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Underground > Radio & Music >

Pop Corner

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miss wonderstarr

04:19 / 23.08.06

Thanks, I should be able to get that on my ipod before work ~ and again, this has been a great thread for me in that I've listened to six or so tracks I should really have known before, but am glad I know now.

06:34 / 23.08.06

I've gotten really annoyed with the start of Jay's first verse on Deja Vu. I used to run base like Juan Pierre/Now I run the bass, hi hat and the snare. He obviously came up with that line before he heard the beat, because otherwise the second line would surely go, Now I run the bass, 808, and the snare? The extra syllable isn't difficult to get out, its a better internal rhyme, and it would still sit on the beat right. I cannot express how much this trivial detail bugs me.

miss wonderstarr

06:35 / 23.08.06

Actually I very much prefer the JT mashup with Ladytron and recommend that in turn ~ it extracts the spoken, pillow-talk vocals ("You're a girl, right? This is something special, right?") and cues them in with the shifts in electronica. "Now everybody dance" and "drums" are particular good as murmured commands, effortlessly switching the song onto different tracks.

09:12 / 24.08.06

Oh, god, Deja Vu!

So: I distinctly remember hearing Crazy in Love for the first time on a University Radio "let's ask our panel guests about the new singles" show. I was on the panel to review a gig I'd been to a few weeks ago.

Anyhow.

I wasn't immediately, entirely, wild about Crazy in Love. I mean, yeah, it was good, but I didn't think the Chi-lites sample exactly fitted right; it felt a bit obvious.

Obviously, I was entirely wrong, because it's a great single, and I'm an idiot.

But.

Fuck me, Deja Vu is stonking. Like, really, immediately awesome. I've been listening to it on loop this morning, and it just works - I love the production, and I love the insinuation ("Bass/Hi-hat/808/Jay") that Jay's just another instrument in Beyonce's arsenal.

What surprised me quite a bit is that the production is by Rodney "Darkchild" Jerkins, a producer I don't usually rate that highly, mainly because I don't find his RnB-style productions that "tight"; they wallow a little, and have very little snap. Well, I take that back, because the horns work, the bassline slithers around in a very disco fashion, and the 808-thump really, really shakes if you've got some good headphones or a good sound system.

Immense. Wish I was still DJing, just to watch people dance to this.

(And how good is that dropped-beat on "you gonna need help try to study my [...] bounce / flow"?)

miss wonderstarr

09:43 / 24.08.06

Now I run the bass, 808, and the snare?

Sorry, I don't understand. The track features bass, 808 and hi-hat. Why would a rewrite listing bass, 808 and snare be an improvement? Surely the snare is what needs to be replaced. (I'm pretending I know for sure what an 808 is; I assume it's the Roland-808 drum machine.)

miss wonderstarr

09:56 / 24.08.06

Anyway, yes it is magnificent the way Beyonce is calling in her troops, counting up the inventory at the start, and Jay is both a weapon and an accomplice ~ like they're about to start a war, launch a heist.

(And how good is that dropped-beat on "you gonna need help try to study my [...] bounce / flow"?)

That whole verse, is it a verse in rap, or a "stanza"? manages a kind of free-falling, stumbling effect, a looseness that's incredibly tight. It sounds like a stepping around and between beats, apparently lazily: on "fo'... fo's, like I'm from the H... O-U-S-T-O... N..."

I really like the kind of bored, strained tone, as if Jay's been asked this stuff so many times before: "I don't make the list, don't be mad at me". Like the huge, overblown sigh in "Encore", before "Look what you made me do, look what I made for you."

11:42 / 24.08.06

I've gotten really annoyed with the start of Jay's first verse on Deja Vu. I used to run base like Juan Pierre/Now I run the bass, hi hat and the snare. He obviously came up with that line before he heard the beat, because otherwise the second line would surely go, Now I run the bass, 808, and the snare? The extra syllable isn't difficult to get out, its a better internal rhyme, and it would still sit on the beat right. I cannot express how much this trivial detail bugs me.

To clarify (and tidy what Ms Wonderstarr's saying): I think Jay and B mean different things by "bass". Beyonce's using "bass" to refer to the bassline, and then announces the iconic electronic kick drum with "808"; Jay means "bass drum" by "bass", because he's referring to the drumbeat, composed of bass drum/snare/hats. Hence: he's using the same word to mean something different.

As such, I don't find it that irritating.

(I tend to refer to the bass drum as the "kick", which avoids any confusion, but that's just me).

11:45 / 24.08.06

(Interestingly, I can't make out any snare in the track - the hand-claps serve the role of the snare in the beat, and there's definitely no snare underneath them).

Regrettable Juvenilia

12:42 / 24.08.06

But also Jay-Z is not only referring to this particular song: he is saying "I used to be in charge of drugs, now I am in charge of music", a theme of which I believe he is rather fond... He used to be in the crack game, now he is the rap game, do you see?

miss wonderstarr

14:45 / 24.08.06

Actually he's using the word that sounds like "bass" in at least three ways! Base and bass signifies his transition from drugs to music, but Juan Pierre runs base as in baseball.

