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New Words for Trolls

 
  

Page: 12(3)4

 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
13:05 / 20.11.02
RDD (Restraint Deficit Disorder)

Surely, if we start pathologising people for suffering from RDD, we're going to have to section the whole board....

now *there's* an idea...

nurse, the screens please...

how about trowel(l): close phonetically enough to be recognisable, but also carries implications of 'small insignificant tool digging annoying little holes for people to fall into. Holes not big enough to be important but enough for you to sprain your ankle/sustain other niggly little injury.'

trowel(l)
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:21 / 20.11.02
or got bored, which is more likely. Because quite frankly I can't even remember what the hell you're talking about.

Yes...these glorious victories tend to live longer in the minds of those who believe they won them. It's a thing.

Duncan (if you'd rather), I suggested that you start some threads that were interesting and involving in order to demonstrate where the real value of barbelith lies. You have responded with an absolutely generic "cliquey cliquey x and y were rude to me they're a clique a clique blah blah fishcakes" rant. I'm afraid that I have to find that rather telling.

I haven't been on Barbelith for as long as some, but I've heard almost exactly this speech delivered to Nick, Flyboy, Ganesh, Mordant Carnival, Myself, Tom Coates, Runce, Jack the Bodiless, Shortfatdyke, and now Sax, Saveloy and B.C (who to my knowledge has been on the board about a fortnight) and on and on and on. It gets a little wearing, and is unlikely to command respect. It's OK to feel put upon every so often - God knows, I do, but to assume that whenever you are disagreed with it is the workings of some sinister clique will just bore people because, whether on this board or elsewhere, it's been heard many times before.

As for your final paragraph - well, who mentioned race? Oh yes, you. Just now. This is hardly my issue. If you'd like to know a little more about how I feel about racism, and possibly contribute something, there is a thread on the attitude of white middle-class liberals to racism as something that happens to and from other people in the Head Shop. I started it. Try a search on the phrase "But I'm".

That smell is the hole in your foot smoldering gently.
 
 
w1rebaby
13:23 / 20.11.02
I like gridley's trumpet-stem idea and I think it is something that we've all been groping towards. Are you groping my trumpet-stem? Stop it. "Trumpet" has all sorts of good associations, blast of worthless noise, "blowing your own..." etc.

Monkeytrumpet. Cocktrumpet. Bagtrumpet. Mmm.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:28 / 20.11.02
I like trowel. I like trowel a lot. A lot a lot. It may be a bit too close to the original, but it's sort of cute and diminutive; like a friend of mine who made "Keep the Claws" stickers with pictures of kittens.
 
 
The Falcon
13:38 / 20.11.02
Runce, I think this place is a counterculture magazine and messageboard. Am I wrong? What do I think these posters are? Tell me what they actually are, please. Part of the supercontext or something?

Listen, I thought this was fascinating when I lurked here, because you needed a proper e-mail address to sign on, which I don't have. Later, I was able to join and found an unnecessary amount of oneupmanship going on - hey, I'm not crying, I got over it fairly quickly, and carried on posting, and made some friends, great!

But: ...or got bored, which is more likely. Because quite frankly I can't even remember what the hell you're talking about. Supercilious, much? See. I started posting under the name of 'jack', if that refreshes your memory, fella. You hate superheroes/corporate comics, but read Planetary - right then...

I don't think you're scared of me, but there are few things quite so annoying as someone starting an argument, then declining to take it to a (or any) conclusion. That was pretty much my introduction to Barbelith. Which was indecorous, to say the least.

Sypha Nadon received similar treatment, in a kind of 'bored distance' post from Smile, who seems to specialise in such things, and Yawn, in the guise of Undo, was set about by pedants wielding rules - later deleted, I believe, when he told whoever to 'fuck off' (at which point raised my metaphorical hat.) It's like gimp class here, sometimes - that, if anything, is what's killing Barbelith. Not that it is dying, whingers.

I'm probably coming across more offended and pissed off than I am, but every time I see this (re:Schwantz) it gets me irritable. That it's (what I consider to be) some of the usual suspects just gives me an excuse for the above tirades.

And, yes, you do derail arguments into semantic sidetracks: see page 1 of this thread. If the accusation of this is irritating, stop doing it.

Oh, and 'chud' means chewing gum where I come from. So that's not very good. And I'm well aware that this thread has descended down irony abyss, despite the best efforts of others.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
13:43 / 20.11.02
Uh....could you tell me what you think "semantic" means? Perhaps with examples of semantic sidetracking? Only people use that word a lot around here, and as far as I can tell it generally means "I cannot work out how to express the fact that I am quite clearly right. You must be using voodoo".

How's the foot?
 
 
The Natural Way
13:48 / 20.11.02
The Supercontext? Cheap one. Why? I wasn't trying to insult you.

