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Legion Of Super Heroes

 
  

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Mr Tricks
20:54 / 30.12.04
after looking at some design sketches online I figured I'd give the 1st issue a try. It was certainly an enjoyable read, though I'm not sure if I'd want to by it on an ongoing basis; not sure why.

Lots of neat conseptual ideas.
The police speaking to each other via com-link while they're still in the same room.

The above mentioned Micro Lad.

"we're here because of them"

the art seemed to suffer from what I presume was paper quality; muddy colors and rough inks here & there. Some of the faces seemed much to cloneish. Nice costume designs... the return of Phantom Girl's bellbottoms YEAH!!!
 
 
A
01:57 / 31.12.04
Does it have Bouncing Boy or Matter Eater Lad?
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
03:17 / 31.12.04
honestly, i enjoyed that a lot better than JLA Classifed as far as high science superheroes goes...i was pretty into this comic! yippee. I like reading Waid's stuff, but not so much lately...so glad this was cool.
 
 
Tamayyurt
03:59 / 31.12.04
I like reading Waid's stuff, but not so much lately...so glad this was cool.

Agreed. I was holding my breath but now I can exhale and enjoy... it looks like it's going to be a fun ride.
 
 
diz
05:45 / 31.12.04
this comic was fucking brilliant. it's fun, exciting, hysterically funny, and the core concept completely owns.

i'm tremendously excited about this book.
 
 
Benny the Ball
18:56 / 02.01.05
I thought it was okay, but suffered from sneak previews being all disjointed and showing middle sections. Liked Cosmic Boy - but always have done - didn't think it was brilliant, but it was okay enough to make me want to keep an eye on it. I'm guessing that Bouncing Boy will be about, they basically made a nice reference to the league being huge, so all the characters are about and ready to use whenever Waid wants to I suppose.
 
 
Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo
19:27 / 02.01.05
I thought this issue was a lot of fun. Kitson does a great job of making the future look fresh and exciting, and Waid, rather than giving some long bullshit continuity spiel on the previous series and why things have changed just writes it as, "Here you go. Start here."

Is it sad that I found that incredibly refreshing?

The story itself had a lot of fun ideas (as noted by others), but it brought back something the series has been missing for YEARS:

Optimism.

Much like Morrison's best work, there is a core of hope in the series and I hope they are able to keep that.
 
 
diz
14:14 / 03.01.05
I thought this issue was a lot of fun. Kitson does a great job of making the future look fresh and exciting, and Waid, rather than giving some long bullshit continuity spiel on the previous series and why things have changed just writes it as, "Here you go. Start here."

all the bullshit spiel was in Teen Titans and Teen Titans/Legion Special #1. =)

The story itself had a lot of fun ideas (as noted by others), but it brought back something the series has been missing for YEARS:

Optimism.

Much like Morrison's best work, there is a core of hope in the series and I hope they are able to keep that.


i agree. it's just got boundless optimistic energy, and humor, and a generally positive outlook. it's about a bunch of kids who are really excited to be changing the world. fucking awesome.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:37 / 04.01.05
I can't figure out if my slight cringe at the opening page, which talks about great heroes winning on the battlefield and which shows Roman soliders kicking the ass of some Arab-looking army, is too overly P.C. reaction or not.

And I felt a little odd about the shantytown Legion fans who keep the police from storming the clubhouse, but 'choose not to go in,' instead choosing to live in squalor to protect their heroes. Can we really say that ALL those people 'choose not to go in' at all? Anyone else have a reaction to this?
 
 
diz
13:44 / 04.01.05
i don't know that they're living in squalor. it looks like a very agreeable TAZ-type thing, or like Deadheads or Phish-heads, except not touring and without the stink of patchouli.

and, yes, i do think that they are legimitately choosing to stay out. why wouldn't they? it looks balmy and pleasant in the utopian Metropolis of the 31st century. they probably have some kind of weather control or something.
 