15:13 / 24.08.06

Well, obviously. I was referring to the second instance, where he's referring to Bass instead of Base.

But yeah, his example is a generic one about the music he makes, rather than specifically about this song.

Gosh, this got convoluted fast.

miss wonderstarr

15:16 / 24.08.06

I've certainly learned something through this analysis.

20:38 / 24.08.06

Oh, Paleface has clarified for me because I was also thinking bass as in bassline, in which case Jay was describing two different kinds of instruments (bass and drums). In which case, I want him to name three, because the 808 has a much bigger presence on the track than the hi-hat. And I think using 'snare' for the snare-replacing-hand-clap is fine, because hardly anyone uses fucking proper snares anymore. (Note: This is a generalisation I will be utterly unable to substantiate but producers, please! Enough with the clapping.)

If you think snare doesn't work as referring the handclaps, it is even more obvious he didn't write the line specifically for this song. In which case I am even more annoyed! If you are going to make a big deal as an artists about how you don't even write down your rhymes, they just come to you when you hear the beat, you better avoid this kind of thing! (Don't worry, I still believe in you Hov...)

miss wonderstarr

20:59 / 24.08.06

That does depend on whether you think the line is meant to refer to this particular track, or (as Flyboy suggested) what he "runs" in general now, ie. beats rather than drugs. Jay's lyric seems to be mainly about his life, career and talent in general, rather than anything more specific.

In fact, in this track it's B running the bass, 808 and hi-hat (and Jay). Which weighs against the interpretation that the line in question is meant to refer specifically to what he's running in "Deja Vu".

If we're going to be picky, I could suggest that Beyonce isn't describing deja vu at all.

Know that I can't get over you
'Cause everything I see is you
[...]
Seeing things that I know can't be
Am I dreaming? When I saw you walking past me
Almost called your name
Got a better glimpse and then I looked away
It's like I'm losing it

That's not deja vu. It's the experience described elsewhere as "can't get you out of my head".

21:47 / 24.08.06

If you think snare doesn't work as referring the handclaps, it is even more obvious he didn't write the line specifically for this song.

What Wonderstarr and Flybs said - he's talking about his career; he used to play baseball/deal base, but now he's making music. It's literally the juxtaposition of his opening verse with B's intro that's confusing you.

So: does anyone like any other pop songs right now?

21:54 / 24.08.06

Okay, I am happy to move on and discuss other songs, not that there are any good songs at the moment, but just to clarify - I'm not confused, I'm annoyed, because a line with 808 with it would have done the work of referring to his career generally, as well as resonating specifically with this song.

05:05 / 29.08.06

Upgrade U, the more recent B/Jay leak, is 1000X better than Deja Vu - hot Swizz Beats production, one of Jay's best post-retirement verses over a killer breakdown, B kills the hook.

17:00 / 25.11.06

I'm enjoying this new Timbaland featuring Nelly Furtado and Justin Timberlake. It builds nicely all the way through, and Justin's verse is a gem: If sexy never left, then why's everybody on my shi-it-it?

Regrettable Juvenilia

19:39 / 25.11.06

That's hott.

22:18 / 25.11.06

Sounds too much like Another Take On Promiscuous! to me, with that beat. But maybe it's just the oddtastic distance among "SexyBack", "My Love", "Promiscuous" and "Maneater" that makes this seem too... conservative for Timbaland. Who knows, might shift with time. Cute chorus, though, definitely.

22:52 / 01.12.06

I haven’t quite settled on a favourite single of 2006 yet, but I think I may just have decided on my favourite single of 2007: “With Every Heartbeat” by Kleerup and Robyn, which can be heard here.

I was directed to it by Popjustice, who are saying “Can’t Get You Out Of My Head” or Daft Punk meets Britney, although I’d’ve thought the more obvious comparison would be “Running Up That Hill”. Except with a bit of “Vapour Trail” by Ride. And a kind of Krautrocky Moroder thing going on too.

Not since I first heard “Graffiti My Soul” (which, neatly enough, would be almost exactly two years ago) have I been so immediately convinced that I was hearing something I’d love for years to come, and that I felt like I’d known forever.

I will stop gushing, since I’m not very good at it. But it’s well worth a listen.

miss wonderstarr

11:43 / 10.12.06

I bought the "Popjustice" album this week ~ you can read about it and its source site here

**

Some of the tracks on it were already part of my personal soundtrack ("Destroy Everything You Touch", "Some Girls", Arctic Babes "I Bet You Look Good On the Dancefloor"), a couple of them I could do without hearing again ("Do You Want To"). Many of them I don't yet know.

But the highlight, and my reason for dropping £8 on this album, is the demo of "Love Machine". If you have any love for Girls Aloud, you will want this track and hence this album. It's an astounding parallel-universe version, a bit more raw and basic, but with entirely different lyrics. Equally meaningless lyrics, equally tight and nifty lyrics, but entirely different lyrics. "Love Machine" isn't even in there. Neither is "What will the neighbours say".

14:47 / 03.04.07

Is this for singles-only?

