake!!), was, indeed, lame...

Lois Lame! Is that a pun?
 
 
Brigade du jour
21:33 / 31.08.06
If it weren't for the fact that he'd just saved her life, I think that throwing a drink in Superman's disappearing bastard face would have been a more appropriate response to his return than fainting. Hmm, maybe that brief emotional struggle between mortal relief and furious dumpedness caused temporary hypoxia in her brain.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:08 / 01.09.06
It's worth pointing out that Lois bangs her head repeatedly and very hard during the Superman rescues a plane sequence which can be used to explain all her abherent behaviour from that point on.

Or maybe a wizard did it.
 
 
Brigade du jour
11:50 / 01.09.06
A wizard? Mr Mxyzptlk strikes again, eh?
 
  

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