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Stupid Music Questions

 
  

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All Acting Regiment
00:48 / 06.04.06
Good-o. I guess The Bravery are the new Walt Whitman then!
 
 
PatrickMM
02:12 / 07.04.06
I just listened to Serge Gainsbourg's History of Melody Nelson for the first time, but I've definitely heard the riff from "Melody" before. So, I'm wondering if anyone knows if anyone's sampled it recently. Maybe I had heard it and just didn't know about it, but it sounds really familiar.
 
 
Mike Modular
05:29 / 07.04.06
David Holmes covered it, instrumentally, and called it Don't Die Just Yet, for some reason.
 
 
Jackie Susann
05:59 / 24.05.06
Is electro a distinct style, or just a generic way to refer to, like, house/techno/dnb/etc?
 
 
SteppersFan
19:11 / 24.05.06
Electro is a distinct style - actually a number of distinct styles. First and foremost it's a very late seventies / very early eighties form of dance music where soul producers got hold of drum machines and synths and made funky machine music. It's the ancestor of much hip hop and r'n'b, all techno, and most house. Rather than the 4x4 beat, it tends to be somewhat more syncopated. Musically it's dominated by the sounds of the Roland 808 drum machine and it's booming sub-bass kick drum - a sound that has inspired literally dozens of musical movements.

Since then it has mutated into various forms that have been called electro, such as the variants of Detroit techno most associated with Drexciya, British versions played by Andrew Wetherall (when he's in that mood - he has many), and German / European glitchy electroclash (which seems to be turning into "minimal", even though it usually, errrr, isn't).

Big tunes? Herbie Hancock's Rockit, Kraftwerk's tour de france (arguably), Hashim "Al-Naafiysh (The Soul, Cybotron "Techno City" (arguably proto-techno), Man Parrish "Hip Hop Be Bop (Don't Stop)", Afrika Bambaataa & The Soul Sonic Force "Planet Rock".

One of the greatest creative forces in music ever is electro, it's all over - wicked stuff at its best.
 
 
illmatic
19:33 / 24.05.06
Threads here and here

I associate electro with Hip Hop, not soul. And it's not really the ancestor of Hip Hop as such, more an early permutation. Its skeleton perhaps, rather than the turbo charged exo-body which exists now. I associate it with all the early electro comps that Morgan Khan put out on Streetsounds ("Electro is aural sex!") , which I'm sure will be Soulseekable. Brings back very specifc memories for me - bunking off school and going round mates house to listen to them (on vinyl), first cigarettes, dodgy causal/b-boy fashion, shoplifting pornography, that sort of thing.
 
 
illmatic
19:37 / 24.05.06
I associate electro with Hip Hop rather than soul

Having said that, if you're interested you could always check out some Joyce Sims. I wonder if she still sounds good? Suppose its not electro as such. But Shannon "Let the music play" defintely is.

The big track that I always have assumed (perhaps wrongly) was the beginning of electro was Soul Sonic Force's Planet Rock. Afrika Bambatta's band, dressed up like Parliment ripped off Kraftwork. Fucking fantastic.
 
 
lekvar
23:04 / 25.05.06
OK, so if Indy Rock is Rock & Roll's younger, faster, hip-er, cooler sibling, does Electronica have a similar sub-genre?

I'm thinking of bands like Ladytron, The Knife, Vitalic. Is this what Electroclash is?
 
 
Jake, Colossus of Clout
03:19 / 26.05.06
if Indy Rock is Rock & Roll's younger, faster, hip-er, cooler sibling

That's one big "if."
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
07:51 / 26.05.06
I think there's three or four different things here:

Electro in the historical sense, as Illmatic describes.

Electronica, which in the 90s became what dance music that wasn't mainstream house, trance or techno became known as in the USA (i.e. dance music that rock kids got into, to generalise, people like the Chemical Brothers and the Prodigy), and which has kind of stuck around as a catch-all name for 'dance music I like but don't want to call dance music' in certain circles. To complicate matters, a small but not insignificant proportion of this was basically electro in the above sense ('Block Rockin' Beats', that Prodigy song with Kool Keith).

Electroclash, which was always a name that described about two or three quite distinct sounds, but rapidly became associated more with a tiny part of London and a certain mode of dress than any of them - and which in turn became a radioactive term - i.e. nobody will call themselves electroclash now or for the next five years because of its associations. I don't think the people making the music in question ever liked it that much anyway. This is how we get:

Electro-, often used as a prefix, hence electropop. In many ways I think this is just a preferred way of describing some of the same things that were meant by electroclash in a less punchable way. But it's a pretty broad term, as the bands lekvar lists indicate, almost as broad as 'electronica'. To complicate matters, right now a lot of this stuff is heavily influenced by electro in the historical sense - the productions styles, and in some cases the MCs - there's this amazing remix of Spank Rock's 'Sweet Talk' which I have that illustrates this.
 
 
coweatman
14:10 / 26.05.06
relative vs. absolute

if you're in a huge flat field, and you're dancing a very sepcific dance, that dance is recognizable no matter if you start standing a bit to the left or a bit to the right.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
19:38 / 26.05.06
Well, you can't argue with that.
 