And that's my point. Some of the posters here aren't the cackling villains you think they are. Barbelith isn't a place where the armies of PC recruit new members...blah.
 
 
The Falcon
14:01 / 20.11.02
Sorry, just saw your post, Haus.

Oh, you've heard it all before... how utterly mind-numbing this must be for you. See, I'm not the one who was initially in disagreement with you. So, I'm not really all that concerned about your clique (or not, as the case may be - is 'like-minded people' satisfactory?) or commanding your respect. Ha ha ha - you see, I find your assumption that I'd wish to rather telling also.

As is your first sentence - my point is that I'd rather have had a satisfactory debate than someone be a prick (yes, you were, Jack) and not stick around for the consequences of their own actions. But you can see that in the above post, anyhoo.

Racism, as I've seen you project on other people in a couple of threads, seemed to pertain to the manifestation of this PC boogeyman. That's all. As for the Head Shop, I tend to stay out, because there's an inordinate amount of long-winded and tedious posting goes on in there, and I suffer too much A.D.D. to read these kind of essays from people whose names I don't even know.

All I'm asking for as that you behave with a little more tolerance and intellectual honesty instead of sophistry; a bit more decorum wouldn't be bad, either. But then we get to your last sentence, to which I'll circularly quote your first: Yes...these glorious victories tend to live longer in the minds of those who believe they won them. Just about perfect.
 
 
Jack Fear
14:06 / 20.11.02
(shrugs) Whatever. I'm not losing any sleep over it. And I think you kight be taking it just a leeeeeeetle too seriously. It's only a game, after all.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
14:11 / 20.11.02
I didn't say "win my respect". I said "demonstrate where the true value of barbelith lies". That is, win *any* respect.

Still and all..ah. Sophistry. That's another word that seems to mean "I am not bearing all before me in victory. Clearly you are using voodoo."

Coudl you possibly explain what that means, along with semantic sidetracking, and give a couple of examples? And while you're there, could you find a few places where I accuse people of racism? And could you also think (to yourself) about whether maybe refusing to look at a thread which concerns exactly what you accused me of because you can't be bothered to read long posts might make you appear a bit of, to use your own term, a prick? And that perhaps a little more tolerance and intellectual curiosity, not to mention decorum, might therefore make things seem less ugly?

Alternatively, you could continue to throw out these little unsupported scarequote words - "sophistry", "semantic", "PC", "racism" - in the hope that I will get (yet more) bored and wander off. I probably will at some point, and then you can claim another glorious victory.

Te tum.
 
 
The Falcon
14:13 / 20.11.02
Runce, I apologise. I wasn't trying to be cheap, just a wee joke that may have gone awry. I understand your point, I didn't get how you were making it; I know these are simply folk (probably white, probably middle-class, probably pretty smart) sitting at a computer typing some shite in. As I'm doing now.

Haus, you're smart enough to know exactly what you're doing with that little post. Arguing semantics about semantics is a new experience, though - congratulations. The foot thing isn't funny, it's wanky, and it's fairly evident that you're trying to wind me up so that I post something "that hoists me by mine own petard", or somesuch pish.

But the more this goes on, the more your own intellectual arrogance ('a spade's a spade, eh?') is becoming emergent. That's something I know about, having practiced it for quite a while, until I realised it made me a fucking tit.
 
 
Bear
14:13 / 20.11.02
I think Duncan is turning into Walter Sobchak - count to ten, relax.

You want a toe?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
14:25 / 20.11.02
So...you aren't actually going to back up or explain any of your unfounded allegations, instead moving into metaaccusation? Quelle surprise. And now I shall no doubt have another fellow who suspects me of using voodoo to prevent his absolute rectitude and will tote this grudge from thread to thread, sniping and threadrotting away with the same five or six popular phrases or sayings.

Hey ho.
 
 
The Falcon
14:29 / 20.11.02
plan out a series of threads so devastatingly insightful that the decadent cliquesters are reduced to speechless admiration?

What does this say? I assume you are one of the 'decadent cliquesters', yeah? Another thing that's telling (at least in base-level psychological understanding) is your assumption that I wish to sweep all before me in victory; perhaps you do, I don't. That would be boring.

It's only a game, after all.
Fair enough, Jack. I am getting a bit riled, and I know this is not that important.

Haus, why not use your understanding and address the accusations head on, once and for all, rather than calling them 'scarequotes'. Why does it happen so often, that you're now overly familiar with such things? Could there, God forbid, be any basis to them?

I believe you circuitously accused 'The Invisibles' of being racist some time ago, because Boy was the least important character, and black, and your Bengali/Indian parents and hospitals thing did similar.

However, I am willing to proven wrong on both counts, because I'm not sure about the first one, and the second was, at least partially, justified. I was only pointing out the origins, as I've seen them, of the 'Haus is part of the PC movement' idea.