 
Benny the Ball
13:06 / 06.01.05
Wolfy - I read that splash page as the 300 Spartans against the Pursian army of Xerxes, so wasn't too offended by it, but will have to look again now.

I thought it was a nice touch that, rather than some image of someone punching Hitler, they opted for Jessie Owens winning at the Berlin Olympics.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:19 / 06.01.05
Benny, you're probably right about the 300 first page.

And yeah, Jesse Owens was a really great touch. It was a cool little meditation on 'heroes through the ages.'
 
 
FinderWolf
16:53 / 27.01.05
New issue is out - some good stuff, I've only given it a cursory skim so far. I know it's 40 pages for the price of 28 or whatever, but the different inkers over Kitson's pencils are noticeable (but overall pretty decent).

Were Dream Girl (what was her name(s) in previous Legion incarnations?) and Braniac 5 a couple in the original series? I think they were, but I forget...
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
17:30 / 27.01.05
it's actually super super good. I liked this a lot, and it seems there is going to be a very cool vibe and story arc to this relaunch. really happy so far.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
00:19 / 28.01.05
Dream Girl = Nura Nal, sister of White Witch aka Mysa Nal. I know all the real names because I was heavy into Giffen/Bierbaums Legion as a kid, and they never used codenames in that.

Yeah, Dream Girl and Brainiac 5/Querl Dox go waaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in the Legion. All of the characters used so far were around back in the 50s/early 60s, though some of them are tweaked - Star Boy/Thom Kallor wasn't a black dude until this version of the Legion.

Fun fact: in the original continuity, Star Boy and Dream Girl were lovers and got married.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
00:26 / 28.01.05
God, I need to read a little slower here -

I misunderstood, sorry. I don't remember Brainy and Dream Girl being a couple, but I know that in the original continuity, Brainy was involved with Super Girl who was retroactively replaced by Laurel Gand after the Crisis.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
00:32 / 28.01.05
I kinda hope that Waid keeps Ayla and Violet's lesbian relationship in this version. It was a subtext thing in the 70s and 80s, but Giffen and the Bierbaums (who came out of fandom and were clearly big on slash) ran with it. After the five year gap, the formerly femme, demure Shrinking Violet was a war scarred badass dyke and her relationship with Ayla became more obvious.

An aside: I really liked all the stuff with Vi and Rokk "Cosmic Boy" Krinn in that version of the Legion - they were both traumatized while fighting on opposite sides of a war between their homeworlds. Man, I really wish that I had all of those issues handy, cos I'd love to reread them.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
10:45 / 28.01.05
Knowing little about the Legion, I have to say this second issue was brilliant - fun, fresh science comics with a soap-opera cast devoid of continuity baggage. I've always wanted to like the legion but felt intimidated by the sheer amount of Legion material out there. Is\there a definitive, or just plain excellent run to look out for from any of the many incarnations?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
12:52 / 28.01.05
I highly recommend the Giffen/Bierbaum run. It's a bit spotty - some issues are amazing, some are throwaway - but it's definitely the best pre-Waid Legion. You can get all the back issues for cheap on Mile High Comics. I just did! It's series 4 1-38.

A brief guide -

1-13 This series takes place 5 years after the end of previous Legion series. Everyone has aged, everything has changed. The Legion fell apart, people lives moved on for better or worse. Over the course of this year, a new version of the Legion slowly comes together. It sets the tone for the rest of the series - dark sci-fi, focusing on large scale political corruption. The first year isn't very arc-y, but the most notable villain is the vicious serial killer Roxxas. Immediately after this very brutal and miserable storyline, there is a great, funny issue which catches up with Tenzil "Matter-Eater Lad" Kem.