 
Jackie Susann
02:42 / 27.05.06
actually i think its really dubious - give chaotic dynamics tiny variations in initial position will produce totally distinct dance movements over time. (assuming it's freestyle not choreographed i guess.) can we start a new thread on this?
 
 
kan
15:33 / 26.06.06
I've just inherited a friend's CD and LP collection in a big old messy jumble and seek your advice on a filing system. I thought I'd go for a straightforward A-Z, no fancy stuff but it wasn't as easy as I anticipated,
and this is where the stupid question arises...

Do you alphabetise by surname or forename? Without thinking I put artists I recognised under their first name (e.g I for Isaac Hayes, J for Jimi Hendrix) but this felt strange for people I was unfamiliar with like Tim Buckley or Gil Scott Heron ( I don't know where his first name ends and second starts), much easier with one-word monikers thankyou Underworld, Prince and Tortoise (whoever you are).
And what about bands that start with a number? they go at the start yeah?

Or do you favour a different approach altogether?
 
 
illmatic
15:42 / 26.06.06
Possibly it shows the pointlessness of categorisation?

Why not have a simple two tier filing system:

Tier a)

Stuff listened to/not listened to

When a CD has passed a)i, it can be subfiled in

Tier b) which consists of:

Stuff that's good/stuff that's shite.

B)ii can of course be subfiled in the bin/charity shop.
 
 
grant
16:17 / 26.06.06
I alphabetize by surname, then within artist roughly chronologically. For a while, I was keeping Syd Barrett in with the Pink Floyd and George Harrison in with the Beatles, but found myself wondering where the hell things were.

So, if you wonder where the hell things are, put them where you can find them.

Oh, and my overall schema is by "genre" first, then alphabetical within genre (if it's big enough to matter).
 
 
Quantum
09:29 / 27.06.06
Listen up suckas I have a Mr T related question. Wikipedia says;

In 1984, he made a motivational video called "Be Somebody or Be Somebody's Fool." He gives helpful advice to children throughout the video; for example, he teaches them how to understand and appreciate their origins, how to dress fashionably without buying designer labels, how to make tripping up look like breakdancing, how to control their anger, and how to deal with peer pressure. The video is roughly one hour long, but contains 30 minutes of singing, either by the mob of children accompanying him, or by Mr. T himself. He sings "Treat Your Mother Right (Treat Her Right)," (video available here) in which he enumerates the reasons why it is important to treat your mother right, and also raps a song about growing up in the ghetto and praising God. The raps in this video were written by Ice T. That same year he released a related rap album titled Mr. T's Commandments.

Twofold- where can I get a copy of Mr T's Commandments, and what does Ice T have to say about Treating your Mother Right? If you've heard it, it could be called a radical departure from Ice T's other work.

Aside- "In October, 2006 [1] his new reality television show for TV Land, called I Pity the Fool [2] begins, which will find the devout Christian assisting those in need."
Mr T the good Samaritan! In My Mind it will be Mr T cleaning up the streets in the name of the Lord, fighting supervillains and rescuing kittens- eeeeeee!
 
 
Red Concrete
20:00 / 27.06.06
Well e-bay has a copy.

As for Ice T, *shrug*. I haven't heard from him since a bootleg tape I bought in the late 80s. Maybe he joined a church?
 
 
Jack Fear
20:45 / 27.06.06
No, he joined the cast of Law & Order: SVU.
 
 
Quantum
13:43 / 28.06.06
Red Concrete- ta, but that's the single, I want lots of T rap. Think of the sampling possibilities!

Ice T has at least eight solo albums, the last in 2004 despite his acting career. He's a T wannabe.
 
 
kan
18:13 / 29.06.06
Thanks Illmatic & grant for filing advice.

Have gone for a combination scheme, in the end I just did it alphabetically with the first letter that came into my head when I read the cover (no, that sounds more random than I meant). Anyway I'm now picking random unknown CD's for two-pile classification so far all bad, or rather not to my taste.

Gil Scott Heron, Moving Target - bit light for me, like moonlighting(tv show) music?
That Petrol Emotion, Chemicrazy - didn't like the singer's voice
Hey Karma ? - not sure if that's the band name or record name, I suppose both , polish rock isn't really my cuppa tea.
ultra vivd scene, no title either - eighties pop? didn't hook me.

and the tim buckley case was empty.
Admittedly I only gave each record about 3 minutes of listening, but I'll move onwards before I return to this lot.
 