I will now look at that 'But I'm...' thread, and, yes, I was being a prick. Not for the fist time - but I was simply responding in kind to something I think that's been going on too long here.

Who's Walter Sobchak?
 
 
Jack Fear
14:34 / 20.11.02
John Goodman's character in the Coen Bros. film The Big Lebowski. Prone to fits of rage, and also to invoking his experiences in Vietnam at the drop of a hat.

Full page of Lebowski quotes hither.
 
 
The Falcon
14:38 / 20.11.02
Shut the fuck up, Donnie!

Oh, right. I'm not really like him, I'm all for reconciliation.
 
 
The Falcon
14:46 / 20.11.02
A search on "But I'm" yields no results, Haus.
 
 
The Falcon
15:05 / 20.11.02
Found it.
 
 
grant
15:22 / 20.11.02
chudtrowel and spunktrowel both have a certain ring.

there's also a parallel with "spade" i find interesting, since a trowel and a spade are related, but a spade is *much* more useful.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:43 / 20.11.02
Well, because I don't know what you mean by either semantic sidetracking or sophistry. Semantic sidetracking I would normally assume to mean sidetracking about the meanings of words, but in a sense this entire *thread* is a semantic sidetrack, and the only irrelevant part of it (this particular discussion here) is entirely non-semantic. "Sophistry" would be using rhetoric or capricious logic to "make the worse argument defeat the better", I assume, which is tricky because frequently subjective; it's rare that somebody believes their argument to be the worse.

I think the Invisibles thread you are talking about is here and, at the risk of being crucified by my PC labelmates, it was a larf, reacting to Count Adam's statment that I kept saying the Invisibles was sexist (can't think where, offhand, but hey). I said that Boy was a character with little character development who punched people a lot, in the same vein that I said that Fanny gets far less consensual sex than King Mob and Jolly Roger gets killed - it was an experiment to see how much people had invested in the idea of the Invisibles, and one based in some places on what turned out to be my imperfect recollection of some of the episodes I was describing. Others who know more about these things seem to think that it was useful to have somebody suggest that the Invisibles was not the right-on unit of perfect political reasoning that it was occasionally represented as being, because it stimulated debate. As it happens, *nobody* is accused of racism in that entire thread, except possibly "The Invisibles", a collection of comics which does not regularly post on Barbelith. If there is another thread where I accuse somebody of being a racist for disagreeing with my opinion of Boy, please do tell me where. That might show a severe lack of decorum.

As for the baby-killing Bengalis - well, if somebody tells me that there is an "unspoken rule" not to tell Bengalis in Whitechapel that their baby is showing up as female in an MRI because they will abort it, and then somebody else "proves" this by directing me to a study they have not read which says that Punjabis who are not in Whitechapel are known to kill babies after they have been born if they are female (that is, the only thing that is in common between the two situations is the colour of the skin of the people involved, the fact that at one point they or their parents or grandparents shared a continent and possibly their religion), then I am not going to be convinced that this is not lazy thinking. But in fact I did not call anyone a racist. I called Torqsidriver an unreliable source and a regurgitator of man-in-pub prejudice, citing his views on homosexual parents and Jews, and called Nick on not actually reading the sources he sought to use to prove that it made perfect sense a) to assume that Bengalis in Whitechapel aborted children shown to be female on their MRIs and b) that doctors were entitled to withold information about the sex of the parents' baby on the grounds that if they told them they would probably abort the child, because they are Bengali. It was *Nick* who said "I suppose that makes me racist", in a Godwin's law backhand, that is a move meant to make the person (in this case, me) back off and stop pressing the issue, because it plays on the liberal white middle-class (and either PC or anti-PC, depending on how you cut it) fear of being seen to accuse somebody of something as terrible as racism lightly. I don't think I much mentioned race, only misleading information, unsupported rumour and bad evidence.

(What I didn't mention at the time, and probably should have, is that I don't think you can tell the sex of a foetus with absolute certainty by MRI - if you can see the penis, you can tell it's a boy, but if you can't it could be either a boy or a girl because the penis may be concealed. I think this is the case right up to the 28-week mark when a foetus could legally be terminated. So the original fact was itself, I think, pretty dubious. Which was kind of the point.)

So, I don't know - does that make me PC? It's difficult, since the only definitions of PC we have tend to be written by people who see PC as a) monolithic and b) bad and wrong. It does, in passsing, mention that accusing people of throwing around terms like "racist" without due consideration (without due consideration) is actually pretty offensive in and of itself.
 
 
The Falcon
16:13 / 20.11.02
PC, to me, is the creation of abstract (i.e. linguistic) problems, swiftly followed by the non-solution of them. Hence, the link to semantics, I guess.