The second year of the series shifts the focus to events taking place throughout the universe. 14-17 cover a war with the Khunds - I never liked those issues (which feature artwork by a young Brandon Peterson that strays very far from the 9 panel grid that is the trademark of the series) and I don't remember them very well. Mysa Nal is reintroduced in this storyline. 18-19 cover a story about the Black Circle and the destruction of Earth's moon. 20 tells the story of Venado Bay, and how Rokk "Cosmic Boy" Krinn lost his powers in the Braal-Imsk war. 21-24 "The Quiet Darkness" is written by inker Al Gordon, and are totally boring - it's about Darkseid killing himself, but it's not nearly as good as you might hope.

The third year is my favorite.

25 introduces the Batch SW6 Legionnaires, who may or may not be the REAL original teenage Legion, held in stasis by the Dominion, who at this point have completely taken over Earth. 26 and 27 feature the adult Legion attacked at their homebase by a powerful android. This story is a lot more awesome than I'm making it sound - the execution is pretty scary. 28 shows us the horrible fate of Dirk "Sun Boy" Morgna, who sold out and collaborated with the Dominion. 29-36 is the Terra Mosaic, in which the Legion and their associates fight to liberate the Earth from the Dominion.

There are a few breaks in this storyline - 31 is about the relationship of Jan "Element Lad" Arrah and Svaughn Erin of the Science Police, who is revealed to be a transgendered man. This story still pisses off hardcore Legion fans. 33 is the story of Kid Quantum, a new character who is retroactively added to the original cast for no apparent reason. Both of these issues are skippable.

There are only two issues after the liberation of Earth is 36 - 37, which is a throwaway story about space baseball (seriously) and 38, which is a very sad single issue story about the last days on Earth before the planet is destroyed.

The story carries on after the destruction of Earth, but Giffen is gone and everything changes. I don't recommend reading beyond this point.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
13:56 / 28.01.05
Thanks - I can pick up some issues in the 25p in David's (the legendary Brighton comic asnd book shop) so I'll check some out. Giffen was really the man for a while.
 
 
BrianFitzgerald
16:49 / 28.01.05
I also know very little of previous Legion stories. I'm wondering if any of you old school types recognized any of the baddies in Dream Girl's vision of the war?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
23:33 / 28.01.05
Haven't seen it yet, but I bet it's Dominators and/or Khunds.
 
 
Mario
02:06 / 29.01.05
Doubt it. Waid has gone on record as not wanting to use pre-existing villains for a bit.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:13 / 30.01.05
more thoughts on issue 2...

great issue, very strong and a good example of how the kids have to deal with the 'adult' world. Loved seeing Karate Kid in action (I wonder if DC sued the movie at the time, since the DC Karate Kid had been around long before Mr. Miyagi and Ralph Macchio showed up...although comic book-related lawsuits were less prevalent then).

I'm still finding the coloring of the book a little too dark and muddy overall - I know that in an interview they said they were going for a pastel pallette but this seems just a bit muddy.

Waid is guilty of the occasional bad pun ("Dream on!" Brainy says to the adults of Dream Girl's world, the goat practical joke at the end of the issue, although that was kind of fun) but overall his writing is strong here. Sometimes he hammers home Brainy's logic a bit too much.

Why does Dream Girl's costume have those silly cloud puffy drawings on her leggings? Did she really need cloud puffy things on her leggings...?
 
 
_Boboss
13:25 / 01.02.05
if you watch karate kid right to the end there is a little dc-appeasing disclaimer near the foot of the credits.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
19:04 / 03.02.05
I liked #2 a lot more than the first issue - nice, full plot, established a lot and got a lot done in about 30 or so pages. Most of other superhero comics these days would have dragged this story out to at least four issues. I think Waid has a much better handle on supercompression than our boy Grant M.

I noticed that the covers for issue 1 and 2 are obviously switched re: cast in the issue and the characters on the cover. I understand why the cover for issue 1 is better for a first issue, but this stuff really bugs me. I love the cover for #3 with Triplicate Girl, though.
 