If so, well, oops. If not, then my oh my let me express my infatuation with Timbaland's "Miscommunication". I mean Jesus. Shock Value, as a whole, so far bores me. Not even "Give It To Me", which seems to have gotten some positive response, grabs me; the beat sounds like a rehash of Promiscuous's and all three of them bore the fuck out of me as self-aggrandizing rappers. A couple of tracks are nice, but nothing mad-grin-inducing.

But Miscommunication. *Swoooon*. I love how the feel of the basic hook is accentuated by Keri Hilson - how when she comes in, it sounds so much more whining and frustrated. And her vocaaal, Goood. The way her voice goes high and weak on "with him", how she packs two killer hooky bits with both the "killing me" bit and the "what you wanna do?" bit, the general tiny strain in her voice and just how she can't seem to keep the fuck still, note-wise.

And the little double-steps the bass does to fill out the melody. And the subtle touches of synth while she repeats the chorus. And the high-pitched back-up to Timbo's intro verse (his own voice?). I can even ignore the fool that raps post-Keri.

The funny thing is, I wouldn't immediately associate it with Timbo if it was unidentified. The clacky rythmic effect sounds like the Neps more than anything to me, and the thick synth seems, if my sense of the authorship on Furtado's album is right, to be more of a Danja thing. Whatever. I so need it to be a Summer single, goddammit.

Oh, I know 'lith doesn't need inept writing about music, but I need to express the joy that this thing is, and the alternative, shouting along like a maniac, isn't really practical right now. I was really needing a song like this.

Regrettable Juvenilia

15:26 / 03.04.07

Oh, I know 'lith doesn't need inept writing about music

Frankly we need all the writing about music we can get at this point, with a few key exceptions. Especially about an album that arguably deserves its own thread but is far from guaranteed to get one.

The big question on my mind is: what's the Fall Out Boy track like?

19:22 / 03.04.07

Especially about an album that arguably deserves its own thread but is far from guaranteed to get one.

I was actually surprised there wasn't one by you or Jackie. Do you think it's worth it?

I think that the thing that's making it harder for me to even have patience for the album is the lack of a continuous thread, even if only in style. It feels like a lazy compilation.

The big question on my mind is: what's the Fall Out Boy track like?

Elements added together, rather than combined = unremarkable.

I feel really strange feeling and talking about the album like this, almost guilty, as if I'm wrong in the head for not loving it. Very odd.

06:50 / 06.04.07

Ha, I am scared off buying a Timbo album because a)Fall Out Boy, b)his favourite rapper is Magoo, c)precedent set by Clones. Plus I have no downloading facility at the moment.

07:33 / 06.04.07

And speaking of big-name-producer tracks, my top two favourite tracks of the year so far are the original and remix of Swizz Beats' 'It's Me, Bitches', with the stupidly hyperactive glockenspielish percussion and (on the original) inane party-raps or (on the remix) Lil Wayne (most overrated rapper alive) sounding awesome because he just yells his verse (which I haven't heard from him before and, at least as a novelty, beats the hell out of his usual 'i rap with weird pauses' flow) and Busta making the remix as per 2003 (God I miss every song ever having a remix with a Busta verse).

10:49 / 06.04.07

Bounce has pretty much made official the reason I can't really get into Timberlake. Have him singing about love, all fragile and sappy, and I dig. Have him talk about sex, all faux-ghetto and commanding, and I yell. I mean, "bounce like your ass had the hiccups" doesn't sound better with humor, it requires humor not to be utterly idiotic + for fuck's sake, does it really seem that impressive to describe a m+f+f threesome (how naughty! how novel!) by just repeting "then x on y", x and y being combinations of "me", "you", "her", "y'all" + ménage "ay twah"? Oh really?

Then Missy comes in, and makes it all so much better. I can't really tell when a rapper/peace of rapping is really good by the style's standards, but I do know what I like, and Missy, I like. A touch of playfulness really raises the level.

I'm ranting about it because it's good, by the way. I'm not really familiar with Timbaland making this sort of harder, driven track. Not amelodic, but less hooky then the recent stuff that I know of.

And Way I Are is cool. That My Love techno influenced thing? Yeah, sort of a continuation, only now the beat seems to take some of it too. Didn't really grab me at first, but I think it gets better as it progresses. Once, it sort of made me think of what the Knife would be like if they followed the sound explored in their self-titled. But then, I hadn't slept all night, so don't trust me.

Though there's this retro sample (well, not really a sample, I think, but a reproduction of a piece of melody) that kind of annoys me; somehow I see some sort of logic for its inclusion but it doesn't seem right. And "yeah! (yeah!)" feels, well, dated, basically.

But mostly, I'm still just kind of fixated on Miscommunication.

Should I 'yousendit' some of this stuff?

Regrettable Juvenilia

08:42 / 15.08.07

I haven’t quite settled on a favourite single of 2006 yet, but I think I may just have decided on my favourite single of 2007: “With Every Heartbeat” by Kleerup and Robyn

Current UK #1, kids! I know it's not as hard to get a number one single as it used to be, but I think that's still pretty exciting. Can we have a thread on Robyn now?

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