'The Invisibles', you are correct, does not post here; but, in arguing, whether for experimentation or no, that it is racist/ homophobic/ sexist, one might suggest you do its' author a disservice. But that's a question for books or head-shop, I guess: "how does one write the Other?" or summat.

I've never accused you of "throwing around" the term 'racist', but, yes, inferring it. And, sorry, what does "mention that accusing people of throwing around terms like "racist" without due consideration"? The PC monolith? Your thread on 'But I'm on your side...'?

I'm sorry that we've had to have this argument, but I think we've both learned fom it - my essential problem with your posts, which are often entirely worthwhile, is an apparent inbuilt superiority complex therein.

This last one is a vast improvement, however, and for that I sincerely thank you.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
16:39 / 20.11.02
Ah...it's been a bad week. It's been a bad month, in fact. I think I get more and more apparently superior (snippy and short-tempered) the more and more exhausted and crappy I feel.

But, to answer the "mentions that...." thing, the subject is the above discussion of those two threads (specifically, the discussion of the Godwin's law backhand. I don't like being accused of falsely accusing others of being racist. But I'll happily cop to thinking Grant Morrison is not as enlightened, as intelligent or as skilled as Grant Morrison does...
 
 
gridley
16:59 / 20.11.02
"spunktrowel" does indeed have a fine ring to it, Grant, but meditate, I beg you, upon the beauty and magnificence of...

spunktrumpet
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
17:07 / 20.11.02
Actually, in tribute to Grant Morrison's departure from the board, how about Catglasser?
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
17:55 / 20.11.02
Is it safe to come out now then?

I like trowel, but perhaps 'handtrowel' would be more... belittling?
 
 
The Falcon
18:52 / 20.11.02
I'll happily cop to thinking Grant Morrison is not as enlightened, as intelligent or as skilled as Grant Morrison does...

Few do. I still think he's great, but I hate cats.
 
 
Cat Chant
11:03 / 21.11.02
: I am certain, however, that the next book will contain extensive notes on magical-agricultural farming methods, economics in a magically industrialised culture, labour relations, breeding programs and basic craft techniques.

Oh, me too. Particularly the labour relations, which will explain how we are supposed to simultaneously see Dumbledore as the Voice of Moral Rectitude and as a slave-owner who believes slaves can't be freed because it is in their nature to be enslaved, and it would be against their own best interests to free them...

I love you, rat. (Have you read Diana Wynne Jones's "A Tough Guide to Fantasyland"?)

And Haus, there have been several cases of female babies being taken for male at birth (it's not always easy to distinguish between a clitoris & a penis, even before you get into any intersex stuff) so I suspect that MRI scans are even more unreliable than you suggest.
 
 
Jack Fear
12:18 / 21.11.02
...there have been several cases of female babies being taken for male at birth...

"It's a boy! ...and what a boy!"

"Err, Mr. Simpson... That's the umbilical cord."
 
 
Char Aina
13:24 / 21.11.02
as i see it (but i may be blind), PC movement is like the rscist movement. it has no union, its a collection of opinions that fall into a pattern. its not a conspiracy.

to call someone a part of it, i reckon, is like saying they are a part of the patriarchy, or the rascist whites.
it does not mean there is any kind of agreement, or meetings or even a manifesto(fuck, but it sounds like you are being obtuse), but it does mean you are part of the problem.

have you ever read any feminist literature? the sensible stuff, not the rants. it might illuminate your view of this(if it actually needs it) to try some sheila jeffries. yes, she is radical, but also fairly measured.



for troll, why do we need a term, more jargon to limit the understanding of the world outside this board?
why not just call a cunt a cunt, and be done with it?
 
 
The Natural Way
13:29 / 21.11.02
It's "racist."

Careful, careful, toksik, tread softly....
 
 
Char Aina
17:59 / 21.11.02
its also next to the 'a' key,(the 's') and i was posting at work. i blame it on fat fingers, quick typing, and a fear of the boss.

keep watching, and you will get to learn many of my posts will be spelled badly.
 
 
Andrew C*** passing himself of as Haus
19:52 / 21.11.02
You aint seen me, right?
 
 
Sleeperservice
19:52 / 21.11.02
Indeed be careful. Even if you correct yourself shortly after, Haus will badger you about it for the rest of the threads life, ignoring your attempts to further the discussion. Much like a...
 
 
Badbh Catha
20:13 / 21.11.02
Would you all just stop bitching about Haus?

Just shut up already. Ignore him if you don't like him. All these pathetic little posters aching for a cockfight is just really fucking boring.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
20:22 / 21.11.02
why not just call a cunt a cunt

My cunt's never done anything to annoy me, besides the odd yeast infection... heyyy...

*PING! Lightbulb appears above head* "Yeast Infections".
 
  

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