 
Axolotl
19:34 / 03.02.05
Though completely unfamiliar with any of the previous versions of the Legion I've read and enjoyed both issues . I think the second has the slight edge, though that might just be because it had to explain the situation less.
Flux: It is good to see a modern comic that manages to tell a complete story nice and clearly in one issue. I've decided that too much decompression for decompressions sake is going on at the moment.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
00:05 / 04.02.05
I think that one of the biggest reasons why issue #2 was better was because there was more emphasis on character and group chemistry.

I'm happy to hear that so many new readers are enjoying this version of the Legion. Since I have a background in the Legion, reading this is very similar to reading Marvel's Ultimate line. I'm still getting used to the new versions of the characters - the Brainiac 5 I knew wasn't much like this kinda douchey version of the character. I'm very fond of this version of Dream Girl, though, and I never had much love for that character before. I'd like to see Cosmic Boy show a bit more personality - right now he seems to be suffering from boringleaderitis aka Summers' Syndrome.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:29 / 04.02.05
Yeah, wasn't Cosmic Boy like the most dynamic, terrific leader of the old version?

Although I've only read various intermittent bits of the Legion through the years, I remember reading (in the 80s and 90s) a characterization of Braniac 5 very similar to the arrogant, Spock-like computer logic brain that we're seeing here. And it was when he dated Supergirl... she would always tease him about being too uptight, logical, arrogant, etc. So it seems Waid is making Dream Girl the Supergirl analog here, if I'm remembering this correctly.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:41 / 28.02.05
#3 is out - skimmed it but not read it yet. Looks fun, tho'.
 
 
Tamayyurt
13:18 / 01.03.05
I just got issues 2 and 3 and I'm really loving this series. I don’t know whether I’ll call this an Ultimates version since the Legion does get periodically revamped, but it is cooler than it’s been in years.

Things I loved in #2:

1) Waid’s use of clairvoyance in a fight… that was great.
2) Element Lad's costume.
3) Brainy’s snarkiness. (And you’re right he was this snarky before he got his 5.1 upgrade, which I believe made the character less interesting.)
4) Shadow Lass’ costume.

#3 Was even better:


1) Atom Girl!
2) A whole planet populated by Triplicate Girl and then her shunning her new, well-traveled self.
3) Sun Boy's entire look is great.
4) Micro Lad still cracks me up.
5) Briany’s coup.
6) Ultra Boy’s, “Use your power.”
7) And Cosmic Boy’s, “It’s time for stage two.”

I can't wait for the 4th issue... I have a feeling Waid's going to do something cool with Saturn Girl.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
14:59 / 01.03.05
It's Ultimate Legion in the sense that Waid is being fairly radical in how he reinterprets the old characters - he's not very reverent, which was definitely the case for the other two revamps.
 
 
Tamayyurt
15:13 / 01.03.05
he's not very reverent

Although I agree, I have a feeling his reverence will creep up eventually. I know he’s a Legion fanboy and it’s going to be extremely difficult for him to hold back (not impossible, though, since he’s a great writer.) Maybe it’ll just come across in the detail, which is more likely.
 
 
Tamayyurt
15:28 / 01.03.05
Oh and about Brainiac’s relationships, yeah at first it was Supergirl and then she became Andromeda (Laurel Gand), but wasn’t he hooking up with Invisible Kid in the last incarnation of the series? I didn’t really keep up with that one but I remember them being very affectionate towards each other and kissing. That would’ve been cool since I’ve seen them played as intellectual rivals.

All of these are interesting given that he’s usually a cold bastard, but I like the idea of him and Supergirl since his ancestor is one of Superman’s greatest villains. There’s a Romeo & Juliet aspect there that I like.
 
 
Billuccho!
17:25 / 01.03.05
So is the book really *that* good? I've got exceptionally high standards for comics, but then, it's Waid, and has been catching my eye a bit... Should I pick up a random issue, or wait for the trade, or what?
 
  

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