 
Jack Fear
18:45 / 29.06.06
That Petrol Emotion had their moments; most of the band are ex-members of the Undertones (of "Teenage Kicks" fame) plus American singer Steve Mack—whose voice isn't a million miles from Feargal Sharkey's, come to think of it, making TPE sort of a simulacrum of how the 'tones might've ended up.

Give CHEMICRAZY another listen: "Hey Venus" (which was the lead single) is mad catchy, "Abandon" works up a nice head of steam, and the closer "Sweet Shiver Burn" is about as pretty as the band ever got. And how can you not love the Gary Panter artwork?
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
18:58 / 29.06.06
Stupid questions? Okay... stupid but genuine, what's the difference between hip-hop and rap? Is one a subset of the other? I listen to a lot of "it," but I can't tell you if the Herbaliser is rap or hip-hop, or where MF Doom slots in, or whether Dälek is rap or hip-hop or another beast entirely, and then there's Roots Manuva...
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
19:02 / 29.06.06
And contributing to kan's dilemma, the perils of surname filing are that you have to know whether the artist in question is a real name or a made-up name. I've got George Harrison under "H," but where do I put Jethro Tull? Okay, that's kind of a band-not-a-person name, so it's a "J," I guess, and then I've got Alice Cooper, which is a pseudonym but it's sort of guy-not-the-band name, so it becomes a "C," but what about this "Kula Shaker" fellow? Is that a band name or is he a person like Ravi Shankar?

I'm being a bit silly, but you get my point.
 
 
grant
21:33 / 29.06.06
On the rap/hip-hop thing -- I'm not really a fan, but I always use "rap" as the vocal style or the act-of-rapping, and "hip-hop" as the genre. "Rap" is what an MC does, whether it's on a dancey "hip-hop" track or as part of a conceptual art piece with a philharmonic orchestra.

If I'm being goofy, please correct.
 
 
Jackie Susann
01:10 / 30.06.06
It depends who you're talking to. The official rap-nerd answer is, hiphop is a culture with four (or five, again depending who you ask) elements - i.e., MCing (rapping), breaking, writing (graffiti) and DJing. I never use the word 'hiphop' if I can help it, because it feels like a word that's all about arguing about realness, and mostly I want to avoid that. So I just call it all rap.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
22:50 / 30.06.06
I think the best answer is that hip hop and rap should be seen as synonymous, except that rap can also be used to refer only to the vocals, and that hip hop could refer to tracks that don't feature an MC. There have also been attempts to use hip hop to mean "good" and rap to mean "bad", but fuck that noise.

The real question is whether hip hop should have a hyphen.
 
 
Jackie Susann
23:32 / 06.07.06
What's the point of triangles? Like, the musical instruments. They have them in orchestras, right? Is being the triangle player in a major orchestra the cushiest job ever? Or do people actually study for years and develop mad triangle chops?
 
 
Jack Fear
00:07 / 07.07.06
I don't think anybody specializes exclusively in triangle. If you're an orchestral percussionist, you'll be playing triangle, but you'll also be playing woodblocks, cymbals, cowbells, crotales, glockenspiel, whips, typewriter, and so forth.
 
 
Char Aina
09:47 / 07.07.06
mad triangle skillz are a thing.
a thing to behold, and also a thing of useful(although often criminally underacknowledged) brilliance.
they arent used to make only one ting-a-ling sound, as commonly supposed.
you can do quite a bit with one, and jamming with a dude playing a triangle can have some pretty cool results.

if you doubt, go have a look at a random page i googled up that talks about triangle tech.

scroll down the page and look for the bit where they say stuff like 'after 2yrs R&D...'
 
 
Char Aina
09:49 / 07.07.06
also, on the earlier question, isnt hip hop how you live, rap what you do?
i heard it in a rap-song once.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
10:06 / 07.07.06
Backing up Jack Fear, in high school music class you could either be a "drummer" or a "percussionist." A drummer played the standard drum kit and sometimes mixed it up a bit with the timpani, etc. "Percussionists" were expected to learn about a dozen rhythm instruments -- cymbals, wood blocks, the fish, vibes and yes, the triangle. And the tambourine, if memory serves.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
10:09 / 07.07.06
Now I'm wondering, though, why are triangles triangles? Why don't people just hit metal rods with sticks? It must be physics, but can anyone explain it?
 
 
Char Aina
10:39 / 07.07.06
nah.
it's the best shape for hanging, and has more than one side so you can rattle around inside it as well as whacking it.
the main reason percussionists in school learn som many individual disciplines is because school band stuff isnt really percussion heavy, making one man per instrument seem a bit like too many cooks.

well, i know none of the orchestras at any of my schools had much of a jazz repertoire.

your's may have, i guess.
 
 
Tom Paine's Bones
18:15 / 09.07.06
When people talk about "pop music" what exactly do they mean? What makes one band "pop" and another one something else?
 
  

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